Escapist Expo: Xbox One vs PS4 vs. Wii U

Xbox One vs PS4 vs. Wii U

Which console will reign supreme? The last few months have been a battleground between Sony and Microsoft throwing barbs at each other, while Nintendo tried to shove its gamepad between them like a little brother saying, "Hey! Look at me!" This panel will discuss the different consoles, the launch titles and the price point and figure out which manufacturer is going to win the next generation.

Participants:
Bob Chipman
Jim Sterling
Dan Epstein
Andrea Rene

Watch Video

Personally, I think sony will EASILY plow through the competition.
By the end, Nintendo will come in second, smoothly breaking even and securing themselves a spot next gen (Seriously, do not underestimate the power of a new Zelda or Smash bros. to sell consoles),
Of course, this all depends on MS' position.
With the higher ups there keen to drop hardware divisions, and Xbox being Gates and Ballmer's baby, I think the Xbone will come in 3rd, assuming it even lasts through this gen.

The Steambox meanwhile... I don't doubt it'll carve a large niche out for itself, but I think it'll do so without directly harming the Big 3 above, especially when you consider its target audience is Steam Users, who would own a PC instead of a console.
In fact I think many people who don't want to set up all the cables could feasibly just buy a Steambox instead of spending money upgrading their PCs.

This gen is projected to last 10 years, so who knows what other competitors or bumps lie ahead?

The winner is PC obviously, just sayin'. They've been next gen for 8 years (1080p 60fps).

And in the next 2-3 years 4K will become the norm which only high end PC's will be able to run.

PS: This was written pre watching the video (currently watching now).

I seriously think at this point, it's too early to declare a "winner" per-se. A lot of it will just depend on too many variables. I certainly don't see Nintendo taking any higher than 3rd place. I know, I know.. they've got Zelda and Mario, yeah. But people are becoming wise to Nintendo's recent trends I honestly don't think they can live off of Mario and Zelda forever just to sell their consoles - it's not realistic. Nintendo isn't doing too hot with the Wii U. All they have going for them (currently) is their own IPs, because even 3rd party development studios are barely touching the thing.

With the amount of fanboy/girls on each side, I see PS4 outselling the Xbox One initially, but eventually, like the 360 and PS3, I think it'll all balance out and each will still have a large following. From a high level, the PS4 and Xbox One aren't THAT different, and the games that they'll be putting out will probably be comparable. I'm personally just going to get an Xbox One because I'm already knee-deep in Microsoft's ecosystem (360, pc, phone, skydrive, etc.)
I can see myself getting a PS4 eventually, but it's not my first choice.

Josh12345:
Personally, I think sony will EASILY plow through the competition.
By the end, Nintendo will come in second, smoothly breaking even and securing themselves a spot next gen (Seriously, do not underestimate the power of a new Zelda or Smash bros. to sell consoles),
Of course, this all depends on MS' position.
With the higher ups there keen to drop hardware divisions, and Xbox being Gates and Ballmer's baby, I think the Xbone will come in 3rd, assuming it even lasts through this gen.

The Steambox meanwhile... I don't doubt it'll carve a large niche out for itself, but I think it'll do so without directly harming the Big 3 above, especially when you consider its target audience is Steam Users, who would own a PC instead of a console.
In fact I think many people who don't want to set up all the cables could feasibly just buy a Steambox instead of spending money upgrading their PCs.

This gen is projected to last 10 years, so who knows what other competitors or bumps lie ahead?

I think you are greatly overestimating the value proposition of the WiiU if you think it's going to sell even half as well as the Xbox One. And why should it? Nintendo has made it more than obvious that WiiU has never been a priority and that they are focusing on handheld game consoles, the bulk of their revenue stream.

I've said this once, I'll say it again: Nintendo is just barely going to come out on top this gen, but it will be a very very close competition between the WiiU and the PS4. The XBone will come in a distant 3rd, and the Steam Machine(s) will come in a close 4th to the XBone (Both of them will be eating each other in America).

My Prediction:

WiiU: 90-100 Million
PS4: 80-95 Million
XBone: 55-65 Million
StMcn: 20-60 Million (They are a serious Wild Card)

I like how Jim had an episode of Jimquisition on the Wii U's launch lineup of ports, sequels, and maybe shovelware - though ZombiU was a good new IP, from what I heard- and he talks about that here.
I like how Bob just recently had an episode of The Game Overthinker - the main reason why I go to ScrewAttack.com - called something like "My Meaningless Top 10 (Meaningful) Games of The Seventh Generation", and he mentions Wii Sports - one of his Top 3 - here.

Well, at least the Wii U is having its big titles out as the other consoles come out rather than 2 years AFTER the other console releases. Then again, last generation generally took a while to get off the ground, so the comparison doesn't mean much. But I digress. I, for one, think I will take the "route less traveled" here and get myself a Wii U and a PlayStation Vita - the Vita being a powerful portable device with PS Plus's free games and enough memory (64GB) in a few months for regions beyond Eastern Asia, hopefully.

