Escapist Podcast: Bonus: Game of Thronescast, Season 3 Wrap-Up

Bonus: Game of Thronescast, Season 3 Wrap-Up

With E3 finally behind us, the Escapist team wraps up the third season of Game of Thrones.

Watch Video

Here's Maisie's Vine that Greg mentioned:

http://vine.co/v/b3XZMHmxzxh

On Walder Frey's motivations:

Really enjoyed that, thanks to all involved. Not many people that I know watch this so for me it's great to listen to a group of fans share their likes and dislikes. The 4th season can't come soon enough :)

Really enjoyed this Thronecast, really liked what you guys (and girl!) thought about it.

Episode 10 didn't really felt like an season finale for me and merely a bridge to tie in Season 4.

Now the hard part is having to wait another year until we get more episodes.

I loved the podcast, but there is something huge that I disagree with.

Joffrey's characterization. Yes, it's more erratic and a bit more crazy in the show, but I think he's far more cruel in the books. There's that whole prostitute scene, which is very disturbing, and the Ros thing in the TV show, but in the books he's -far- more ruthless, such as arranging to have his guards beat Sansa constantly for reasons as little as disobedience and at times even no reasons at all. He just has her beat so that he can keep dominance over her. And as for something you all shot down, Joffrey -does- say in the books that he wants to have Robb Stark's head served to Sansa at Joffrey/Margaery's wedding. Joffrey in the books isn't as crazy as his tv show counterpart, but his cruelty far more than make up for that.

Sansa's characterization is something that I agree on, though, but honestly, Sansa is both a boring character and a terrible one. She was still boring in the show, as she was broken pretty quickly, but she was an annoying character in the books to read and even with the small amount of character development, I still didn't like her all that much. And in the books, she's just plain vicious at times. At least in the show, she's less that and more just a big sister.

And on the topic of characterization, I'm guessing that George R.R. Martin is setting up Theon to have a huge redemption plot, but I think it's a little lost on the tv series. Theon's just not a dick like he is in the books and I thought the betrayal came a bit out of left field. It made sense in the books. He never felt too much love for the Starks and was harsh in behavior towards them and anyone. In the show, he's not that. Sure, he's kind of a prick, but no more than anybody else is. In the show, all the feelings just come out of nowhere.

Don't get me wrong, though. I absolutely love the show and have enjoyed every single episode. The show just has to take a bit of liberty due to the nature of how tv shows work.

I like Game of Thrones cast, but I'm gonna stop watching because seriously you guys can't go 5 minutes without bringing something up from the other books that a lot of us haven't read. It's incredibly annoying.

=/ I was really looking forward to this, but I'm unfortunately finding these podcasts less and less enjoyable over time. As a person who has not read the books (or has any desire to) it feels like over time the podcast cast has progressively placed emphasis over direct comparisons between the two forms of media, has less sensitivity towards minor/vague spoilers, and spend less time discussing the show on its own merits. A book perspective is great when trying to fill in the blanks, but constant comparisons are completely unrelateable for a TV viewer.

I think you guys do a great job, and hope for your continued success, but I think it's time for me to find a new GoT podcast more suited towards my viewing experience.

Great thronescast guys, I was really looking forward to this, I hope you keep it up.

AngelOfBlueRoses:
I loved the podcast, but there is something huge that I disagree with.

Joffrey's characterization. Yes, it's more erratic and a bit more crazy in the show, but I think he's far more cruel in the books. There's that whole prostitute scene, which is very disturbing, and the Ros thing in the TV show, but in the books he's -far- more ruthless, such as arranging to have his guards beat Sansa constantly for reasons as little as disobedience and at times even no reasons at all. He just has her beat so that he can keep dominance over her. And as for something you all shot down, Joffrey -does- say in the books that he wants to have Robb Stark's head served to Sansa at Joffrey/Margaery's wedding. Joffrey in the books isn't as crazy as his tv show counterpart, but his cruelty far more than make up for that.

Sansa's characterization is something that I agree on, though, but honestly, Sansa is both a boring character and a terrible one. She was still boring in the show, as she was broken pretty quickly, but she was an annoying character in the books to read and even with the small amount of character development, I still didn't like her all that much. And in the books, she's just plain vicious at times. At least in the show, she's less that and more just a big sister.

