Zero Punctuation: Super Smash Bros. Brawl

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No you're not. That guy generally doesn't think he is. It's of a paradoxical nature. Or, at least the very annoying ones don't.

I disagree with his overall opinion but it was quite funny anyways.

But then again he hates fighting games - so really this was a pointless exercise.

Agreed, to some point. Exercise in comedy at the least.

megablitz:
as if it were Hitler or something,

Godwin has been called! Thread Locks.

I haven't read this whole thing, but has anyone commented on the fanboyism going the other way? I mean, look at the first page of comments. Yahtzee reviews game, and theres 500 people who agree with him completely! YOU'RE the fanboys! That being said, I liked the review. I also like SSBB.

these dam fighting games piss me off becos u always get that cunt who thinks he's brilliant at the dam game because he can randomly smash all the buttons at the same dam time... and there just shit anyway.
Oh and also i'm a crazy fan girl and i want my yahtzee hat!!!

The_root_of_all_evil:

megablitz:
as if it were Hitler or something,

Godwin has been called! Thread Locks.

lmfao.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law

I think your joke would be funnier though if I wasn't the only one who understood it though, hence the above linkage.

Post 706 is rather ironic if read immediately after 705, i.e., in order. And such poor grammar...

I wonder how much of this Yahtzee has read, laughing at us from behind his computer. I would be.

Uszi:
lmfao.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law

I think your joke would be funnier though if I wasn't the only one who understood it though, hence the above linkage.

"Reducto ad Hitlerum". What more needs to be said? =D

Uszi:

The_root_of_all_evil:

megablitz:
as if it were Hitler or something,

Godwin has been called! Thread Locks.

lmfao.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwins_law

I think your joke would be funnier though if I wasn't the only one who understood it though, hence the above linkage.

Dude... everyone on the internet knows what Godwin's Law is...

...I didn't know...

144:
I wonder how much of this Yahtzee has read, laughing at us from behind his computer. I would be.

I don't know. I don't find the reaction funny... rather COMPELLING. He must be saying "Ok, now this is amusing."

The_root_of_all_evil:

megablitz:
as if it were Hitler or something,

Godwin has been called! Thread Locks.

The Nazis have already been cited
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.58918?page=11#445682
(Being sick = a lot of spare time to fully appreciate wank-fests.)

The_root_of_all_evil:

megablitz:
as if it were Hitler or something,

Godwin has been called! Thread Locks.

I'm nooooooooot in the mood to go back all those 666+ posts, but Godwin has been called a loooong time ago in this one ;)

EDIT: someone was in the mood >.>

And no lock plz :'( almost 1k

OT: SSBB rules 8)

I have to say its about time someone finally started pointing out that nintendo are STILL going on with their damned little franchise, I just hope they come up with a decent new character sometime soon

For each person that tells me, "Uszi, I already knew about Godwin's Law," I am certain there are three more people who will learn of it today for the first time.

Or, at least, that's what I tell myself.

Wow. I can't believe this. Something actually forced me to speak in an internet forum. I hope I can stand the jibbering chimps long enough to get out alive.

Yahtzee should be ashamed of himself for this review. The only possible point that I sympathize with him on is that he was basically forced to review a game that he had no interest in, so of course the end result isn't going to be much fun, but that gives him no excuse for throwing his "cherished reviewer integrity" out the window.

Personally, I believe that Yahtzee's review of Brawl was incredibly unfair, and I believe that I have the right to assert that opinion more the he or more than 95% of the people that have posted in this thread because I have actually, you know, actually played the game at all. But more importantly and seriously, he did two things that should be sacrelige to any professional game reviewer that don't have any bearing on my personal opinons of the game:

As a reviewer, he started losing credability when he 1.) did not even make an effort to experience -near- the game's full content before making a judgment on it, and (most importantly) he 2.) made statements about the game in his review that I know to be 100% inaccurate. I don't mean than his opinions on the game's quality differ from mine, I mean that he made statements of fact about the game's features that are plain and simply wrong.

