What Has Nintendo Done Right Lately?

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Jorpho:
How I tire of everyone stating that they know exactly what Nintendo should be doing.

I'm sure Nintendo has the capacity to hire people with some degree of competency and that they have their own perfectly good reasons for the decisions they have made, however murky they may appear to an outsider. It's not like the higher-ups have been spotted drunkenly stumbling down the streets or something; they do not need a stern talking-to from anybody.

Considering Iwata is still the CEO we know that's not true.

I'm personally not worried about what's going on with Nintendo lately, they've had their slip-ups in the past, sure, but they always eventually bounced back on their feet.

Besides, has Nintendo ever tried to shove DRM down our throats?

Has Nintendo taken up using anti-consumer methods?

Has Nintendo ever tried to make us buy season passes or online passes?

Did Nintendo ever try to kill the used game market?

Did Nintendo ever try to shun backwards compatibility?

Taking all these into account, where do you do think Nintendo's choosing not to be any of the above will bring them in the long run?

Xman490:
I guess Nintendo has been swimming in "bad nostalgia" over the past few years. The only new gameplay style in a Nintendo-published game since 2009 was in Super Mario 3D World, and even that was 2D Mario in 3D with the need to speed up. Now their only innovations besides that one thing are graphics enhancements, overpowered power-ups, and the poorly-thought-out variations Skyward Sword and A Link Between Worlds had.

Now, that isn't to say that "bad nostalgia" without great innovation is "bad", necessarily. I have been enjoying the New Super Mario Bros series (discounting the 3DS one) as it incorporates tougher and wilder levels, Jim Sterling still loves Kirby (which has had a few separate innovations), and people get excited for new Donkey Kong Country games.

How about WarioWare D.I.Y. Where you can create and share your own microgames or Metroid, a game that was very different from it's predeccesors. Going just a year or two further back we also have games like Rhytmn Heaven and Super Paper Mario. One could also point at Pikmin 3, Game and Wario or Nintendoland to find a couple of other examples where Nintendo tries new things. While they seemed more eager to innovate back on Wii and Ds i don't think it's entirely fair to say that they aren't trying. They do make throwback games, but these games are made alongside new stuff.

I'm not too worried about the WiiU, even though it isn't doing too well. It might never be able to compete with Playstation or Xbox, but it doesn't really need to. It needs more sales though and it needs more games. The games are coming and i'm sure we'll see even more game announcements during the year, by then it might be able to pick up some steam that atleast makes it profitable and a viable platform for third party exclusives. They just need to make it appealing enough so that it makes sense to buy it as your sevondary console. To me, the virtual cosole with DS and GBA titles + the upcoming releases and last years releases are enough to make me a potential costumer in a near future.

themilo504:
I think that a console war without Nintendo would be a very boring console war, maybe its for the best but I still feel like it would be a huge loss.

Yep. Because the PC would win easily since the Xbox One and the PS4 are basically watered down PCs.

Nintendo needs to become innovative once again for local multiplayer to prevail, otherwise its a farewell to local multiplayer... They got a ton of work to do if you ask me but they keep beating the dead horses instead of coming up with new ideas.

I, personally, don't agree that top-down 2D is inherently worse than 3D. It really depends on the need of the game. Now, admittedly, I haven't played A Link Between Worlds (I don't have a 3DS), but consider this: Don't Starve has movement and camera mechanics almost identical to A Link to the Past: it's top-down, with full 360 degrees of movement. While I, myself, couldn't really get into it, its popularity and the fact that my girlfriend plays it constantly tells me that it's possible to have just as much immersion with top-down 2D graphics as with first-person 3D graphics.

Of course, I could just be a fanboy for the 16-bit era of games... except for the fact that (flame-shield up) I kinda have trouble getting into A Link to the Past, as well. Honestly, I enjoy the first Zelda more than ALttP, since it's pretty much a Zelda sandbox. (Yahtzee once joked that Zelda is just one game that Nintendo has been constantly remaking since 1986, and honestly, I WISH that were the case; the Elder Scrolls games are far more faithful to the NES Zelda than the subsequent Zelda games, especially Arena which pretty much has the exact same goal.)

Top-down 2D allows for a wider view of your surroundings, unlike first-person 3D which limits you to seeing what's directly ahead. Both are good depending on the needs of the game.

