The Big Picture: Boy's Own Adventure

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Sir Shockwave:
...Are you sure nobody's stuck the whole "gay agenda" thing on the Ponies yet? Or is that just the Internet?

Also - The Hub for me is not the channel to watch Ponies. It's the Channel to go watch Transformers X3

Wait... are you being serious? Have people tried to pin the "gay agenda" on ponies? I'm genuinely curious, I rarely go to the likes of 4chan and /mlp/ so if it originated there I wouldn't know.

OT: I watch ponies and transformers on the internet. But I did hear about this a while back, I assumed people were trolling. Well it looks decent enough, can't be any worse than Johnny Test. If it gets the far right family values clowns in a tizzy, shit... run it for 7 seasons.

theApoc:
Social change should come because of a change in how SOCIETY thinks, feels, behaves.

The society is not some kind of magic entity. It's made up of people.
And this is a huge group of people, a subset of the society, saying they're ready for a change.

Quick question:

I actually do watch Fox News as well as other news outlets (both right and left leaning/TV and internet based) and before watching this I wasn't aware that this existed, let alone that it was a "thing." So, well, where exactly is the outrage? Maybe it was buried under all the other important news stories he mentioned, but I honestly did see/hear it.

"It's a drop in the bucket."

And you know, that's really all it needs to be. And that's a really good thing :)

Drauger:
hey fox we kind of forget Bugs Bunny loves to drag don't we?

My reaction to this post and this thread as well:

OT: Funny how nobody except Hub fanboys and original fans of the show overseas really knew about this until a bunch of people complained about it. I bet it'll get way more ratings now. Isn't it funny how that works, America?

Captcha: Wash whites separately

Captcha is a fucking racist today.

*deleted*

valium:
thank god anime and manga largely flies by under the radar of the bible thumping idiots these days, this is an entire effing genre in Japanese animation and manga.

Amen. Also... This totally reminds me of a 90's oav series called Moldiver.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moldiver

Look i'm just saying, If you were mostly unrecognizable, would you (as guys) not wear a dress and lipstick to get superpowers?

So, let me see if I have this correct:

Little-known network debuts a cartoon for kids with a cross-dressing hero(ine) = freak the !@#% out.
Major video game company introduces gender confused character in 1988, continues to use him/her to this day = carry on.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birdo

Seems legit.

I never heard of it, but I might watch a few episodes to see. Looks reasonable enough if it can keep the humor fresh. Oppose to a Ranma 1/2 retread..

*applause*

People are actually losing their fecal matter over this? The only thing offensive about this show is the lazy animation.

Anything that gets Fox News upset is okay in my book. Then again, pretty much everything gets Fox News upset, so it's hard to be surprised at this point.

I... uh, uhm... wow - sry, i'm overwhelmed by this amount of irony!

Ok, at it again - First things first, thx for the heads up, because i'm currently not very into what's happening in the USA.
But, holy cow, this is hillarious! Honestly, thank you for pointing this out, otherwise i'd possibly never heard of it and also, i kind of thank those... "journalists" (i guess that's what they call themselves) for bringing it up in the first place. Obviously this is nothing but a desperate try to shift attention from bigger problems onto "anything else", but the fact that this (the whole gender-cazoo) is getting attention this way to begin with - at least i think so - isn't necessary a bad thing. As Bob pointed out, it appears to be pretty much the ultimate punshline of the whole show, so... i guess the joke is even more on those who rage about it.
However, i had a good laugh from this and another point to possibly bring up in future discussions, so it's a double win for me so far. Probably should take a look into the show itself first though, whatevs...

Le_Lisra:
What would these morons think if they watched/read Ranma 1/2? :D

I guess their minds would be blown - right through their constrained heads. On the other hand, that's "asian stuff and every good citizen knows, those are crazy anyways and noone should pay attention to their shit", at least i guess that's what the FOX-people would bring it down to ;)

My problem with the show: tweening. As an animator I don't have a problem with method, however in this cartoon it's so apparent it kinda ticks me off. BTW for those of you who aren't animator tweening is a form of animation, that significantly reduces the time and effort into a cartoon, but also reduces some of the quality if done incorrectly.

McMarbles:
*applause*

People are actually losing their fecal matter over this? The only thing offensive about this show is the lazy animation.

As an animator: THANK YOU

Hey, Bob? Would it be possible for you not to alienate, insult, denigrate, and mock half your prospective audience - including me, who you are ostensibly defending, in your videos?

On to the subject at hand: The meta problem, I believe, is not the presence of this show. The problem is that in a matter of a few years, most or all shows will feature or include similar social ideas, and all kids will grow up inundated in this particular brand of culture.