Snake and Sonic taking over 10 hours of gameplay to unlock? I had Snake unlocked within half an hour of the game's power being on for the first time and I wasn't even consciously trying. If you really were you could probably have him in five minutes. And you unlock Sonic just for playing a certain number of multiplayer matches (along with most of the unlockable characters in the game, by the way.) You know, multiplayer? The thing he was complaining about not getting to play because you "had to unlock everything in single-player?" My friends and I had Sonic out within maybe two hours tops.

And button mashing does not get you anywhere in Smash Bros. As a matter of fact it's what sets it apart from most fighting games, whose very nature force you to study command lists for 15 years before playing easy mode. Smash Bros was designed to be "minute to learn, lifetime to master." So when you play it for, by your own admission, "one vodka fueled evening" and assume that you've experienced even half the game's content, you seem to be wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

I guess, by now everything I've said is being written off as the flailings of a "fanboy." Well, I am a male and a fan of the game, so I guess that description is apt, but I love how Yahtzee and every other sore loser who wants to sound like one of the cool kids by saying that a game released by Nintendo is shit is able to validate disregarding every opinion people on the dissending side of the argument have by saying the magical three words: "You're a fanboy," and patting themselves on the backs at their clever retort.

Well, guess what guys? In this particular case, you are the minority. Gamers who play and genuinely enjoy the Smash Bros franchise far outnumber those who don't. There's a reason for that: the games are innovative, the gameplay is easy to pick up while still being gratifying to improve at, and best of all, the games are just raw fun.

Remember FUN, Yahtzee? -Back before gaming started feeling like a second job?-

Ooo, wow. You think Yahtzee's right? YOU, sir are a Yahtzee fanboy!

Think he's wrong? Then YOU, my dear chap, are a Nintendo fanboy!

Hang on a minute...

*chin scratching*

I think I'm going to sit on the fence and shout abuse at both sides for this one.

[/sarcasm]

ArchmageDale:
Wow. I can't believe this. Something actually forced me to speak in an internet forum. I hope I can stand the jibbering chimps long enough to get out alive.

Yahtzee should be ashamed of himself for this review. The only possible point that I sympathize with him on is that he was basically forced to review a game that he had no interest in, so of course the end result isn't going to be much fun, but that gives him no excuse for throwing his "cherished reviewer integrity" out the window.

Personally, I believe that Yahtzee's review of Brawl was incredibly unfair, and I believe that I have the right to assert that opinion more the he or more than 95% of the people that have posted in this thread because I have actually, you know, actually played the game at all. But more importantly and seriously, he did two things that should be sacrelige to any professional game reviewer that don't have any bearing on my personal opinons of the game:

As a reviewer, he started losing credability when he 1.) did not even make an effort to experience -near- the game's full content before making a judgment on it, and (most importantly) he 2.) made statements about the game in his review that I know to be 100% inaccurate. I don't mean than his opinions on the game's quality differ from mine, I mean that he made statements of fact about the game's features that are plain and simply wrong.

Snake and Sonic taking over 10 hours of gameplay to unlock? I had Snake unlocked within half an hour of the game's power being on for the first time and I wasn't even consciously trying. If you really were you could probably have him in five minutes. And you unlock Sonic just for playing a certain number of multiplayer matches (along with most of the unlockable characters in the game, by the way.) You know, multiplayer? The thing he was complaining about not getting to play because you "had to unlock everything in single-player?" My friends and I had Sonic out within maybe two hours tops.

