No Right Answer: Is Going to Space Worth It?

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Is Going to Space Worth It?

Kyle and Chris are both going to be Dads, and as such it's time to consider the future. Can't have the future without space travel, but is that a good thing?

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You just made a blood enemy of Neil DeGrasse Tyson.

This debate is poorly named; It's less "Is going to space worth it?" and more "Could we feasibly live in space?"

Also, overpopulation isn't really a good argument for going to space, at least not in the forseeable future; It's way easier to develop sustainable living on Earth than it is to terraform even the tiny percentage of another planet so that it could support human life independently. Sure, I'll buy that in a millennium (maybe a few centuries less) we might have actually hit the peak of the Earth's carrying capacity, but right now becoming more efficient is way easier and smarter than trying to spread inefficiency.

Earth is the cradle of Humanity but every child must leave his crib one day or another.
If mankind don't, mankind will disappear.

No matter how badly we fuck up the Earth it will never be as inhospitable for life as the Moon or Mars are. Even after complete nuclear annihilation Earth would still be a paradise compared to any other planet we know of. Let's stop pretending that somehow space exploration is an adequate solution to our problems here.

That said I think space exploration is totally a worthwhile endeavor for many reasons, it sadly just isn't high on our list of priorities right now.

I am insulted at this video. It was like you were purposely trying to make dumb arguments.

Reasons to go to space:
1) Not get killed by Asteroids
2) Asteroids have lots of really rare things that would be good to have on Earth like Platinum
3) Satellites (they never specified manned space missions)

Reasons not to go:
1) It is really expensive.
2) It is really dirty.
3) The RoI has as much chance of being 0 as being huge.

I just debated both sides better than they did, by a lot.

Really, Chris? You don't know ANY facts about this appearantly.
Maybe hate a little less on science and read some more up on it.

For instance, Mars AND the Moon have water: On September 24, 2009 NASA announced the discovery of water on the Moon.
Something to maybe skim over: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonization_of_the_Moon

Yeah, I've got to give this one to Kyle, hands down.

That being said, congrats to both on their impending dad-hoods! :D

Mars doesn't have a magnetic field.

We'll never create a sustainable anything out of that place.

Like it or not, we're not a self sustaining species - We exist because the planet we inhabit allows us to exist. The reason we are what we are is because the Earth shaped us over millions of years. And if the Earth goes, we'll likely go with it.

Not that it isn't nice to dream.

One more vote for Kyle, the problem is money.

Earth is such a rich planet, just fit for sustaining higher life forms such as ours. Yet mankind's primitive, egocentric and greedy economical organization has pillaged and sullied Earth's very rare and delicate life support equilibrium. With no concern for other species', nor our own, survival. Do we really want to spread out this venomous, cannibalistic society through the universe? Is it not a development plan always meant to fail? To cause disparity, injustice and poverty? To end in territorial war?

The exploration of space needs a more socially evolved mankind to have any kind of success.

I'm REALLY trying to understand why I am such a huge fan of this show. I feel like I shouldnt be, or there is not a big enough reason to be such a fan, but I think you guys are simply that likable. I just love watching you guys banter, your mood is extremely contagious.

Why are they discussing a question with one very obviously right answer?

Have they forgotten what their show is titled?

EDIT: What the hell Chris? There's tons of water in space. That shit is plentiful. It's not all in liquid form, but there's no shortage of it.

Humans can't survive in space because of eye damage.

( http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/station/research/news/Astronaut_Vision.html )

And cancer due to radiation ( http://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Human_Spaceflight/Astronauts/Living_in_space )

Especially when most of those who have gone into space have spent only 6 months or less there.

Is it just me, or was this the angriest debate on No Right Answer? Admittedly, it is a more important debate than Ninja Turtles V. Power Rangers.

this was the worst no right answer episode i've ever seen. i've never seen less informed arguments than this. for a moment i thought i was watching fox news. it was just cringinly bad to watch. my science heart still aches...

i also agree that this episode has the wrong name. they're not debating if it's worth it but if it's feasable...

Eh. Sure our future is in space but we don't care and when we need to do it, it will be far too late.

Personally I want to be a Martian ice miner but that will never happen. How awesome would it be to have a job cutting massive slabs of ice with like a plasma torch?!?!

Wow. Neither of you could do even a little research about this beyond watching scifi movies?

Okay, seriously did no one do research at all on this?

http://www.mars-one.com/

Debate = over.

TheMemoman:
Earth is such a rich planet, just fit for sustaining higher life forms such as ours. Yet mankind's primitive, egocentric and greedy economical organization has pillaged and sullied Earth's very rare and delicate life support equilibrium. With no concern for other species', nor our own, survival. Do we really want to spread out this venomous, cannibalistic society through the universe? Is it not a development plan always meant to fail? To cause disparity, injustice and poverty? To end in territorial war?