It all boils down to the exclusives for me, and the Wii U and Vita have some unusual exclusives. It would be a shame if I missed out on Kingdom Hearts 3 and inFamous: Second Son, but oh well.

Being that I was there at the panel, figured I'd explain what happened at around 59:40 of the video. I was actually the guy who was in line whom, as fate would have it, be the "last" (sort of) one to get in a question. While I waited in the line, I noticed in the opposite line that there was a little boy in it. Probably about 7 or 8 years old, maybe a little older but not by much. I thought to myself as I got up to ready my question that the kid probably wouldn't get a chance to get in his question and I thought it would bum the kid out, due that I noticed as well than an hour was about to have passed in the panel, thus chances were high the panel was about over. Once I got up to the mic, I figured I'd do a nice thing for the boy, and called out to him to get to the mic so he could get in the last question. I hope the boy was happy that he got up to give his question to the panel. As for me, I later on gave my question to another panel. :)

"...vs. Wii U"

Good one, escapist. Seriously, though - there are no games on that system I care about. Of course, there are loads of people who are, but I'm really not sure there are enough of them.

Is it just me, or Bob constantly gets interrupted? I dunno it only seems to opened to him.
It would be nice if Yahtzee pitched in... speaking of who, is the hour of love coming out at the end of the week?
To be frank the console wars don't matter, I'm sick of them. PC master race blah blah.

I really, really hope the Steam Machines bring an end to console exclusives and we get Yahtzee's universal platform. Sadly I think Nintendo would rather go out of business than play ball.

Word of advice, Escapist community... in future, when it comes to the audience participation portion to a panel of experts, just make a point or ask a question. Panels are not forums, you don't have five hours to write a dissertation on the advantages of advertising vs hardware capacity (for example). Nobody is there to see or hear you; they're there to listen to the panel and their opinions. To be blunt, be clear and brief or don't bother.

The video seemed kinda amateurish. I expected more.
I couldn't even finish, that audio was terrible.

Anyway, as much as I like Nintendo I don't think it will be able to sell 90 million as Mr Matress said, but I do think it won't be a flop and that will way sell more than Game Cube and Nintendo 64.

Mr.Mattress:
I've said this once, I'll say it again: Nintendo is just barely going to come out on top this gen, but it will be a very very close competition between the WiiU and the PS4. The XBone will come in a distant 3rd, and the Steam Machine(s) will come in a close 4th to the XBone (Both of them will be eating each other in America).

My Prediction:

WiiU: 90-100 Million
PS4: 80-95 Million
XBone: 55-65 Million
StMcn: 20-60 Million (They are a serious Wild Card)

If you're talking dollars, that's hilariously low. If you're talking units, I think you might be a little bit optimistic on all fronts.

The Wii sold 100 million units, but it had a huge amount of hype among non-gamers as a really nifty place to start, giving it an enormous boost. The Wii U is having serious troubles meeting basic targets, and it's doubtful that it will reach those lofty goals later if it can't reach normal ones right now.

lacktheknack:

Mr.Mattress:
SNIP

If you're talking dollars, that's hilariously low. If you're talking units, I think you might be a little bit optimistic on all fronts.

The Wii sold 100 million units, but it had a huge amount of hype among non-gamers as a really nifty place to start, giving it an enormous boost. The Wii U is having serious troubles meeting basic targets, and it's doubtful that it will reach those lofty goals later if it can't reach normal ones right now.

I am indeed talking about Units.

And of course it's having some troubles right now, but so did the PS3 when it launched. All it took was the release of amazing games and (A couple of) price drops to fix that problem, something Nintendo is doing/already done. The only reasons I think Nintendo will come out on top this generation is because A) They have some serious heavy Exclusives; way more then either the XBone or PS4 will have, and B)The Steam Machine is going to steal Americans away from PS4 (Slightly) and XBone (Heavily). Plus, it is the Cheapest Console on the Market, and that usually helps, especially in a Recession-Recovering Economy.

Of Course, I could be wrong, the PS4 could indeed come out on top (Which I wouldn't doubt). I'm just saying that as of Right now, Nintendo looks like it can barely win again.

Mr.Mattress:
WiiU: 90-100 Million

Nintendo themselves predicted no more than 40 million units in the console's lifespan and that was before being slammed with month after months of less than 125k units, some less than 100k. The WiiU is going to have to drastically turn things around and even they don't think they can.

I have no idea what the market as a whole is going to look like at the end. This generation saw ps3/360 around 90 million each with the ps3 only just having overtaken the 360 in sales with the Wii over 100 million and likely to overtake the PS1 as second most sold console in gaming history with the WiiU's dismal performance.

