Zero Punctuation: Webcomics

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purple rain, there isn't a hate for CAD, really just the topic of conversation.

Poor taste saying we should focus our time on solving issues of world racism (KKK) rather than post to this thread. I know you didn't quite mean it like that, but it comes off that way.

You like CAD? Enjoy CAD then. Fine. I like VGCats, but I will say that Ramossair (however the hell you spell it) is a quality "hit or miss"er and posts every Monday like I have a third testicle (No offense to anyone who may suffer an actual medical condition that has resulted in a third testicle).

I think CAD is more dull than funny or informative. How is that a hate rant? And how is that any more pointless than you saying you love all of your web comic children equally?

A-wel Cruiz:
Getting off the "Yahtzee sucks/CAD sucks!" train for just a second, would anyone else buy that Gears of War "put one foot forward" shirt if Yahtzee offered it?

It's not even funny, and most people wont get it,,
But thats the whole idea!

3 shirts please,
=D

The man is just nitpicking now... Seriously If this pointless pandering and hatemongering just to seem like a jerk keeps up I really am considering just giving up on this whole thing. Considering ZP fits into the whole "Web comic/Net cartoon" niche quite nicely I would say that in and of itself is hypocritical, especially considering his humor in most cases is very much the same. It really takes away from the funny when he acts like a jerk for the sake of acting like a jerk and its just another sign of a pattern he has been going down. Now I admit web comics are not for everyone, thats fine. Most people are not going to like OOtS or Penny Arcade or other such but really when the man just keeps bashing people for things he does himself. I admit that the whole MGS4 one was debatable and thats part of why I gave up (nobody would listen/understood) but we are talking about a man who not only works in the SAME VENUE but has the SAME SENSE OF HUMOR.

I know I am going to get slammed for this but the fact is the pot is calling the kettle black. A man making net cartoons which are already more or less stop frame progression by nature (Similar to a long net comic with poor as hell animation being played pannel by pannel) and the fact that he makes similar observations...

You know what? at this point I am willing to guess he is just waiting around for people to call him out on this.

I hate my fathers laptop and the double posts it causes.

TerraMGP:
Most people are not going to like OOtS or Penny Arcade or other such but really when the man just keeps bashing people for things he does himself.

You know, I just learned of OotS through this thread, and it's freaking awesome. The most verbose comic I've ever read, but there's something to be said for the story that Rich has crafted.

http://www.giantitp.com/index.html

Tempdude0:

PurpleRain:
I don't hate CAD. I read it every so often. I don't see this big hate rant on it. I could understand if people pentented this anger against... hmm, lets say the KKK, for a sec. I don't find anything wrong with CAD. I like Penny Arcade equally, and I'm a huge XKCD and Concerned fan too. Sigh, this is pointless.

Find the post about the denigration of the medium, it should clear up any nagging questions you may have about why people hate it with the white hot intensity of a thousand suns. If not, check out any of the WALL OF TEXT posts. There's plenty of them from a bunch of different people and all of them should help fill in the gaps.

So? If people hate it, then why do they have to rant about it? It may not be the best, but it's certainly not killing anyone inside. It's just one of those things, if you don't like it, stop looking at it. It's not hard. I don't like Ginger so I never eat it. I don't complain about how much I hate it. I've never gotten that with people and that's the point I was trying to make.

mark_n_b:
purple rain, there isn't a hate for CAD, really just the topic of conversation.

Poor taste saying we should focus our time on solving issues of world racism (KKK) rather than post to this thread. I know you didn't quite mean it like that, but it comes off that way.

You like CAD? Enjoy CAD then. Fine. I like VGCats, but I will say that Ramossair (however the hell you spell it) is a quality "hit or miss"er and posts every Monday like I have a third testicle (No offense to anyone who may suffer an actual medical condition that has resulted in a third testicle).

I think CAD is more dull than funny or informative. How is that a hate rant? And how is that any more pointless than you saying you love all of your web comic children equally?

