Jimquisition: Why PC Gaming Gets Away With It

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Wait... you can migrate from gaming platform on PC? For FREE?

Since when?

EDIT: And System Shock 2 might not be the best example. Have you tried playing it on a modern OS? Good luck with that...

hermes200:
Wait... you can migrate from gaming platform on PC? For FREE?

Since when?

EDIT: And System Shock 2 might not be the best example. Have you tried playing it on a modern OS? Good luck with that...

If you have an old copy it won't run well on a modern operating system, but you can still get a copy of a current operating system that allows compatibility mode. There are ways to do it. It's not always easy, but there are ways. For consoles it's impossible. Just simply not going to happen no matter how hard you try.

RhombusHatesYou:

Lightknight:
The 500GB hard drives are better

Because Sony didn't piss about with purpose built enclosures and proprietary firmware, a PS3 can handle up to a 750Gb 2.5" HDD... and the reason the 1Gb and larger 2.5" HDDs couldn't be used is that the extra platter(s) the used for storage made the drive unit too large to fit into the case (unless you wanted to go with some fucked up case mod). Hopefully the console manufacturers didn't cheap on on the mobos for their new consoles so there'll be no maximum HDD size (most computers can't run an HDD larger than 3Tb)... and also that, for Xbone owners, MS will ditch all the prioprietary bollocks.

Ah, interesting. Thanks for all that information. I was wondering if the XBO would allow the swapping out of HDDs. This past generation we hardly touched our 360 until we got a new HDD that was ridiculously priced for being a whopping 50Gbs (heh). Whereas my PS3 has always been available for upgrade and I just hadn't had need for that until now.

As for game price on Digital Distro... forget serious reductions outside of sales, especially if you live outside the US. Publishers are far too busy handjobbing retailers to allow digital distro to have an advantage on price... and of course, they're more than happy to pocket the mark up that keeps retail price competitive.

I assume that was in response to the conversation going on in general rather than to me since I didn't mention price reductions. What are the average download/upload times in other countries? I have 16 mbps and it still takes just under a day to download Uncharted 3 (got it for free with PS+ which I was finally convinced to buy). It's to my understanding that while the US is slower on average than several other countries, most countries are even slower. We can't all live in Hong Kong and enjoy 44 mbps (which would have still required 6 hours or so to download Uncharted).

Restrictions on PC games exist because of the very nature of digital content and how hard it is to regulate. Though they try to make up for it in numerous other regards.

Restrictions on the XBox One exist because Microsoft thought they could get away with it.

kajinking:

PunkRex:

canadamus_prime:
Man, do I miss the days when I could just pick up and play on my consoles without all the bullshit.

Me to, I REALLY miss backwards compatability... I also have no experience with gaming PC's so I found this vid quit informative, thanks Jim.

That is one of the better parts of PC, I can install and play games from 10+ years ago on my system without having to do much.

I don't have my PS2 around the house but want to play GTA:SA? Download the PC version and get playing within 5 minutes!

Gaming PCs seem scary as hell when you first get them and get into them (I was terrified the first time I had to pop the case open to deal with something inside) but once you get the hang of it it's not all that badf.

Well, when you say it like that it doesn't sound badf at all.

I have always been more loyal to consoles than to PCs. As a kid/teen/adult I was never able to afford the top of the line $3000 gaming PCs. And every year new PC games required upgrades just to play them. Consoles were not like that. Any game I buy for my 360 will play on my 360. I've never had a console tell me "your graphics card is not compatible blah blah blah", or tell my I need DirectX-9.9.1.2.5B
They just start right up.
So for Microsoft to pull some sort of PC type bullshit, where games have to update/download/ask for 12 digit key numbers/whatever was just...heart-breaking. I have already accepted reduced graphics as a fair-trade off to be able to play Mass Effect 3, or Call of Duty. I don't need Microsoft hounding me 24/7 for loyalty. I don't need to prove my loyalty, they should prove why they deserve it!

hermes200:
Wait... you can migrate from gaming platform on PC? For FREE?

Since when?