Nintendo has a serious problem if they don't generate a compelling reason to buy their console. This is why the gamecube was the most powerful console of its generation while being the cheapest and still sold only 22 million and letting a new expensive entrant (xbox) sell 24 million right out the gate. Even the N64 which we all have fond memories of only sold 34 million to the ps1's 102 million. So they've got a real problem on their hands. You putting them at 90 million is incredibly unlikely. The wii had the first legitimate motion control that made the game fun for casual gamers. The WiiU has nothing new. The gamepad is expensive and has a higher learning curve for the older target market that bought the Wii like hotcakes and the console is not powerful enough to compete with the upcoming generation. If the system hasn't made a comeback by the end of Christmas and the other consoles launch successfully then they aren't likely to come back. This is when ps3 managed to come back after a rockey start with price cuts and more game launches. Nintendo's pricecut didn't seem to impact the market and the Zelda re-release did bump console sales but not by much. The articles say over 600% in Europe but that's by the week and when the previous week was only 5,000 units. It didn't even manage to sell more than the 360 in that region for that week and the 360 is supposedly 7th gen with the WiiU claiming 8th.

Without the casual market, which they have well and truly lost to smartphones, and since they will be ignored perpetually by third party developers and will therefore be nobody but a fanboys first choice, the WiiU will continue to follow the downward slope their home consoles have been on since the SNES (ignoring the Wii, which the WiiU is proving was a fluke). With a continual cannibalization of their own sales via 3DS versions (i.e Smash Brothers), a focus on just remaking their older games, whether blatantly (Wind Waker HD) or by pretending its new and expecting us to go along (Mario 3D HD), as well as a flat out refusal to innovate or do anything that might threaten their kiddy, safe image (and thereby grow their market), they will simply subsist on their fanboys. I predict 13.7 million at the most, with the likely outcome being 9 million or so - the equivalent of the Dreamcast or the Sega Saturn.

While beset a relatively unimpressive launch lineup and a continual wasting of all goodwill they have accrued, Microsoft will still be buoyed up by its hardware actually being current gen, and it therefore getting actual modern third party games. The shunning and third rate treatment of gamers and indie will bite it in the ass when those become the true focus of this generation, but until then, it should sell stably. It will likely outsell the Ps4 once Titanfall comes out, but this will be shortlived once the Ps4 version is announced. I'd estimate a total of 55-65 million consoles sold.

The PS4 will likely take an early lead off its preorders, and sell stably, buoyed by cultivating indie talent and using a series of smaller quality releases to eschew the traditional AAA drought that follows a consoles launch. A lower price than the Xbox One will mean it will consistently outsell it, barring the aforementioned Titanfall launch window. Following a price drop and the new Naughty Dog game in late 2014, the sales will escalate but steady themselves, with the stable level being about 18 million consoles sold a year (years down the track, mind - I don't expect it to hit that sort of stride til 2015). Barring a cannibalization of the market via game streaming services like Gaikai, I predict about 118 million sold.

Mr.Mattress:

lacktheknack:

Mr.Mattress:
SNIP

If you're talking dollars, that's hilariously low. If you're talking units, I think you might be a little bit optimistic on all fronts.

The Wii sold 100 million units, but it had a huge amount of hype among non-gamers as a really nifty place to start, giving it an enormous boost. The Wii U is having serious troubles meeting basic targets, and it's doubtful that it will reach those lofty goals later if it can't reach normal ones right now.

I am indeed talking about Units.

And of course it's having some troubles right now, but so did the PS3 when it launched. All it took was the release of amazing games and (A couple of) price drops to fix that problem, something Nintendo is doing/already done. The only reasons I think Nintendo will come out on top this generation is because A) They have some serious heavy Exclusives; way more then either the XBone or PS4 will have, and B)The Steam Machine is going to steal Americans away from PS4 (Slightly) and XBone (Heavily). Plus, it is the Cheapest Console on the Market, and that usually helps, especially in a Recession-Recovering Economy.

Of Course, I could be wrong, the PS4 could indeed come out on top (Which I wouldn't doubt). I'm just saying that as of Right now, Nintendo looks like it can barely win again.

4 things.

One) The Ps3 was, at the very least, on an equivalent power level to the 360. It could enjoy a shared library that helped to pad out the consoles library and make it more attractive. Most third party developers have already gone on record as saying they will not make games for the WiiU, so it is nothing like the Ps3.

Two) The most anticipated upcoming game by a huge margin is the Xbox One exclusive Titanfall. It blows any Nintendo game completely out of the water in any objective comparison.

Three) No console gamer has shown any interest whatsoever in the Steam Box. All anticipation has come from PC gamers, many of whom seem to be proud of the fact that they were going to refuse to buy a Ps4 or Xbox One in the first place. It will draw customers from the PC, but absolutely none from the Ps4 or Xbox One.