And button mashing does not get you anywhere in Smash Bros. As a matter of fact it's what sets it apart from most fighting games, whose very nature force you to study command lists for 15 years before playing easy mode. Smash Bros was designed to be "minute to learn, lifetime to master." So when you play it for, by your own admission, "one vodka fueled evening" and assume that you've experienced even half the game's content, you seem to be wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

I guess, by now everything I've said is being written off as the flailings of a "fanboy." Well, I am a male and a fan of the game, so I guess that description is apt, but I love how Yahtzee and every other sore loser who wants to sound like one of the cool kids by saying that a game released by Nintendo is shit is able to validate disregarding every opinion people on the dissending side of the argument have by saying the magical three words: "You're a fanboy," and patting themselves on the backs at their clever retort.

Well, guess what guys? In this particular case, you are the minority. Gamers who play and genuinely enjoy the Smash Bros franchise far outnumber those who don't. There's a reason for that: the games are innovative, the gameplay is easy to pick up while still being gratifying to improve at, and best of all, the games are just raw fun.

Remember FUN, Yahtzee? -Back before gaming started feeling like a second job?-

This man is exactly right.

Oh good, holy lord in heaven.

It's called COMEDY for the love of God!!!!!

Humour, you know, like ha ha ha, that was rather funny and so on? Is that not what Yahtzee is about, making us laugh with his witty, cutting reviews, you know, HIS JOB?! THE REASON HE'S GOTTEN SUCH FAME IS BEACUSE IT'S FUNNY.

I LOVED SSBB, and I LOVED this review, because it made me laugh, and anyone, ANYONE who got "offended" is a fucking idiot.

IT'S A GAME. Jesus CHRIST.

EvilToaster:

ArchmageDale:
Wow. I can't believe this. Something actually forced me to speak in an internet forum. I hope I can stand the jibbering chimps long enough to get out alive.

Yahtzee should be ashamed of himself for this review. The only possible point that I sympathize with him on is that he was basically forced to review a game that he had no interest in, so of course the end result isn't going to be much fun, but that gives him no excuse for throwing his "cherished reviewer integrity" out the window.

Personally, I believe that Yahtzee's review of Brawl was incredibly unfair, and I believe that I have the right to assert that opinion more the he or more than 95% of the people that have posted in this thread because I have actually, you know, actually played the game at all. But more importantly and seriously, he did two things that should be sacrelige to any professional game reviewer that don't have any bearing on my personal opinons of the game:

As a reviewer, he started losing credability when he 1.) did not even make an effort to experience -near- the game's full content before making a judgment on it, and (most importantly) he 2.) made statements about the game in his review that I know to be 100% inaccurate. I don't mean than his opinions on the game's quality differ from mine, I mean that he made statements of fact about the game's features that are plain and simply wrong.

Snake and Sonic taking over 10 hours of gameplay to unlock? I had Snake unlocked within half an hour of the game's power being on for the first time and I wasn't even consciously trying. If you really were you could probably have him in five minutes. And you unlock Sonic just for playing a certain number of multiplayer matches (along with most of the unlockable characters in the game, by the way.) You know, multiplayer? The thing he was complaining about not getting to play because you "had to unlock everything in single-player?" My friends and I had Sonic out within maybe two hours tops.

And button mashing does not get you anywhere in Smash Bros. As a matter of fact it's what sets it apart from most fighting games, whose very nature force you to study command lists for 15 years before playing easy mode. Smash Bros was designed to be "minute to learn, lifetime to master." So when you play it for, by your own admission, "one vodka fueled evening" and assume that you've experienced even half the game's content, you seem to be wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

I guess, by now everything I've said is being written off as the flailings of a "fanboy." Well, I am a male and a fan of the game, so I guess that description is apt, but I love how Yahtzee and every other sore loser who wants to sound like one of the cool kids by saying that a game released by Nintendo is shit is able to validate disregarding every opinion people on the dissending side of the argument have by saying the magical three words: "You're a fanboy," and patting themselves on the backs at their clever retort.

Well, guess what guys? In this particular case, you are the minority. Gamers who play and genuinely enjoy the Smash Bros franchise far outnumber those who don't. There's a reason for that: the games are innovative, the gameplay is easy to pick up while still being gratifying to improve at, and best of all, the games are just raw fun.

