South Park As A Gated Community

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South Park As A Gated Community

I will point out how it nicely illustrates the disconnect of Privilege that began right around that moment to slowly transform South Park from the vital truth-telling youngster of TV animation to the grouchy grandpa old before its time.

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That baby-vs-annoying-dude example at the start of the article was... kind of brilliant, actually.

ValSmith61:
Once again, Bob shows what a massive f**king hypocrite he is by calling out South Park, yet he gives shows like the Simpsons & Family Guy a free pass when they use their "privilege" to insult people, simply because he agrees more with the far-left leanings of Groening and McFarlane.

Bob, you are just a worthless hypocrite. And you're still wrong for supporting drone warfare.

I'm not really sure you could call Trey Parker and Matt Stone left-wing or right-wing; they generally target whatever has pissed them off at the moment, or alternatively, whatever provides the most humor to mock.

I fall in the South Park category of politics, in which I feel both sides of the issues are so far batshit insane (and downright stupid) that I want no part in it and trust none of them. I love the humor of South Park, because it really hits the nose on what "equality" really means. Humor has no politics.

That analogy was kinda disturbing... but absolutely brilliant, heck, it's definitely something that could certainly happen in South Park (TBH, I'm actually surprised that it hasn't been done yet...).

ValSmith61:
Once again, Bob shows what a massive f**king hypocrite he is by calling out South Park, yet he gives shows like the Simpsons & Family Guy a free pass when they use their "privilege" to insult people, simply because he agrees more with the far-left leanings of Groening and McFarlane.

Bob, you are just a worthless hypocrite. And you're still wrong for supporting drone warfare.

Maybe chill out and just say you disagree, instead of throwing out profanity and character attacks? You've been on the site long enough to know you hate Bob, so just don't watch/read his stuff.

ValSmith61:

Someone has to call him out for being a dick.

You might wanna edit your posts. We're not allowed to criticise content creators around these parts.

amaranth_dru:
I fall in the South Park category of politics, in which I feel both sides of the issues are so far batshit insane (and downright stupid) that I want no part in it and trust none of them. I love the humor of South Park, because it really hits the nose on what "equality" really means. Humor has no politics.

That's not true. Parker and Stone are middle-of-the-road libertarians, not left-wing or right-wing. They are primarily focused on issues of middle-class consumerist Americans. This gives them a very specific political position, which is consistently employed in their show.

South Park is like the Simpsons, Family Guy, or Futurama - it's so utterly middle-of-the-road that it hardly offends anyone - hence it's popularity. It's something Americans can partake in and feel American. South Park is like apple pie.

The great irony is that South Park's reputation is for being "offensive", when in truth it's anything but.

I find South Park's "everyone is equally wrong, so just cool it" attitude refreshing. Honestly, in this era of ever-increasing political polarization, this is a message that desperately needs to be reinforced. Sometimes, the best way to make progress is put your overzealous emotional factionalism aside and just take in the objective absurdity of both sides from an outsider's perspective.

Unfortunately, Bob is just a very opinionated person. At the risk of unfairly calling him out personally, I would say that the mentality he exemplifies is the primary reason for the political gridlock making America so ineffectual right now at dealing with its problems. Everyone just refuses to even consider the possibility that they could *gasp* be wrong about something, and will instead fight to the death over issues that they have no stake in and are unqualified to be debating.

Edit: Sorry about my wordiness, I just wrote a research essay and the whole "vocabulary soup bullshit filler" habit is hard to shake off.

This has got to be one of the worst articles I've read here on The Escapist in a while. The first page was fine, the second seemed like an unwarranted attack by somebody who only listens to people who bad mouth the show but has never actually watched it.

I mean, did you even finish watching the NSA episode? It pointed out the hypocrisy of people demanding less government surveillance but still plaster their personal information all over the net, it pointed out how ludicrous it is to believe that the government is watching *you* specifically and that it borders on paranoia, and hell, one of the characters came right out and said their opinion quite blatantly, leaving Cartman, who is railing against the NSA, speechless. They actually do state their opinion quite oftem, and they do it deliberately by attacking both sides. It doesn't make them contrarian for the sake of being contrarian if both sides of an argument deserve to be criticized, does it? They don't mindlessly take a side, they illustrate their own opinion based on the criticisms they make. I mean, is there any side of an issue that you wholeheartedly agree with? Just with the last episode, they expressed sympathy for those who think that they're doing good by getting rid of these "murder simulator" videogames while still disagreeing with them and pointing out the flaws of that mindset.

