Jimquisition: Why PC Gaming Gets Away With It

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Machine Man 1992:

Ultratwinkie:

Machine Man 1992:

First off, I wasn't even conversing with you, you injected yourself into a debate that was over before you even got here.

Second, I don't need or want a gaming PC, because every single time someone brings up a PC, I get flashbacks; an endless stream of blue-screens, system freezes, crashes, and Ctrl-Alt-Del-ing through problems. Endless technical bullshit, endless problems. I've had enough. I used a PC for about a decade, give or take. When the whole family switched over to Mac's and consoles, rather than just have PC's, all that bullshit went away.

Third, are Mac's Windows? No? Then they were worth every penny theoretically spent. It doesn't matter what the brand is as long as it isn't fucking Windows. And this thing I'm using isn't even that new: I got it about 4-5 years ago (I can't remember).

Forth, given how almost every PC user I've encountered so far has been an elitist douchenozzle, I'm not really convinced PC is all that great. If I wanted a radical personality change, I'd do PCP.

Fifth, the "PC games have better games defense" doesn't really work when A) a lot of games these days are released on ALL platforms, B) indie games can work on most rigs, even Macs, and C) it's not like the exclusives have me my the short-and-curlies.

When you go to the doctor do you get flashbacks of bonesaws and leeches? No? Then get out of 1495 and get with the damn program.

Hell, I remember when macs were so crappy everyone took turns taking a big ole dump on Steve Jobs every chance they got. Before apple went mobile. Did that stop people?

even multiplatform doesn't really work anymore when PC is getting huge swaths of games thanks to kickstarter, and no, mac games are by no means just as prevalent.

Hell, Linux gets more games than Mac does right now. Wanna know why? Because ever since the Apple II, Steve Jobs has always dismissed gaming.

and you rely on what other people are doing on their console? Did that stop people from playing Xbox and playstation with the racist, homophobic 5 year olds online?

Again, you get overly defensive and your contrived reasons are hilarious. What next, are you going to talk about how pagers are cool and your new CRT monitor is the bee's knees?

Fuck me, that was fast. It's almost like you're poised, ready respond as soon as I post, BUT THAT WOULD BE CRAZY.

You're clearly upset about something, because no-one would defend the platform this hard. No-one, except blind fanboys who can't fathom why anyone wouldn't want to be part of the glorious PC gaming master race. A master race composed entirely of people who project so hard, they could point themselves at a wall and show off power points.

I don't need a PC. I don't need eye-fucking graphics, keyboard and mouse controls, or the ability to mod games. I don't need the hassle of constant upgrades to stay current. I don't need any of the bullshit PC gamers take for granted.

I can do just fine with consoles. You don't need to agree with me on why I like consoles over PC. You do need to back the hell off already, and go irritate someone else.

I am actually not upset, I am amused anyone would still be using that outdated "omg blue screen" crap in 2013.

That crap stopped long ago, and only applied in the 90 and early 2000s.

Its like someone saying how he doesn't want a car because he needs to crank it up to start. In 2013. I didn't even knew anyone still seriously thought that in this day and age.

Hell, even updates are automated entirely on PC games. In fact, everything computers do is automated now.

You're not convincing anyone here with your overly defensive nature. You're trying to deflect how computers have changed since the 90s and ignore all the progress of 20 years.

Hell, even now consoles need to update too and that's also automated. Everything is. Computers aren't the specialist machines they were in the 80s and 90s. Computers now are so stable the only way to get a blue screen is to hit your processor with a hammer.

Ultratwinkie:

Machine Man 1992:

Ultratwinkie:

When you go to the doctor do you get flashbacks of bonesaws and leeches? No? Then get out of 1495 and get with the damn program.

Hell, I remember when macs were so crappy everyone took turns taking a big ole dump on Steve Jobs every chance they got. Before apple went mobile. Did that stop people?

even multiplatform doesn't really work anymore when PC is getting huge swaths of games thanks to kickstarter, and no, mac games are by no means just as prevalent.

Hell, Linux gets more games than Mac does right now. Wanna know why? Because ever since the Apple II, Steve Jobs has always dismissed gaming.

and you rely on what other people are doing on their console? Did that stop people from playing Xbox and playstation with the racist, homophobic 5 year olds online?

