Zero Punctuation: Next Gen Buyer's Guide

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12
 

I have an XP computer and full screen monitor from a great number of years ago that I acquired for roughly $50.

In 4 years, I can purchase a new console for $100-200 and ensure absolute compatibility, no loss of frame rate (unless the inherent port was flawed), and optimized absolutely to the games I will be buying for $10-15 each (of which I can own physical copies that I will play 20 years down the road), and I will buy up to two games per year.

From my perspective, relying on a computer I built myself to smoothly run ANY game I want for $230 for the next 8 years is far-fetched and the amount of time I could save head-scratching over finding the reverse of this could be spent earning enough money to relegate the differences.

Others have time to harp over deals, investigate product, and build electronics before they can be entertained. I choose my job. Good for them. Good for me. We all have options.

Yahtzee Croshaw:
Next Gen Buyer's Guide

This week, Zero Punctuation takes a look at the three next gen consoles.

Watch Video

"This week, we repost one of Yahtzee's videos from June, as Mr Croshaw is incapacitated due to Christmas indulgence."

it's funny how this is still relevant.

Second World:

In 4 years, I can purchase a new console for $100-200 and ensure absolute compatibility, no loss of frame rate (unless the inherent port was flawed), and optimized absolutely to the games I will be buying for $10-15 each (of which I can own physical copies that I will play 20 years down the road), and I will buy up to two games per year.

From my perspective, relying on a computer I built myself to smoothly run ANY game I want for $230 for the next 8 years is far-fetched and the amount of time I could save head-scratching over finding the reverse of this could be spent earning enough money to relegate the differences.

Others have time to harp over deals, investigate product, and build electronics before they can be entertained. I choose my job. Good for them. Good for me. We all have options.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but here's how I think about the value I get from my computer.

I get to keep my games no matter what. While people buying into the XBone and PS4 have no backwards compatibility, I get to keep my 230+ Steam games. Even in 8 years, all my games are mine and they're all in the one place. With every new console you buy, you have to throw out the baby with the bathwater and start again.

I don't need to worry about where my physical copies are or what condition they're in. A small consideration, but when you have over 200 games and you're renting houses and moving every few years, it's worth considering. I don't like having to take my old N64/GC/Wii stuff from house to house, but they still get used and I don't want to part with them.

The future of PC gaming looks brighter. Soon I'll be able to get a Steam Box and put it in my lounge. I'll be able to stream all the games I already own from my PC to my television. Most games are not optimised for this, and it will take some time for this to become a reality, but it's happening.

The PC is definitely a bigger investment of time and money, but you get a lot more. Not that it's worth it to everybody.

tikalal:
XBone and PS4 have no backwards compatibility

IMHO, as of both Sony and Microsoft taking after the original Xbox in using (almost) off-the-shelf (laptop) PC components, the PC vs Console argument has been rendered moot.

The current x86 microarchitecture/instruction set used by both new consoles (and Nintendo will soon do so too, mark my words) is designed to run most code compiled to intel from the late eighties with little fuss. I don't even think IBM's Power (used by old macs and new mainframes) or ARM (used in just about every touchscreen device not attached to a physical keyboard) bends so far backwards for backwards compatibility.

Once a few DRM keys get busted either the XBone or the PS4 could run Windows or SteamOS just fine. It would not be ideal, but again, only DRM is stopping them from being full-fledged HTPCs capable of running just about anything (slowly, especially if a piece of software in question depends on a heavy main thread).

I expect both Sony and MS to announce partnership with CD Projekt to get the Good Old Games marketplace working for any title published before 2005, and to invest heavily in DosBox so it can actually get AMD K6-3DNow level performance out of 1.6ghz Jaguar cores to preempt the temptation of, ahem, enthusiasts trying to find loopholes or side-channel attacks which would help divulge the keys.

QUINTIX:
Snip.

This actually sounds really interesting and relevant to my interests. I just wish I had a better handle on what you're actually saying.

What I'm getting from this is "backwards compatibility and emulation is actually a lot more feasible than we've been led to believe." Is that accurate?

It also kinda sounds like you're giving these companies a lot of credit, though. I really doubt that your prediction will come to pass, not for technological reasons, but for bureaucratic ones. The suggestions you're making sound like too much of a leap from the status quo. Game companies, at least as far as I can tell, seem to prefer only the shallowest modes of innovation and change.

SteamBox here yet? I will continue as planned to not buy a console until the great console-pc singularity. They seem intent on inventing new ways alienate their customers. Used to be they tried to offer more goodie baskets than the other guy. Now they just withhold our favorite franchises until we sign them a Terms of Service blank check. No thanks...*fires up Smash Bros on GameCube makes a rude gesture*

This is just lazy of you, posting a old episode. Much have change in 6 months.