I like South Park. I think its one of the best shows on TV. I don't think its necessarily a great show, but its a good show, and the creators use it as a platform to voice their opinions about a subject and basically encourage people to think for themselves. There's not many TV shows that do that. If the only reason I'm not excited to see what Matt and Trey have to say about an issue, its because I'm so familiar with their opinions that I think I know what it is before the show airs. Hell, I'll bet ten bucks what the message of the episode on Chelsea Manning is. The only thing I found negative about the experience is that their stance is predictable, because most of us think along the same lines as them.

Eh, I guess you're right. Yeah I hate to admit it, but yeah you're kind of right. Personally, I think Trey and Matt let the praise they've always gotten go to their heads. They aren't, and never were actually very insightful about politics. Any B-list pundit could out do them. The difference, however, was that no one expected B-grade political commentary to be coming from a cartoon! Oh wait, well, no one expected B-grade political commentary reflecting things that happened last week to be coming from a cartoon! So that was the hook.

What SP was truly good at was trolling with people. Yeah that's what Trey and Matt always really were; ornery little pranksters. THAT is what was always actually appealing about the commentary. And personally, I think that the last run of 7 episodes was the best run in the series history, and it's looking like this season will be pretty good as well. It seems like they're finally giving the commentary less of a focus.

I mean references to news headlines are still there, but they rarely still spawn into whole plot lines. They're more make up little jokes and scenes, like it was back in the first three seasons.

And if my memory serves, in the event that they do make whole episodes out of issues, they've lately been coming down pretty decisively on one side. This week's episode was pretty much "censorship is stupid. The end"

ValSmith61:
Stuff

He was just saying South Park was slightly less incredibly wonderful than it was before. But he still places it way above FG or modern Simpsons.

Zaydin:

ValSmith61:
Once again, Bob shows what a massive f**king hypocrite he is by calling out South Park, yet he gives shows like the Simpsons & Family Guy a free pass when they use their "privilege" to insult people, simply because he agrees more with the far-left leanings of Groening and McFarlane.

Bob, you are just a worthless hypocrite. And you're still wrong for supporting drone warfare.

I'm not really sure you could call Trey Parker and Matt Stone left-wing or right-wing; they generally target whatever has pissed them off at the moment, or alternatively, whatever provides the most humor to mock.

Trey and Matt are examples of the rare outspoken moderates.

Seriously Bob, I like most of the stuff you put up on this site but when you talk politics you really make a mess of things. Are you really so blinded by your own bias that you think it is completely unfair and unwarranted to mock the people or ideologies you happen to agree with while their supposed opposition should be completely fair game?

Bob doesn't seem to hate the supposed "fallacy" of attacking everything equally(which South Park doesn't really do, their thing is more that anything is fair game to mock) as much as he doesn't like agreeing with and enjoying the mocking of the people he dislikes but then being caught off guard when those he agrees with are mocked. He would much rather be able to enjoy all the mocking like with Family Guy the other blatantly liberal McFarlane stuff or just be able to avoid it entirely because it mocks the stuff he likes and dismiss it as evil.

Also, are you really going to bring up 'privilege' when comparing the very wealthy, celebrity producers of hit television shows?

Slightly off topic but on a slightly less inflammatory note: What did people think of South Park's recent episode where they touched on the whole violent media makes people violent thing? I thought it was really funny how when the parents became obsessed with minecraft they starting digging up lawns, punching trees, and building blocky structures in the real world.

Silent Protagonist:
Seriously Bob, I like most of the stuff you put up on this site but when you talk politics you really make a mess of things. Are you really so blinded by your own bias that you think it is completely unfair and unwarranted to mock the people or ideologies you happen to agree with while their supposed opposition should be completely fair game?