Progress is all well and good, but if it ain't broke, don't fix it. (The lives system IS broke, Nintendo; unless you actually are making an arcade-style competitive game, FIX IT!)

Now, all of that said... the item renting system just sounds horrible. I think I see where Nintendo is going with this, as item buying is what you do in RPGs, but I'd rather you just start out with all the items you'll ever get and just craft the dungeons with puzzles requiring good combinations of item-usage.

What are they doing right?

The 3DS continues to blow away the PSVita in sales, and Nintendo portable hardware remains the platform of choice for non-Triple-AAA RPGs. Niche market, certainly, but there are some fantastic third party Nintendo-DS exclusive jRPGs.

Majora's Mask on Steam? MAKE IT HAPPEN!!
But seriously, it was the black sheep of the franchise. The only time when a Zelda game's plot didn't involve rescuing Zelda or fighting Ganon. I actually felt like I was part of the world as no one pushed "destiny" into my face like I'm the TV repairman being called in to sort shit out.

It does seem like Nintendo's commitment to making games is also their folly as they have nothing to back up on. Either they have to do something else or come up with really innovative ideas. Something way out of their comfort zone.

Sonic redesigned? A scarf? WOW! Why don't we paint a white circle on his belly and call him Rayman?

Yahtzee:
And if Nintendo and Sega were back on even turf again, existing only as competing developer/publishers, then it'd be like Holmes and Moriarty matching wits once more.

Hah! No.
Not even remotely.
Unless Moriarty spent the last decade locked in his manse playing with his own feces, while Holmes sulks around hitting the bottle, re-visiting his old case files compulsively, and doing opium just to escape the pain of longing for the past.

I refuse to accept any notion that Link Between Worlds represents any kind of forward movement from something like, say, Wind Waker. Or even Ocarina of Time, to be more 3DS-relevant.

This assertion might mean something if you actually reviewed A Link Between Worlds to prove you have a fair basis of comparison. But you didn't, so all I can do is sit here and guess if you did, or if you're just pulling yet more conclusions out of a hat just so you can keep your "Being jaded all the time = I R Smart" schtick.

Those were good nostalgia games that took the Zelda model and elevated it into a stirring adventure across the lands, with pleasing graphics, spectacular views and sweeping, epic music. Going back to squeaky top-down grid gameplay is the exact opposite of an elevation.

This sounds suspiciously similar to that nonsensical argument about how there's no point to turn-based gameplay when real-time exists, or how 2D graphics have no place in gaming since 3D arrived.
Either of which is akin to saying that there's no reason to play cards when football exists.

Innovative, sure, but two things: firstly, this doesn't in itself turn the bad nostalgia into good nostalgia, it's just bad nostalgia with one new idea in it.

Funny, I could say the same exact thing about your precious Wind Waker.
What is sailing but filler between the usual glut of towns and dungeons?

And secondly, I wonder if it's entirely coincidental that as well as being innovative, this gameplay model is also a hell of a lot easier to implement than something like the aforesaid properly paced experience.

Pray tell what "Properly paced" is beyond some vague arbitrary definition?
Properly paced compared to its predecessors?
Aren't you the guy who constantly COMPLAINS about Nintendo doing nothing but recycling its old shit?

Taking on a variety of obstacles with a varied set of tools sounds like a proper experience to me.

I'd like to expand on ALBW's item rental thing. I'd like to have [n] items in some sort of central temple, which allow you to reach the [n] dungeons in the game. Each dungeon also has an item used to solve the latter half of its puzzles, and, along with the other item, beat the boss.

But you'd only have one of the temple items, at first. Let's say they're all sealed, but you can remove the seal with a shard of the macguffin, one of which you start with. Each dungeon has another shard, which lets you get another item, and getting them all lets you move to the endgame.

Misterian:
I'm personally not worried about what's going on with Nintendo lately, they've had their slip-ups in the past, sure, but they always eventually bounced back on their feet.

Besides, has Nintendo ever tried to shove DRM down our throats?

Has Nintendo taken up using anti-consumer methods?

Has Nintendo ever tried to make us buy season passes or online passes?

Did Nintendo ever try to kill the used game market?

Did Nintendo ever try to shun backwards compatibility?

Taking all these into account, where do you do think Nintendo's choosing not to be any of the above will bring them in the long run?

