The Great Debate

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ClanCrusher:
One thing that I think a lot of people forget when preaching about the first amendment and trying to wow us with the evils of censorship is that our first amendment does NOT give you the right to be heard, it does NOT require people to listen to your opinions, and it most certainly does NOT give you the right to say anything you want anywhere you want without any form of consequence.

That aside, I am in complete agreement with Erin's views here. In order to have a reasoned discussion on the internet, you need moderation.

I've seen reasoned discussion on 4chan, and on websites where they let you act like assholes. I've seen some on Youtube comments even.

ClanCrusher:

YouTube does not have moderation in any real sense of the word

You can delete posts, you can ban people from posting to your videos. It has moderation.

John Funk:
People angry about Anita Sarkeesian disabling comments because OH NOES IT STIFLES MY FREE SPEECH IF I CAN'T RESPOND TO IT OR DISAGREE are missing one huge point (whether deliberately or accidentally, I don't know):

You can still respond to it. You can still disagree. You can make a YouTube video response. You can make a blog post. You can comment in any one of the threads on major gaming sites about it. You just can't do it in her space. And as for the laughable claim that she's being hypocritical because "she claims to want to start a dialogue but then prevents it from happening," she's not preventing a thing!

She had to go out of her way to disable comments on youtube. She's shutting down an avenue of discussion while laughably claiming she wants to foster discussion.

John Funk:

Look at us. Right here. This is part of the dialogue! Every comment thread, every video response, every tweet about her videos is the very dialogue she wanted to start!

It helps that she couldn't shut this down even if she wanted to.

Father Time:

John Funk:
People angry about Anita Sarkeesian disabling comments because OH NOES IT STIFLES MY FREE SPEECH IF I CAN'T RESPOND TO IT OR DISAGREE are missing one huge point (whether deliberately or accidentally, I don't know):

You can still respond to it. You can still disagree. You can make a YouTube video response. You can make a blog post. You can comment in any one of the threads on major gaming sites about it. You just can't do it in her space. And as for the laughable claim that she's being hypocritical because "she claims to want to start a dialogue but then prevents it from happening," she's not preventing a thing!

She had to go out of her way to disable comments on youtube. She's shutting down an avenue of discussion while laughably claiming she wants to foster discussion.

John Funk:

Look at us. Right here. This is part of the dialogue! Every comment thread, every video response, every tweet about her videos is the very dialogue she wanted to start!

It helps that she couldn't shut this down even if she wanted to.

No, she's... fostering a discussion. She's just not obligated to make that discussion happen on her front yard / invite the sort of DELIGHTFUL DISCOURSE and by that I mean rape threats and misogyny that YouTube invites.

You have no leg to stand on. She is fostering a discussion. Criticizing her for disabling YouTube comments is just another way to try and get around the fact that they don't like a woman having an opinion that MAYBE their cherished things aren't all great.

John Funk:

Father Time:

John Funk:
People angry about Anita Sarkeesian disabling comments because OH NOES IT STIFLES MY FREE SPEECH IF I CAN'T RESPOND TO IT OR DISAGREE are missing one huge point (whether deliberately or accidentally, I don't know):

You can still respond to it. You can still disagree. You can make a YouTube video response. You can make a blog post. You can comment in any one of the threads on major gaming sites about it. You just can't do it in her space. And as for the laughable claim that she's being hypocritical because "she claims to want to start a dialogue but then prevents it from happening," she's not preventing a thing!

She had to go out of her way to disable comments on youtube. She's shutting down an avenue of discussion while laughably claiming she wants to foster discussion.

John Funk:

Look at us. Right here. This is part of the dialogue! Every comment thread, every video response, every tweet about her videos is the very dialogue she wanted to start!

It helps that she couldn't shut this down even if she wanted to.

No, she's... fostering a discussion.

How? We at the escapist can talk about any video we want. What makes her special?

John Funk:

She's just not obligated to make that discussion happen on her front yard

I'm not saying she's obligated to, I'm just saying she's a hypocrite for saying she wants to foster discussion then shutting down an avenue of discussion.

BTW youtube isn't exactly her front lawn.

John Funk:

You have no leg to stand on. She is fostering a discussion.

fos·ter
/ˈfôstər/
Verb
Encourage or promote the development of (something, typically something regarded as good).