EDIT: And System Shock 2 might not be the best example. Have you tried playing it on a modern OS? Good luck with that...

I bought sys shock 2 the other day on GOG, it has been running no problem for me about 3 hours in.

Lightknight:
Ah, interesting. Thanks for all that information. I was wondering if the XBO would allow the swapping out of HDDs. This past generation we hardly touched our 360 until we got a new HDD that was ridiculously priced for being a whopping 50Gbs (heh). Whereas my PS3 has always been available for upgrade and I just hadn't had need for that until now.

Hard to say what MS are going to do unless a majority of consumers are standing on their sac. With Sony, I think they went with standard HDDs both to save themselves some cash in production and also because they weren't sure if the HDD sizes they offered would prove to be insufficient. What will be interesting to see is if the new gen of consoles support SSDs. Expensive and kinda shit on price Vs storage capacity... but next to zero load times from disk? Yeah, that's some shit I can see a lot of console gamers thinking about if they continue to drop in price. Another thing to factor in is how the next gen will handle external HDDs... because if you can get a cheapish SSD for current installs and an external for bulk data storage then shit gets very interesting for console gamers looking for that extra bit of performance.

Honestly, I think Sony will be the best option when it comes to 3rd party hardware *again*. MS might pull their heads out of their arses and stop trying to control every aspect of their console... but we have to live in the world we have not the world we want.

Oh yeah, the 360 drives were standard 2.5" HDDs... the problem was with the cage and, most importantly, some proprietary firmware MS installed on the drives... All of the 360 softmods (think console chipping that doesn't need chips if you're not following) are based on a hack that allowed people to install 3rd party HDDs on 360s. If MS hadn't been dicks about it, it would have been a simple HDD swap.

I assume that was in response to the conversation going on in general rather than to me since I didn't mention price reductions. What are the average download/upload times in other countries? I have 16 mbps and it still takes just under a day to download Uncharted 3 (got it for free with PS+ which I was finally convinced to buy). It's to my understanding that while the US is slower on average than several other countries, most countries are even slower.

See, speed isn't the issue for a lot of countries, it's the monthly data caps that hurt. When you've got a set maximum allowance of data you can download in a month speed becomes less relevent... For example, I'm on a 100Mbit/s cable connection but my monthly data allowance is 200GB... given sufficent shit to download from high bandwidth sources I can kill that data cap in a day or so... and would have to spend the rest of the month at dial up speeds. So yeah, I could download a few games in not much time at all (assuming the download servers were up to it) but then I'd be sent back to the mid 90s for the rest of the month. Balls to that.

Steam as a gaming platform didn't build up it's rep in a day. It was quite a unpopular decision at first to many fans of Half Life and other Valve titles. The reason Steam is so popular, is simply because Valve has treated it's community fairly and built up Steam as such a great community of people, for the gamer by the gamer. Xbox One simply came out with the idea, and tried to force feed us it. Add Microsoft's reputation for screwing over just about everyone they have ever worked with, and it's not hard to see why there was such a negative reaction.

Yea more like talking for 8 and a half minuets Jim. lol

But still I can understand it yea Steam can be annoying yes I was pissed of a little when I needed it for Skyrim and Bioshock infinite.

but I honestly don't give a fuck anymore.

Here's a question for people who can't live without having physical copies of their games: Have you considered that digital is much less wasteful? And bad for the environment? There's everything that has to go into making the plastic and then the games have to be shipped in planes and then driven to the retailer. And then you have to drive to the shop to pick it up or have someone have it driven to you. Just think about that carbon footprint you could be avoiding.

PunkRex:
Well, when you say it like that it doesn't sound badf at all.

Thing to remember about PCs is they will only offer you a superior experience if that's the experience you prefer... (before an PC enthusiasts light the torches, chill. I'm talking experiences not technological performance.)

Beyond that, the biggest hurdles to PC gaming are the jargon and, unfortunately, those few PC gamers who just can't take the stick out their arse.

