Zero Punctuation: XBLA Double Bill

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On the Ocarina vs Twilight debate, the answer should be obvious.

Master Quest.

Ocarina rocked, but I have reached the point where I could probably beat the whole damn game wearing a blindfold. Twilight Princess rocked also, and probably rocked enough to snipe Ocarina for so many reasons. The first two that pop into my head are the fact you are at no point required to play as Child Link, and the second is the huge amount of Furry Wolf-Link-On-Imp-Midna porn that the game spawned to keep us entertained between gaming sessions.

The reason I'd pick Master Quest is that most of the dungeons are harder than Garry Glitter in the school playground. The insane difficulty ensures that fans of the original Ocarina have plenty to keep them occupied, especially as much of the enhanced difficulty comes from moving the whole damn dungeon around as opposed to just doubling the number of monsters as most games do.

I've not played the actual games reviewed, and I probably won't. However, I can't deny that nostalgia does play a big role in making old games seem great. That said, Jumping Flash remains bloody good fun to this day...

Oh yeah, like others have said - the "Hybrid" Health system used by Resistance is the best ever devised.

Am I the only one who thinks that his video length should be doubled? He hardly talked about Castle Crashers at all. It was an average video, not great, but at least he destroyed BC.

BobisOnlyBob:
Having read the comments resulting from this video, I feel dumber.

Was everyone oblivious to his point about RELATIVITY? ROSE-TINTED glasses? He likes Twilight Princess and Mario Sunshine because they WERE THE FIRST 3D GAMES IN THOSE SERIES HE PLAYED.

He then goes on to declare "ALSO HITLER WAS RIGHT" because Hitler was the FIRST CONQUERING FACIST he knew presumably, therefore IT MUST BE RIGHT, are you understanding the hypocrisy of loving your past so tightly now? He's being deliberately hypocritical to make a point, and people are STILL jumping down his throat, even with his two-seconds-later disclaimer. The point is that YOU LOVE YOUR PAST and therefore like things you've liked before. So companies make games that cash in on this.

Hell, I still love FFVII, and I know deep down than graphically it's poor, the villian is bland, the main character's a mess and sorting him out is more effort than it's worth, and most of the support cast are one-shtick stereotypes tucked into their own nice backstory that's usually mutually exclusive to everyone else. Yet it's still MY FAVOURITE and if they remade it flawlessly, preserving everything I loved from the first with shiny new graphics and the same old materia system minus the glitches, I would pay full price for it, because my perspective is skewed and I know it and enjoy it.

Also there's a ton of things about 2D/3D playspaces and 2D/3D graphics. Castle Crashers has 2D graphics and a 3D playspace (up into background/down into foreground, left/right, and jumping up/down, 3 axis, 3D). This results in the 2-pixel miss-wiggle nonsense that should've stopped with Golden Axe. Bionic Commando has 3D graphics and 2D gameplay (left/right, grapple up/down). What's the point of the wasteful 3D on bland 2D gameplay that has barely been refined? Giving nostalgia a fresh coat of paint. That's it. There's no other benefit except maybe to appease people who detest anything that looks old, in which case they'll probably hate it once they start playing it anyway.

Yahtzee has never been wrong - you just have to be on the same level of insane, ultra-self-aware, reflexive mentality as him to see why. Everything is wonderful and shiny, everything is made of shit. But I see very little wonderful and shiny in the forum posts above me, and now look what you've made me done. I've written a horrible, bitter little rant and now I'm one of you gibbering idiots claiming to understand what's going through Yahtzee's head. Fuck it. I have no clue, I just think he's got a point and here's my understanding of it. In his own words, if you don't like it, fuck off.

Cocks.

I think this guy "got it".

By the way, what if what he actually said was "Hitler was WRIGHT" - coming of his Spore review, that would actually make a lot of sense. Or maybe it wouldn't, but still.

"He admits he does. And he picked up Painkiller recently before he reviewed it, or atleast somewhat recently since he found it after it went to the bargain bin"

Really? I thought he said he played it when it was new as well : /

Anyways, the point here is that retro games are just like games are in general. We all appreciate different things, many of which are completely idiotic, like games were trial-and-error is required to finally conquer, or shooters were all the weapons feel like cork pistols. : )

Sometimes we head back high on nostalgia unable to notice any flaws, and sometimes we crash and burn, shocked by how much time we spent playing crap.