And on the topic of characterization, I'm guessing that George R.R. Martin is setting up Theon to have a huge redemption plot, but I think it's a little lost on the tv series. Theon's just not a dick like he is in the books and I thought the betrayal came a bit out of left field. It made sense in the books. He never felt too much love for the Starks and was harsh in behavior towards them and anyone. In the show, he's not that. Sure, he's kind of a prick, but no more than anybody else is. In the show, all the feelings just come out of nowhere.

Don't get me wrong, though. I absolutely love the show and have enjoyed every single episode. The show just has to take a bit of liberty due to the nature of how tv shows work.

In the book we are privy to Theon's thoughts. It really is hard to convey the "two families, but son of neither" bitterness that he has without scenes explicitly stating that. I haven't watched the show beyond season one (didn't like it) so I don't know if they do this. If not, then his betrayal would seem particularly vicious.

Thuggych:
=/ I was really looking forward to this, but I'm unfortunately finding these podcasts less and less enjoyable over time. As a person who has not read the books (or has any desire to) it feels like over time the podcast cast has progressively placed emphasis over direct comparisons between the two forms of media, has less sensitivity towards minor/vague spoilers, and spend less time discussing the show on its own merits. A book perspective is great when trying to fill in the blanks, but constant comparisons are completely unrelateable for a TV viewer.

I think you guys do a great job, and hope for your continued success, but I think it's time for me to find a new GoT podcast more suited towards my viewing experience.

You make a great point. Well, with next season I think a lot more of the plot will be stuff we haven't read so hopefully we can draw you back in for a listen then. It's also getting tougher and tougher to have people on the podcast who HAVEN'T read the books yet. At least in our office. :)

Greg

It seems people are getting annoyed with book spoilers...hmm. Do they realize how incredibly hard it is to keep that from bleeding through when they compare the books to the show, especially with the show stopping in the middle of book three? On top of that, since the show is diverging from the books, the minor spoilers might not even be in the show. Also, the books are pretty old, with 4 coming out in 2005 and only 5 being recent(2011). This leaves the Thronescast in a weird spoiler territory, because they are well within their rights to spoil the books, but the show messes that up. I think book spoilers are completely separate from show spoilers at this point, because the have consistently changed the books for the show, and are very different at this point, and no one knows what direction the show will actually go in.

Enjoyed the podcast as always, I've been missing this the past few weeks so I was glad to see that you all hadn't stopped doing it.

Seeing as how you've all read the books, I was surprised nobody brought up what I considered to be a MASSIVE missing scene from episode 10, and very worthy of spoiler tags for those who haven't read book 3:

Yojoo:
Seeing as how you've all read the books, I was surprised nobody brought up what I considered to be a MASSIVE missing scene from episode 10, and very worthy of spoiler tags for those who haven't read book 3:

Holy crap, I forgot all about that scene (read the books years ago).

The format is slowly becoming better (viewing wise) and all that need to be set up is a 4 split screen from the chest upwards.

It helps the viewer feel like they are apart of the conversation more in my opinion than seeing 4 people with mics talking to each other.

Of course that is just my opinion on the matter still enjoy the podcast.

RedEyesBlackGamer:

AngelOfBlueRoses:
I loved the podcast, but there is something huge that I disagree with.

Joffrey's characterization. Yes, it's more erratic and a bit more crazy in the show, but I think he's far more cruel in the books. There's that whole prostitute scene, which is very disturbing, and the Ros thing in the TV show, but in the books he's -far- more ruthless, such as arranging to have his guards beat Sansa constantly for reasons as little as disobedience and at times even no reasons at all. He just has her beat so that he can keep dominance over her. And as for something you all shot down, Joffrey -does- say in the books that he wants to have Robb Stark's head served to Sansa at Joffrey/Margaery's wedding. Joffrey in the books isn't as crazy as his tv show counterpart, but his cruelty far more than make up for that.

Sansa's characterization is something that I agree on, though, but honestly, Sansa is both a boring character and a terrible one. She was still boring in the show, as she was broken pretty quickly, but she was an annoying character in the books to read and even with the small amount of character development, I still didn't like her all that much. And in the books, she's just plain vicious at times. At least in the show, she's less that and more just a big sister.