The advantage to an online community like the 'Pist is there are plenty (well a handful) of PC enthusiasts who are not only willing to help the neophyte but can also translate from PC enthusiast to newbie... and you can access these people without have to venture to sites where being a console gamer is a stoning offense... Just don't trust any of those heretics who recommend Haswell CPUs over Ivy Bridge, like that Intel shill Snowy. (cheers, Snow!)

I adore GOG and avoid using Steam whenever possible. I wouldn't mind Steam so much if they didn't charge me $99 USD for games because of where I love.

LaochEire:

Arcade Hero X:

LaochEire:
I don't really post on The Escapist, but can I just say that Steam is an absolute rip off when it comes to new games. In fact over in Ireland Gamestop can undercut Steam with a physical retail copy of a PC game by €20 euro. I never understood the myth about Steam being this bastion of excellence and the main reason to own a PC.

Sure, it has those great sales and they are great, but if I want a game upon release I would have to wait up to a year before it becomes anyway affordable on Steam.

Honestly, with Steam. I really just don't get it. Someone enlighten me, please.

Here man I live in Ireland too and your a bit wide of the mark really. I have seen copies of terraria go for €25 quid in GS while it's standard price on steam is €9.99 also GS matches the price for most new releases.......except COD which is €10 cheaper than steam for some reason. GS Ireland really can't give a fuck about PC games and as an ex employee I can attest to that I mean there is literally a 1x1 foot spinning shelf thing in my local GS for PC games and most other stores the PC games are hidden away from view while the Steam vouchers are right in your face as you walk in.

I understand so just an update on a few titles. Don't forget I'm talking about pre-order or brand new releases.

Company of Heroes 2
Steam 49.99
GS 39.97

Rome Total War 2
Steam 54.99
GS 44.97

Skyrim Legendary Edition
Steam 39.99
GS 29.97

Bioshock Infinite
Steam 49.99
GS 34.97

Total savings from shopping at GS over Steam €45.08. That's a massive difference.

I swear as soon as I go and try to get more examples the bloody site goes down.

Edit to say I will update the post with more when GS website decides to co-operate.

A chunk of it is due to you using steam in Euros. Steam doesn't like Euros. For example Company of heroes 2 is 39.99 which is cheaper. You might want to look at trying to change your location to the UK to get better deals.

Skyrim legendary is 24.99

Bioshock infinite is 29.99

Rome 2 is currently 29.99 on steam :D

EvilRoy:

hermes200:
Wait... you can migrate from gaming platform on PC? For FREE?

Since when?

EDIT: And System Shock 2 might not be the best example. Have you tried playing it on a modern OS? Good luck with that...

I bought sys shock 2 the other day on GOG, it has been running no problem for me about 3 hours in.

I left that out of my reply because you could do the same thing with new consoles (buy an old game made compatible for the new system). The point is buying the game new and play it forever without having to buy it again for the new compatibility. Buying from GOG is not the same. They have modified it to work with new operating systems and you had to pay for the new compatibility (a second time if you bought it 14 years ago). Yet, as I mentioned, there are plenty of things you can do to get an old game to work. Yet you have to be a little proactive and buy the right OS with compatibility mode or learn how to make it work (which can be a hassle). It is possible though, and the same cannot be said for old console games.

RhombusHatesYou:
Hard to say what MS are going to do unless a majority of consumers are standing on their sac. With Sony, I think they went with standard HDDs both to save themselves some cash in production and also because they weren't sure if the HDD sizes they offered would prove to be insufficient. What will be interesting to see is if the new gen of consoles support SSDs. Expensive and kinda shit on price Vs storage capacity... but next to zero load times from disk? Yeah, that's some shit I can see a lot of console gamers thinking about if they continue to drop in price. Another thing to factor in is how the next gen will handle external HDDs... because if you can get a cheapish SSD for current installs and an external for bulk data storage then shit gets very interesting for console gamers looking for that extra bit of performance.

Oh, I thought you new something about their HDD that I didn't. Their proprietary HDD's last gen were enfuriating compared with Sony's.

Honestly, I think Sony will be the best option when it comes to 3rd party hardware *again*. MS might pull their heads out of their arses and stop trying to control every aspect of their console... but we have to live in the world we have not the world we want.

