Game of Thrones Season 4 Episode 2 Review "The Lion and the Rose"

Game of Thrones Season 4 Episode 2 Review "The Lion and the Rose"

There's a lot to say about the latest twists in HBO's crazy story.

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I'm actually curious to see how they handle the next few seasons. With the way the timelines of books 4 and 5 intersect and cross, it seems like they could just go and do it all chronologically ,and have those two books take up like, 4 seasons or more (they are both quite dense in terms of stuff going on).

After that, well, let's all pray to our respective deities that Martin has finished the last two books by then. I just finished book 5, and after the way it ended, he needs to hurry on up. I gotta find out what happens next.

It's not like Tommen really does anything. He's a doormat in the book and all he's good for is playing with the Royal Seal.

Soviet Heavy:
It's not like Tommen really does anything. He's a doormat in the book and all he's good for is playing with the Royal Seal.

That's very true. This recap makes it sound like they've somehow failed in translating Tommen to the TV screen, but he's just as much of a non-entity in the books. Prior to taking the throne he's barely mentioned, and even once he's taken the throne he's mentioned more but is still utterly useless and is only "on-screen" when he's talking about his cats or stamping a document when he's told to.

I heard the guy who plays Ilyn Payne is sick (cancer), and if so, that's likely why they didn't use him in the role of Jamie's sparring partner.

RonHiler:
I heard the guy who plays Ilyn Payne is sick (cancer), and if so, that's likely why they didn't use him in the role of Jamie's sparring partner.

Terminally ill, at that.

They didn't want to recast him out of respect.

Plus, it makes more sense for TV, as Ilyn wasn't very talkative.

I know I was clapping my hands like an excitable circus seal on Christmas morning when I realized Joffrey was FINALLY gonna get his.

That whole reception scene was just painful to watch, and I felt really bad for Tyrion. I couldn't help but get the feeling that the Tyrells were waiting for something to happen to him during that whole time up until his death. That was just the impression I got from the looks on their faces.

In any event, I'm super excited for the next episode which can't get here fast enough! D:

As sadistic as this might sound, I was worried that Joffrey's death wouldn't be painful enough. I know it was coming sooner or later but I was worried it wouldn't satisfy me. However I am pleasantly surprised. Might not be as gruesome as some of the things he's done to others but it defiantly looked painful, HIS FACE I love it. I also hate the queen but the actress playing her does such a good job of portraying that stuck up bitch. Seeing her yell and scream in despair put a smile on my face. In the words of the queen "It's the little pleasures."

In my opinion, the story would be better if Joffrey had survived.

Arya should be the one to kill him. They would have a second fight mirroring the one at the river, except this time they're both adults, and are equipped with swords rather than sticks.

I really used to like Game of Thrones, and I still do, but seriously, this show became just too convoluted. Too many places, too many characters, too many plot threads, too many themes, and many of them don't seem to be going anywhay. And having read the books - as much of them as I could bear anyway - I know it won't be getting any better...

I found the episode to be a bit disjointed in the first half, with the Stannis and Bran scenes in particular feeling rushed. This could, however, be just my problem, because I knew exactly what was going to happen in this episode and that it would be at the very end of it. In other words, it made everything that wasn't in King's Landing far less important to me.

That changed with the wedding though. That was brilliantly done, and more or less the same as how it is in the book with a few slight changes here and there. The added interactions between characters, like Oberyn and Ellaria with Cersei and Tywin, were the nice additions I always like to see since we didn't see them in the book. From the dwarf joust on, the episode was almost entirely how it happened in A Storm of Swords, and I had been waiting a long time for this. I was not disappointed.

Though... I didn't have what seems like the "typical" reaction to Joffrey's death scene. I didn't clap, cheer, or celebrate in any way. Despite being a major supporter of the Starks (and by extension a vicious hater of the Freys and Boltons), how Joffrey went out is a horrible way to die, and not something I would ever cheer for. Would I have preferred something else? Yes. Robb, Arya, Sansa, or really any Stark being the one to take him out would have been great.