(blinks)

as a pointless de-lay here's a forum...of ZP...yes
if you dont like it then wtf dont click
its that obvious

www.zeropunctuation.proboards80.com

hey i got the vids from this site w/ embedding so dont hassle me bout tht :]

Edit: sry I don't have ths vid up yet...for some reason it won't load. Oh well, when I get on another comp.

TerraMGP:
The man is just nitpicking now... Seriously If this pointless pandering and hatemongering just to seem like a jerk keeps up I really am considering just giving up on this whole thing. Considering ZP fits into the whole "Web comic/Net cartoon" niche quite nicely I would say that in and of itself is hypocritical, especially considering his humor in most cases is very much the same. It really takes away from the funny when he acts like a jerk for the sake of acting like a jerk and its just another sign of a pattern he has been going down. Now I admit web comics are not for everyone, thats fine. Most people are not going to like OOtS or Penny Arcade or other such but really when the man just keeps bashing people for things he does himself. I admit that the whole MGS4 one was debatable and thats part of why I gave up (nobody would listen/understood) but we are talking about a man who not only works in the SAME VENUE but has the SAME SENSE OF HUMOR.

I know I am going to get slammed for this but the fact is the pot is calling the kettle black. A man making net cartoons which are already more or less stop frame progression by nature (Similar to a long net comic with poor as hell animation being played pannel by pannel) and the fact that he makes similar observations...

You know what? at this point I am willing to guess he is just waiting around for people to call him out on this.

Or you're a twit. I remember you from that damnable MGS debate. Perhaps I should start beating my head against the wall that is your poor debating in the hopes that people will once again start making well reasoned arguments once you've left.

Eh, screw it. I've got nothing better to do.

The "humor" isn't all that similar. I don't see Yahtzee pointing out the game "Alone in the Dark" takes place alone and in the dark har he har he har, except perhaps to say how stupid that is. That's not even a joke, it's an observation, and going even further it's a blatantly obvious one. It'd be like chuckling at someone calling the sky blue. "Ye gods, it IS blue, truly you are a laugh riot."

That little paragraph as an aside, what things do he and Buckley have in common? Aside from both working with games and humor of sorts, I fail to see any other parallels.

Quick reference to the MGS thing again, we all understood, we just thought you were a pillock, even the people on your side...I see that happening again. Well, assuming more people with an ounce of debating skills pop up.

Again, nifty, they aren't really the same "venue", but I don't care enough to go into the differences. As for the humor, in what way are they the same? Here, Cosby and Mitch Hedberg. Both talked about drugs and yet their comedy really isn't that similar.

I...That's like saying Disney is equatable to Marvel Comics. Way to not understand differences in mediums. Next you'll be telling me swimming is kind of like professional boxing, both have movement and one is fluid while the other is IN fluid. I swear, that single paragraph is so nonsensical I can't even describe it's level of absurdity appropriately.

PurpleRain:

Tempdude0:

PurpleRain:
I don't hate CAD. I read it every so often. I don't see this big hate rant on it. I could understand if people pentented this anger against... hmm, lets say the KKK, for a sec. I don't find anything wrong with CAD. I like Penny Arcade equally, and I'm a huge XKCD and Concerned fan too. Sigh, this is pointless.

Find the post about the denigration of the medium, it should clear up any nagging questions you may have about why people hate it with the white hot intensity of a thousand suns. If not, check out any of the WALL OF TEXT posts. There's plenty of them from a bunch of different people and all of them should help fill in the gaps.

So? If people hate it, then why do they have to rant about it? It may not be the best, but it's certainly not killing anyone inside. It's just one of those things, if you don't like it, stop looking at it. It's not hard. I don't like Ginger so I never eat it. I don't complain about how much I hate it. I've never gotten that with people and that's the point I was trying to make.

mark_n_b:
purple rain, there isn't a hate for CAD, really just the topic of conversation.

Poor taste saying we should focus our time on solving issues of world racism (KKK) rather than post to this thread. I know you didn't quite mean it like that, but it comes off that way.

You like CAD? Enjoy CAD then. Fine. I like VGCats, but I will say that Ramossair (however the hell you spell it) is a quality "hit or miss"er and posts every Monday like I have a third testicle (No offense to anyone who may suffer an actual medical condition that has resulted in a third testicle).