I don't know all the details (don't do enough research into these things), but one anti-consumer method Nintendo adopted is region locking. Sony does it to some extent still, but not so much that you can't have a PS4 in a country which does not sell it. As far as I can tell the Xbox One has no region locking.

I dunno I kinda loved all the 3ds games I got over christmas...

Bravely Default, Pokemon Y, LoZ: Link Between Worlds, Etrian Odyssey 4.

It was solid... nothing groundbreaking or new, but a solid roster of games that people will enjoy playing. There wasn't really any need to innovate more than they did. They didn't innovate for the sake of it (Ironic on the 3DS, one of the most gimmicky consoles ever but still).

I do enjoy seeing the hardcore Nintendo defenders always jump down Yahtzee's throat (or anyone else for that matter) for expressing his dissatisfaction with the way they're doing things these days. For some reason people feel the need to vehemently defend Nintendo like they're some poor, abused little boy. Surprising as it may seem, Nintendo don't actually give a rats arse what Yahtzee or anyone else thinks about their games or their company - including you, the gamers who rush to their defence anytime anyone says something against them. All they're really worried about is how much money they're making, which is perfectly understandable since they're a business. I'm not saying they don't care about the products they produce - they consistently make games that are extremely well polished, if derivative - but the core of their business is their financial situation, not what others think of them.

I completely understand the point Yahtzee is making. ALBW is a reimagining of ALttP, a game that's presently 23 years old. I thoroughly enjoyed playing through ALBW, but I also understand why Yahtzee didn't appreciate it that much since it feels like nostalgia for nostalgia's sake. I also happen to agree with him that this so called "console war" is an idiotic concept that promotes elitism and exclusionary tactics in order to sell hardware. Wouldn't it be great if you could buy any game you wanted without having to lay down hundreds or dollars to buy a new console? How is it we have reached a point in gaming's history where people actually (and loudly) defend the concept of exclusive games? Imagine if Warner Brothers developed their own version of DVD or Blu-ray that worked exclusively on their players. In other words, you couldn't watch a WB film or TV show without spending $400 on their player. Then imagine if Sony Pictures did the same. And 20th Century Fox. And Universal. And MGM. Something tells me people wouldn't be defending exclusives then, would they?

What Has Nintendo Done Right Lately?

They made fun game systems with fun games to play on them. Is... that not what they're supposed to do any more?

Since I have a gaming PC, the Wii U was the only interesting "next-gen" system to me... which is something I've heard from a few people. Nintendo is still king of couch multi-player. If I want amazing graphics or online multiplayer, my PC still does it better than any console, but it doesn't do innovative controls or couch multiplayer like Nintendo can.

Misterian:
I'm personally not worried about what's going on with Nintendo lately, they've had their slip-ups in the past, sure, but they always eventually bounced back on their feet.

Besides, has Nintendo ever tried to shove DRM down our throats?

Has Nintendo taken up using anti-consumer methods?

Has Nintendo ever tried to make us buy season passes or online passes?

Did Nintendo ever try to kill the used game market?

Did Nintendo ever try to shun backwards compatibility?

Taking all these into account, where do you do think Nintendo's choosing not to be any of the above will bring them in the long run?

Personally I think the worst they've is copyright claim youtube videos and such. Something along those lines anyways because they are pretty protective of their IP. Their almost like Disney in that regard. However if that is the worst of their crimes towards consumers then they are freaking saints compared to others that actually do all the stuff you just listed.

Branovices:
What Has Nintendo Done Right Lately?

They made fun game systems with fun games to play on them. Is... that not what they're supposed to do any more?

Since I have a gaming PC, the Wii U was the only interesting "next-gen" system to me... which is something I've heard from a few people. Nintendo is still king of couch multi-player. If I want amazing graphics or online multiplayer, my PC still does it better than any console, but it doesn't do innovative controls or couch multiplayer like Nintendo can.

Problem is thanks to the Microsoft guys couch multi player all but died out. No one wants couch multi player anymore since they now have two consoles that can do online multi player just as easily as any PC. I wish couch multiplayer wasn't a dying trend. :( It'd remind people not to be dicks while playing a freaking video game.

Lazule:

themilo504:
I think that a console war without Nintendo would be a very boring console war, maybe its for the best but I still feel like it would be a huge loss.

Yep. Because the PC would win easily since the Xbox One and the PS4 are basically watered down PCs.