Joffrey is gone, and even if it wasn't done by who i'd have preferred (but the ones who did do it... awesome), it's still done.

Now to look forward to the rest of the season... because Joffrey's death is the catalyst for the rest of Season 4's King's Landing storyline. And there are scenes coming up I am looking forward to far... far more than Joffrey's death:

...and of course a certain scene involving a privvy. :)

Anyway, fun episode, but much more is to come. I'm gonna run away now.

*flees*

Asclepion:
In my opinion, the story would be better if Joffrey had survived.

Arya should be the one to kill him. They would have a second fight mirroring the one at the river, except this time they're both adults, and are equipped with swords rather than sticks.

There wouldn't be much of a duel, Joffrey is a coward and he's all show, he'll run away after 5 seconds. Arya is on her way to become Westeros' Ezio.

Asclepion:
In my opinion, the story would be better if Joffrey had survived.

Arya should be the one to kill him. They would have a second fight mirroring the one at the river, except this time they're both adults, and are equipped with swords rather than sticks.

No, because his death works as a catalyst for a whole number of other things.

Great respect for the acting of Jack Gleeson though. It's a great feat for a young actor to portray such a hated character in perfect fashion :)

Fdzzaigl:
No, because his death works as a catalyst for a whole number of other things.

It would improve the narrative.

The make-up on Jack's face in his final scene was outstanding. I've seen some jokes floating around that they actually killed him for maximum believability. The Bolton's are shaping up to be this season's baddies, though I have read the books and I know that we're in for a lot of drama in King's Landing after the events of the last episode. This season so far has been sensational though, it's on it's way to being the best yet. Can't wait for more!

Asclepion:

Fdzzaigl:
No, because his death works as a catalyst for a whole number of other things.

It would improve the narrative.

Disagree. Joffrey isn't that important. He never was. Arya is bound for much greater things than a duel with some cowardly brat whose only talent is was to offend everyone he's ever encountered.

Scars Unseen:

Asclepion:

Fdzzaigl:
No, because his death works as a catalyst for a whole number of other things.

It would improve the narrative.

Disagree. Joffrey isn't that important. He never was. Arya is bound for much greater things than a duel with some cowardly brat whose only talent is was to offend everyone he's ever encountered.

Indeed, it really wouldn't. The events that will happen in the next few chapters as everyone scurries to find out "whodunnit" start really throwing everything upside down.

Keeping Joffrey alive would mean you start screwing with a whole bunch of things that are going on in the books. The only reason why the show is going so strong is the fact that they remain faithful to the equally strong core material, the moment they throw that overboard they enter the territory of mediocrity.

What I was disappointed in was the missing dwarf in the comedy troupe. A certain pig riding one...

I think the entire scene was well done, though I recall from the book that he was in so much pain that he was clawing away at his own throat trying to breath.

Even though Joffrey was a horrible king the death I want to see the most involves someone releasing their bowels upon expiring.

It's a shame Jack Gleeson has decided to stop acting after this episode. His performance gave us one of the most memorable villains of all time, and it was some of the, if not THE best acting in the show.

Game of Thrones won't be the same without him.

Makabriel:
What I was disappointed in was the missing dwarf in the comedy troupe. A certain pig riding one...

Yes, I was wondering about that as well. I think one of the dwarves kept a mask on, and the audience never saw the face, so they'll be able to cast Penny for later seasons.

Asclepion:
In my opinion, the story would be better if Joffrey had survived.

Arya should be the one to kill him. They would have a second fight mirroring the one at the river, except this time they're both adults, and are equipped with swords rather than sticks.

Personally, I think this would ruin what's great about A Song of Ice and Fire. Sure, that is a totally gratifying and "feel good" way to cap it off, but that's not what this series is about. It aims instead to challenge the expected lines we're used to. Having the Starks get their revenge and everything settles back into order is just to neat and tiddy for the series.