It is looking that way.

Oh yeah, the 360 drives were standard 2.5" HDDs... the problem was with the cage and, most importantly, some proprietary firmware MS installed on the drives... All of the 360 softmods (think console chipping that doesn't need chips if you're not following) are based on a hack that allowed people to install 3rd party HDDs on 360s. If MS hadn't been dicks about it, it would have been a simple HDD swap.

Yeah, that was a dick move on their part. Not that Sony was any better with proprietary handheld memory sticks for the psp and vita.

See, speed isn't the issue for a lot of countries, it's the monthly data caps that hurt. When you've got a set maximum allowance of data you can download in a month speed becomes less relevent... For example, I'm on a 100Mbit/s cable connection but my monthly data allowance is 200GB... given sufficent shit to download from high bandwidth sources I can kill that data cap in a day or so... and would have to spend the rest of the month at dial up speeds. So yeah, I could download a few games in not much time at all (assuming the download servers were up to it) but then I'd be sent back to the mid 90s for the rest of the month. Balls to that.

Ah, that'd be awful. Especially if games get into the 100GBs which shouldn't be hard with Uncharted 3 running 40GB on the ps3.

scott91575:

hermes200:
Wait... you can migrate from gaming platform on PC? For FREE?

Since when?

EDIT: And System Shock 2 might not be the best example. Have you tried playing it on a modern OS? Good luck with that...

If you have an old copy it won't run well on a modern operating system, but you can still get a copy of a current operating system that allows compatibility mode. There are ways to do it. It's not always easy, but there are ways. For consoles it's impossible. Just simply not going to happen no matter how hard you try.

EvilRoy:
I bought sys shock 2 the other day on GOG, it has been running no problem for me about 3 hours in.

I works because Irrational did some work on the original code to work on modern PC/Mac via the gog system; which is nice, but not different than if some developers try to resell a 360 game on XBox One after they recompile it with the new SDK. The point is, it requires some work on the developer side, otherwise it won't happen... ever.

If I can take my copy of Descent or FX Fighter and make them run decently on my Windows 7, quad core PC, I will admit the superiority of the PC as a platform in terms of preserving past games for future generations. Otherwise, it might have some advantages, but it is not better than most consoles in that regard.

Kinitawowi:
Okay, let me be the one to say it:

Jim, you are a patronising, condescending arsewipe of a human being and I hope you choke on what I'm sure you regard as the beautiful, beautiful taste of your own excrement.

You've made a video here that tells us why everything else about PC gaming is awesome. Steam sales, eternal* compatability, prompt upgrades, community integration and development, vastly more content... but what you haven't done is told us why DRM is considered acceptable on PC. And then you have the cheek to turn around and say "I really shouldn't have to", when you've just told exactly why you do have to, and then failed to do so. At most you've argued that everything else that the DRM-mongers have done is great, so let's just take this little bit of dick up our holes.

You haven't told us anything about why PC gamers (like myself, I hasten to add) can go out to one of the few places on the high street that still sells PC games, buy a boxed game with a disc and everything, and then have to go back home and install Origin and sign up to their bullshit (and watch their sign-up process have a fart and lock me out for two hours) and type in a single-user product key in order to make it work. The fact that everything else about PC gaming is awesome does not make that acceptable. (Oh, and said Origin game still costs the same amount six months later as it did at the time. Blame Origin all you want, but that still doesn't make the system that has allowed it okay.)

You have outright lied about the nature of competition between online storefronts. Several of these stores are still under the control of their respective publishers and as such they're free to monopolise and gouge individual titles as they see fit. Again, this is partly the publisher's fault, but again, this doesn't make it okay. Game and Amazon and Tesco and even CeX can fight for my wallet on several titles. Steam and Origin have several where they can't.

You haven't told us why the lack of a used game market is fine. I don't trade in games myself, but there are plenty who do and I'm more than willing to tour those racks to find a couple of their bargains. GoG half-answers my side of this (although I really wish they'd post prices in pounds), but the sellers' side is still sorely lacking.