Nintendo needs to become innovative once again for local multiplayer to prevail, otherwise its a farewell to local multiplayer... They got a ton of work to do if you ask me but they keep beating the dead horses instead of coming up with new ideas.

To your first comment. As Yahtzee said they are in a race to see who can become obsolete the fastest.

To your other comment. I thought it was farewell to local multi player already sadly. With only Mario Kart, Super Smash Bros., and Mario Party keeping it alive. As for innovation that game pad is a mighty big innovative tool that NO ONE WILL FREAKING USE BECAUSE THEY ARE BRAINLESS FREAKING TWATS WITH NO CREATIVITY!.....sorry about that lost my cool. Seriously though I am pissed to hell that it seems no one in the entire industry is looking at that thing and thinking. "Hmmm...wonder what kind of crazy ass idea we can do with this." They've dug into their trenches for so damn long its like they don't know a good opportunity when they see one. I see a perfect one. RTS games on that thing would work wonderfully.

KazeAizen:

Misterian:
I'm personally not worried about what's going on with Nintendo lately, they've had their slip-ups in the past, sure, but they always eventually bounced back on their feet.

Besides, has Nintendo ever tried to shove DRM down our throats?

Has Nintendo taken up using anti-consumer methods?

Has Nintendo ever tried to make us buy season passes or online passes?

Did Nintendo ever try to kill the used game market?

Did Nintendo ever try to shun backwards compatibility?

Taking all these into account, where do you do think Nintendo's choosing not to be any of the above will bring them in the long run?

Personally I think the worst they've is copyright claim youtube videos and such. Something along those lines anyways because they are pretty protective of their IP. Their almost like Disney in that regard. However if that is the worst of their crimes towards consumers then they are freaking saints compared to others that actually do all the stuff you just listed.

They also keep their games at full price for years and years (SMG2's and NSMBW's price only dropped in summer of last year, and even then they only went from $50 to $30), they're the only console maker that still implements region lock and they release two different versions of Pokemon games at a time even though they're essentially the same but with slightly different rosters of pokemon. They're no more of a saint than many of the other game companies, they just have different ways to suck the money out of people than the others.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I would love to play Zelda (though the new one sounds awful) on Playstation. I'm not holding my breath.

Nintendo may go Third Party at some point, but that time is not today. I believe the CEO said a while back that if Nintendo stops making consoles, they will stop being a company. I think that is shortsighted and foolish, however.

I do think Nintendo, as a third party developer, could do a lot of good. And I imagine Sony or Microsoft would love to cut a deal with them to release games on their consoles. But that seems unlikely to happen unless the Wii U continues down it's path of irrelevance.

Will games like X and Super Smash Brothers help? In all likelihood, yes. But I don't think it will outsell PS4, and Xbox One has been selling decently and could certainly overtake the Wii U in time. And even if the Wii U does gain some momentum, I think it comes down to a serious question of whether they will make a console in the next generation. And, if so, what that console will look like.

Now, what I would like, is for Nintendo to get in on Sony's Playstation Now service. It sounds like it will work and having Nintendo games as an added bonus would be something worthwhile. Imagine being able to play some classic SNES games via the service. Maybe if they ever do go third party...

Lazule:

themilo504:
I think that a console war without Nintendo would be a very boring console war, maybe its for the best but I still feel like it would be a huge loss.

Yep. Because the PC would win easily since the Xbox One and the PS4 are basically watered down PCs.

Nintendo needs to become innovative once again for local multiplayer to prevail, otherwise its a farewell to local multiplayer... They got a ton of work to do if you ask me but they keep beating the dead horses instead of coming up with new ideas.

Tiny Brains is on the PS4 and encourages same screen multiplayer as well as online. Admittedly, most AAA games are online encouraging games, but that's a problem with the developers. Not Sony or Microsoft. This is true on PCs, too, though.

Evonisia:
I don't know all the details (don't do enough research into these things), but one anti-consumer method Nintendo adopted is region locking. Sony does it to some extent still, but not so much that you can't have a PS4 in a country which does not sell it. As far as I can tell the Xbox One has no region locking.

Sony does not region lock. At all. The PS Store is done by region, but that's all.