Bob doesn't seem to hate the supposed "fallacy" of attacking everything equally(which South Park doesn't really do, their thing is more that anything is fair game to mock) as much as he doesn't like agreeing with and enjoying the mocking of the people he dislikes but then being caught off guard when those he agrees with are mocked. He would much rather be able to enjoy all the mocking like with Family Guy the other blatantly liberal McFarlane stuff or just be able to avoid it entirely because it mocks the stuff he likes and dismiss it as evil.

Also, are you really going to bring up 'privilege' when comparing the very wealthy, celebrity producers of hit television shows?

Slightly off topic but on a slightly less inflammatory note: What did people think of South Park's recent episode where they touched on the whole violent media makes people violent thing? I thought it was really funny how when the parents became obsessed with minecraft they starting digging up lawns, punching trees, and building blocky structures in the real world.

Exactly.

I highly recommend Bob to stay away from touching on politics. Making the analogy that South Park's comedic angles is akin to slapping an innocent baby (Liberals/Democrats) and slapping an overgrown man (Conservatives/Republicans) is pretty ridiculous. Your poor logos and crazy pathos ruins your ethos. Ya, just learned those terms in my English for Engineers class.

Joining your off topic Silent Protagonist: I really enjoyed their violent media episode and especially liked their "harder to make available" argument at the end. Much better episode overall compared to the Season premier. And you just can't go wrong with some hilarious nipple play.

Let's review:

1) I open the article.
2) I see Bob bashing South Park for having the "nerve" to attack a liberal over his homophobic rants on social media.
3) I note that this is the same MovieBob who defends Family Guy as quality material, even though it tugs a blatantly liberal bias throughout all of its content.

Stay hypocritical, Bob.

Not that I'd expect you to understand hypocrisy, after all, you basically get a free pass on this site by virtue of being their incarnation of the "anti-Yahtzee", effectively functioning as the overly-pro-Nintendo Yin to Yahtzee's overly-anti-Nintendo Yang.

So it's cool for Family Guy to tastelessly attack conservatives with insults that go so far as to place McCain campaign buttons on Nazis (yes, really), but when South Park takes jabs at a liberal, WOH NOW, that's just a bridge too far!

Bravo, Bob. There's a big difference between being a balanced, reasonable moderate and being a true-neutral "EVERYONE ON BOTH SIDES IS AN IDIOT FOR TAKING A SIDE IN THE FIRST PLACE" moderate.

You know, it's funny. I may have said this before. South Park has a decidedly anti-leftist bent and does things like have hybrid cars belching clouds of "smug" and compare Al Gore to people who are scared that Bigfoot is going to come down out of the mountains and gobble up our children, while Family Guy does stuff like literally call John McCain supporters Nazis without a hint of irony. And yet: the Internet, where people who vote Republican rarely venture outside of their own designated haunts like the Fox News site or Conservapedia, is the one place you can find truckloads of people who love South Park and hate Family Guy. There's something fundamentally different about their approaches, and it sure ain't who they vote for.

I think it's the fact that South Park's satire comes off as mockery, while Family Guy's is more openly meanspirited and... well, smug. It's the difference between "oh, you crazy people" and "fuck you, asshole". Actually, it's not even "fuck you", it's more "fuck those assholes, amirite?" *smirks at camera*

Steve the Pocket:
Actually, it's not even "fuck you", it's more "fuck those assholes, amirite?" *smirks at camera*

The exact reason I stopped watching Family Guy with any regularity. I mean, there was an episode where Quagmire goes off on Brian, and pretty much the entire audience is applauding this. Somehow, though, this is supposed to make Quagmire a dick, and the show goes on without the slightest bit of self-awareness as displayed in that single scene. Its like it was written by a critic of the show rather than any of the show's writers themselves, and then the writers fall back into old habits like nothing happened. Its almost like they don't care that they're hypocrites.

rasputin0009:

Silent Protagonist:
Seriously Bob, I like most of the stuff you put up on this site but when you talk politics you really make a mess of things. Are you really so blinded by your own bias that you think it is completely unfair and unwarranted to mock the people or ideologies you happen to agree with while their supposed opposition should be completely fair game?