And sometimes we do neither and just call each other cocks on forums.

Funny how most people say that sure Sunshine was better than 64 but no way Twilight was better than Ocarina of Time, I think Sunshine wasn't much better than 64, but Twilight beats Ocarina by a long shot. BobisOnlyBob wins the thread, nostalgia and such plays a big role in what you think is good. Without nostalgia I'm pretty sure I'd say: "Man Bionic Commando is bad and the jumping system is retarded" but no no, I think it's awesome and the hand is cool.

Registered just to post this. Usually I like ZP, but I just have to note some wrongness that hasn't been noted already.

First, spikes in ReArmed aren't "insta-death," unless you're playing the challenge rooms, but that just voids the lives complaint. And doesn't Art of Theft pretty much have a lives system too?

Someone mentioned how the grapple system isn't hard, since it's just over for and end of swing release or down to a release at any time before that. More to the point, Yahtzee suggested the grapple button should also release. That can't be done since it's only one button and there are 2 forms of releasing. He didn't think this one through.

Also, it's not that strange that a 2D platformer can't jump. Somehow jumping 5 times your height is standard; it's healthy to challenge that. And, barrels aren't waist-high.

ReArmed is very, very easy on the default difficulty all up until Albatross, but it's pretty obvious Yahtzee didn't get close to getting that far.

Yahtzee's method boils down to this: anything that you may say in a British/Auzy accent will sound funny to a dumb enough audience.

And he is probably right, as is evident from the amount of applause that he gets.

He has some real talent that shows every once in a while but he mostly relies on his fanboys to keep the traffic high because they like to hear "fuck ... shit ... dick ... cunt" in a British/Auzy accent, don't care about what's filling in the blanks and wouldn't know subtle humor if it bit them in the ass.

Here's a little test for all of you to know if you are one: if you can watch a clip three times without getting bored - you're a stupid fanboy. If you laughed in all three times then your brain is defective. extremely defective if you don't even care about the game being reviewed.

Maybe some of the reviews are insightful... I wouldn't know 'cause I never played any of those games, I don't even own a console but I enjoy it as a comedy, that is, until recently I found that it did all it can do for me and now it's just very nicely edited and narrated boring piece of text. If you don't agree you are either:
1. a stupid fanboy (stupid enough to still find funny the usage of the word FUCK in any sentence coming out of that asshole).

2. care about the game being reviewed (aka a liar and actually a fanboy).

or

3. just seen this for the first time and everything is new and exciting, in that case, it's interesting to see if you'll become a fanboy by the time you finnish watching all the other clips including all the ones that cover games that you don't care about.

anti_strunt:

BobisOnlyBob:
Having read the comments resulting from this video, I feel dumber.

Was everyone oblivious to his point about RELATIVITY? ROSE-TINTED glasses? He likes Twilight Princess and Mario Sunshine because they WERE THE FIRST 3D GAMES IN THOSE SERIES HE PLAYED.

He then goes on to declare "ALSO HITLER WAS RIGHT" because Hitler was the FIRST CONQUERING FACIST he knew presumably, therefore IT MUST BE RIGHT, are you understanding the hypocrisy of loving your past so tightly now? He's being deliberately hypocritical to make a point, and people are STILL jumping down his throat, even with his two-seconds-later disclaimer. The point is that YOU LOVE YOUR PAST and therefore like things you've liked before. So companies make games that cash in on this.

Hell, I still love FFVII, and I know deep down than graphically it's poor, the villian is bland, the main character's a mess and sorting him out is more effort than it's worth, and most of the support cast are one-shtick stereotypes tucked into their own nice backstory that's usually mutually exclusive to everyone else. Yet it's still MY FAVOURITE and if they remade it flawlessly, preserving everything I loved from the first with shiny new graphics and the same old materia system minus the glitches, I would pay full price for it, because my perspective is skewed and I know it and enjoy it.