Remember FUN, Yahtzee? -Back before gaming started feeling like a second job?-

This man is exactly right.

So is this one.

Yahtzee called it. He should really be afraid of his mailbox now. :)

Although I don't agree with some of his points, I can definitely see where he is coming from, and he raised some good issues. Such as the wonky camera.

ayoama:

The_root_of_all_evil:

megablitz:
as if it were Hitler or something,

Godwin has been called! Thread Locks.

The Nazis have already been cited
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.58918?page=11#445682
(Being sick = a lot of spare time to fully appreciate wank-fests.)

And it was then revised to British Imperialism.

Sparkly-elf:
Oh good, holy lord in heaven.

It's called COMEDY for the love of God!!!!!

Humour, you know, like ha ha ha, that was rather funny and so on? Is that not what Yahtzee is about, making us laugh with his witty, cutting reviews, you know, HIS JOB?! THE REASON HE'S GOTTEN SUCH FAME IS BEACUSE IT'S FUNNY.

I LOVED SSBB, and I LOVED this review, because it made me laugh, and anyone, ANYONE who got "offended" is a fucking idiot.

IT'S A GAME. Jesus CHRIST.

Hey, don't get me wrong. I'm a longtime Yahtzee fan, and this is far from the first time he has given a negative review to a franchise I like. Case in point: Resident Evil. One of my favorite franchises ever, Yahtzee clearly isn't a fan. That's okay. RE isn't for everyone, and I totally see where he's coming from on some of the things he said about it. He has also made a great deal of reviews that I completely agree with him on.

This one is different because he isn't giving the game a fair shake and he isn't backing up his statements with fact.

Oh, and as far as people who "got offended by it being fucking idiots," well that was probably because he pretty much came right out and said "this game is stupid, and if you like it you are stupid." Actually, I think his exact wording was "jibbering fanboy twats," or something close to it. So, yes, I was mildly offended... because he was directly insulting me. That's kind of the textbook definition of being offended. Negative reviews are fine, but when you start directly stating that a person is stupid for their tastes in games (something that members of gaming culture are notoriously bad about) that's when you've crossed the line.

Heaven knows I'm not trying to start a flame war here, geez. I'm just trying to make sure the other side of the coin is seen.

Joined to vote Valve:

EvilToaster:

ArchmageDale:
Wow. I can't believe this. Something actually forced me to speak in an internet forum. I hope I can stand the jibbering chimps long enough to get out alive.

Yahtzee should be ashamed of himself for this review. The only possible point that I sympathize with him on is that he was basically forced to review a game that he had no interest in, so of course the end result isn't going to be much fun, but that gives him no excuse for throwing his "cherished reviewer integrity" out the window.

Personally, I believe that Yahtzee's review of Brawl was incredibly unfair, and I believe that I have the right to assert that opinion more the he or more than 95% of the people that have posted in this thread because I have actually, you know, actually played the game at all. But more importantly and seriously, he did two things that should be sacrelige to any professional game reviewer that don't have any bearing on my personal opinons of the game:

As a reviewer, he started losing credability when he 1.) did not even make an effort to experience -near- the game's full content before making a judgment on it, and (most importantly) he 2.) made statements about the game in his review that I know to be 100% inaccurate. I don't mean than his opinions on the game's quality differ from mine, I mean that he made statements of fact about the game's features that are plain and simply wrong.

Snake and Sonic taking over 10 hours of gameplay to unlock? I had Snake unlocked within half an hour of the game's power being on for the first time and I wasn't even consciously trying. If you really were you could probably have him in five minutes. And you unlock Sonic just for playing a certain number of multiplayer matches (along with most of the unlockable characters in the game, by the way.) You know, multiplayer? The thing he was complaining about not getting to play because you "had to unlock everything in single-player?" My friends and I had Sonic out within maybe two hours tops.