Four) Price only means anything if you are providing an equivalent experience. The WiiU is providing an equivalent experience to the Ps3 and 360. As such, no, its not the cheapest console on the market, not by a long shot.

Anoni Mus:
The video seemed kinda amateurish. I expected more.
I couldn't even finish, that audio was terrible.

Anyway, as much as I like Nintendo I don't think it will be able to sell 90 million as Mr Matress said, but I do think it won't be a flop and that will way sell more than Game Cube and Nintendo 64.

What are you basing that on? The Gamecube had Metroid Prime, Eternal Darkness, and some semblance of third party support. The N64 had Zelda back when it mattered, and Rare. What does the WiiU have that can possibly match those?

Toadfish1:
4 things.

One) The Ps3 was, at the very least, on an equivalent power level to the 360. It could enjoy a shared library that helped to pad out the consoles library and make it more attractive. Most third party developers have already gone on record as saying they will not make games for the WiiU, so it is nothing like the Ps3.

Two) The most anticipated upcoming game by a huge margin is the Xbox One exclusive Titanfall. It blows any Nintendo game completely out of the water in any objective comparison.

Three) No console gamer has shown any interest whatsoever in the Steam Box. All anticipation has come from PC gamers, many of whom seem to be proud of the fact that they were going to refuse to buy a Ps4 or Xbox One in the first place. It will draw customers from the PC, but absolutely none from the Ps4 or Xbox One.

Four) Price only means anything if you are providing an equivalent experience. The WiiU is providing an equivalent experience to the Ps3 and 360. As such, no, its not the cheapest console on the market, not by a long shot.

1) Not at the beginning of the PS3's life. In fact, PS3 sales at the begining were so bad that big 3rd Parties (Activision and EA) were actually threatening to drop support for the PS3 and PSP, in favor of NINTENDO. Amazing how things actually change. And while I believe a number of third parties won't be heading for the WiiU, they wouldn't sell well on it anyways. Plus, Nintendo's first Party is enough to support the system.

2) Oh yeah, A new IP with 0 sales and a lot of hype is certain to outsell Mario Kart 8, Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze, Super Smash Bros 3DU, and Legend of Zelda U, individually and combined, which are all really hyped Nintendo Games that all have been a part of series that have sold 5 Million at least once in their life.

3) Well, there are a lot of PC Gamers, to be honest, and if it gets some good exclusives, then it's possible. This is Valve, we're talking about, and they can make good Exclusives. And we don't know that absolutely zero people will jump ship from PS4/XBone for the Steam Machine, hype and reviews could convince some people.

4) Even if that's true, then that would put the PS4, XBone, and the Steam Machine in bigger trouble as all of them are more expensive then even the WiiU! Now you can claim that they are a completely different EE (Equivalent Experience), but it won't be immediately obvious, just like how the 360 and PS3 weren't completely different EE's from the PS2/XBox/Gamecube era (Look at the launch titles for the 360 and PS3, they look like XBox and PS2 games). Nintendo, on the other hand, is already starting to release games that look Next Gen (A benefit for being the first one out the gate), and either way, that would mean the WiiU does win.

Toadfish1:

Anoni Mus:
The video seemed kinda amateurish. I expected more.
I couldn't even finish, that audio was terrible.

Anyway, as much as I like Nintendo I don't think it will be able to sell 90 million as Mr Matress said, but I do think it won't be a flop and that will way sell more than Game Cube and Nintendo 64.

What are you basing that on? The Gamecube had Metroid Prime, Eternal Darkness, and some semblance of third party support. The N64 had Zelda back when it mattered, and Rare. What does the WiiU have that can possibly match those?

Probably a larger audience. The number of potential customers is much higher in 2013 than it was in 2002. Though in all honesty I think the Wii U will probably reach Gamecube or N64 sales figures, not the Wii's.

Mr.Mattress:

Toadfish1:
4 things.

One) The Ps3 was, at the very least, on an equivalent power level to the 360. It could enjoy a shared library that helped to pad out the consoles library and make it more attractive. Most third party developers have already gone on record as saying they will not make games for the WiiU, so it is nothing like the Ps3.

Two) The most anticipated upcoming game by a huge margin is the Xbox One exclusive Titanfall. It blows any Nintendo game completely out of the water in any objective comparison.

Three) No console gamer has shown any interest whatsoever in the Steam Box. All anticipation has come from PC gamers, many of whom seem to be proud of the fact that they were going to refuse to buy a Ps4 or Xbox One in the first place. It will draw customers from the PC, but absolutely none from the Ps4 or Xbox One.

Four) Price only means anything if you are providing an equivalent experience. The WiiU is providing an equivalent experience to the Ps3 and 360. As such, no, its not the cheapest console on the market, not by a long shot.

