Movie Defense Force: The Amazing Spider-Man 2: Better Than Broody Gritty Wah Wah

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Now I want Bobby to make a video defending... Steam I guess. Ubisoft works too.

Is Peter Parker less of a fuckin prick this time around? Cause that was my biggest problem with the first one.

Either way, I think I'm going to wait until they James Bond Spider-Man again. The people in charge of it right now don't get super heroes.

Holy sh****! MovieBob! Jim's throwing down the gauntlet!

Shots fired!

But it is ballsy defending ASM2.

You really need to do a no right answer episode with moviebob about the Spiderman movie, assuming that moviebob doesn't kill you for liking this movie.

I also liked it, sure the story is a mess and besides the rhino the villains motivations make no sense, and the story focuses heavily on the gwenXpeter romance which we know is pointless since they make it perfectly clear that Gwen is dead meat.

But the action and acting is great, and despite it having been foreshadowed way too much I did think that Gwen's death was pretty effective.

I still think the raimi films are better and would have rather seen Spiderman 4, also I never understood the hate Tobey Maguire gets.

Mangod:
Holy sh****! MovieBob! Jim's throwing down the gauntlet!

I love Jim but I gotta take Bob's side on this issue, although Jim's relaxed enjoyment of the film is completely okay and it seems like these film were shooting for casual moviegoers anyway.

I enjoyed it as well. Moviebob's hyperbolic review where he literally started crying about the damn film was ridiculous. The movie wasn't a masterpiece in anyway but it was fun to watch.

Dear lord you must be joking. I get that there are people who really like this new Spidey, but it just doesn't work.

The new siper-man was camp. It just was. I lot of people can't handle a bit of camp. The movies were a mess but they weren't some kind of travesty. I think people take superheroes too seriously. The Amazing Spider Man 2 is a failure but it is not the same kind of failure as something like "Dark Knight Rises" or the new Spooperman movie. Some people prefer a campy farcical mess to grim faced uncomfortably.

Maybe you've already read it, Jim, but if not, you should check out Film Critic Hulk's take on the movie. Probably the smartest movie review I've ever read. http://badassdigest.com/2014/05/06/film-crit-hulk-smash-hulks-237-burning-questions-for-the-amazing-spider-man/

themilo504:
You really need to do a no right answer episode with moviebob about the Spiderman movie, assuming that moviebob doesn't kill you for liking this movie.

For some reason, after reading that sentence, my mind just called back to that Comic-Con episode of The Cleveland Show that depicted Kevin Smith and Harry Knowles fighting over a corn dog...

I'm on the side that sees that both Spiderman films have their pros and cons such as the Rami films having better villains (I mean come on, Dafoe as the Green Goblin, it's an automatic win) but there is one thing that the reboot does beat the original in and that is this:

Gwen Stacy is a better girlfriend than Mary Jane, there I said it. MJ is the reason why I didn't like the original trilogy, she's not a character, she's a tool to make Spiderman look good, their relationship is just bland, there's the constant breaking up and getting back together bullcrap for all three films and of course "MJ is in some kind of danger cliché". Gwen on the other hand, helps Spiderman, has a more interesting character and their relationship is more believable compared to MJ's blandness

Didn't see the latest one, but I liked the previous film. I really don't see what's everyone problem with it. Not great, but made sort of sense and was watchable. Sam Raimi's previous trilogy never clicked with me, in fact I absolutely hated #2 and #3 was dumb.

BTW: I only ever read one Spider-Man comic book (as in one copy of one book).

I haven't seen the movie, so I can't comment except to say that while nothing about the current movie franchise appeals to me (and the previous movie actually angers me quite a bit), there is nothing at all wrong with watching people do fun, cool stuff you wish you could do, and Mr. Sterling's response is inherently defensible.

Now I need to yell at someone.

Fusioncode9:
MovieBob's hyperbolic review where he literally started crying about the damn film was ridiculous.

That did not happen. You are making shit up. Here is a link to his review, wherein I do not believe he is speaking in hyperbole and wherein it is a provable fact that he neither cries nor references crying.

If you insist on ragging on someone's review, please rag on things the review actually says.

Fusioncode9:
I enjoyed it as well. Moviebob's hyperbolic review where he literally started crying about the damn film was ridiculous. The movie wasn't a masterpiece in anyway but it was fun to watch.