Shutting down comments discourages discussion. And it's a great avenue for discussion. Because in a year or so it would be taboo to bring up such old news on a forum, but not for any youtube comments section.

John Funk:

Criticizing her for disabling YouTube comments is just another way to try and get around the fact that they don't like a woman having an opinion that MAYBE their cherished things aren't all great.

Aw yes when losing a debate about gender just resort to mud slinging and random accusations of sexism. It's on par with Godwin's Law.

Come on seriously, you're playing the sexist card? Two can play that game, you know.

Father Time:

John Funk:

Father Time:

She had to go out of her way to disable comments on youtube. She's shutting down an avenue of discussion while laughably claiming she wants to foster discussion.

It helps that she couldn't shut this down even if she wanted to.

No, she's... fostering a discussion.

How? We at the escapist can talk about any video we want. What makes her special?

John Funk:

She's just not obligated to make that discussion happen on her front yard

I'm not saying she's obligated to, I'm just saying she's a hypocrite for saying she wants to foster discussion then shutting down an avenue of discussion.

BTW youtube isn't exactly her front lawn.

John Funk:

You have no leg to stand on. She is fostering a discussion.

fos·ter
/ˈfôstər/
Verb
Encourage or promote the development of (something, typically something regarded as good).

Shutting down comments discourages discussion. And it's a great avenue for discussion. Because in a year or so it would be taboo to bring up such old news on a forum, but not for any youtube comments section.

John Funk:

Criticizing her for disabling YouTube comments is just another way to try and get around the fact that they don't like a woman having an opinion that MAYBE their cherished things aren't all great.

Aw yes when losing a debate about gender just resort to mud slinging and random accusations of sexism. It's on par with Godwin's Law.

Come on seriously, you're playing the sexist card? Two can play that game, you know.

...she is fostering discussion by providing examples and an argument that can then spur discussion on any number of websites. She is starting a discussion with her videos and inviting others to continue it.

Do you remember what happened the last time she enabled comments? Gee, I can't imagine why she wouldn't want to invite that sort of experience again.

What you are saying is that she must open herself up to relentless abuse and threats on her own channel or else she is somehow less deserving of expressing an opinion. That says far more about you being a sexist than I ever could, and I'm done wasting my breath on you.

John Funk:

Father Time:

John Funk:

No, she's... fostering a discussion.

How? We at the escapist can talk about any video we want. What makes her special?

John Funk:

She's just not obligated to make that discussion happen on her front yard

I'm not saying she's obligated to, I'm just saying she's a hypocrite for saying she wants to foster discussion then shutting down an avenue of discussion.

BTW youtube isn't exactly her front lawn.

John Funk:

You have no leg to stand on. She is fostering a discussion.

fos·ter
/ˈfôstər/
Verb
Encourage or promote the development of (something, typically something regarded as good).

Shutting down comments discourages discussion. And it's a great avenue for discussion. Because in a year or so it would be taboo to bring up such old news on a forum, but not for any youtube comments section.

John Funk:

Criticizing her for disabling YouTube comments is just another way to try and get around the fact that they don't like a woman having an opinion that MAYBE their cherished things aren't all great.

Aw yes when losing a debate about gender just resort to mud slinging and random accusations of sexism. It's on par with Godwin's Law.

Come on seriously, you're playing the sexist card? Two can play that game, you know.

...she is fostering discussion by providing examples and an argument that can then spur discussion on any number of websites. She is starting a discussion with her videos and inviting others to continue it.

Do you remember what happened the last time she enabled comments? Gee, I can't imagine why she wouldn't want to invite that sort of experience again.

She can simply not read the comments. A lot of people do that. Hell IIRC youtube has a way to ban certain people from posting comments.

John Funk:

What you are saying is that she must open herself up to relentless abuse and threats on her own channel or else she is somehow less deserving of expressing an opinion. That says far more about you being a sexist than I ever could, and I'm done wasting my breath on you.

You assume I'd only hold this stance if it was her, or if it was a woman, which is not true. Also I'd never say she's less deserving of an opinion, I'm saying that it makes her a hypocrite if she also claims she wants to foster discussion.

People can send her private messages, or abuse her on other forums she's free to ignore. Youtube commenters aren't limited to just youtube you know. So how would the youtube comments be special?

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