You haven't told us why it's okay that past attempts at DRM have at best installed disruptive and slowing software to people's PCs and at worst exposed those PCs to security issues and potential physical harm.

In short, you've told us precisely nothing about the actual issue and then patronised people for wondering about it. You. Piece. Of. Shit.

(The wonderful irony in all of this is that there are several answers, speaking to the long-term culture of gaming on home computers versus that of consoles, and you've chosen to ignore all of them in order to go off on an irrelevant tangent.)

Now I understand why Jim sounds so frustrated.

It's not that DRM and no used games are part of the things he listed. It's the fact the plusses allow them to add in some negatives and still have it a net overall gain for many users vs. other platforms. It may not be ok for you, and that is fine. Yet, obviously, there are many people who are willing to put up with the DRM and lack of used games in order to take advantage of what the PC can offer. Those same plusses are not available on consoles, so they cannot add in a negative like DRM and eliminate used game. They don't have that luxury.

I have stated this over and over again in this thread. I have no idea why you people cannot fathom that. If DRM destroys any experience for you, then sure, PC gaming not for you. Yet PC gaming offers other plusses that offset that minus for many people. Consoles do not have those added plusses and therefore have less leeway in adding restrictive measures. The consoles simply don't have the added plusses to offset any additional negative features. In order for the consoles to add a negative feature they needed to offset that feature with a positive even though neither is a requirement for the other. From what we saw, there simply were not enough added positives for the consumer to accept a negative addition.

Evilpigeon:

LaochEire:

Arcade Hero X:

Here man I live in Ireland too and your a bit wide of the mark really. I have seen copies of terraria go for €25 quid in GS while it's standard price on steam is €9.99 also GS matches the price for most new releases.......except COD which is €10 cheaper than steam for some reason. GS Ireland really can't give a fuck about PC games and as an ex employee I can attest to that I mean there is literally a 1x1 foot spinning shelf thing in my local GS for PC games and most other stores the PC games are hidden away from view while the Steam vouchers are right in your face as you walk in.

I understand so just an update on a few titles. Don't forget I'm talking about pre-order or brand new releases.

Company of Heroes 2
Steam 49.99
GS 39.97

Rome Total War 2
Steam 54.99
GS 44.97

Skyrim Legendary Edition
Steam 39.99
GS 29.97

Bioshock Infinite
Steam 49.99
GS 34.97

Total savings from shopping at GS over Steam €45.08. That's a massive difference.

I swear as soon as I go and try to get more examples the bloody site goes down.

Edit to say I will update the post with more when GS website decides to co-operate.

A chunk of it is due to you using steam in Euros. Steam doesn't like Euros. For example Company of heroes 2 is 39.99 which is cheaper. You might want to look at trying to change your location to the UK to get better deals.

Skyrim legendary is 24.99

Bioshock infinite is 29.99

Rome 2 is currently 29.99 on steam :D

Crazy, why are they shafting the Euro crowd? Although the pound to Euro puts them on equal footing with GS give or take a few cents. COH2 is on sale on the UK store, now how is that fair to everyone else?

Doesn't matter now anyway, I do most of my gaming on PS3 now. Only go on PC for RTS and Strategy gaming.

hermes200:
I works because Irrational did some work on the original code to work on modern PC/Mac via the gog system; which is nice, but not different than if some developers try to resell a 360 game on XBox One after they recompile it with the new SDK. The point is, it requires some work on the developer side, otherwise it won't happen... ever.

This is false. Some guys over at TTLG did it, and have been since the Windows 2k/XP days, which, due to their differing kernelhad problems running dark engine games out of the box.Nothing a /lgntforce couldn't handle back on win2k, though. Gog just packaged it.

If I can take my copy of Descent or FX Fighter and make them run decently on my Windows 7, quad core PC, I will admit the superiority of the PC as a platform in terms of preserving past games for future generations. Otherwise, it might have some advantages, but it is not better than most consoles in that regard.