I think CAD is more dull than funny or informative. How is that a hate rant? And how is that any more pointless than you saying you love all of your web comic children equally?

(blinks)

My point was...You didn't go back and read it, did you? All it would have taken is to go to each page and ctrl-f the word "denigration" or "denigrates" or "standards" or "medium" and you would have stumbled upon it. I took the time to read what you had to say, could you at least extend the same courtesy?

Uh, to summarize mark_n_b, the idea is that stating dislike of something is tantamount to your statements proclaiming your enjoyment of it. Both are relatively pointless in that they don't add to the discussion, yet one is seen as worse than the other for some reason. Essentially, he's calling everyone who has posted the "don't like it, don't read it." argument and all those similar hypocrites.

At least that's what I'm getting out of it...I'm now sad that I didn't make that statement first.

MercFox1:

TerraMGP:
Most people are not going to like OOtS or Penny Arcade or other such but really when the man just keeps bashing people for things he does himself.

You know, I just learned of OotS through this thread, and it's freaking awesome. The most verbose comic I've ever read, but there's something to be said for the story that Rich has crafted.

http://www.giantitp.com/index.html

Oh yeah it is quite verbose, especially when Roy or V start blathering away, but for basically being stick figures those are some of the most expressive character models I've ever seen, it is also fairly well written.

TerraMPG: ZP isn't a webcomic in any way, that's like calling X-play a comic for gaming nerds, sure they do similar things but they fill in completely different niches one makes fun of games the other judges them from a rather elitist point of view, it just happens that this judgment is freaking hilarious. By reading CAD you will never know if you may or may not like a game because it will never express enough about a game unless that game is so awesome you only need to say a handful of words about it to get across how awesome it is. By watching ZP you will know fairly quickly (at least within 4 minutes) on whether or not the game is worth taking a look at, for example I played SSBM for the spectacle and the silly combat, I would do the same for SSBB because I now know that the very same spectacle and goofy combat styling is still there.

Meh. lots of comics go through Cerebrus Syndrome. I don't see what the big deal is.

Salad Is Murder:
Can you show me conclusive evidence that there are, in fact, no ball's in his mouth at this time?

I cannot show conclusive evidence that unicorns do not, in fact, exist or that Saddam Hussein did not, in fact, ever have any WMDs.

Lord_Seth:
In fairness, some of the criticism at him has nothing to do with his comic. Much of it comes from the fact he comes across as an egomaniac OUTSIDE of the comic.

I wasn't aware that you or anyone else who posts on these boards knows Buckley personally.

Evilducks:
Considering what made Buckley popular was essentially trolling games, I don't think it really is much different than what posters are doing here. Last time I checked Buckley doesn't create the games he seems to enjoy mocking. Sure, he does it with colorful pictures, but it really isn't any different than what is happening here.

I'm trying and am succeeding at the things I want to do in life and I choose to mock things I have no desire to do. You're stating the same tired argument that Buckley likes to use: "Lets see you do better." I don't have to be great at something to recognize when something else is bad.

1)Making a webcomic that has gaming humor is not equivalent to trolling or ridiculing a man for no other reason than you don't like his webcomic/website. Furthermore, (I am fairly certain, although not sure) Buckley does not resort to unwarranted, juvenile personal attacks of game developers. And even if he did, that gives you no excuse to be as sophmoric as he.

2)That you are "suceeding at the things you want to do in life" is complete heresay.

3)My argument is very different from "Let's see you do better." You can criticize something that you think is crappy all you want. Like I said, I do not wish to stifle any critcism of his webcomic. My argument is that there is no justifiable reason to personally attack him because you don't like his webcomic.

Tempdude0:
I hate him not because of his failures, but because of his actions as a person. I also think less of people who fail specifically because they instigated their failure. If a runner attempts to win a race but decides to shoot himself in the foot halfway through, he has lost my respect. Buckley did this by jumping back and forth between the "drama" and the "humor". Had he attempted to see it through I may have thought him a 'tard for attempting such a serious subject in a humor comic and more so a subject so beyond his skills as a writer to do well, but I would have respected the attempt at doing something deeper than his normal shtick. I wouldn't have LIKED it, but at least he's trying to do something a bit different.