Which, if you'll recall '50s Americana culture - Bible values in everything - this is pretty much precisely the same idea, just that this time you agree with it. Both are equally wrong, because both are equally suffocating to the many, many people who disagree.

A general rule of thumb is, any sociopolitical issue, if you want to know if it's fair, reverse the sides and see if it still seems fair.

Gotta say Bob, I'm from Australia and have seen watched the cartoon idly in the afternoons sometimes. I think you're reading too much into it. The main thrust of it is the recogniseable idea of having to swallow your pride, and compared to some stuff like 'A Planet Called Treason', which describes in slightly too graphic detail the process of a man turning into a woman, this thing has really nothing to say about gender beyond 'hey that guy has to dress up like a girl in order to be a hero, gee guys isn't that funny.'
I think you're trying a little too hard to find support for your strange attitude to gender in a tv show (last I checked male and female were fairly binary things or maybe that's just me)

And not that I'm averse to people putting thier views into their show (it's your show after all) do us a favour and find a better validation for them than 'it's the 21st century' - the number of times our planet has orbited the sun since the birth of Christ doesn't really have any bearing on anything whatsoever.

On an unrelated topic, how about doing a 'Batman Revisited' style Big Picture series but with the Superman movies instead. I'm actually curious what you thought of Superman Returns.

omicron1:
Hey, Bob? Would it be possible for you not to alienate, insult, denigrate, and mock half your prospective audience - including me, who you are ostensibly defending, in your videos?

What exactly are you referring to?

Jamane:
a transvetite superhero and everyone losses their minds, quick show them priscilla queen of the desert and watch the fireworks.

I'm so confused, why isn't Hugo Weaving playing a villain, I think that is the much bigger question posed by that movie.

Aardvaarkman:

omicron1:
Hey, Bob? Would it be possible for you not to alienate, insult, denigrate, and mock half your prospective audience - including me, who you are ostensibly defending, in your videos?

What exactly are you referring to?

Conservaphobic attacks of opportunity.
I mean, it's not like Bob's the only staff member who regularly attacks my worldview and beliefs, but he has a role which allows a certain amount of neutrality - should he choose to accept it. He does not. This rankles.

Strain42:
Bob, I often agree with you on a lot of things, but one thing stood out to me here, and I know you just said it as an opinion, so I'm not gonna make a fuss and claim that you're wrong but...

Did you really just cite Gumball as an example of a quality cartoon? I mean I don't dislike Gumball, I think it's a cute little show, gets some humor out of the wackiness, interesting presentation with all the different animation styles but...

...If that's what we're considering near the top of current animated shows, I feel kinda sad right now.

I find this opinion cropping up a lot on the internet. Either people really like gumball or they find it meh... but somehow get OFFENDED when they find someone who likes it.

It is humor. Comedy is the most polarizing form of entertainment on our entire society. It is very hard for a piece of comedy to be universally liked (the closest probably being The Simpsons... even though it's became hip to hate it for its longevity alone regardless of the quality lately).

Of the current animation shows I despise Regular Show, one of the most popular. But I know this is a personal opinion. I just can't get to sympathize even a little bit with its protagonists.

Family Guy and the other Seth McFarlane's shows are also on a scale with only "hate-love" markers. Personally, I only find American Dad consistently funny (and that's only when Roger isn't the focus), mostly because it is the only one of the three that doesn't survive solely on 80s jokes.

Then there's My Little Pony harnessing an entire spectrum of reactions on its own. I watched the show, don't regret it, but I can't see what the fuzz is all about. And then there's people out there worshiping the show like a religion. And the people who find the other group deranged.

That said, I find Gumball hilarious. Gumball does stupid stuff, but at least he isn't doing random stupid stuff. You always get a sense of the reason behind Gumball's actions. The truly random stuff on the show, however, always get me completely off-guard. And I love the animation style in the sense that there isn't a single one. It is mesmerizing to see such clashing characters on the very rules of how they exist on the world interacting with each other. And yet, all this is just an opinion.

Personally, I find those recent shows aren't lacking anything in comparison to the 90s cartoons. Except maybe to Animaniacs and Rocko's Modern Life. And of course there's people out there who find these shows are shitte and that Transformers and TMNT were the only cartoons worth watching.

Just, you know, respect someone else's opinion on what's a good humorous show.

It is an issue of mental illness and degeneracy, and my two children will never see this show. Our country has a serious problem with gender digression, and I'm tired of it. It's a problem that needs to be cured, not celebrated.

Yes, I know some people are afflicted with feeling like the opposite gender. We should treat these people just like we treat everyone else, but at the same time we need to think about where we want our country to be in 50 years time, if we still want standards, decency, and morality for our children's children, and those of us for whom it concerns are going to keep fighting back against what we think is sending us down a very dangerous path.