At the rate they're going I really don't think they're going to be able to just stick to Storm of Swords material and have a full season, especially for the guys in Kings Landing. They've already had to dip into Dance with Dragons territory for Theon, now they've accelerated Jaime's Feast for Crows stuff in too. If they're addressing all of that now, what's going to be left for the next season? Very little actually happens in a Feast for Crows (Lotta walking, talking, and scheming, but only one real plot development), so they're probably going to have to rely on Dance with Dragons material pretty heavily. I had originally thought they would continue to break each book into two seasons, but with so little actually going on in Feast, it would make for a very drawn out, dull season, let alone two. I haven't finished Dance yet, but if it's anything like Feast they could probably cover both books in one season.

Here's hoping George picks up the pace on the last two books...

"a fatal disease for most but only left her scarred"
That's VERY insensitive, if there ever was a word that needed quotes around it, it's "only" in that scentence!!!!

Anyway, I was like: I fucking hate Joffrey so much. And then, could it be?!
BEST EPISODE EVAR!!!! :D :D :D :D :D
It genuinely made my day!

Now that Joffery is gone we can finally get to my favorite characters in the story: Ser Ponce, Lady Whiskers, and Boots.

Honestly, I did feel a little sorry for Joffrey (at least in the books). He didn't get a good chance to become a decent human being. He was a bully who was given unlimited power. You can't honestly say that you haven't known kids in your life who probably would have done shit like he did at that stage of their lives if given the chance.

Not only that, the books do have one scene that sort of humanizes him and makes you truly feel sorry for him (at least that's how I felt). You find out that Joffrey was the one who ordered the assassin to kill Bran. He overheard Robert saying that Bran should be allowed to die and that it would be a mercy. Joffrey, trying to win his father's approval (which never seems to happen), decides to give the "mercy" to Bran. The environment Joffrey was brought up in of being spoiled beyond belief while only having one loving parent yet desperately seeking the approval of the other is a sad way for any kid to grow up and it's not overly surprising that he turned out the way he did.

Does it excuse his actions? Absolutely not, but it does make you realize that he probably wasn't evil down to the core.

Is anyone else really disliking Tyrion and Shae's relationship in the show, or is it just me?

I mean in the books, there's this element of "I know she after me for the money, but I'm still in love with her" going on and we don't really get to see Shae's thoughts so we never know if she is just in it for the money or not and then

Meanwhile in the show, Shae just outright says "I love him" and we see Tywin tell (someone at the wedding, can't remember who) to take "the whore" up to his chambers after the feast,

This really annoyed me about the Thenn in the previous episode too. In the books they're portrayed as the most civilised of the free folk (if a bit abrasive) as they have at least some form of governing body (the Magnar), they have actual laws and mine their own ore to make weapons and armour instead of looting from dead corpses of Crows or grabbing bones and tree branches.

And what do we get in the show? Cannibals. CANNIBALS.

I really want to see how they're going to dig themselves out of that hole when the fifth/sixth season rolls around.

Makabriel:
What I was disappointed in was the missing dwarf in the comedy troupe. A certain pig riding one...

This one thinks that maybe the dwarf you're referring to was the one under the wolf mask playing Robb Stark since you never see their face.

EDIT: Disregard what I said, I just remembered that that dwarf speaks a few times and that pretty much rules it out.

Sight Unseen:

Makabriel:
What I was disappointed in was the missing dwarf in the comedy troupe. A certain pig riding one...

This one thinks that maybe the dwarf you're referring to was the one under the wolf mask playing Robb Stark since you never see their face.

EDIT: Disregard what I said, I just remembered that that dwarf speaks a few times and that pretty much rules it out.

They'll probably just make her the sister of one of those dwarves in the show. Maybe she was inside of the giant lion, and helps make the costumes or otherwise run the behind the scenes aspects of the show. There's a lot of ways to go with that.

A very good ep. This was less of a review and more of a text recap though, you should go more into what they kept from the book and what they dropped, ect. rather than just summarize the episode.

 

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