I was not aware you knew him personally. (I feel like I'm repeating myself at this point)
Also the analogy is flawed. A runner who shoots himself in the foot in the middle of a race clearly has no desire to succeed. Buckley made a genuine attempt to create a dramatic narrative. A more apt analogy would be if a champion runner injured himself playing football, a sport he should not be playing if he wants to continue to be successful as a runner. You can criticize him as a professional athlete, because clearly playing football is not the best decision to make if you're training for a race, but you have no reason to criticize him as a person. Similarly, Buckley can be criticized as an artist but, contrary to popular belief/practice, online message boards are no place for personal attacks.

[Edited for spelling]

not funny to me. Negativity upon negativity upon negativity. I mean, your stuff is always cutting in one way or another, and I know there are SO MANY people out there who love to just sit and laugh at making fun of others. But personally, I like to laugh, or be educated. I do find this series to be very original and I do enjoy most of them, but not this one.

Some of the old newpaper comics did this way back in the day, try to be funny one week and the next have the characters diagnosed with alzhiemers/cancer/gunshots/dies in car wreck.

Crankshaft, Winkerbean, Better or Worse, to name a few.

TerraMGP:
GARBLEFARBLEWANKETYDUM

I missed the part where he trumpeted the almighty godliness of his own work.

And I suppose him being in that trough of shit with the other webcomic "artists" was because he has a neck-deep scat fetish or something.

I don't read webcomics at all, but I still found this review funny and relevant. I do, however, still feel that Yahtzee has sold out. Now even more so, because he obviously thinks it's okay. Yahtzee! What have you done?! It didn't used to be like this with the Escapist!

The CAD Rule

Take out dialogue except in first panel (optional although recommended) - remove panel 2 and 3 - and keep 4. This will result in a funnier comic, well, most of the time, some can't be saved.

image

image

image

I only think a few are really that funny (mainly Guitar Hero, and "Bomberman") but I'm sure the rest of you will get a kick out of it.

Hes going to need to do a doubleheader mailbag showdown for webcomics and MGS4.

i like how he says in the end he didn't mention any names....no, he just used "Bontrol Bolt Belete" at 2:14. pretty funny

Wasn't Tim Buckley a musician that died in the 70s from a drug overdose?

OMG someone beat Yahtzee to the miscarriage of the IMP.

image

heerthefood:
i like how he says in the end he didn't mention any names....no, he just used "Bontrol Bolt Belete" at 2:14. pretty funny

I saw "benny BARCAD" or something near the end too...

To Fisher_King

He seemed to have a genuine desire to succeed initially, but then went back to "joke a day" format in the middle of it. I realize a person may want a break once in a while but that terrible timing is tantamount to shooting yourself in the foot. Unless he's a special kind of stupid, he should know this.

I do like your analogy though. More apt than mine. That said, the man has displayed a ridiculous level of dickery. Now, I may not know him personally, but take this for example. That one guy who played Kramer or whatever going "Nigger nigger...etc." you know what I'm talking about. If people want to think less of him because of that, it's fair game. If people want to think less of that athlete who was caught running dogfights, also fair game.

You don't need to personally know someone to judge them based on their actions.

Honestly, aside from the fact that you don't get that some dislike him based on actions and not his comic, you're not making half bad arguments.

ElArabDeMagnifico:
The CAD Rule

Take out dialogue except in first panel (optional although recommended) - remove panel 2 and 3 - and keep 4. This will result in a funnier comic, well, most of the time, some can't be saved.

Bomberman was awesome I didn't really like the others. (Smiley baby losing?!)

Also, I have it on good authority that Yahtzee is a massive jerk too. I know quite a few people in the QLD and most haven't got nice things to say about him...

Doesn't make Zero Punctuation any less appealing to me, though.