And on the topic of characterization, I'm guessing that George R.R. Martin is setting up Theon to have a huge redemption plot, but I think it's a little lost on the tv series. Theon's just not a dick like he is in the books and I thought the betrayal came a bit out of left field. It made sense in the books. He never felt too much love for the Starks and was harsh in behavior towards them and anyone. In the show, he's not that. Sure, he's kind of a prick, but no more than anybody else is. In the show, all the feelings just come out of nowhere.

Don't get me wrong, though. I absolutely love the show and have enjoyed every single episode. The show just has to take a bit of liberty due to the nature of how tv shows work.

In the book we are privy to Theon's thoughts. It really is hard to convey the "two families, but son of neither" bitterness that he has without scenes explicitly stating that. I haven't watched the show beyond season one (didn't like it) so I don't know if they do this. If not, then his betrayal would seem particularly vicious.

In my opinion, it's not so much that we aren't privy to Theon's thoughts, but rather the way he acts in the show is different compared to the books. Theon acts out quite a bit in the books, such as kicking Gared's head and laughing or saying harsh words at others' expense as a rather commonplace thing. He's crude, like a man in his position should be, and he shows no love or loyalty for the Stakrs. In the show, it's different. He's not so crude, at least no more so than the other characters, and aside from a few off hand comments, and appears to be fiercely loyal to Robb right up until he goes to the iron islands. I think it's partially that we don't have his thoughts to see, but mostly that he just acts different enough to make his betrayal seem more out of left field in the tv show.

I have to agree with those who were disappointed in this podcast edition.

First, while I understand that the 4 episodes in one recap was necessary scheduling wise it sort of killed much of the content. It spead the given time really thin for each episode besides the major moments and ended up feeling like a "best of" rather than any sort of deeper examination. When so much of the content is glossed over because it either doesn't stand out as notable when recalled over a month later or just isn't remembered at all it's a pretty glaring issue.

Second, I really missed the perspective of those who either hadn't read the books or weren't totally immersed in recollection of every detail. This podcast, far more than any previous one, felt like just a parade of not only book to TV comparisons but also a lot of "well, the books are better" type talk.

Just a small point for Tito: mentioned the gratuitous nature of the sex scenes as 'sexposition' a few times... I think the word you're meaning to use it "sexploitation".

II2:
Just a small point for Tito: mentioned the gratuitous nature of the sex scenes as 'sexposition' a few times... I think the word you're meaning to use it "sexploitation".

I believe that he is referring to the practice of giving exposition or advancing the plot during sex scenes known as "sexposistion"

I started watching Game of Thrones two weeks ago and haven't read the books. I do intend to read them, but they're not at the top of my to-read list.

I found it frustrating to watch some parts as a couple of times the phrasing went "X, Y, Z - spoiler!", which...isn't helpful as I only find out that I don't want to listen to that sentence after the fact.

I know that it must be hard to not mention the books, but it leaves me feeling detached from what I thought was an otherwise excellent show. I would probably have enjoyed the discussion a lot more if I'd read the books, and that feels wrong since the subject is the TV show.

This is the first Game of Thronescast I've watched and despite thoroughly enjoying the discussion I'm honestly not sure about watching more: I find even vague spoilers quite annoying, and I want to go into the next series knowing what's going to happen (even in broad terms).

Splitzi:
Also, the books are pretty old, with 4 coming out in 2005 and only 5 being recent(2011). This leaves the Thronescast in a weird spoiler territory, because they are well within their rights to spoil the books, but the show messes that up.

I don't think it's at all fair to spoil the books; just because somebody has seen the TV show and wants to watch discussion of it doesn't follow that they have either read the books or don't care about spoilers. And as for being old, I still don't think it matters: the TV show is new, and I imagine a reasonable number of people have started reading them because of the show. "Tinker, Tailer, Soldier, Spy" was written a while ago, but I'd be very annoyed if somebody had told me the ending just because the book had been published a long time ago.

Splitzi:
I think book spoilers are completely separate from show spoilers at this point, because the have consistently changed the books for the show, and are very different at this point, and no one knows what direction the show will actually go in.