Bob doesn't seem to hate the supposed "fallacy" of attacking everything equally(which South Park doesn't really do, their thing is more that anything is fair game to mock) as much as he doesn't like agreeing with and enjoying the mocking of the people he dislikes but then being caught off guard when those he agrees with are mocked. He would much rather be able to enjoy all the mocking like with Family Guy the other blatantly liberal McFarlane stuff or just be able to avoid it entirely because it mocks the stuff he likes and dismiss it as evil.

Also, are you really going to bring up 'privilege' when comparing the very wealthy, celebrity producers of hit television shows?

Slightly off topic but on a slightly less inflammatory note: What did people think of South Park's recent episode where they touched on the whole violent media makes people violent thing? I thought it was really funny how when the parents became obsessed with minecraft they starting digging up lawns, punching trees, and building blocky structures in the real world.

Exactly.

I highly recommend Bob to stay away from touching on politics. Making the analogy that South Park's comedic angles is akin to slapping an innocent baby (Liberals/Democrats) and slapping an overgrown man (Conservatives/Republicans) is pretty ridiculous. Your poor logos and crazy pathos ruins your ethos. Ya, just learned those terms in my English for Engineers class.

Joining your off topic Silent Protagonist: I really enjoyed their violent media episode and especially liked their "harder to make available" argument at the end. Much better episode overall compared to the Season premier. And you just can't go wrong with some hilarious nipple play.

Woah woah woah. Slow down there hoss. Republicans are the baby and the Democratic party are the cellphone dude. I mean, who has been throwing increasingly large tantrums since 2008 because they're not getting their way?

You know what I realized here?

you can analyze something wayyy to much. Its just a show that pokes fun at current events and tries to be funny.

Not everything needs to be probed for message or deeper meaning, not everything needs to be torn down and criticized for every detail, that doesn't make you intelligent, it makes you bitter and spiteful, and eventually takes away any ability to genuinely have fun and enjoy things.

CriticKitten:
Let's review:

1) I open the article.
2) I see Bob bashing South Park for having the "nerve" to attack a liberal over his homophobic rants on social media.
3) I note that this is the same MovieBob who defends Family Guy as quality material, even though it tugs a blatantly liberal bias throughout all of its content.

Stay hypocritical, Bob.

Not that I'd expect you to understand hypocrisy, after all, you basically get a free pass on this site by virtue of being their incarnation of the "anti-Yahtzee", effectively functioning as the overly-pro-Nintendo Yin to Yahtzee's overly-anti-Nintendo Yang.

So it's cool for Family Guy to tastelessly attack conservatives with insults that go so far as to place McCain campaign buttons on Nazis (yes, really), but when South Park takes jabs at a liberal, WOH NOW, that's just a bridge too far!

Erm i don't think yahtzee is anti-nintendo rather then anti-everyone and theyr mums.

Didn't realy like the article overall. Southparks overall tone hasn't changed that much as far as i can see. I also never considered them as this cultural force described in the article. More like 2 reasonable moderate guys making a show trolling self righteouss assholes on all sides.

MarsAtlas:
I mean, there was an episode where Quagmire goes off on Brian, and pretty much the entire audience is applauding this. Somehow, though, this is supposed to make Quagmire a dick, and the show goes on without the slightest bit of self-awareness as displayed in that single scene. Its like it was written by a critic of the show rather than any of the show's writers themselves, and then the writers fall back into old habits like nothing happened. Its almost like they don't care that they're hypocrites.

The first time I heard about that scene (this was after I had stopped watching), it was from some people who thought Quagmire was actually meant to be a mouthpiece for the audience, and cheered that the writers were finally taking the piss out of Brian. And to their credit, the following episode (which I did watch out of curiosity) was basically Brian being force-fed humble pie in a variety of exciting flavors. But the fact that it's been taken both ways just goes to show how impossible it is to make any sort of coherent point when you populate your show entirely with unlikable assholes.

SecondPrize:
Woah woah woah. Slow down there hoss. Republicans are the baby and the Democratic party are the cellphone dude. I mean, who has been throwing increasingly large tantrums since 2008 because they're not getting their way?