The exploration of space needs a more socially evolved mankind to have any kind of success.

Hello friend.
The universe is home to things that explode a lot. Like Stars. Remember those? Yeah those fckers have probably killed more living things than Humans did and ever will. Earth itself has murdered most of its creations. Heck, most species on earth are getting by with a lot of killing.
Add to that the incredible number of "low probability but with total ruination" events that the universe regularly throws at things inside of itself. Like big rocks. The universe sure likes to have rocks hit other things....

Currently, only humanity has made it to a point where all the things that kill everything are even understood, let alone developing the capability to do something about it.

Life as we know it on earth is flat out incompatible with what the rest of the universe is mostly made of: Things that kill shit by just being there.

Has vacuum ever made an attack against someone, like a human? nope. But it will sure as fck kill you if you step into its presence unprepared. You might have learned that there is a whole lot of vacuum. And when there is not, something more killtastic has taken its place.

You can blabber about how humanity is such a scourge on this poor blue planet (that has survived at least 3 apocalyptic events and is still rocking a fckton of life) all you want but there is on immutable fact you ignore:

Its humans that have begun developing Technology, science and an understanding of how the universe works. Its humanity that will eventually fix its own errors, its science and technology that will spread a part of earth wherever humans will go.
Whatever mistakes we as a species, as a civilisation make - at some point we will fix them.

I can't subscribe to your humanity scourge crap. If i'd believe that i could not wake up in the morning and go to my cog in the machine job.

I believe that humanity will correct itself because at some point the immutable fact that the universe is a killing machine will get into peoples heads. Our current dicking around is unsustainable and the facts will force a course shift.

Aside from mars one...

We already know how to solve the oxygen issue on the moon, it can be extracted from the moondust, there's a functional machine built that can make enough oxygen for a few people for a day with just a small amount of moon dust(like 10-20kg oxygen out of every 100kg moon dust). You could basically send an astronaut out with a shovel and they could collect enough for 10 people to breath for a week. Automate it and you could do much better.

Darknacht:
Wow. Neither of you could do even a little research about this beyond watching scifi movies?

Kyle has done extensive research into the Privatization of space travel. Chris ate a sandwich. Such was the deabate, the archetype of well-researched pundit vs loud noises pundit.

Cerebrawl:
Aside from mars one...

We already know how to solve the oxygen issue on the moon, it can be extracted from the moondust, there's a functional machine built that can make enough oxygen for a few people for a day with just a small amount of moon dust(like 10-20kg oxygen out of every 100kg moon dust). You could basically send an astronaut out with a shovel and they could collect enough for 10 people to breath for a week. Automate it and you could do much better.

That's really neat, I didn't know that one.

There is a ton of research that is going on into space travel, it's just not as prominent as it used to be.

umbraticus:
this was the worst no right answer episode i've ever seen. i've never seen less informed arguments than this. for a moment i thought i was watching fox news. it was just cringinly bad to watch. my science heart still aches...

i also agree that this episode has the wrong name. they're not debating if it's worth it but if it's feasable...

If it makes you feel better, Chris was going for the "Fox News silly". Kyle has actually written a novel on the privatization of space exploration and in doing so has an extensive library of knowlege on it.

Also, we play for the giggles.

errorwrong:
Is it just me, or was this the angriest debate on No Right Answer? Admittedly, it is a more important debate than Ninja Turtles V. Power Rangers.

Kyle was passionate due to this being his thing. He wrote a novel on it!

Scorpid:
You just made a blood enemy of Neil DeGrasse Tyson.

But I'm his Twitter follower!

tzimize:
I'm REALLY trying to understand why I am such a huge fan of this show. I feel like I shouldnt be, or there is not a big enough reason to be such a fan, but I think you guys are simply that likable. I just love watching you guys banter, your mood is extremely contagious.

We love you too. smooch

Casual Shinji:
Mars doesn't have a magnetic field.

We'll never create a sustainable anything out of that place.

Like it or not, we're not a self sustaining species - We exist because the planet we inhabit allows us to exist. The reason we are what we are is because the Earth shaped us over millions of years. And if the Earth goes, we'll likely go with it.

Not that it isn't nice to dream.

actually mars does, its just about as strong as most refrigerator magnets. I also believe your wrong about us not being a self sustaining species as we are they very definition of one, the earth didn't shape us we shaped it to suit us. I mean think about how many things on our planet can kill us? a lot and that's not even counting weather.

OT: we can and will colonize space it just wont be for a long time, not a thousand years but at least several hundred.

ecoho:

Casual Shinji:
Mars doesn't have a magnetic field.