As a transgendered person, this is my reaction.

The animation is rather bad, seems to be done in the same style as Johnny Test.(I know it's flash, but flash is not inherently bad. Look at Venture Bros, it can be done very well.)

The comedy from what Ive seen seems.....wanting, even for a kids show.

That said, I certainly don't think it an outright bad thing, and overall it probably is good that there is something like this on TV for the kids who will identify with it.
Baby steps after all.

Oh Fox;D
Imagine if one day, something did actually "Destroy America!!". Fox news would be like "yeah! tha- we... yo...... what, really? Like... Really? Well... Cool?"

I'm kinda confused? A cartoon that essentially uses the idea of a boy being unintentionally forced to dress like a girl to be a superhero as its main mocking gag is in some way pushing the LGBT agenda? really? By that logic Benny Hill and Milton Berle should be considered two of the gay communities greatest saints. (I'll concede that most of my gay friends can in fact quote Monty Python like scripture. But I think that is more of a nerd thing than a gay thing.) And how exactly do we fit Tyler Perry into all of this? What exactly is he pushing or corrupting? The messages get so conflicted?

omicron1:

Aardvaarkman:

omicron1:
Hey, Bob? Would it be possible for you not to alienate, insult, denigrate, and mock half your prospective audience - including me, who you are ostensibly defending, in your videos?

What exactly are you referring to?

Conservaphobic attacks of opportunity.
I mean, it's not like Bob's the only staff member who regularly attacks my worldview and beliefs, but he has a role which allows a certain amount of neutrality - should he choose to accept it. He does not. This rankles.

I gotta side with Bob on this one. If you're simply of the opinion that traditional gender roles are more important than the typically left crowd think they are, that's cool, and Bob wasn't talking about you. But if you're of the, as he rightly put it, "deranged" idea that anything looking to encourage acceptance of anyone who does not fit into those traditional gender roles is 'Destroying the moral fibre of America!' as many comentators have done in reaction to this new show, THEN he was talking about you, and it doesn't matter how sizable that demographic is, it's far less excusable for people like Bob, and I don't blame him.

Ishal:

Sir Shockwave:
...Are you sure nobody's stuck the whole "gay agenda" thing on the Ponies yet? Or is that just the Internet?

Also - The Hub for me is not the channel to watch Ponies. It's the Channel to go watch Transformers X3

Wait... are you being serious? Have people tried to pin the "gay agenda" on ponies? I'm genuinely curious, I rarely go to the likes of 4chan and /mlp/ so if it originated there I wouldn't know.

OT: I watch ponies and transformers on the internet. But I did hear about this a while back, I assumed people were trolling. Well it looks decent enough, can't be any worse than Johnny Test. If it gets the far right family values clowns in a tizzy, shit... run it for 7 seasons.

Some Christians said it was demonic, and that's why men liked it. They didn't say it was gay though.

No, I am completely serious. There is even a video of them saying it.

Fiairflair:

I expect there is a very complicated historical answer to this question but... how can the United States be so tolerant in some places and so remarkably vile in others?

It's a big country, and the romanticism of introvert behavior (in the guise of "self-sufficiency") is kind of burned into our national psyche. It's very, VERY easy for us to withdraw into either our own cocoons or into small fractional groups where we only ever hear our own biases reflected back at us.

Trishbot:

And THIS...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlH71V1LpNw

It sounds like a Anime version of Tootsie. When actor Michael Dorsey (Dustin Hoffman) fails to close on yet another audition, he decides to dress up as a female character of his invention - Dorothy Michaels. She immediately gets a soap opera role and the requisite drama ensues.

God Forbid Fox News learns of the Rocky Horror Picture Show, Victor Victoria, Ed Wood, Sylvia Scarlett and I Was A Male War Bride.

I personally think Homosexual is nu-natural; mental sickness that is related to uncontrollable sexual desires, who ever have it needs love, acceptance, and LOTS OF PRAYERS/HEALINGS! No matter how tempting yuri anime looks, and how yaoi is hot to all girls on earth... I think sending kids the messages that Homosexual-ness is OK, is wrong... I know over population is a GREAT EXCUSE for such behavior... but I also think NORMAL marriage with no/adoption kids is better way...

(MAIN TOPIC:)

HOW EVER, this animation in particular... is more like "Mrs.Doubfire", "I MY ME strawberry egg", or "RAMA1/2", where sex-change/Cross dress is meant to be the gag, and it's not like the dud in the cartoon "likes" to be a girl... he wants to be super hero... that's all... I think it's funny, and fun cartoon... not super smart... but funny for a laugh or two... but NOT OFFENSIVE AT ALL....