But it's not safe to assume that things will stay that sufficiently different. If you read the book of X and then go to see the film of X with somebody, it's not fair to give them book spoilers on the grounds that the film might be different, even if you've seen the first 30 minutes.

archiebawled:

Splitzi:
Also, the books are pretty old, with 4 coming out in 2005 and only 5 being recent(2011). This leaves the Thronescast in a weird spoiler territory, because they are well within their rights to spoil the books, but the show messes that up.

I don't think it's at all fair to spoil the books; just because somebody has seen the TV show and wants to watch discussion of it doesn't follow that they have either read the books or don't care about spoilers. And as for being old, I still don't think it matters: the TV show is new, and I imagine a reasonable number of people have started reading them because of the show. "Tinker, Tailer, Soldier, Spy" was written a while ago, but I'd be very annoyed if somebody had told me the ending just because the book had been published a long time ago.

Don't watch this sort of podcast then. Stick to podcasts specifically designed for show-fans only. AVClub does two reviews for GoT, one for book fans and the other for people new to the series.

Can't really avoid talking about the books in a podcast to discuss the books just to suit people who didn't bother to read them

DracoSuave:
Don't watch this sort of podcast then. Stick to podcasts specifically designed for show-fans only. AVClub does two reviews for GoT, one for book fans and the other for people new to the series.

Can't really avoid talking about the books in a podcast to discuss the books just to suit people who didn't bother to read them

It's not a podcast about the books, it's a podcast about the show. Otherwise it would have a different name ("A Song of Ice and Fire-cast"?) and not line up with the seasons of the TV show.

It isn't suggested anywhere that this is a show-vs-book podcast, and there are no spoiler warnings, so I stand by my comments.

archiebawled:

DracoSuave:
Don't watch this sort of podcast then. Stick to podcasts specifically designed for show-fans only. AVClub does two reviews for GoT, one for book fans and the other for people new to the series.

Can't really avoid talking about the books in a podcast to discuss the books just to suit people who didn't bother to read them

It's not a podcast about the books, it's a podcast about the show. Otherwise it would have a different name ("A Song of Ice and Fire-cast"?) and not line up with the seasons of the TV show.

It isn't suggested anywhere that this is a show-vs-book podcast, and there are no spoiler warnings, so I stand by my comments.

It's an adaptation of a very popular book series. The reasonable expectation is that the book series WILL be brought up. This has been the reasonable expectation in geek culture for over a decade now. Discussions of adaptations that involve fans of the original work will include discussion of the original work. Discussions that involve future directions of that adaptation MUST, by necessity, include spoilers from the original work.

Arguing semantics will not change any of those above facts.

DracoSuave, I think we fundamentally disagree about the intended nature/reasonable expectations of the podcast, and I don't see anything good coming from continued discussion, so let's draw the discussion to a close here.

Just to mention, (in the books) at the scene of the Tully funeral for Hoster Tully, Edmure does in fact miss the boat with the flaming arrow three times, and then the Blackfish has to take over and hits it the first try. I always liked the Blackfish, and I think this scene helps develop both his and Edmure's character.

Bryndon the Blackfish is generally an extremely effective leader and goes on to do other reasonably bad-ass things after he slips off at the Red Wedding. (Note: he went off to "find a tree to piss on" immediately prior to the murderous events of that evening.) I hope, generally, the series doesn't forget about him, like they seem to be at risk of doing for a lot of interesting characters.

On the note of other characters that have disappeared: I agree, Gregor Clegane does need to come back. If only for the one on one fight he'll have in the future which should be truly interesting to see on screen.

I feel you guys had a very romanticized impression of the brotherhood without banners book version.
I got pretty much the same impression of who they were and what they were doing from the books as the show.

Joff wanting to serve Robb´s head to Sansa was in the books.

And, edmure never does hit his fathers funeral pyre, and brynden does take over, the scene was pretty much a word for word depiction.

Psykoma:
And, edmure never does hit his fathers funeral pyre, and brynden does take over, the scene was pretty much a word for word depiction.

Oh yeah, I was just hoping they both would miss anyway. :D

No matter how much I think what Theon did was shit, I frankly pity him...

 

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