The Xbox One was originally region locked. In fact, I think out of the box, it is region locked still. You have to download a Day One patch that removes that among other things.

st0pnsw0p:

KazeAizen:

Misterian:
I'm personally not worried about what's going on with Nintendo lately, they've had their slip-ups in the past, sure, but they always eventually bounced back on their feet.

Besides, has Nintendo ever tried to shove DRM down our throats?

Has Nintendo taken up using anti-consumer methods?

Has Nintendo ever tried to make us buy season passes or online passes?

Did Nintendo ever try to kill the used game market?

Did Nintendo ever try to shun backwards compatibility?

Taking all these into account, where do you do think Nintendo's choosing not to be any of the above will bring them in the long run?

Personally I think the worst they've is copyright claim youtube videos and such. Something along those lines anyways because they are pretty protective of their IP. Their almost like Disney in that regard. However if that is the worst of their crimes towards consumers then they are freaking saints compared to others that actually do all the stuff you just listed.

They also keep their games at full price for years and years (SMG2's and NSMBW's price only dropped in summer of last year, and even then they only went from $50 to $30), they're the only console maker that still implements region lock and they release two different versions of Pokemon games at a time even though they're essentially the same but with slightly different rosters of pokemon. They're no more of a saint than many of the other game companies, they just have different ways to suck the money out of people than the others.

I will never understand the complaint with the Pokemon versions. ESPECIALLY when it's SO DAMN EASY to get those exclusives on blasted wifi. Rendering the whole point against it useless. What about legendaries you may ask? Doesn't matter. They will eventually come out with dozens of events that will feature the opposite legendary for all players. Case in point I got a Zekrom even though I have Pokemon Black without requiring me to buy the other version nor trade away any of my Pokemon.

If you choose to buy the second version when all it takes is to message someone on the Pokemon forum for your exclusive needs or hit the wifi button that is your fault.

I don't know but I would like Nintendo to make fun games. The PS4 and Xbone seem to be in a pissing contest over who has better graphics. It's kinda of old seeing how people just want to play games, unless your on a xbone or ps4 board where it's 60 fps this and 1080p that. It seems like games don't even matter just how pretty they are.

themilo504:
I think that a console war without Nintendo would be a very boring console war, maybe its for the best but I still feel like it would be a huge loss.

I feel like the "console war" we just endured, or are currently enduring, or whatever, is a pretty good indicator of what a console war absent of Nintendo would be like.

So, he makes fun of Skywards Sword for not offering anywhere near enough freedom, and yet at the same time he makes fun of Link Between World for offering what is far and away the greatest sense of player freedom in the entire franchise? I swear, it's like nothing can ever please him.

st0pnsw0p:

KazeAizen:

Misterian:
I'm personally not worried about what's going on with Nintendo lately, they've had their slip-ups in the past, sure, but they always eventually bounced back on their feet.

Besides, has Nintendo ever tried to shove DRM down our throats?

Has Nintendo taken up using anti-consumer methods?

Has Nintendo ever tried to make us buy season passes or online passes?

Did Nintendo ever try to kill the used game market?

Did Nintendo ever try to shun backwards compatibility?

Taking all these into account, where do you do think Nintendo's choosing not to be any of the above will bring them in the long run?

Personally I think the worst they've is copyright claim youtube videos and such. Something along those lines anyways because they are pretty protective of their IP. Their almost like Disney in that regard. However if that is the worst of their crimes towards consumers then they are freaking saints compared to others that actually do all the stuff you just listed.

They also keep their games at full price for years and years (SMG2's and NSMBW's price only dropped in summer of last year, and even then they only went from $50 to $30), they're the only console maker that still implements region lock and they release two different versions of Pokemon games at a time even though they're essentially the same but with slightly different rosters of pokemon. They're no more of a saint than many of the other game companies, they just have different ways to suck the money out of people than the others.

Eh I've never dealt with Region Lock so its not my concern. If those are literally the worst crimes Nintendo has committed then yeah they are pretty dang saintly compared to everyone else.

Nintendo has not really made anything worth playing honestly for me in a very long time.

People say they make the best party games but think about it. If you don't actually own the system, don't actually get to play the 'big multiplayer games' to the point where you have become 'that guy' who is too good at it, when it comes time for the big party that everyone is playing that nintendo game on, suddenly you are not really having that much fun.