Again, you get overly defensive and your contrived reasons are hilarious. What next, are you going to talk about how pagers are cool and your new CRT monitor is the bee's knees?

Fuck me, that was fast. It's almost like you're poised, ready respond as soon as I post, BUT THAT WOULD BE CRAZY.

You're clearly upset about something, because no-one would defend the platform this hard. No-one, except blind fanboys who can't fathom why anyone wouldn't want to be part of the glorious PC gaming master race. A master race composed entirely of people who project so hard, they could point themselves at a wall and show off power points.

I don't need a PC. I don't need eye-fucking graphics, keyboard and mouse controls, or the ability to mod games. I don't need the hassle of constant upgrades to stay current. I don't need any of the bullshit PC gamers take for granted.

I can do just fine with consoles. You don't need to agree with me on why I like consoles over PC. You do need to back the hell off already, and go irritate someone else.

I am actually not upset, I am amused anyone would still be using that outdated "omg blue screen" crap in 2013.

That crap stopped long ago, and only applied in the 90 and early 2000s.

Its like someone saying how he doesn't want a car because he needs to crank it up to start. In 2013. I didn't even knew anyone still seriously thought that in this day and age.

Hell, even updates are automated entirely on PC games. In fact, everything computers do is automated now.

You're not convincing anyone here with your overly defensive nature. You're trying to deflect how computers have changed since the 90s and ignore all the progress of 20 years.

Hell, even now consoles need to update too and that's also automated. Everything is. Computers aren't the specialist machines they were in the 80s and 90s. Computers now are so stable the only way to get a blue screen is to hit your processor with a hammer.

What are you even on about anymore? I said "flashbacks" from "a decade ago". Jesus, it's like you're just looking to bitch.

Machine Man 1992:

What are you even on about anymore? I said "flashbacks" from "a decade ago". Jesus, it's like you're just looking to bitch.

Actually he's addressing all of your critiques, point by point. It's pretty fun to watch.
Though you seem to be running out of straw-man arguments though. :P

My reasoning is simple.

At one point PC gaming was close to dead with almost nothing coming out but poorly made ports thanks to console hardware... remember that? When you were still playing CS 1.5, UT2004, C&C or Everquest 2 because NOTHING was coming out?
Valve have never let me down, Steam stumbled abit at the start but quickly became extremely attractive with indie games you'd never heard of and mind blowing sales, those first few sale events were insane, you could get nostalgic and replay an old favorite for 25% of an already low price, because the history of PC games is as important as the future to us.

Thanks to Steam, developers/publishers put more effort into PC ports, and even create games tailored to PC's. It offered them a place to sell with less piracy, and a network where they could include automatic patches and additional features for Steam users using fast reliable servers, the larger identifiable market they created gave indie developers the confidence to launch crowd funding campaigns to see their creations go to market and succeed.

I want to see Steam continue to succeed, because while someone else may have come along to do it at some point, Steam came first and saved PC gaming.

It's basic economics, I mean if anyone in the console publishing industry took a class on Economics they SHOULD know that competition benefits the consumer. Happy loyal consumers spend more money.

Microsoft try to make a monopoly, while taking a big risk.. risking their business after the terrible sales of windows 8.
I've never seen fans of a console flock so fast to Sony before, it was almost judgement day for the crap Microsoft has put us through with buggy windows releases and the demonic spawn that was Vista.

cikame:
My reasoning is simple.

At one point PC gaming was close to dead with almost nothing coming out but poorly made ports thanks to console hardware... remember that? When you were still playing CS 1.5, UT2004, C&C or Everquest 2 because NOTHING was coming out?
Valve have never let me down, Steam stumbled abit at the start but quickly became extremely attractive with indie games you'd never heard of and mind blowing sales, those first few sale events were insane, you could get nostalgic and replay an old favorite for 25% of an already low price, because the history of PC games is as important as the future to us.

Thanks to Steam, developers/publishers put more effort into PC ports, and even create games tailored to PC's. It offered them a place to sell with less piracy, and a network where they could include automatic patches and additional features for Steam users using fast reliable servers, the larger identifiable market they created gave indie developers the confidence to launch crowd funding campaigns to see their creations go to market and succeed.