1) Not at the beginning of the PS3's life. In fact, PS3 sales at the begining were so bad that big 3rd Parties (Activision and EA) were actually threatening to drop support for the PS3 and PSP, in favor of NINTENDO. Amazing how things actually change. And while I believe a number of third parties won't be heading for the WiiU, they wouldn't sell well on it anyways. Plus, Nintendo's first Party is enough to support the system.

2) Oh yeah, A new IP with 0 sales and a lot of hype is certain to outsell Mario Kart 8, Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze, Super Smash Bros 3DU, and Legend of Zelda U, individually and combined, which are all really hyped Nintendo Games that all have been a part of series that have sold 5 Million at least once in their life.

3) Well, there are a lot of PC Gamers, to be honest, and if it gets some good exclusives, then it's possible. This is Valve, we're talking about, and they can make good Exclusives. And we don't know that absolutely zero people will jump ship from PS4/XBone for the Steam Machine, hype and reviews could convince some people.

4) Even if that's true, then that would put the PS4, XBone, and the Steam Machine in bigger trouble as all of them are more expensive then even the WiiU! Now you can claim that they are a completely different EE (Equivalent Experience), but it won't be immediately obvious, just like how the 360 and PS3 weren't completely different EE's from the PS2/XBox/Gamecube era (Look at the launch titles for the 360 and PS3, they look like XBox and PS2 games). Nintendo, on the other hand, is already starting to release games that look Next Gen (A benefit for being the first one out the gate), and either way, that would mean the WiiU does win.

One) Threatening to. As opposed to Nintendo, where Bethesda, EA, Capcom and 2K already are refusing to make games. Like, not in the "shape up and change your ways or we'll walk", in the "There is no future in this, I am leaving now" way.

And Nintendos first party was not enough to support the Gamecube. WHat makes you think it can support the WiiU when its worse?

Two) Ooh, bit of a mistake there, you missed out the "Made by a team who made the biggest gaming series of the seventh generation" part of Titanfall.

Three) There is absolutely no incentive for a console gamer who already didn't play games on steam to get a Steam Box. It has no aspects that make it more attractive than a PC already would have been.

Four) Okay, first of all, on the WiiU producing next gen looking games, not it bloody isn't. What it is doing is struggling to make games that look as good as current gen. I have not seen a single thing on the WiiU look anywhere close to as impressive as The Last Of Us, visually.

And yes, thats why it is immediately obvious that the WiiU doesn't provide anywhere close to as refined an entertainment experience as the Ps4 or Xbox One. Anyone with a functional pair of eyes can see that those consoles are leaps and bounds ahead of the WiiU.

So the WiiU will be seen for what it is - the last released seventh generation console. That it is cheaper than the Ps4 or Xbox One is as relevant as saying that a peddle car is cheaper than a 4 door sedan. It will be a niche console bought only by Nintendo fanboys.

Evonisia:

Toadfish1:

Anoni Mus:
The video seemed kinda amateurish. I expected more.
I couldn't even finish, that audio was terrible.

Anyway, as much as I like Nintendo I don't think it will be able to sell 90 million as Mr Matress said, but I do think it won't be a flop and that will way sell more than Game Cube and Nintendo 64.

What are you basing that on? The Gamecube had Metroid Prime, Eternal Darkness, and some semblance of third party support. The N64 had Zelda back when it mattered, and Rare. What does the WiiU have that can possibly match those?

Probably a larger audience. The number of potential customers is much higher in 2013 than it was in 2002. Though in all honesty I think the Wii U will probably reach Gamecube or N64 sales figures, not the Wii's.

Not really. If you discount the casuals who have long since left for smartphones, the number of gamers has remained pretty steady since the 6th generation. Meaning Nintendo are drawing from a similar pool of customers, but without third party support, and with the added benefit of having spit in their fan-base's face for the past 7 years.

Toadfish1:
One) Threatening to. As opposed to Nintendo, where Bethesda, EA, Capcom and 2K already are refusing to make games. Like, not in the "shape up and change your ways or we'll walk", in the "There is no future in this, I am leaving now" way.

And Nintendos first party was not enough to support the Gamecube. WHat makes you think it can support the WiiU when its worse?

Two) Ooh, bit of a mistake there, you missed out the "Made by a team who made the biggest gaming series of the seventh generation" part of Titanfall.

Three) There is absolutely no incentive for a console gamer who already didn't play games on steam to get a Steam Box. It has no aspects that make it more attractive than a PC already would have been.

Four) Okay, first of all, on the WiiU producing next gen looking games, not it bloody isn't. What it is doing is struggling to make games that look as good as current gen. I have not seen a single thing on the WiiU look anywhere close to as impressive as The Last Of Us, visually.