That is what has turned me off of Nintendo ever since the N64. Every time I get a chance to try playing the system... I am not given much time to actually familiarize myself with the mutant controllers that Nintendo tries to innovate and shove down our throats. I was not allowed to familiarize myself with the game, they wanted to jump straight into the game with only the most rudimentary of instructions on how to play and then they proceed to trash you three ways to tuesday and you get a foul taste in your mouth.

Competition does that.

The fans don't see it that way. They don't see the frustration that someone new coming into it might be feeling when they get trounced over and over again at a big party, embaressed on the couch before others. And this happened during the N64, GC, and Wii generations from many different fan boys trying to get me to take a break from my PS, X-Box, or PC to come play a bit of 'nostalgic fun'.

This is the ravenous fan base at work. They are so enthralled with showing off how much fun something is that they take over the conversation and don't leave you to make your own choice, they taint it with their own.

So of course turned off by a wonky controller (Every one of them is) because obviously the SNES controller was an abomination and fans who were idiots... I missed the nostalgic joy that must have somehow been hidden in those generations... so even wanting to come back and look at what Nintendo is doing these days... and I do keep track because well, I did like the NES and SNES back when I was very young... I can't help but feel that they are idiots.

I don't have any of the rose tinted nostalgia goggles for the games that came out post SNES... so seeing them continue to just rehash the same games over and over and over again seems... well... bad. I remember they used to do interesting games once but not anymore.

And I know... there was the zelda games that were different but when you have five different fan boys show up at your house with their systems on different occassions to show you the opening and then to play it while you watch while they go and do the high end content to show how awesome the game is... well... it doesn't seem that appealing.

This rehash of a rehash of a rehash is just that... overcooked. I am no longer the 13 year old I was when Link to the Past first came out. The things I liked then, I do not like as much now so playing a reiteration doesn't appeal.

What are they doing right? Very little. They keep hammering out Pokemon with some improvement in quality with each iteration but even then the mouth breather fans kill it when they start talking about such and such being the best and if you make the choice that you did, you are a complete fool or that wasn't an optimal choice and that X would have been so much better and that they will beat you senseless if you ever get into a match. Oh, by the way, you want a match? Yeah... My 3DS sits on my desk, barely touched because the fans of the game make it not worth playing and there is very little else on it that appeals to my need for a high quality single player experience.

And yes... I do have the new Fire Emblem and even it got stale rather quickly because I have done other turn based grid based tactics games before over the years and thus the game play was not that amazing.

So in essence, their own fans and inability to do anything of quality that is new is what is killing them.

The Nintendo Fanboys are out in force today!

It's good to see more people coming around to the idea of Nintendo going third-party. Hope they come to their senses soon. I'm imagining Majora's Mask on Steam, maybe even with mod support, and I'm drooling a little bit...

Blaine Houle:
Nintendo has not really made anything worth playing honestly for me in a very long time.

People say they make the best party games but think about it. If you don't actually own the system, don't actually get to play the 'big multiplayer games' to the point where you have become 'that guy' who is too good at it, when it comes time for the big party that everyone is playing that nintendo game on, suddenly you are not really having that much fun.

That is what has turned me off of Nintendo ever since the N64. Every time I get a chance to try playing the system... I am not given much time to actually familiarize myself with the mutant controllers that Nintendo tries to innovate and shove down our throats. I was not allowed to familiarize myself with the game, they wanted to jump straight into the game with only the most rudimentary of instructions on how to play and then they proceed to trash you three ways to tuesday and you get a foul taste in your mouth.

Competition does that.

The fans don't see it that way. They don't see the frustration that someone new coming into it might be feeling when they get trounced over and over again at a big party, embaressed on the couch before others. And this happened during the N64, GC, and Wii generations from many different fan boys trying to get me to take a break from my PS, X-Box, or PC to come play a bit of 'nostalgic fun'.

I know exactly what you mean. My roommates are big Nintendo fans, so whenever they talk me into it (or if we're all just drunk enough) I sit down and play Mario Party with them, or that WiiU Mii party thing, and I may as well not even have a controller because those fuckers have memorized every facet of the games mechanics. Any time I manage to do well is based solely on random dice roles.

Blaine Houle:
Nintendo has not really made anything worth playing honestly for me in a very long time.

People say they make the best party games but think about it. If you don't actually own the system, don't actually get to play the 'big multiplayer games' to the point where you have become 'that guy' who is too good at it, when it comes time for the big party that everyone is playing that nintendo game on, suddenly you are not really having that much fun.