I want to see Steam continue to succeed, because while someone else may have come along to do it at some point, Steam came first and saved PC gaming.

Not only did Valve pay close attention during Economics class, they also care about the consumer. And that my friends, is love that comes right back... it's not just love that Valve gets in return... Treating customers with respect makes you rich? What a novel concept!

EXos:

Machine Man 1992:

What are you even on about anymore? I said "flashbacks" from "a decade ago". Jesus, it's like you're just looking to bitch.

Actually he's addressing all of your critiques, point by point. It's pretty fun to watch.
Though you seem to be running out of straw-man arguments though. :P

What strawman arguments? I don't like PC gaming, nor the people who do it.

Machine Man 1992:

What strawman arguments?

What arguments? The cost & the stability.

The stability I should have expected from a mac fanatic.
But yes windows isn't perfect but neither is apple os.
I've worked in the movie industries where they used macs for editing and I have witnessed several attempts to restart a crashed... Sorry "locked up"... mac with a hammer because it died and deleted 5 hours of work. Oh the cursing that editors can do. XD

The cost. That has been debunked so many times in this thread it's a disgrace that you can't come up with something better.

See good a argument against PC gaming is knowledge of hardware. When buying a PC you need to know a bit about the current state of technology.
Does this mean console users(peasants! :P) are dumb. No! It takes a fondness and interest in the technology to be able to build your own PC (which is cheapest).
That is what is great about consoles just buy the thing and a game. A little bit of time for the set up but after that it's ready for gaming.

Also Maintenance. PC's need a bit of looking after especially when you use them a lot. A bit of defrag here, some register cleaning etc etc.

See that Machine? That is how you argue against PC gaming.

Machine Man 1992:

I don't like PC gaming, nor the people who do it.

Machine Man 1992:

It doesn't matter what the brand is as long as it isn't fucking Windows.

That is a lot of hate you carry around.

I don't mind someone arguing their Xbox 360 is the best thing since cheetos; as long as he/she/it has some proper arguments and not some BS that is spewed by every fanboy from both sides!

So you prefer a mac? So why did you have to add all the other ravings around that?

EXos:

So you prefer a mac? So why did you have to add all the other ravings around that?

I prefer it because the alternative is no computer, and that simply won't do.

PC's cost me more in the long run, require persistant maintenance, and I hear that the best ones are assembled piecemeal. That means spending more money and doing lots of research to make sure all the parts talk to each other.

Then to actually pay the game, I have to jump through a bunch of hoops, register, and sign on with who knows how many different services, download a patch to fix an inevitable problem, etc. My experience with PC gaming has not been a nice one. A console, I just put in a game and play, maybe download a patch that's provided automatically. I own a Xbox 360, a PS3 and a PS2 of all things, with ample games for all. I just don't see a benefit to going PC.

As for the ravings... You try coming up with logical arguments after two shots of sambuca, two shots of Bailey's, and a shot cheap cherry vodka.

That, and it's funny watching Ultratwinkie try and argue with someone who has completely stopped giving a shit and is now just fucking with him.

Machine Man 1992:

I prefer it because the alternative is no computer, and that simply won't do.

That's a fair enough point.

Machine Man 1992:

PC's cost me more in the long run, require persistant maintenance, and I hear that the best ones are assembled piecemeal. That means spending more money and doing lots of research to make sure all the parts talk to each other.

They cost a bit more time but you don't have to spent money on research. There are several sites that have best buy guides where you can pick up a basic system in ranges from $250 al the way up to $1500.
Also I haven't heard parts not talking to each other hasn't been a problem for years. Though you have to make sure you get the proper sockets AM3+ PCI-Express etc. etc.
As for updating you can swap around parts fairly easy. And the amount of money you save on the games you can put back into the machine once a year. :P
Cause as Jim said in the video if you wait for a Sale on either Steam, GoG or Amazon you can buy a ton of games very cheaply, even AAA titles.