Oh, and this thread reminds me of this:

image

MercFox1:

TerraMGP:
Most people are not going to like OOtS or Penny Arcade or other such but really when the man just keeps bashing people for things he does himself.

You know, I just learned of OotS through this thread, and it's freaking awesome. The most verbose comic I've ever read, but there's something to be said for the story that Rich has crafted.

http://www.giantitp.com/index.html


Order of the Stick is THE example of how to execute Cerebus Syndrome correctly, and can pretty much be used as an example as to how Ctrl+Alt+Del failed miserably at it. Order of the Stick magnificently combines plot, character, and humor, with none of them detracting from the other. Great example: This comic. It may be a bit confusing if you're not familiar with the comic, but you should be able to see what I'm getting at: In that one comic, character development, drama, and humor are all combined. And none harm the others, they all flow naturally.

That's what Ctrl+Alt+Del failed to do. The humor during its DRAMA™ just doesn't work. It's terrible juxtaposition and does not feel natural in the least. Mind you, that's not even mentioning how sudden the DRAMA™ tag was pulled. It was essentially in just one switch turning it from a lighthearted comic to DRAMA™. Order of the Stick built it up very gradually, and didn't drop bombshells (i.e. a major character's death) on you until it was well into Cerebus Syndrome.

Whether or not it would be well-written (it wasn't), whether or not the humor would manage to work in it (it didn't), simply put, you do NOT go from what has been a lighthearted strip for YEARS and suddenly insert massive DRAMA™. You also do not do it by terribly handling a topic as serious as a miscarriage. I mean, even Mookie had the common sense to not start his infamous "orc rape" arc in Dominic Deegan until it had been in Cerebus Syndrome for a while. Of course, that was the only shred of "common sense" that ever made it into THAT arc...

FunkyJ, it'd be appropriate except for a few of us are taking the time to explain, in detail, why we have issues with Buckley/CAD. That, and I notice he seems to be mainly referencing 4chan's /b/...That would be apt, except most of the retards there are actually intelligent people who get off on acting like retards...I know it sounds crazy, but wait till there's a serious thread there. Motherfuckers get smart eerily fast.

ElArabDeMagnifico:
The CAD Rule

Take out dialogue except in first panel (optional although recommended) - remove panel 2 and 3 - and keep 4. This will result in a funnier comic, well, most of the time, some can't be saved.

image

image

image

I only think a few are really that funny (mainly Guitar Hero, and "Bomberman") but I'm sure the rest of you will get a kick out of it.

That's disturbing, I think if I were a normal person I would feel the desire to retch, oddly enough I don't...I'm not sure what is wrong with me...am I that jaded?

EDIT: add that creepy ass Zelda comic to the list here.....

FunkyJ:
Also, I have it on good authority that Yahtzee is a massive jerk too. I know quite a few people in the QLD and most haven't got nice things to say about him...

Doesn't make Zero Punctuation any less appealing to me, though.

Oh, and this thread reminds me of this:

Odd reminds me of the entire internet.

Also, CAD is best when it's doing things like that, I don't like CAD but I'm not gonna sit here and say "NONE HAVE MADE ME LAUGH, EVER! THEY ALL SUCK BECAUSE IT IS CAD!" - it has it's moments, just wish it could keep them up.

-also, don't we like Yahtzee kind of because he is a Jerk? With the whole "Go jump out of a plane and land on a pike" and things like that, not to mention that he always talks about everything he hates, which is...everything.

Just one thing I'd like to know is, how do all of you who claim to hate Tim Buckly actually make up such harsh opinions about his persona?
Do you know him through anything else but his work? Have you met him personally? What do you know about his daily routine?

The way some people are talking it seems like you've seen the devil incarnate and he's drawing web-comics.

Seriously though, if you know some-one only through his work, and the things he does that involve his work and come with his work, then how can you honestely form any opinion about him other than about his work. I know this has been said before, and I'm probably just appearing to repeat others, but I have yet to see one single valid argument as to WHY he would be so horrible.

Please note, in the rant yahtzee made there was also no reference to the creator, just his work, asfar as I could tell. Yet so many people are gladly turning this into a witch-hunt.