Arnoxthe1:
Why was this episode

WarpZone:
Nice to see this is still up-to-date.

wat? Microsoft reversed... all of their former policies for check-in's and used games. How is this video up to date on that?

Simple. The Xbone still sucks after the changes. They moved it from "much worse than the PS4" to "slightly worse than the 360 in terms of everything but graphics." The conclusion is still the same: Don't.

he seems to have ignored the steambox

WarpZone:
slightly worse than the 360 in terms of everything but graphics.

It's got a better controller, much slicker OS, and voice commands that actually work for the most part. And that power can serve for MUCH more than just graphics, not to mention all the sweet new IP's that are about to come out for the system. So yes, you definitely might want to check it out. This all for the most part goes for the PS4 too as well.

Arnoxthe1:

And that power can serve for MUCH more than just graphics...

It can, but it won't.
Because programming better AI, creating more intricate/interactive level design and making new mechanics in general takes more effort than increasing the degree of whatever Taylor Series they use in the physics engine or jacking up the gradient on the textures/lighting/geometry effects.

And the name of the game right now, at least for AAA, is "maximum pandering to the lowest common denominator at minimal effort". Which means boosting the most superficial elements of the game, like graphics and physics, while continuing to rely on the same narrowing set of "golden gameplay mechanics" they've been relying on for the last 5 years.

So...

...not to mention all the sweet new IP's that are about to come out for the system.

...expect more of the same, perhaps with a new name.
Honestly, I can find absolutely no reason get excited for this next console generation.

Atmos Duality:

Arnoxthe1:

And that power can serve for MUCH more than just graphics...

It can, but it won't.
Because programming better AI, creating more intricate/interactive level design and making new mechanics in general takes more effort than increasing the degree of whatever Taylor Series they use in the physics engine or jacking up the gradient on the textures/lighting/geometry effects.

And the name of the game right now, at least for AAA, is "maximum pandering to the lowest common denominator at minimal effort". Which means boosting the most superficial elements of the game, like graphics and physics, while continuing to rely on the same narrowing set of "golden gameplay mechanics" they've been relying on for the last 5 years.

So...

Actually, I read a couple articles detailing how the current gen of consoles are holding back what they can really do with games and there are a lot of devs that are quoted with saying how excited they are for the next gen.

Atmos Duality:
...expect more of the same, perhaps with a new name.
Honestly, I can find absolutely no reason get excited for this next console generation.

Nah, trust me. I've seen a detailed list on all of the exclusives that are coming out for the One and they all look pretty awesome. Also, have you seen this game? It's not an exclusive for any system but man, it looks amazing and it's just indie.

I know that it's tempting to be cynical but you'll be a lot happier if you also consider the good things as well as the bad.

commasplice:
What I'm getting from this is "backwards compatibility and emulation is actually a lot more feasible than we've been led to believe." Is that accurate?

Mostly, though outside of DosBox 386 semi-emulation I am actually not talking about emulation. At all.

Let me put it this way: The "uncore" parts responsible for input/output, video compositing/recording and system memory interface are custom, but the central and graphics processors are parts (technically die masks) straight from AMD's catalogue. In fact, they are available in ordinary desktops and laptops right now. When Sony said "super charged PC architecture" they meant it. Well, maybe not so much the super-charged part... anyways

Essentially, if any of these laptops can run an old game, be it directly in Windows or running under DosBox, there is very little stopping Microsoft from allowing the game to run on Xbox One. A little more is stopping Sony from running old windows games because the OS they made for the PS4 has the same foundation (BSD Unix) as Apple, but iirc there should already be a DosBox port to BSD Unix.

QUINTIX:

commasplice:
What I'm getting from this is "backwards compatibility and emulation is actually a lot more feasible than we've been led to believe." Is that accurate?

Mostly, though outside of DosBox 386 semi-emulation I am actually not talking about emulation. At all.

Let me put it this way: The "uncore" parts responsible for input/output, video compositing/recording and system memory interface are custom, but the central and graphics processors are parts (technically die masks) straight from AMD's catalogue. In fact, they are available in ordinary desktops and laptops right now. When Sony said "super charged PC architecture" they meant it. Well, maybe not so much the super-charged part... anyways

Essentially, if any of these laptops can run an old game, be it directly in Windows or running under DosBox, there is very little stopping Microsoft from allowing the game to run on Xbox One. A little more is stopping Sony from running old windows games because the OS they made for the PS4 has the same foundation (BSD Unix) as Apple, but iirc there should already be a DosBox port to BSD Unix.

Interesting. So instead of emulating old console games on the Xbone/PS4, they can do a negligible amount of work on the PC versions of those same old games and run them on the new consoles.

I like where this is going.