*arguing politics in a thread unrelated to politics*

image

Take this elsewhere. Leave this thread for the bitching at/defending of MovieBob and South Park talk.

Steve the Pocket:
But the fact that it's been taken both ways just goes to show how impossible it is to make any sort of coherent point when you populate your show entirely with unlikable assholes.

I think its less about unlikable assholes and more about being an asshole with your point. I mean, people love Cartman, people love It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. Cartman is a terrible person, The Gang are terrible people, but its written so that the characters are what is terrible, not the point of the episode. I loved the episode last season where Eric Cartman "lowered the bar", because the point wasn't "Hey, be the asshole that has no self-respect and have lower standards for mankind", it was the opposite of that. Many of Family Guy's episodes in the passing years have been relatively blatant attacks on people who aren't really so terrible that they don't deserve some time worth understanding. American Dad has managed much better at not outright insulting people who believe in certain things, rather than explaining why they think its wrong (as South Park does), but it still falls victim every now and then.

Edit: Breaking Bad. A fantastic show with a protagonist that turns outright evil. Not necessary soul-less, but evil for sure (and when I call somebody evil, you had better believe they're all kinds of fucked up). The show never endorsed Walter White's path though. Another example, The Godfather II. The whole point of the ending was to show Michael Corleone as fallen and irredeemable. He had his chance, and the audience is hoping that he does the right thing. He doesn't, and the audience is crushed. We pity him, in the end, as he lost everything that matters, and is left alone. The movie doesn't condone his actions, because what he does in The Godfather II is supposed to be seen as unjustifiable, whereas most of his actions in the first film can be, if not condoned, understood.

My friends religiously watched South Park for a couple of years back in college, but that was during the beginning of it's run. (Yeah... we're old.) We're the ones who gave a hoot and a cheer when we first heard the jingle at the end of the first episode, recognizing it as "The sky is blue, and all the leaves are green..." from Cannibal the Musical.

And then, well, most of us all but stopped watching television.

I've watched a couple of episodes of SP here and there, but I wasn't even aware of the sabbatical; that may say something about my level of stake on this particular issue.

I do remember hearing about the argument with Isaac Hayes that blew up during the Tom Cruise episode, and thinking at the time that while Parker and Stone had a point that the show had been making fun of people for a long time and it was peculiar for Hayes to start getting outraged about it now, they also reacted by treating someone who had been with the show from the beginning, someone who had a non-trivial part in establishing its success, like absolute shit.

"Chef was a robotic child molester all along!" ...Yeah, guys, that's hilarious. What is this, the Mafia? You walk away, you can expect a bullet to the back of the head?

So, noting the lack of stake and relatively narrow vantage point, it still sounds like MB's criticism is pretty accurate. Which is kind of a shame- it would be nice if someone with the kind of platform of Parker and Stone actually tried to use it for good, rather than patting people on the back for sneering apathy.

The analogy in the beginning of the blog is intentionally wrong to provide undue sympathy to one side. A South Park stand-in would slap the parent of the crying baby for not doing anything to console the baby.

I have no respect for people who are locked in on one political position. It shows intellectual laziness. No one political ideology is the correct answer to every problem that faces society. People who just advocates only one particular political position all the time are just engaging in tribalism. Instead of honestly discussing the issue.

South Park isn't complicated. There are only two rules.

1. Make fun of everything.
2. Nothing is too sacred to show.

KissingSunlight:
The analogy in the beginning of the blog is intentionally wrong to provide undue sympathy to one side. A South Park stand-in would slap the parent of the crying baby for not doing anything to console the baby.

I had the same thought.

Making strawmen does far more harm than good to your (Bob's) argument to anyone that isn't already completely blindly agreeing with your argument.

CriticKitten:
Let's review:

1) I open the article.
2) I see Bob bashing South Park for having the "nerve" to attack a liberal over his homophobic rants on social media.
3) I note that this is the same MovieBob who defends Family Guy as quality material, even though it tugs a blatantly liberal bias throughout all of its content.

Stay hypocritical, Bob.