And yes, thats why it is immediately obvious that the WiiU doesn't provide anywhere close to as refined an entertainment experience as the Ps4 or Xbox One. Anyone with a functional pair of eyes can see that those consoles are leaps and bounds ahead of the WiiU.

So the WiiU will be seen for what it is - the last released seventh generation console. That it is cheaper than the Ps4 or Xbox One is as relevant as saying that a peddle car is cheaper than a 4 door sedan. It will be a niche console bought only by Nintendo fanboys.

1) I already said that they wouldn't be coming back.

And Nintendo's first Party pretty much supported the Wii (With a few Exceptions). For every Skyrim and EA game that wasn't on the Wii, there was a Donkey Kong Country Returns, a Wii Fit, and Mario Kart Wii; Way more games that sold a lot and cost a little.

2) Oh right, Respawn Entertainment. A Quick Wiki will show you that this is the first game they're making. Sure, the founders helped make Call of Duty, but that means jack all when it comes to the Video Game industry. The guy that made Doom would go on to make Daikatana, which was terrible. Odds are, Titanfall will be decent or good, but it could be terrible and tank.

And if you think Respawn is a "Team that has made the greatest 7th gen games" (When they haven't), then you should think Nintendo as the "Team that has made the greatest games of Every Generation they've been in".

3) Again, we don't know that.

4) Please take a look At the Fallowing Gameplay Trailers. If you think those look like 7th Gen Games, then I don't think I have anything further to say.

Mr.Mattress:

Toadfish1:
One) Threatening to. As opposed to Nintendo, where Bethesda, EA, Capcom and 2K already are refusing to make games. Like, not in the "shape up and change your ways or we'll walk", in the "There is no future in this, I am leaving now" way.

And Nintendos first party was not enough to support the Gamecube. WHat makes you think it can support the WiiU when its worse?

Two) Ooh, bit of a mistake there, you missed out the "Made by a team who made the biggest gaming series of the seventh generation" part of Titanfall.

Three) There is absolutely no incentive for a console gamer who already didn't play games on steam to get a Steam Box. It has no aspects that make it more attractive than a PC already would have been.

Four) Okay, first of all, on the WiiU producing next gen looking games, not it bloody isn't. What it is doing is struggling to make games that look as good as current gen. I have not seen a single thing on the WiiU look anywhere close to as impressive as The Last Of Us, visually.

And yes, thats why it is immediately obvious that the WiiU doesn't provide anywhere close to as refined an entertainment experience as the Ps4 or Xbox One. Anyone with a functional pair of eyes can see that those consoles are leaps and bounds ahead of the WiiU.

So the WiiU will be seen for what it is - the last released seventh generation console. That it is cheaper than the Ps4 or Xbox One is as relevant as saying that a peddle car is cheaper than a 4 door sedan. It will be a niche console bought only by Nintendo fanboys.

1) I already said that they wouldn't be coming back.

And Nintendo's first Party pretty much supported the Wii (With a few Exceptions). For every Skyrim and EA game that wasn't on the Wii, there was a Donkey Kong Country Returns, a Wii Fit, and Mario Kart Wii; Way more games that sold a lot and cost a little.

2) Oh right, Respawn Entertainment. A Quick Wiki will show you that this is the first game they're making. Sure, the founders helped make Call of Duty, but that means jack all when it comes to the Video Game industry. The guy that made Doom would go on to make Daikatana, which was terrible. Odds are, Titanfall will be decent or good, but it could be terrible and tank.

And if you think Respawn is a "Team that has made the greatest 7th gen games" (When they haven't), then you should think Nintendo as the "Team that has made the greatest games of Every Generation they've been in".

3) Again, we don't know that.

4) Please take a look At the Fallowing Gameplay Trailers. If you think those look like 7th Gen Games, then I don't think I have anything further to say.

One)No, casuals supported the Wii. Casuals who have long since abandoned Nintendo.

Two) A quicker Wiki will tell you that Respawn is made up of two thirds of the founders of Infinity Ward. A quick googling would reveal that the game has been playable at 5 major industry events, getting near unanimous praise from all of them. There is virtually no chance of the game not being as good as the previews make it out to be.

As for trying to use your opinions to win an argument about whether or not Call of Duty was the biggest franchise of the generation and sold over 100 million copies in about 5 years, yeah, thats not gonna work, even if I did think Nintendo had made a better than average game since 2001 (and they haven't).

Three)Basic logic tells us that.

Four) Good, because it appears you don't even understand what you're talking about. We're talking about graphical achievement and technical superiority, not how many anime cliches you can jam into the games trailer. Lets compare X with Lightning returns, Mario Kart with LBP Karting, and Bayonetta 2 with MGR Revengeance. None look even the tiniest bit more technically impressive or graphically advanced. Not in any way. Go ahead - you can't find better draw distance, character model detail, or framerate in those games. And now you will attempt to say that graphics don't matter, despite the entire argument being how the WiiU ;looks shit compared to the Ps4 and Xbox One.