That is what has turned me off of Nintendo ever since the N64. Every time I get a chance to try playing the system... I am not given much time to actually familiarize myself with the mutant controllers that Nintendo tries to innovate and shove down our throats. I was not allowed to familiarize myself with the game, they wanted to jump straight into the game with only the most rudimentary of instructions on how to play and then they proceed to trash you three ways to tuesday and you get a foul taste in your mouth.

Competition does that.

The fans don't see it that way. They don't see the frustration that someone new coming into it might be feeling when they get trounced over and over again at a big party, embaressed on the couch before others. And this happened during the N64, GC, and Wii generations from many different fan boys trying to get me to take a break from my PS, X-Box, or PC to come play a bit of 'nostalgic fun'.

This is the ravenous fan base at work. They are so enthralled with showing off how much fun something is that they take over the conversation and don't leave you to make your own choice, they taint it with their own.

So of course turned off by a wonky controller (Every one of them is) because obviously the SNES controller was an abomination and fans who were idiots... I missed the nostalgic joy that must have somehow been hidden in those generations... so even wanting to come back and look at what Nintendo is doing these days... and I do keep track because well, I did like the NES and SNES back when I was very young... I can't help but feel that they are idiots.

I don't have any of the rose tinted nostalgia goggles for the games that came out post SNES... so seeing them continue to just rehash the same games over and over and over again seems... well... bad. I remember they used to do interesting games once but not anymore.

And I know... there was the zelda games that were different but when you have five different fan boys show up at your house with their systems on different occassions to show you the opening and then to play it while you watch while they go and do the high end content to show how awesome the game is... well... it doesn't seem that appealing.

This rehash of a rehash of a rehash is just that... overcooked. I am no longer the 13 year old I was when Link to the Past first came out. The things I liked then, I do not like as much now so playing a reiteration doesn't appeal.

What are they doing right? Very little. They keep hammering out Pokemon with some improvement in quality with each iteration but even then the mouth breather fans kill it when they start talking about such and such being the best and if you make the choice that you did, you are a complete fool or that wasn't an optimal choice and that X would have been so much better and that they will beat you senseless if you ever get into a match. Oh, by the way, you want a match? Yeah... My 3DS sits on my desk, barely touched because the fans of the game make it not worth playing and there is very little else on it that appeals to my need for a high quality single player experience.

And yes... I do have the new Fire Emblem and even it got stale rather quickly because I have done other turn based grid based tactics games before over the years and thus the game play was not that amazing.

So in essence, their own fans and inability to do anything of quality that is new is what is killing them.

That sounds kind of like you're using your own negative experiences to justify a dislike of Nintendo rather than the actual quality of their games, which are still consistently very high when measured on their own merits. If your friends act like assholes to you, that's their problem, not Nintendo's. Most of the people I play games with are pretty casual about it, so you can't really say that fans are a problem.

As for making games that are similar to their past games, I still fail to understand how that's bad. If I like a game, then I'm going to want to play a game that's recognizably similar, but still different enough to be new. Fallout 3, for example, was really just Oblivion with guns, and Fallout: New Vegas was really just another Fallout 3. Skyrim is really nothing more than Oblivion with a few mechanical differences and a different world, and GTA 5 was just another GTA 4.

None of those games are in any way bad, however, they're all top-notch AAA games from famous developers that have received immense critical acclaim. So what's different? If I had to guess, it's that they don't carry the "kiddy" stigma that Nintendo still hasn't quite gotten rid of since the Playstation era. People forgive other games for being derivative because they try to present themselves as "mature", when in most cases they're really just glorified playthings dressed as an action movie blockbuster.

I'll admit the Wii U has been not that great, but the 3DS is doing well, with a solid library of games, even after a shaky start.

I see people who whine on about not being able to play Nintendo IPs, having no problem plunking down cash on a Playstation or Xbox system for exclusives. Every platform has exclusives, even PC. If you want to play the games then buy the system or otherwise move on. I really don't know why this keeps being brought up. It's not going to happen. Get over it.

Also, "Going the way of Sega" would mean for Nintendo to drop the Wii U, dump money into a new system, then drop it again, pump more money into yet another system, until they lose consumer confidence and go near bankrupt. That's what fucked Sega over. Putting hardware out, not giving it time or support and letting their product sink. Dropping the Wii U isn't an option.