We'll never create a sustainable anything out of that place.

Like it or not, we're not a self sustaining species - We exist because the planet we inhabit allows us to exist. The reason we are what we are is because the Earth shaped us over millions of years. And if the Earth goes, we'll likely go with it.

Not that it isn't nice to dream.

actually mars does, its just about as strong as most refrigerator magnets. I also believe your wrong about us not being a self sustaining species as we are they very definition of one, the earth didn't shape us we shaped it to suit us. I mean think about how many things on our planet can kill us? a lot and that's not even counting weather.

It has a few very small pockets which are remnants of the field it once had. That's nothing worth mentioning.

We're more self sustaining than any other animal on this planet - That doesn't mean the Earth couldn't easily wipe us out if certain systems dropped out. Without a magnetic field we'd be fucked. The gravity of this planet gives us the bodies we have. If somehow we could put a colony on Mars (and not have them subjected to space radiation), they'd all too quickly turn into pathetic masses of deseased tissue. Our bodies can only function when subjected to this gravity - anything more or less and it'll start to collapse.

Even if by some miracle we'd find a planet that is equally sized and suitable for sustaining life, we'd still be foreign bodies in that environment. Just introducing animals to different continents on this planet can have extreme consequences.

I laughed at the screenshot of Total Recall, and the whole argument about whether or not colonizing space is worth it. Which other movies had screenshots made from them to take pot shots at them?

Darth_Payn:
I laughed at the screenshot of Total Recall, and the whole argument about whether or not colonizing space is worth it. Which other movies had screenshots made from them to take pot shots at them?

I used one from "Mission to Mars"

Three letters:

G. P. S.

We have SatNavs. Sat-Phones. Satellite-Internet. Oh, sure, we also have Spy-Sats allowing the USA to read number plates in London, but the main point is that satellites have completely changed modern communication. And they are just a by-product of getting into space. And I'm pretty sure the Satellite network, by itself has paid back the investment of getting into space.

So, yes, it is worth it. Just to find out what we can do once we're up there.

(And because I'd like to live in the future please...)

TheMemoman:
Earth is such a rich planet, just fit for sustaining higher life forms such as ours. Yet mankind's primitive, egocentric and greedy economical organization has pillaged and sullied Earth's very rare and delicate life support equilibrium. With no concern for other species', nor our own, survival. Do we really want to spread out this venomous, cannibalistic society through the universe? Is it not a development plan always meant to fail? To cause disparity, injustice and poverty? To end in territorial war?

The exploration of space needs a more socially evolved mankind to have any kind of success.

Our greed as you put it is our great engine of greatness. The drive to do and see more than anybody else is a central tenant of human existence. We should leave this God forsaken rock to do what we as a species where meant to, to conquer the galaxy.

The level of ignorance on the subject (on one side more than the other) was just downright painful to watch. It's probably mindsets like that which stand in the way of solid progress.

You can't really effectively debate something you have virtually no knowledge of.

Casual Shinji:

ecoho:

Casual Shinji:
Mars doesn't have a magnetic field.

We'll never create a sustainable anything out of that place.

Like it or not, we're not a self sustaining species - We exist because the planet we inhabit allows us to exist. The reason we are what we are is because the Earth shaped us over millions of years. And if the Earth goes, we'll likely go with it.

Not that it isn't nice to dream.

actually mars does, its just about as strong as most refrigerator magnets. I also believe your wrong about us not being a self sustaining species as we are they very definition of one, the earth didn't shape us we shaped it to suit us. I mean think about how many things on our planet can kill us? a lot and that's not even counting weather.

It has a few very small pockets which are remnants of the field it once had. That's nothing worth mentioning.

We're more self sustaining than any other animal on this planet - That doesn't mean the Earth couldn't easily wipe us out if certain systems dropped out. Without a magnetic field we'd be fucked. The gravity of this planet gives us the bodies we have. If somehow we could put a colony on Mars (and not have them subjected to space radiation), they'd all too quickly turn into pathetic masses of deseased tissue. Our bodies can only function when subjected to this gravity - anything more or less and it'll start to collapse.

Even if by some miracle we'd find a planet that is equally sized and suitable for sustaining life, we'd still be foreign bodies in that environment. Just introducing animals to different continents on this planet can have extreme consequences.

I don't even know were to start with were your wrong. we can live in lower gravity we just have to work harder in it to keep ourselves healthy. Yes if we lost the magnetic field around us without warning wed all die, but we have structures and suits that block the radiation in space (suits less so). Humans as a species are the very definition of adaptability that is how we function, we don't rely on our environment we make our environment.

I guess what im trying to get across to you is that humans as a species are not that easy to kill off, even the earth which has tried many time to kill us off cant do it as well as you think.

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