Machine Man 1992:

Then to actually pay the game, I have to jump through a bunch of hoops, register, and sign on with who knows how many different services, download a patch to fix an inevitable problem, etc. My experience with PC gaming has not been a nice one. A console, I just put in a game and play, maybe download a patch that's provided automatically. I own a Xbox 360, a PS3 and a PS2 of all things, with ample games for all. I just don't see a benefit to going PC.

The way you experience it with consoles is the same way I experience it on the PC. I pop in the disc install it download a patch (maybe) and play. About services there are only three services on PC that you actually need to sign up for before you can play. Origin, Uplay and of course Steam.

Machine Man 1992:

As for the ravings... You try coming up with logical arguments after two shots of sambuca, two shots of Bailey's, and a shot cheap cherry vodka.

Don't reply drunk then. :P

Machine Man 1992:

That, and it's funny watching Ultratwinkie try and argue with someone who has completely stopped giving a shit and is now just fucking with him.

Well you started swearing first so within standard debating rules you lost. :P Though you haven't made any ad hominem.

EXos:

Machine Man 1992:

I prefer it because the alternative is no computer, and that simply won't do.

That's a fair enough point.

Machine Man 1992:

PC's cost me more in the long run, require persistant maintenance, and I hear that the best ones are assembled piecemeal. That means spending more money and doing lots of research to make sure all the parts talk to each other.

They cost a bit more time but you don't have to spent money on research. There are several sites that have best buy guides where you can pick up a basic system in ranges from $250 al the way up to $1500.
Also I haven't heard parts not talking to each other hasn't been a problem for years. Though you have to make sure you get the proper sockets AM3+ PCI-Express etc. etc.
As for updating you can swap around parts fairly easy. And the amount of money you save on the games you can put back into the machine once a year. :P
Cause as Jim said in the video if you wait for a Sale on either Steam, GoG or Amazon you can buy a ton of games very cheaply, even AAA titles.

Machine Man 1992:

Then to actually pay the game, I have to jump through a bunch of hoops, register, and sign on with who knows how many different services, download a patch to fix an inevitable problem, etc. My experience with PC gaming has not been a nice one. A console, I just put in a game and play, maybe download a patch that's provided automatically. I own a Xbox 360, a PS3 and a PS2 of all things, with ample games for all. I just don't see a benefit to going PC.

The way you experience it with consoles is the same way I experience it on the PC. I pop in the disc install it download a patch (maybe) and play. About services there are only three services on PC that you actually need to sign up for before you can play. Origin, Uplay and of course Steam.

Machine Man 1992:

As for the ravings... You try coming up with logical arguments after two shots of sambuca, two shots of Bailey's, and a shot cheap cherry vodka.

Don't reply drunk then. :P

Machine Man 1992:

That, and it's funny watching Ultratwinkie try and argue with someone who has completely stopped giving a shit and is now just fucking with him.

Well you started swearing first so within standard debating rules you lost. :P Though you haven't made any ad hominem.

Actually, the debate was over and done with by the time Ultratinkle butted in.

Machine Man 1992:

Actually, the debate was over and done with by the time Ultratinkle butted in.

No it wasn't you ended with (see quote) before Ultratwinkie began. Shame for the Ad Hominem you were doing so well... :(

Machine Man 1992:

Honestly? Switching to consoles was my dad's idea. He's the IT person of the household, and he thinks the universal system requirements are what makes consoles "better".

Granted that was back in the PS2 era, but still.

That was 13 years ago when consoles were still practical, before they needed a internet connection to get the proper firmware updates before you can run a game.

EXos:

Machine Man 1992:

Actually, the debate was over and done with by the time Ultratinkle butted in.

No it wasn't you ended with (see quote) before Ultratwinkie began. Shame for the Ad Hominem you were doing so well... :(

Machine Man 1992:

Honestly? Switching to consoles was my dad's idea. He's the IT person of the household, and he thinks the universal system requirements are what makes consoles "better".

Granted that was back in the PS2 era, but still.

That was 13 years ago when consoles were still practical, before they needed a internet connection to get the proper firmware updates before you can run a game.

Misspellings don't count, and it wasn't within the context of the argument. So, I'm still gonna call that a moral victory, I guess.

Was it really thirteen years ago? I feel old now, thanks!

Andy of Comix Inc:
So, basically, "PC is an open platform that needs the added security. Consoles are closed platforms that do not deserve any more security."