Honestly, this whole thing is overblown.

It would be kind of nice to not have to buy a special box just for nintendo games as their quality does seem to have dropped. Particularly mario, as yatzee said, galaxy was the last great mario that really wanted to be different. The marios and zeldas of now haven't got me excited at all, which is sad since I grew up on their consoles.

Everywhere else just seems to have more potential in gaming these days, particularly story. A company that's been around as long as nintendo hasn't even attempted a story really.

Its sad but I don't think they are out or they need to stop making hardware yet, I just want them to make some cool mind blowing stuff.

Like mario soccer with jetpacks and a gigantic map, or use the touchpad and make a D&D game with the GM using the tablet.

IS taking the non-linear approach to dungeons what passes for innovation these days?

I think Yahtzee (and a bunch of forum posters who know who they are) need to revisit Yahtzee's own Gears of War 2 review, and ask if a game needs to blow the world away with innovation to be good.

Zelda was my favorite game this (insert extended period of time here, somewhere between 1 and 3 years).

Regarding what Nintendo is doing right, I feel that Yahtzee isn't as much of a business expert as he makes himself out to be, as needs to stay on the opinion side of things in these columns and less on the "here's the solution" side. I've already heard from lots of forum posters what Nintendo needs to do to and such, and I don't think any of us actually know. Also, I've seen the Sega comparison shot down in more professional-seeming articles than this too many times to give it validity anymore...

Thanatos2k:

I refuse to accept any notion that Link Between Worlds represents any kind of forward movement from something like, say, Wind Waker. Or even Ocarina of Time, to be more 3DS-relevant.

Did you really play the game? LBW is the first Zelda in years to actually attempt to move the series forward. The wall walking mechanic is a game changer in the realm of top down 2D Zelda action adventure because it opens up so much in the level design. The equipment renting almost turns the game into open world exploration which is revolutionary for a Zelda game. And yet you bash on it because it ruined your gradual equipment collection that you EXPECTED out of the game. So it defies your expectations but then you criticize it for not changing the experience enough. What in the....

They did EVERYTHING right, and you're acting like they did the complete opposite.

Going back to squeaky top-down grid gameplay is the exact opposite of an elevation.

Oh...I think I get it now. You just don't like 2D games. You seriously think that 3D is inherently better. Well. Talk about bias.

Yeah... it felt to me like he didn't play it either. Or hear about it. I forgave it in the last video because of its joke, but this time, the fact that he didn't even elude to the wall mechanic (a major part of the game), even negatively, is bizarre.

Dark Knifer:

Everywhere else just seems to have more potential in gaming these days, particularly story. A company that's been around as long as nintendo hasn't even attempted a story really.

Depends what you're into. If you want a story, the 3DS has plenty in the form of JRPGs.

Crimson Shroud
Bravely Default
Fire Emblem Awakening
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Shin Megami Tensei Devil Survivor Overclocked
Shin Megami Tensei Devil Summoner Soul Hackers

And so on.

Those are all incredibly story heavy games. Might not be your cup of tea, but it's silly to claim Nintendo systems lack titles that have story.

Dead Century:

Dark Knifer:

Everywhere else just seems to have more potential in gaming these days, particularly story. A company that's been around as long as nintendo hasn't even attempted a story really.

Depends what you're into. If you want a story, the 3DS has plenty in the form of JRPGs.

Crimson Shroud
Bravely Default
Fire Emblem Awakening
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Shin Megami Tensei Devil Survivor Overclocked
Shin Megami Tensei Devil Summoner Soul Hackers

And so on.

Those are all incredibly story heavy games. Might not be your cup of tea, but it's silly to claim Nintendo systems lack titles that have story.

Forgive me on that. I didn't know about them because I'm not big on jrpgs and I also meant as in first party nintendo games have yet to try story, not the systems themselves. I'm sure the consoles have stuff.

I think fire emblem is the only one made by nintendo though I could be wrong.

If I had to play armchair CEO for Nintendo I'd say the problem lies in the marketing department. In Scandinavia at least, I can't speak for the rest of the world of course, Nintendo is neigh invisible to the casual eye. No newspaper ads, nearly no TV ads, no ads at all really. You want people to talk about your product you have to remind people that you exist.

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