I've always wanted game companies to tastefully remaster their best old games and update them for newer systems for a fair price. They never seem to have the foresight or the direct, shareholder-friendly financial incentive to do so, but as things converge it seems more hopeful.

I've been frustrated with the lack of quality games from the games industry for a few years now. When I look back at games I used to play, there's usually some great, unique experience they had that games just don't have today. There are so many great old games that just need a little bit of work on the UI and tech side to get them current again.

While the increase in technology has done a lot for games, the ultimate factor of quality comes from the artists making the game and the environment they made it in. It seems outrageous to me that the most valuable, lighting-in-a-bottle gems are being left behind.

Branindain:

Your Fearless Captain:

Branindain:

Oh, and as someone who lives in a country...100x less murders than America

I looked this up and for that to be possible you would have to live in either Monaco or Palau both of which have a murder rate of 0. It's unlikely that you live in either but it is possible.

Lol, you got me. Deservedly so, since you actually bothered to fact check. I certainly didn't, hence the hyperbolic figure. Nonetheless, we have [a whole lot] less.

When I was Googling murder rates I was pretty surprised at far they had gone done. In the 90s several countries had rates well over 100, which is insane considering the current rate in the U.S. is around 4. Now though, the highest is Honduras with a rate of 91.6, which is 22 higher then #2, El Salvador.

That makes me wonder if there was some massive murder spree that some gang went on, or maybe tons of people emigrated out of the country or it really is that much more violent then the rest of the world. Interestingly, San Pedro Sula, a city in Honduras, has a murder rate of 158, which is a lot closer too the #2 city, Juaraz, Mexico. Mexico has a relatively low murder rate so that makes me think that in Honduras the violence is widespread where as in Mexico it's mainly in cities and alone drug trafficking routes.

Unrelated to Honduras but still related to murder rates, is the top fifty cities by murder rate only 5 are outside of North and South America, those being 4 in South Africa and 1 in Iraq. This speaks a lot about the kind of crimes by committed in the more violent places of the world. The fact that Mexico is 26 in murder rate but has 5 of the top 10 most violent cities on the planet says that the majority or the murders are in cities were as in most African countries with high murder rates it's far more widespread. The same for the America. New Orleans has the highest rate in the country with 57, that's 14x higher then the average of the country.

I'm going to stop because this is really rambley and I don't want to edit it down to something readable.

Arnoxthe1:

Actually, I read a couple articles detailing how the current gen of consoles are holding back what they can really do with games and there are a lot of devs that are quoted with saying how excited they are for the next gen.

Funny. I recall industry figureheads claiming the same exact thing about the previous generation (PS2/Xbox/Gamecube era), and that generation had even more variety in games and genres than the last one (PS3/360/Wii).

So forgive me if I'm not buying into this "we could do more than just graphics!" business again, because a lot of what worked mechanically in that generation was made dumber and shinier this recent generation.

Nah, trust me. I've seen a detailed list on all of the exclusives that are coming out for the One and they all look pretty awesome.

What list?
Nothing personal, but I'll trust something I can evaluate for myself over the word of a random person on the internet.

Also, have you seen this game? It's not an exclusive for any system but man, it looks amazing and it's just indie.

Well...that was a random plug but...Ok?

I know that it's tempting to be cynical but you'll be a lot happier if you also consider the good things as well as the bad.

I really try to not be so cynical, but damn does this business make it difficult.
Right now, I really have more reasons to avoid next gen consoles, than to even look at them.

Well the WiiU has more games if that counts for anything.

A repost?
I thought you better then this?
what the hell?

This is basically the same results I came to. I wanted to get a PS4 originally, and may someday when they fix the current problem I have with it: there is nothing I want to goddam play. So I took the $600 I set aside for a PS4 and some games and build a brand new computer that makes the new consoles look childish in comparison. =|

At least Nintendo has been getting things right with the 3DS, five exceptionally good games this year (FE: Awakening, Pokemon X, Dual Destinies, Weegee's Mansion, New Leaf), and they slapped SE with enough sense to localize Bravely Default to the rest of the world.

dantoddd:
he seems to have ignored the steambox

This whole thing is a repost from like 3 months ago or something.

Okay, so it's a repost.
You'd think he comment a bit on the video, or add or change something... SOMETHING to update this to the current state of things. I mean, a lot of what he said is now fairly irrelevant, though he's still pretty right on that "don't" conclusion. I was hoping to see something there where he added something to it or changed it somehow to reflect all the change that's happened. The consoles are all out now. The Wii U has a few genuinely worthwhile games on it. Kinect isn't mandatory.

No need for the repost, we can accept that maybe Yahtzee can get Christmas day off, it's not like he's never missed a week. Besides, this one seems very dated by now.

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Registered for a free account here