I don't know FX Fighter, but my Gold Games version of Descent runs. Via DOSBox, granted, but the fact that such software even EXISTS is a major boon and something you just can't do on Consoles. You're confusing Backwards Compatibility, NATIVE Backwards Compatibility, and Rereleases.

Jim, you are a patronising, condescending arsewipe of a human being and I hope you choke on what I'm sure you regard as the beautiful, beautiful taste of your own excrement.

I'm not really a person to make a comment that has nothing to do with the topic at hand, but Hate to say it dude, while you brought up good points in the rest of your argument, you can criticize someone without using vulgar insults such as this one.

Reeve:
Here's a question for people who can't live without having physical copies of their games: Have you considered that digital is much less wasteful? And bad for the environment? There's everything that has to go into making the plastic and then the games have to be shipped in planes and then driven to the retailer. And then you have to drive to the shop to pick it up or have someone have it driven to you. Just think about that carbon footprint you could be avoiding.

Firstly, your argument is so flawed I can't even...
Everything, from your computer, to the things you use for comfort was delivered in some way.
You might as well quit right now and live in the forest.
Saying that we aren't environmentally conscious about ourselves because we want to OWN the thing we paid $60.00 for is stupid.
Saying that being that environmentally conscious is a good reason to go digital is even dumber.

hermes200:

scott91575:

hermes200:
Wait... you can migrate from gaming platform on PC? For FREE?

Since when?

EDIT: And System Shock 2 might not be the best example. Have you tried playing it on a modern OS? Good luck with that...

If you have an old copy it won't run well on a modern operating system, but you can still get a copy of a current operating system that allows compatibility mode. There are ways to do it. It's not always easy, but there are ways. For consoles it's impossible. Just simply not going to happen no matter how hard you try.

EvilRoy:
I bought sys shock 2 the other day on GOG, it has been running no problem for me about 3 hours in.

I works because Irrational did some work on the original code to work on modern PC/Mac via the gog system; which is nice, but not different than if some developers try to resell a 360 game on XBox One after they recompile it with the new SDK. The point is, it requires some work on the developer side, otherwise it won't happen... ever.

If I can take my copy of Descent or FX Fighter and make them run decently on my Windows 7, quad core PC, I will admit the superiority of the PC as a platform in terms of preserving past games for future generations. Otherwise, it might have some advantages, but it is not better than most consoles in that regard.

It has been mentioned down the page by a different poster, but it was actually a fan made patch that allows system shock 2 (and thief 2) to run on current machines. GOG/Irrational may have taken a look at the patch to make sure there was nothing that would murder a computer user in there, but the work had already been done before it was set up for official digital distribution.

Dragonbums:

Reeve:
Here's a question for people who can't live without having physical copies of their games: Have you considered that digital is much less wasteful? And bad for the environment? There's everything that has to go into making the plastic and then the games have to be shipped in planes and then driven to the retailer. And then you have to drive to the shop to pick it up or have someone have it driven to you. Just think about that carbon footprint you could be avoiding.

Firstly, your argument is so flawed I can't even...
Everything, from your computer, to the things you use for comfort was delivered in some way.
You might as well quit right now and live in the forest.
Saying that we aren't environmentally conscious about ourselves because we want to OWN the thing we paid $60.00 for is stupid.
Saying that being that environmentally conscious is a good reason to go digital is even dumber.

Yes of course we have to get our PCs etc made and delivered. That does contribute to the carbon footprint. The thing is having games physically distributed and us going out to get them ADDS some more to that carbon footprint than we otherwise would have, if we had simply downloaded the game.

Ben Jeanotte:
YOU CAN PIRATE ON PC VERY EASILY.

Funny thing is once you make the investment in time to softmod a 360, it's much easier to pirate on the 360.

Any chance of a list of all the games shown in that video? I recognised Witcher 2 and Portal 2 but none of the others. Particularly interested to know what that 'dude walking through frozen time mid-explosion' thing was as it looked really cool.

Jim, you never fail to brighten up my day with your clever mix of journalism and sarcasm. Rock on forever!

Machine Man 1992:

Holythirteen:
Console gamers are running out of excuses to not go PC.

You mean beisdes prohibitive cost?