Media needs to chill the F#*^% off... and start worrying about our economy...

John Funk:

shadowmagus:
I'm totally with you on the "Fox news is over-exaggerating about a cartoon" bit. Its a cartoon.

That said, you lost me at "Connected to men= good; independent=evil". Your white knight is showing.

Again.

Stop it.

You don't have to be a "white knight" to think that there are inherent problems with depictions of gender in our media, and it is not only wrong-headed but deeply insulting that you're using that as an excuse to dismiss it without thought.

There are problems on both sides. There ALSO seems to be this ridiculous notion these days that a woman is not allowed to be associated with men, or she's no longer considered independent. She also apparently can't be in love with a man, or else she is being subservient to him. Then there is the dumb idea that a woman has to be a sassy little bitch to be considered a tough character. I find it kind of odd that Bob used Storm as his example. How does being apart of a group that also includes men make her less of a hero than the males? How does this stop her from being independent and tough in her own right? She works with men, but she isn't subservient to them.

People don't seem aware of the confusion this causes people. It happens both ways, whether people want to admit it or not.

omicron1:

Conservaphobic attacks of opportunity.
I mean, it's not like Bob's the only staff member who regularly attacks my worldview and beliefs, but he has a role which allows a certain amount of neutrality - should he choose to accept it. He does not. This rankles.

What makes you think conservatives are anywhere near half of Bob's audience? And why should his role be neutral? He's a critic and commentator - he's not a judge. he has no duty to be neutral.

In any case, it was hardly even an attack on conservatism. It was an attack on idiocy. Or do you think Fox News somehow accurately represents conservatives as a group? I don't quite understand what the worldview that's being attacked is - people who think that boys should never dress in "female" clothing? I think you'll find plenty of conservatives who cross-dress.

Instead of just reacting, why don;t you explain to us what the problem is with the cartoon, and why it goes against your beliefs?

chronobreak:
It is an issue of mental illness and degeneracy, and my two children will never see this show. Our country has a serious problem with gender digression, and I'm tired of it. It's a problem that needs to be cured, not celebrated.

Yes, I know some people are afflicted with feeling like the opposite gender. We should treat these people just like we treat everyone else, but at the same time we need to think about where we want our country to be in 50 years time, if we still want standards, decency, and morality for our children's children, and those of us for whom it concerns are going to keep fighting back against what we think is sending us down a very dangerous path.

But the kid in the cartoon doesn't change gender. He just has stereotypically "female" clothing. Are you saying that gender is defined by something as superficial as clothing? that somebody is less of a man if they are wearing a dress? That seems like a fairly weak idea of masculinity to me.

Dragonbums:
Honestly, the Hub needs that attention even if it's controversy. No one watches that channel outside of MLP.
On that note however the show seems average.
It's the equivalent of those 90's live action shows where the male cast dresses up as a girl to get into a club or something. Or various skits where it's basically a bunch of men dressed as women having parody conversations about what women supposedly talk about in real life. Nickelodeon was notorious for that.
Yet I didn't hear the media complain.
So what's the difference here exactly?

The difference is those were brief individual skits played for laughs with little importance in the grand scheme of things, and this is the central premise of the show.

Blue Ranger:

John Funk:

shadowmagus:
I'm totally with you on the "Fox news is over-exaggerating about a cartoon" bit. Its a cartoon.

That said, you lost me at "Connected to men= good; independent=evil". Your white knight is showing.

Again.

Stop it.

You don't have to be a "white knight" to think that there are inherent problems with depictions of gender in our media, and it is not only wrong-headed but deeply insulting that you're using that as an excuse to dismiss it without thought.

There are problems on both sides. There ALSO seems to be this ridiculous notion these days that a woman is not allowed to be associated with men, or she can't be independent. She also apparently can't be in love with a man, or else she is being subservient to him. Then there is the dumb idea that a woman has to be a sassy little bitch to be considered a tough character. I find it kind of odd that Bob used Storm as his example. How does being apart of a group that also includes men make her less of a hero than the males? How does this stop her from being independent and tough in her own right? She works with men, but she isn't subservient to them.

People don't seem aware of the confusion this causes people. It happens both ways, whether people want to admit it or not.

You misunderstand the problem completely. The problem is not any one character, or indeed any one series. The problem is all the characters and all the series taken together reveal certain troublesome trends.

People aren't asking for every single woman to be a sassy independent character. People aren't even asking for every single woman to necessarily be a TOUGH character! They're asking for varied characters who are independent, codependent, rely on others for strength, cowardly, generous, selfish, anything - as long as they're interesting, well-rounded and we get *different types.* Is it a problem if a female villain is independent and a female hero works as a team? No, not at all; it's a problem if almost all the female heroes work as part of a team.

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