Also there's a ton of things about 2D/3D playspaces and 2D/3D graphics. Castle Crashers has 2D graphics and a 3D playspace (up into background/down into foreground, left/right, and jumping up/down, 3 axis, 3D). This results in the 2-pixel miss-wiggle nonsense that should've stopped with Golden Axe. Bionic Commando has 3D graphics and 2D gameplay (left/right, grapple up/down). What's the point of the wasteful 3D on bland 2D gameplay that has barely been refined? Giving nostalgia a fresh coat of paint. That's it. There's no other benefit except maybe to appease people who detest anything that looks old, in which case they'll probably hate it once they start playing it anyway.

Yahtzee has never been wrong - you just have to be on the same level of insane, ultra-self-aware, reflexive mentality as him to see why. Everything is wonderful and shiny, everything is made of shit. But I see very little wonderful and shiny in the forum posts above me, and now look what you've made me done. I've written a horrible, bitter little rant and now I'm one of you gibbering idiots claiming to understand what's going through Yahtzee's head. Fuck it. I have no clue, I just think he's got a point and here's my understanding of it. In his own words, if you don't like it, fuck off.

Cocks.

I think this guy "got it".

By the way, what if what he actually said was "Hitler was WRIGHT" - coming of his Spore review, that would actually make a lot of sense. Or maybe it wouldn't, but still.

Well, at least there are SOME smart people on this thread. I was starting to think I was the only sane person on the internet.

I actually went to some casual gamers (not casual game players - a subtle but important difference) who didn't know of ZP, and asked what they thought with regard to the whole TP vs Oot or nostalgia stuff, and they ALL like TP much better. They ALL like sunshine better.
Which caused me to realize that there's something other than nostalgia at work here. It's the desperate desire to stick to ones' claims that "(insert classic game here) is the best game ever, and everything since is shit," something only the "hardcore" gamers believe. Weird, huh.

somerandomguy:
Fuck it, I'm leaving the escapist and I'm never going to watch another Yahtzee review again. To all of those Yahtzee fanboys who their cock right up near Yahtzee's tiny cock, fuck yourselfs. I'm obviously doing to intentionally get the banhammer. God, to believe I used to like Yahtzee.

To that Bobisonlybob, I know a couple of gaming websites with critics who give a fairer review and honest review than Yahtzee could ever make. Gamecritics.com, Giantbomb.com, firingsquad.com, gamedailybiz.com, destructoid.com, and mygamer.com.

I also want to make one last statement to Yahtzee; You're an asshole of the weak.

Well, you're an asshole too. They often say people who are the same hate each other.

;)

I just don't see the point of his videos anymore. His whole 'shtick' before was that he was angry, funny, and brought up some good points that you could agree with.

So now that he's no longer going for funny what do we have?

Ok, so his videos aren't funny anymore, they still bring up good points right? Nope, we don't even get that anymore. You can't even chuckle and say, "heheh, yeah he's so right".

Instead he resorts to contradicting his previous statements in an attempt at shock comedy.

But, "Oh he's being sarcastic". Sarcasm is supposed to have wit which his videos no longer have.

Why do I get the feeling your workbook looked the same as mine did?

I just realised. In this he said that all games in the past were shit, in Braid he said that all modern games are shit, and in the E3 trailer coverage he said that all games in the future are likely to be shit. So, according to him, gaming is a constant cesspool of bad games.

I laughed so much at the Dizzy joke at the beginning! It was a great game but you are still right that old games are not really as good as new games. In a nostalgic attempt to have some fun, I went and bought Spyro 2 (one of my favourite childhood games). The game is still a lot of fun no doubt but I realised that it just doesn't compare to the games of today. Actually that said, are there any games today where you get to play as a freaking dragon that burns to death elephants with snail shells on their backs and impales giant beetles with his horns? I guess that many things have improved in games more recently but ingenuity is not one of them.

Wait, why am I writing this? It's going to appear about 10 pages in! Why do I waste my time like this?

Hitler was not right. There are some things that you just can't joke about.

Excelent review, I just finished stitching up my sides. And not only do the extremely deprived want to have sex with you!