You can build a middling gaming-PC, on par with console experience, for the same or less than the cost of an XBone.

Or the fact that some of us have an extensive console library already?

Irrelevant. Whether you build a gaming PC or buy the next gen of consoles, you won't be able to play those without the old console you already own.

Or the unspoken guarantee that a game put in a console will work, every time?

Unspoken, and not particularly true.

All that said, I have to disagree with Jim on this one. I know he's more forgiving of PC DRM, but the fact is that Steam is just as bad as Origin in that your only choices are to agree to whatever they might feel like jamming into the TOS, or your library is forfeit (Origin is more obnoxious about this so far, but Steam's done it too). But for some reason he glossed over one of the big arguments against the XBone: anyone with a bad/no internet connection is screwed. Now that you get titles like DX:HR and Borderlands 2 coming with steam even on the physical disc (there are many more examples, those are just the ones I can think of that I wanted but passed on) has those people just as screwed.

PunkRex:

kajinking:

PunkRex:

Me to, I REALLY miss backwards compatability... I also have no experience with gaming PC's so I found this vid quit informative, thanks Jim.

That is one of the better parts of PC, I can install and play games from 10+ years ago on my system without having to do much.

I don't have my PS2 around the house but want to play GTA:SA? Download the PC version and get playing within 5 minutes!

Gaming PCs seem scary as hell when you first get them and get into them (I was terrified the first time I had to pop the case open to deal with something inside) but once you get the hang of it it's not all that badf.

Well, when you say it like that it doesn't sound badf at all.

I really gotta re-read my stuff before posting LOLf.

Jimothy Sterling:
Why PC Gaming Gets Away With It

The Xbox One no longer enforces restrictions on used games, but the debate over console DRM is not over. One lingering question is this -- why are consoles criticized, but PC gets away with it?

I think it's more that nobody (who counts) cares about PC gaming.

Reeve:

Dragonbums:

Reeve:
Here's a question for people who can't live without having physical copies of their games: Have you considered that digital is much less wasteful? And bad for the environment? There's everything that has to go into making the plastic and then the games have to be shipped in planes and then driven to the retailer. And then you have to drive to the shop to pick it up or have someone have it driven to you. Just think about that carbon footprint you could be avoiding.

Firstly, your argument is so flawed I can't even...
Everything, from your computer, to the things you use for comfort was delivered in some way.
You might as well quit right now and live in the forest.
Saying that we aren't environmentally conscious about ourselves because we want to OWN the thing we paid $60.00 for is stupid.
Saying that being that environmentally conscious is a good reason to go digital is even dumber.

Yes of course we have to get our PCs etc made and delivered. That does contribute to the carbon footprint. The thing is having games physically distributed and us going out to get them ADDS some more to that carbon footprint than we otherwise would have, if we had simply downloaded the game.

That is still a very poor reason to convince to someone to go digital. You are going to have to find a better argument then that.

the antithesis:
Not to mention that you can put together a gaming PC for the price of a console these days.

So consoles don't even have the lower price point to make them attractive.

The WiiU is actually cheaper than $400 at its most basic set and does have games that the PC will probably never have. So the WiiU does have that going for it.

Dragonbums:

Reeve:

Dragonbums:

Firstly, your argument is so flawed I can't even...
Everything, from your computer, to the things you use for comfort was delivered in some way.
You might as well quit right now and live in the forest.
Saying that we aren't environmentally conscious about ourselves because we want to OWN the thing we paid $60.00 for is stupid.
Saying that being that environmentally conscious is a good reason to go digital is even dumber.

Yes of course we have to get our PCs etc made and delivered. That does contribute to the carbon footprint. The thing is having games physically distributed and us going out to get them ADDS some more to that carbon footprint than we otherwise would have, if we had simply downloaded the game.

That is still a very poor reason to convince to someone to go digital. You are going to have to find a better argument then that.

I would argue that someone who isn't convinced when the stability of our planet's environment is in question has not got their priorities straight. ;)

I'm sure you'd agree that the planet is more important than one's personal sense of ownership over a videogame?

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