Toadfish1:
One)No, casuals supported the Wii. Casuals who have long since abandoned Nintendo.

Two) A quicker Wiki will tell you that Respawn is made up of two thirds of the founders of Infinity Ward. A quick googling would reveal that the game has been playable at 5 major industry events, getting near unanimous praise from all of them. There is virtually no chance of the game not being as good as the previews make it out to be.

As for trying to use your opinions to win an argument about whether or not Call of Duty was the biggest franchise of the generation and sold over 100 million copies in about 5 years, yeah, thats not gonna work, even if I did think Nintendo had made a better than average game since 2001 (and they haven't).

Three)Basic logic tells us that.

Four) Good, because it appears you don't even understand what you're talking about. We're talking about graphical achievement and technical superiority, not how many anime cliches you can jam into the games trailer. Lets compare X with Lightning returns, Mario Kart with LBP Karting, and Bayonetta 2 with MGR Revengeance. None look even the tiniest bit more technically impressive or graphically advanced. Not in any way. Go ahead - you can't find better draw distance, character model detail, or framerate in those games. And now you will attempt to say that graphics don't matter, despite the entire argument being how the WiiU ;looks shit compared to the Ps4 and Xbox One.

1) Yeah, that's why Donkey Kong Returns sold 5 Million, Kirby's Epic Yarn sold 2.17 Million, Kirby's Return To Dreamland Sold 1.5 Million, LoZ: SS sold 3.7 Million, and New Super Mario Bros U has sold 2 Million, because only Casuals Supported the Wii and they won't support the WiiU... Even though all these games came out in 2010-11 (And NSMBU came out in 2012), when the "Casuals" Left.

I won't even get into the 3DS showing that Mario and Mario Kart are fantastic System sellers.

2) That's what we all thought, until that Aliens Game from Gearbox proved that even Demos can lie. I'm now a lot more cautious when it comes to Demos, especially at Game Events and Conventions.

3) Basic Logic tells us that we don't know what the Steam Machine will do. So don't say "Logic Says" one thing or the other, because we don't have the Logistics on the Steam Machine.

4) Then we have nothing to discuss, cause all those games are poorer looking compared to the Upcoming WiiU Games. Say what you want, I disagree with you. And no, I will not say Graphics don't matter, because to people like you, they do. But you are blind if you don't see the WiiU Games looking better then the PS3/360 games, or your completely biased.

Mr.Mattress:

Toadfish1:
One)No, casuals supported the Wii. Casuals who have long since abandoned Nintendo.

Two) A quicker Wiki will tell you that Respawn is made up of two thirds of the founders of Infinity Ward. A quick googling would reveal that the game has been playable at 5 major industry events, getting near unanimous praise from all of them. There is virtually no chance of the game not being as good as the previews make it out to be.

As for trying to use your opinions to win an argument about whether or not Call of Duty was the biggest franchise of the generation and sold over 100 million copies in about 5 years, yeah, thats not gonna work, even if I did think Nintendo had made a better than average game since 2001 (and they haven't).

Three)Basic logic tells us that.

Four) Good, because it appears you don't even understand what you're talking about. We're talking about graphical achievement and technical superiority, not how many anime cliches you can jam into the games trailer. Lets compare X with Lightning returns, Mario Kart with LBP Karting, and Bayonetta 2 with MGR Revengeance. None look even the tiniest bit more technically impressive or graphically advanced. Not in any way. Go ahead - you can't find better draw distance, character model detail, or framerate in those games. And now you will attempt to say that graphics don't matter, despite the entire argument being how the WiiU ;looks shit compared to the Ps4 and Xbox One.

1) Yeah, that's why Donkey Kong Returns sold 5 Million, Kirby's Epic Yarn sold 2.17 Million, Kirby's Return To Dreamland Sold 1.5 Million, LoZ: SS sold 3.7 Million, and New Super Mario Bros U has sold 2 Million, because only Casuals Supported the Wii and they won't support the WiiU... Even though all these games came out in 2010-11 (And NSMBU came out in 2012), when the "Casuals" Left.

I won't even get into the 3DS showing that Mario and Mario Kart are fantastic System sellers.

2) That's what we all thought, until that Aliens Game from Gearbox proved that even Demos can lie. I'm now a lot more cautious when it comes to Demos, especially at Game Events and Conventions.

3) Basic Logic tells us that we don't know what the Steam Machine will do. So don't say "Logic Says" one thing or the other, because we don't have the Logistics on the Steam Machine.

4) Then we have nothing to discuss, cause all those games are poorer looking compared to the Upcoming WiiU Games. Say what you want, I disagree with you. And no, I will not say Graphics don't matter, because to people like you, they do. But you are blind if you don't see the WiiU Games looking better then the PS3/360 games, or your completely biased.