I played the demo of Castle Crashers at my mate's house, I don't own a 360, and to me it feels EXACTLY how an update of a retro classic should be, take what made it good, update the graphics and sound, because you can, and I don't care how retro you are, you can make a old game look better. Then take the old gameplay and tweak it, don't make a new game of it, but trim off any unfair stuff, add new elements if it was too repetitive, maybe add the levelling system or new combos etc, and you have Castle Crashers which just feels...right!

Oh and I'm not sure he was being sarcastic about the older zelda and mario, sure we look back and love our memories of older games, but have you actually played em recently?

I'm not knocking older games, but in the main a lot of things have evolved, streamlined, polished up and improved over the years, and I'm one of those suckers who had a Atari 2600 with the wooden panelling on the front, and a controller with one, yes, one button.

Hell I got ET for one christmas, and enjoyed it, as I knew no better. Go on, just try to make me play ET now!

Again I'm not saying 'all old games are bad', but lets drop the rose tinted glasses.

I played twilight princess and sunshine before oot and 64, too, but honestly, i thought the old ones were much better.

you say that twilight princess and sunshine are better than the n64 counter parts but there really just the same games only the old ones have nostalgia and the new ones have nice looking graphics. though personally i chooose the older pair

diocles777:
Hitler was not right. There are some things that you just can't joke about.

Look at the credits

Of course Twilight Princess is better because it came out about 10 years (I don't know if that is the real number) after OoT. Better graphics, better gameplay and maybe better story.

Yeah, but BC:Rearmed _did_ update the original in a lot of ways without ruining the spirit of the thing:

Among other things, the health meter is a lot more forgiving, the frustrating radio receiver guessing game is gone, infinite continues, grenades, the weapon system is completely overhauled and you can swap weapons in-level, instead of having to pick a particular layout when you're deployed onto a map.

Grin did a fantastic job on BC:R and for fans of the original it's been a great treat.

However, I can easily see the uninitiated (like Yahtzee, apparently) finding it to be a frustrating throwback. (Imagine if he was forced to play the original.)

I haven't read all the posts here, so forgive me if I'm the 16th person so say this, but the original Bionic Commando is still quite enjoyable today. It's certainly not a rose-colored glasses thing; not for those who really appreciated how different a title it was back then.

Of course, if you've never played the damned game in your life and your first exposure to it is literally 20 years after it was first published, yeah, it'll seem a bit crusty. And any attempt to remake it will only come off as applying a cosmetic product containing pigments, oils, waxes, and emollients that applies color and texture to a porcine's oral sphincter.

It's not a failed joke because it got a reaction. Some people rightfully had a chuckle, and some idiots actually took offense, 70 years and 900 billion Hitler jokes later. If any Hitler joke seriously shocks you to your core, you don't go outside and interact with people enough. Are you people kidding me? I've heard abortion jokes today that makes Yahtzee's Hitler crack insignificant.

Wow,that was the first Zero Punctuation I've liked in quite some time. Sounds like Yahtzee's been reading the comments and is getting back to what made him good.

TaboriHK:
It's not a failed joke because it got a reaction. Some people rightfully had a chuckle, and some idiots actually took offense, 70 years and 900 billion Hitler jokes later. If any Hitler joke seriously shocks you to your core, you don't go outside and interact with people enough. Are you people kidding me? I've heard abortion jokes today that makes Yahtzee's Hitler crack insignificant.

I could care less about the Hitler part. The whole video in general was just bad, and unfunny.

Log Dropper M.D.:

TaboriHK:
It's not a failed joke because it got a reaction. Some people rightfully had a chuckle, and some idiots actually took offense, 70 years and 900 billion Hitler jokes later. If any Hitler joke seriously shocks you to your core, you don't go outside and interact with people enough. Are you people kidding me? I've heard abortion jokes today that makes Yahtzee's Hitler crack insignificant.

I could care less about the Hitler part. The whole video in general was just bad, and unfunny.

my review on this to is also ''meh'' just wait till big releases come out

Another honest and hilarious review.

Today's games are rotating in circles too. I think Yahtzee made that clear at the end credits, where he is digging the quick-time events, forseeing the future to come, when quick-time events will be seen as cool retro-gaming features.