Way to miss the point entirely. First of all, Alec Baldwin didn't go on a homophobic rant. He merely used the word "queen" as an derogatory phrase when insulting a news reporter (who happened to be gay) for apparently lying about Baldwin's wife's conduct at their friend's funeral service. South Park meanwhile had an entire episode based around the use of the F word and it appears regularly in the show's script (especially spoken by Mr. Garrison and Cartman). Not even considering all the other 'tasteless' content of the show, who do you think is really getting a free ride? Bob's point was about personal conduct, not politics.

Doopliss64:
I find South Park's "everyone is equally wrong, so just cool it" attitude refreshing. Honestly, in this era of ever-increasing political polarization, this is a message that desperately needs to be reinforced. Sometimes, the best way to make progress is put your overzealous emotional factionalism aside and just take in the objective absurdity of both sides from an outsider's perspective.

Unfortunately, Bob is just a very opinionated person. At the risk of unfairly calling him out personally, I would say that the mentality he exemplifies is the primary reason for the political gridlock making America so ineffectual right now at dealing with its problems. Everyone just refuses to even consider the possibility that they could *gasp* be wrong about something, and will instead fight to the death over issues that they have no stake in and are unqualified to be debating.

Edit: Sorry about my wordiness, I just wrote a research essay and the whole "vocabulary soup bullshit filler" habit is hard to shake off.

Whereas your attitude of "I'm the only one that's right because I don't have an opinion" solves everything doesn't it? Not taking a side and just laughing at anyone who is passionate about their beliefs is exactly why america becomes more and more divided. Saying that finding a "middle ground" is ALWAYS the best solution only passes the problem further down the road. The longer it waits the angrier people get. Sometimes there IS a right side and a wrong side.

MarsAtlas:
The exact reason I stopped watching Family Guy with any regularity. I mean, there was an episode where Quagmire goes off on Brian, and pretty much the entire audience is applauding this. Somehow, though, this is supposed to make Quagmire a dick, and the show goes on without the slightest bit of self-awareness as displayed in that single scene. Its like it was written by a critic of the show rather than any of the show's writers themselves, and then the writers fall back into old habits like nothing happened. Its almost like they don't care that they're hypocrites.

Brian falls back on his old habits like nothing happened. They have gone out of their way to show how flawed Brian is as a character on numerous occasions: He's an unrepentant alcoholic, he can be incredibly selfish and arrogant, and can't handle not being the smartest one in a romantic relationship. He failed college twice and turned conservative for an episode after Rush Limbaugh saved him from a street gang. Brian is the "liberal conscience" of the show but that doesn't mean he's supposed to be a role model. Nobody on that show is a good role model.

Steve the Pocket:
But the fact that it's been taken both ways just goes to show how impossible it is to make any sort of coherent point when you populate your show entirely with unlikable assholes.

It also goes to show that different people can see the exact same thing and have different opinions on it. Crazy right?

Did Bob really write a whole article saying Matt Stone and Trey Parker need to check their privilege because South Park attacks liberals as well as conservatives. Bob thinks that they don't care about an agenda because they have cis white straight male privilege. What the hell is this tumblr?
Why is the Liberal agenda the baby? So its only okay for people to make fun and disagree with the conservative agenda like family guy and Simpsons blatantly associating the republican party with evil. But when someone attacks the agenda that you follow its not okay its because of privilege.

DVS BSTrD:
Brian falls back on his old habits like nothing happened. They have gone out of their way to show how flawed Brian is as a character on numerous occasions: He's an unrepentant alcoholic, he can be incredibly selfish and arrogant, and can't handle not being the smartest one in a romantic relationship. He failed college twice and turned conservative for an episode after Rush Limbaugh saved him from a street gang. Brian is the "liberal conscience" of the show but that doesn't mean he's supposed to be a role model. Nobody on that show is a good role model.

Its not about Brian though, its the whole show itself. Brian, I could understand, but the entire show seems to fall back into mocking anybody with a slightly conservative belief to some extent or another, and outright calls people with certain beliefs "idiots" without explaining why they're wrong. Its not just Brian saying that either.

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