One) Ooh, two million copies of Kirbys Epic Yarn. Yeah, thats gonna make a HUGE impact for the WiiU. Because as we all know, its not like the fanbase who buys Kirby games hasn't already got a WiiU, meaning that any Kirby game that comes out is gonna have virtually no impact on sales.

Two) Those were unplayable demos. Titanfall has been live and in the publics hands in five different places.

Three) The logisitcs don't matter since we know its stated aims, goals and abilities.

Four) Again, I note that you can't actually point to any area where, if it were superior, you could use it as an example, you can only so "No it looks better" and not back that up in any way.

Toadfish1:
One) Ooh, two million copies of Kirbys Epic Yarn. Yeah, thats gonna make a HUGE impact for the WiiU. Because as we all know, its not like the fanbase who buys Kirby games hasn't already got a WiiU, meaning that any Kirby game that comes out is gonna have virtually no impact on sales.

Two) Those were unplayable demos. Titanfall has been live and in the publics hands in five different places.

Three) The logisitcs don't matter since we know its stated aims, goals and abilities.

Four) Again, I note that you can't actually point to any area where, if it were superior, you could use it as an example, you can only so "No it looks better" and not back that up in any way.

1) Still sell better then most games out there, and they have always made Nintendo Money. Unlike Tomb Raider that sold just as much but made jack for Square enix.

2) I still won't judge the product until it's official release.

3) Yeah, just like we knew the stated aims, goals and abilities of the Wii, but then it shattered all of that. Nintendo wasn't expecting the Wii to be as big as it was, and yet it was. It was really an experiment on their part, and it paid off in very big ways.

4) I can give you an example: They're all in 60 FPS with no frame drop and they're all 1080p (Even if they're upscaled). That already blows your games out of the water, because they're all 720p, 30 FPS games (The 360 and PS3 could hardly do any games in 1080p, and none of their games are in 60FPS).

Toadfish1:

Anoni Mus:
The video seemed kinda amateurish. I expected more.
I couldn't even finish, that audio was terrible.

Anyway, as much as I like Nintendo I don't think it will be able to sell 90 million as Mr Matress said, but I do think it won't be a flop and that will way sell more than Game Cube and Nintendo 64.

What are you basing that on? The Gamecube had Metroid Prime, Eternal Darkness, and some semblance of third party support. The N64 had Zelda back when it mattered, and Rare. What does the WiiU have that can possibly match those?

It's not a matter of games, if it was N64 would've outsold PSone.

Sorry for the off-topic comment. I was looking forward to this panel and hear the opinion of some experts and some celebrities, but the sound was so awful that I could not listen for an hour. It seems the sound was recorded as it came out of the room speakers. Is there a way to remaster with sound from the mics/mixer? I have tried playing around with my sound settings.

OT- the console is as good as the games it plays. The game-appeal is entirely based on taste (user opinion). Which console is best is an argument similar to what colour is best?

2xDouble:
Word of advice, Escapist community... in future, when it comes to the audience participation portion to a panel of experts, just make a point or ask a question. Panels are not forums, you don't have five hours to write a dissertation on the advantages of advertising vs hardware capacity (for example). Nobody is there to see or hear you; they're there to listen to the panel and their opinions. To be blunt, be clear and brief or don't bother.

I'm pretty sure if they wanted the person to make their question brief they would tell the person to get to the point. In all honesty they came to be there as much as everyone else.

Anoni Mus:

Toadfish1:

Anoni Mus:
The video seemed kinda amateurish. I expected more.
I couldn't even finish, that audio was terrible.

Anyway, as much as I like Nintendo I don't think it will be able to sell 90 million as Mr Matress said, but I do think it won't be a flop and that will way sell more than Game Cube and Nintendo 64.

What are you basing that on? The Gamecube had Metroid Prime, Eternal Darkness, and some semblance of third party support. The N64 had Zelda back when it mattered, and Rare. What does the WiiU have that can possibly match those?

It's not a matter of games, if it was N64 would've outsold PSone.

Wow, I must have gone into some alternate dimension where the PsONe didn't have Crash 1-3, Spyro 1-3, Twisted Metal 2, Abes Oddworld, Tomb Raider, Tekken, FF7-9 and Tactics, Vagrant Story, Silent Hill, Legacy of Kain, Resident Evil 1-3, Megaman Legends 1 and 2, and Gran Turismo 2.

The N64 had about 11 great games, and the rest of the library was crap.Hell, people are so desperate to reach for a good game on the N64, half the top 10 lists include a photography game.

So yeah, it is about games - who has more good ones.

And I repeat, even if you think that how a console sells has nothing to do with the quality of its library, then you still haven't given a reason why people would think they need a Wiiu in their house.

 

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