Long live Ben.

skoomaeater:

Playbahnosh:
Meh. Yahtzee, you seriously need a vacation, man. I hate to say it, but ZP is going downhill for the last few episodes. I didn't even smile at this one.

It's not about quoting Yahtzee to death, or getting used to his jokes. Hell, I was watching the series from the very first episodes, and it was awesome until a few weeks earlier. ZP had it's ups and downs, but this one is different. It's getting shallow and repetitive, with Yahtzee doing nothing but playing Captain Obvious and hating at the wrong direction. That Hitler "joke" wasn't funny at all, for example. Forced, bumpy and semi-boring, ZP is running out of juice fast.

You need a refill, Yahtzee, go have a brake for a few weeks, seriously. Yeah, we will miss the show for the time being, but it will be all for the better, and we'll get some good 'ol ZP power when you get back.

I think you are perhaps missing the point. Yahtzee is reviewing games - not producing a comedy series. While his general rantings are amusing he is first and foremost reviewing the game. I personally like to watch ZP to pick up on the stuff that IGN and the like miss out in their rantings about normal mapping, polygons and vertexes.

Huh. Never thought about it that way before, it just seemed like he was reviewing these games to be funny.

By the way, Ben, if you think this world is poluted with hedonistic perverts that want to go to bed with retro games or ... you, don't feel you re the only one. Hehe.

Russian Redneck:
Best review since the Mailbag Showdown. Not only did he deliver crisp, sharp-as-knives criticism and wit he also raised very good points about how nostalgia can cloud our better judgment towards video games.

Excellent job, man! :D

bw:

Edable Giraffe:
What was the Hitler comment at the end all about? lol

I must agree. Up until now I thought you were one of the most intelligent people on this planet. Then you make a shitty comment like "Hitler was right". What was that for? That was not funny. That was not cool. When did you become Mel Gibson. If you said it for any other reason other than you thought it was funny it makes you are horrible excuse for a human being, and yes, if anyone who heard it thought it was funny, you are an asshole too.

Hey, man! Being an asshole isn't an easy job. It's not like you can just make up a smarmy remark and sell it to the people. You have to deliver with just the right tone and at the appropriate time. Also, it needs to be something original yet totally, totally true.

Lol perfect comeback.

Shinkada:
A bit funnier than usual, but more importantly, I love it when people wail on reminiscence in gaming.

To all the people inevitably defending Ocarina of Time: Stop being dickbags.

EDIT: The constant, and usual stream of people saying ZMG YATZEY U NOT FUNAY NEMORE has, for this episode only, gone from frustrating to hilarious because YOU'RE PROOVING THE EXACT POINT HE'S MENTIONING IN THE FUCKING VIDEO.

He isn't getting less funny, you twats have all just ruined it by quoting him five thousand times a day and thus becoming too used to his style. I, however, haven't been going around quoting him at every waking moment as if he was Monty Python, Maddox, Chapelle or anyone else nearly-ruined by constant quotation, and thus I still find him hilarious.

None to blame but yourselves.

Well sorry now mate but you can bugger right off with that.

I have never once in my life quoted Yahtzee or whatever his name is. I come on every wednesday watch and then forget about it. He's just lost that special touch he had. people are right, before he was being a bitter old bastard now he's just being an arrogant arse-hole for the sake of being an arrogant arse-hole

somerandomguy:
Fuck it, I'm leaving the escapist and I'm never going to watch another Yahtzee review again. To all of those Yahtzee fanboys who their cock right up near Yahtzee's tiny cock, fuck yourselfs. I'm obviously doing to intentionally get the banhammer. God, to believe I used to like Yahtzee.

To that Bobisonlybob, I know a couple of gaming websites with critics who give a fairer review and honest review than Yahtzee could ever make. Gamecritics.com, Giantbomb.com, firingsquad.com, gamedailybiz.com, destructoid.com, and mygamer.com.

I also want to make one last statement to Yahtzee; You're an asshole of the weak.

Just asking, What was the point of posting that?

To all those mindless posters claiming that the Hitler affirmation was 'too much'.

First of all what do you think, 'Hitler was right' means?

Not even historians would be able to answer because Hitler believed in many things, not only in torturing Jewish(which is the first thing that passed through those mindless cunts).