And button mashing does not get you anywhere in Smash Bros. As a matter of fact it's what sets it apart from most fighting games, whose very nature force you to study command lists for 15 years before playing easy mode. Smash Bros was designed to be "minute to learn, lifetime to master." So when you play it for, by your own admission, "one vodka fueled evening" and assume that you've experienced even half the game's content, you seem to be wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

I guess, by now everything I've said is being written off as the flailings of a "fanboy." Well, I am a male and a fan of the game, so I guess that description is apt, but I love how Yahtzee and every other sore loser who wants to sound like one of the cool kids by saying that a game released by Nintendo is shit is able to validate disregarding every opinion people on the dissending side of the argument have by saying the magical three words: "You're a fanboy," and patting themselves on the backs at their clever retort.

Well, guess what guys? In this particular case, you are the minority. Gamers who play and genuinely enjoy the Smash Bros franchise far outnumber those who don't. There's a reason for that: the games are innovative, the gameplay is easy to pick up while still being gratifying to improve at, and best of all, the games are just raw fun.

Remember FUN, Yahtzee? -Back before gaming started feeling like a second job?-

This man is exactly right.

So is this one.

How is it that there is always someone who is thinking exactly what you are, but can state it better.

And once more, if this is wrong, please tell me why, but -

How is the play needed to unlock Sonic or Snake any different from having to play through the setlist on any Guitar Hero game to get to the much hyped final tier? One and Number Of The Beast were featured in the hype for Guitar Hero III just as strongly as Sonic and Snake. I may be missing something, but they look to be exactly the same situations. The oint is, if he took such offence to it in this review, and did not mention it at all in the Guitar Hero III review, then he is just exhibiting a double standard.

Titanium Dragon:
Incidentally, all of you praising Yahtzee for "sticking it to this game" are, in fact, as bad or worse than the people who were yelling for Yahtzee to review the thing in the first place. Why? Because you guys are exactly the same as those people, except you want him to heap vitrolic hatred on the game. You want someone who agrees with you and are praising him for knocking on the game, because you want to say "Ha ha someone said SSBB sucks", probably to win some argument with your friends. Grow up.

If that's the sort of person you are then you are that guy; not that guy who is better at games, but that guy who everyone realizes over time somehow became their friend but is a jerk and they really don't want to hang out with him because he is mean, obnoxious, and acts like a twelve year old. Seriously. Nice as it is to feel validated, if your opinions need external validation then they are pretty worthless. Don't be afraid to hold your own opinions, but if you must back them up with what some random online reviewer said then you really do need to get a life.

You should not particularly care that he "stuck it to the game"; as far as I and many other viewers are concerned, the purpose of Zero Punctuation is not so much to review games as to give us five minutes of pure unadulterated joy and laughter per week in the context of a game review. We all love to see Yahtzee insult games; he's quite good at it. But when he starts insulting people he just falls down because it just isn't quite as funny and there really isn't all that much new ground to cover - everyone has said pretty much everything insulting there is to say about gamers, and it really just isn't all that funny anymore because we've seen it done twenty thousand times already.

His review was spot on and funny IMHO. Maybe it wasn't for you this time, but I'm not sure who made you think that your opinion mattered, especially seeing as the part where he complain about having to review the game is a direct jab at people trying to tell him how to do his stuff.

If something requires you to agree with the person for it to be funny, then it isn't actually funny at all.

But more to the point, I'm not telling him what to do but rather stating my opinion - that this week's work was of inferior quality. If you don't ever get useful feedback, if you try something different (which this week seemed like) and don't really know whether or not people liked it, then what's the point of having feedback at all? A hall of mirrors is hardly helpful, and my goal was to let him know that at least one of his viewers felt let down.

As much as I'm sure everyone's favorite English-born Australian would like to hit it out of the park every time (and as much as we'd like for him to do so), I felt he didn't this week and thought this was the appropriate venue in which to put forward that opinion.