Kovash86:

That's disturbing, I think if I were a normal person I would feel the desire to retch, oddly enough I don't...I'm not sure what is wrong with me...am I that jaded?

Seeing as that most (no..ALL) people here have watched the latest ZP and saw his Miscarriage Image - I didn't think this would scar anyone's mind any farther.

EDIT: I pushed my luck with the Zelda comic.

ElArabDeMagnifico:

Kovash86:

That's disturbing, I think if I were a normal person I would feel the desire to retch, oddly enough I don't...I'm not sure what is wrong with me...am I that jaded?

Seeing as that most (no..ALL) people here have watched the latest ZP and saw his Miscarriage Image - I didn't think this would scar anyone's mind any farther.

EDIT: I pushed my luck with the Zelda comic.

Yeah but that wasn't nearly as graphic, it was also a hell of a lot shorter so if you blinked you missed it, apparently it isn't new scarring as I was unfazed. I was also unfazed by what Yahtzee showed. Just because something doesn't faze you doesn't mean it is not disturbing, I could give a few visuals but I'm not really in the mood.

And the saga goes on.

Still more comments, so many that Yahtzee must be laughing his ass off.

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. People still take Yahtzee seriously? I stopped after the brawl review, button mashing to win? Yeah right. Anyway that's not my point. I still can't believe YOU take your reviews seriously, I mean you're funny, but your reviews just suck. CAD was serious long before the miscarriage thing, you've just hopped on the bandwagon, you've most likely never read any of the strips in the middle, just the first few then the last few, you ignorant douche. If any of you disagree with my statement with no reason given, you've got his balls so far down his throat you're shitting them out.

Didn't Yahtzee start the bandwagon.. how can he hop onto what he started? I take Yahtzee seriously he hasn't given me any bad advice yet, god forbid you were to pay attention to the SSBB review you would realize that the same stuff you(probably) liked about SSB and SSBM he also enjoyed, except the whole fact that it is a party based game where only a pack of "that guy"s can really get anything done in short order. Yahtzee liked the spectacle, the concept of watching Mario beat the retard out of Peach while the fans screams for more blood, what more could you ask?

Kovash86:

ElArabDeMagnifico:

Kovash86:

That's disturbing, I think if I were a normal person I would feel the desire to retch, oddly enough I don't...I'm not sure what is wrong with me...am I that jaded?

Seeing as that most (no..ALL) people here have watched the latest ZP and saw his Miscarriage Image - I didn't think this would scar anyone's mind any farther.

EDIT: I pushed my luck with the Zelda comic.

Yeah but that wasn't nearly as graphic, it was also a hell of a lot shorter so if you blinked you missed it, apparently it isn't new scarring as I was unfazed. I was also unfazed by what Yahtzee showed. Just because something doesn't faze you doesn't mean it is not disturbing, I could give a few visuals but I'm not really in the mood.

Well I can't read minds, it's all in the eye's of the beholder and if they want to report me or something so be it, it was an honest mistake. I don't see much in those comics that will cause me to get a permaban or anything except the zelda one and hell, if Yahtzee can have it in his video then I didn't expect well drawn characters with less blood (not to mention coming out of her mouth and not her genitals, like in Yahtzee's vid.) shouldn't cause any harm.

Sorry to disturb you, I didn't think it would.

Meatshield27:
Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. People still take Yahtzee seriously? I stopped after the brawl review, button mashing to win? Yeah right. Anyway that's not my point. I still can't believe YOU take your reviews seriously, I mean you're funny, but your reviews just suck. CAD was serious long before the miscarriage thing, you've just hopped on the bandwagon, you've most likely never read any of the strips in the middle, just the first few then the last few, you ignorant douche. If any of you disagree with my statement with no reason given, you've got his balls so far down his throat you're shitting them out.

Yes, surprising as it is, you can beat tournament level players by mashing buttons. It happens, go figure. Just saying.

Aside from the "Zeke goes crazy" and "Fat chick, lol not really" arcs, which were surreal as hell, what are you talking about?

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