Hitler was a psicologist, and was a very profound person. I guess nobody would of jumped from their seat, if Yahtzee affirmed 'Harry S Truman was right'.

And he obviously made a trap for you nostalgia gamers, moral of the story: "don't blindly believe in something, just because it wears a label".

Hitler wears the "past" label. Just because he was from the past doesn't mean he didn't participate in the Holocaust.

Bionic Commando: rearmed, and the rest wear the "retro-game" label. Just because they are retro (and retro snobs 'must' love it) doesn't mean they don't carry the retro-faults.

Dectilon:
"He admits he does. And he picked up Painkiller recently before he reviewed it, or atleast somewhat recently since he found it after it went to the bargain bin"

Really? I thought he said he played it when it was new as well : /

Either way it was at most 3 years ago.

anti_strunt:

BobisOnlyBob:
Having read the comments resulting from this video, I feel dumber.

Was everyone oblivious to his point about RELATIVITY? ROSE-TINTED glasses? He likes Twilight Princess and Mario Sunshine because they WERE THE FIRST 3D GAMES IN THOSE SERIES HE PLAYED.

He then goes on to declare "ALSO HITLER WAS RIGHT" because Hitler was the FIRST CONQUERING FACIST he knew presumably, therefore IT MUST BE RIGHT, are you understanding the hypocrisy of loving your past so tightly now? He's being deliberately hypocritical to make a point, and people are STILL jumping down his throat, even with his two-seconds-later disclaimer. The point is that YOU LOVE YOUR PAST and therefore like things you've liked before. So companies make games that cash in on this.

Hell, I still love FFVII, and I know deep down than graphically it's poor, the villian is bland, the main character's a mess and sorting him out is more effort than it's worth, and most of the support cast are one-shtick stereotypes tucked into their own nice backstory that's usually mutually exclusive to everyone else. Yet it's still MY FAVOURITE and if they remade it flawlessly, preserving everything I loved from the first with shiny new graphics and the same old materia system minus the glitches, I would pay full price for it, because my perspective is skewed and I know it and enjoy it.

Also there's a ton of things about 2D/3D playspaces and 2D/3D graphics. Castle Crashers has 2D graphics and a 3D playspace (up into background/down into foreground, left/right, and jumping up/down, 3 axis, 3D). This results in the 2-pixel miss-wiggle nonsense that should've stopped with Golden Axe. Bionic Commando has 3D graphics and 2D gameplay (left/right, grapple up/down). What's the point of the wasteful 3D on bland 2D gameplay that has barely been refined? Giving nostalgia a fresh coat of paint. That's it. There's no other benefit except maybe to appease people who detest anything that looks old, in which case they'll probably hate it once they start playing it anyway.

Yahtzee has never been wrong - you just have to be on the same level of insane, ultra-self-aware, reflexive mentality as him to see why. Everything is wonderful and shiny, everything is made of shit. But I see very little wonderful and shiny in the forum posts above me, and now look what you've made me done. I've written a horrible, bitter little rant and now I'm one of you gibbering idiots claiming to understand what's going through Yahtzee's head. Fuck it. I have no clue, I just think he's got a point and here's my understanding of it. In his own words, if you don't like it, fuck off.

Cocks.

I think this guy "got it".

By the way, what if what he actually said was "Hitler was WRIGHT" - coming of his Spore review, that would actually make a lot of sense. Or maybe it wouldn't, but still.

While I enjoy the debating that's going on in this topic, I think you guys are reading way too much into what is essentially a parody of the serious video game reviewing community. The "Hitler was right!" comment was in there to prove that the last part, if not all of the video relating to classic gaming automatically being bad was at least partly sarcastic.

Or perhaps he really does like TP better than OOT, which I can respect, but not agree with. If you really care, I've let a total of three friends up to this point borrow both TP and then OOT, and they all enjoyed Ocarina much more. The most cited reason was the story, level design, items, and, most of all, originality. Don't get me wrong here; Twilight Princess is a wonderful game that probably deserves a spot in the Top 25, but it still can't touch what is widely considered by video game critics to be the best game ever made.

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