I'm still mad that retail PC games just come with Steam codes now. I remember being able to install... hell. Even Fallout 3 on multiple people's computers at once, and now everything is bolted to a single account instead. Fair enough, I guess, there's a demand for Steampowered games, but... yeah. I'm still annoyed about that.

I guess people like me installing Fallout 3 on multiple people's computers at once are sort of what justified that. Again, the openness of the PC platform dictates that gates have to be closed somewhere. The fact that you can just literally copy the files of old PC games over with absolutely no hassle at all really does make DRM a necessity, and since it is all circumvented eventually anyway, it makes making that DRM appealing in some way to buy into even more of a necessity. Steam's greatest achievement is that it has made people WANT games to use Steam; it has made people WANT a DRM-flavoured copy of their games. Huh.

I guess you're lucky that you didn't get modwrath for your admission of piracy there...

evilneko:

Andy of Comix Inc:
So, basically, "PC is an open platform that needs the added security. Consoles are closed platforms that do not deserve any more security."

I'm still mad that retail PC games just come with Steam codes now. I remember being able to install... hell. Even Fallout 3 on multiple people's computers at once, and now everything is bolted to a single account instead. Fair enough, I guess, there's a demand for Steampowered games, but... yeah. I'm still annoyed about that.

I guess people like me installing Fallout 3 on multiple people's computers at once are sort of what justified that. Again, the openness of the PC platform dictates that gates have to be closed somewhere. The fact that you can just literally copy the files of old PC games over with absolutely no hassle at all really does make DRM a necessity, and since it is all circumvented eventually anyway, it makes making that DRM appealing in some way to buy into even more of a necessity. Steam's greatest achievement is that it has made people WANT games to use Steam; it has made people WANT a DRM-flavoured copy of their games. Huh.

I guess you're lucky that you didn't get modwrath for your admission of piracy there...

Not that I'd deny that I did pirate games once upon a time (no longer), and that modwrath is actually faced not for mere admission of piracy but for the appraisal or encouragement of piracy, but, um... where? When I said I lent my friends a copy of my game? That's not piracy...?

Andy of Comix Inc:

evilneko:

Andy of Comix Inc:
So, basically, "PC is an open platform that needs the added security. Consoles are closed platforms that do not deserve any more security."

I'm still mad that retail PC games just come with Steam codes now. I remember being able to install... hell. Even Fallout 3 on multiple people's computers at once, and now everything is bolted to a single account instead. Fair enough, I guess, there's a demand for Steampowered games, but... yeah. I'm still annoyed about that.

I guess people like me installing Fallout 3 on multiple people's computers at once are sort of what justified that.

I guess you're lucky that you didn't get modwrath for your admission of piracy there...

Not that I'd deny that I did pirate games once upon a time (no longer), and that modwrath is actually faced not for mere admission of piracy but for the appraisal or encouragement of piracy, but, um... where? When I said I lent my friends a copy of my game? That's not piracy...?

Right there, where I bolded. You're giving copies of a game you don't own copyright to to multiple other people. That's copyright infringement, also known as piracy, albeit on a very small scale.

And with FO3, you could've all been playing these copies at once.

evilneko:

Andy of Comix Inc:

evilneko:

I guess you're lucky that you didn't get modwrath for your admission of piracy there...

Not that I'd deny that I did pirate games once upon a time (no longer), and that modwrath is actually faced not for mere admission of piracy but for the appraisal or encouragement of piracy, but, um... where? When I said I lent my friends a copy of my game? That's not piracy...?

Right there, where I bolded. You're giving copies of a game you don't own copyright to to multiple other people. That's copyright infringement, also known as piracy, albeit on a very small scale.

And with FO3, you could've all been playing these copies at once.

I lent them the game, geez. I didn't distribute installs on a USB drive or anything. They probably played it all at once - I actually bought it along my brother for the purpose of playing it both at the same time. I didn't read the EULA though. Presumably it does tell me I'm not allowed to do that.

It is not download piracy though. And like I said, I'm not endorsing it. I didn't like FO3 at all, to the point where I never played it, so I lent it to friends to feel like I got my money's worth. That's it, really.

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