Yathzee is a little sparkle of light in a world full of darkness. That darkness is mainly the money and interests that are driving the videogame industry. He's the only one who has the integrity to not kneel before the power of the videogaming majors and mindlessly prasining their sub-par products only beacuse they MUST be considered masterpieces, regardless of their real value.
He's my hero.

You can tell the amount a game relies on the faith of its followers to plug up its shortcomings by how vehemently they defend it, at 728 posts, i think my point is made.

Ultrajoe:
You can tell the amount a game relies on the faith of its followers to plug up its shortcomings by how vehemently they defend it, at 728 posts, i think my point is made.

The same could be said for Yahtzee himself.

Ultrajoe:
You can tell the amount a game relies on the faith of its followers to plug up its shortcomings by how vehemently they defend it, at 728 posts, i think my point is made.

You're crazy.

ArchmageDale:
Actually, I think his exact wording was "jibbering fanboy twats," or something close to it. So, yes, I was mildly offended... because he was directly insulting me.

I read this and actually had to go back and watch the review. I enyojed it far more than before, and here's why: The TWAT fanboy commentary was directed at the guy that writes hatemail because he did a negative review for Smash Brothers. True, he actually wanted to play the game to play as Sonic, and what got him pissed the most was that you had to UNLOCK him.
He refered to fanboys ONCE: When he said "You'll like the game EVEN if you haven't played it if you defended the Wii name when it came out". Come on, he actually didn't insult anyone. I encourage you to go back, forgetting there's around 18 pages of people saying how much the game sucks, and I bet you'll enjoy it a lot more.

Screw you guys, Im going home.

ArchmageDale:
Snake and Sonic taking over 10 hours of gameplay to unlock? I had Snake unlocked within half an hour of the game's power being on for the first time and I wasn't even consciously trying. If you really were you could probably have him in five minutes. And you unlock Sonic just for playing a certain number of multiplayer matches (along with most of the unlockable characters in the game, by the way.) You know, multiplayer? The thing he was complaining about not getting to play because you "had to unlock everything in single-player?" My friends and I had Sonic out within maybe two hours tops.

The "certain number of multiplayer matches" to unlock Sonic is 300.

2 hours tops means you would have had to play 2.5 matches every minute.

See, that unfortunately means that you don't have a point here. Ok. So, what I would have done not having a point is I would have not typed anything? But you seem to have taken a different route.

Ultrajoe:
You can tell the amount a game relies on the faith of its followers to plug up its shortcomings by how vehemently they defend it, at 728 posts, i think my point is made.

But most of those posts are supporting Yahtzee...

From what I've read it looks like hater-trolls out number rabid-fanboys. But there are some pretty good posts that are quite true on either side of the argument.

Ragdrazi:

The "certain number of multiplayer matches" to unlock Sonic is 300.

No, that can't be. I remember fighting him quite early. Did you get that from gamefaqs? I think it's wrong because it said R.O.B. is only 160 but I never got him until I suffered through the singleplayer.

edit: it's probably a typo, cause I think it was 30 matches in that I fought him.

Simon_TR:

Ultrajoe:
You can tell the amount a game relies on the faith of its followers to plug up its shortcomings by how vehemently they defend it, at 728 posts, i think my point is made.

But most of those posts are supporting Yahtzee...

From what I've read it looks like hater-trolls out number rabid-fanboys. But there are some pretty good posts that are quite true on either side of the argument.

true, but given Yahtzee as an online review, it a given that it does rely on the faith of its followers, thats the point of a fanbase for such a review, my point is that a game should not need to rely on spit and prayers

not that i think brawl is bad, i just think my comment is relevant, spit and prayers isnt bad if it works, for the 40K players out there: It works for the Orks, why not Brawl?

EDIT: man, you must have got in just before me BTW: we look to be coming up on longest thread ever, keep it coming

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