Is that the one where he said the film was so bad it killed his desire to be a critic? Because I cringed, I cringed more than I did when watching the movie, which was incredibly cringe-worthy. But good for a few chuckles.

What? It didn't steal Jim's soul and melt off his face, Raiders-style?

Perhaps there's more to this tale than I've been led to believe...

I liked the 1st one at the time but for the 2nd I agree with Bob. They ruined Spiderman and all his villains and the film is irredeemably awful. After sitting through all that shit, then when I saw Rhino I thought 'WTF?, I'm done with this franchise'. Hes just a tank, the fact that its shaped like a rhino is pretty much irrelevant. Hes more like an Iron Man enemy now.
The new stupid bullshit story about Peter's parents was the worst part of ASM 1 and barely even amounts to anything in 2. Dumbing everything down to just 'Oscorp is bad and responsible for everything bad that ever happens' is stupid.

I do always find it amusing how people complain about reboots so much more nowadays when they have always existed in film, just look at how many Dracula, Frankenstein and other book's saw adaptions every few years pre internet.

Adapting the same book over and over again fine but doing it with a film WAAH!

And rebooting comic books wow big deal I do find it funny how the MCU Hulk reboot was fine but Sony doing it to Spiderman is too far.

How is it any different than when comics change creative teams all the damn time. If this many people dropped comics because of those changing there would be no super hero comics anymore.

Sorry but no, I don't agree with Jim. It was painfully obvious that the movie was not made to tell a story but rather just an obligation, just the next cog in the franchise milking machine, existing only to act as the glue for the next bunch of movies that will inevitably be churned out. Fox was terrible both as the stereotype nerd and as the completely forgettable and bland Electro. Goblin and Rhino have less than 10 minutes of screen time combined and that is a fucking crime when so much time was wasted instead on the ultimately pointless romance with Gwen. I shouldn't be stuck with Twilight or Star was prequels awkward romances in a super hero movie!

Kitsune Hunter:
Gwen Stacy is a better girlfriend than Mary Jane, there I said it. MJ is the reason why I didn't like the original trilogy, she's not a character, she's a tool to make Spiderman look good, their relationship is just bland, there's the constant breaking up and getting back together bullcrap for all three films and of course "MJ is in some kind of danger cliché". Gwen on the other hand, helps Spiderman, has a more interesting character and their relationship is more believable compared to MJ's blandness

Rewatching the original recently I thought "Jesus Christ! Mary Jane is a whore!" A bit of hyperbole, but I thought "Christ! How many guys is she "in love with" in this movie? First it was Flash, then they broke up and she got with Harry. Then, while dating Harry, she did the upside-down kiss with Spiderman. Then, while still dating Harry, she "had a moment" with Peter while in Aunt May's hospital room that Harry witnessed, told Norman Osborne about, and Norman realized he could use her to get to Peter. Then, she tells Peter that she loves him, and kisses him, in the cemetery where Harry's (the guy she was still sorta dating - we never see them officially break up, though they had the spat at thanksgiving when he didn't defend her to his father) father was JUST BURIED.

What...the...fuck? It struck me, "Mary Jane isn't a character...she's just a plot device." Re-watch and see how much time she spends screaming. It got really old really fast.

I didn't care for Gwen in the first Amazing Spiderman, and I haven't seen the second, but I didn't dislike her. I just couldn't get involved in her knowing ultimately where her story arc was going. Also, Amazing Spiderman wasn't very good at making engaging characters.

Movie Defense Force is slowly morphing from "Jim defends unpopular movies that actually have merit" to "Jim just has shit taste in movies".

Of course, taste is entirely subjective, so if he enjoyed ASM2, good for him. His taste clearly doesn't align with mine, though, so I won't really be taking his opinion on this seriously.

After seeing the Nostalgia Critic video concerning these films I kind of realised just how little I cared about the Raimi films, not that I don't respect them for helping come about this GOLDEN AGE OF COMIC BOOK MOVIES!

I never saw the first film but Amazing Spiderman 2 had a far more likable Peter and Gwen actually had character unlike another red haired love interest. Not to mention Gwen had a purpose, unlike half of the Marvel love interests, seriously what was the point of Jane Foster in Thor 2?

The death scene was also very good. The THUNK her head made when it hit the floor was harsh.

By some strange coincidence just before going into the film I was asking myself why movies don't have OST tracks for individual characters, for example:

Wouldn't you know it, Electro had his own theme and it was awesome.

There's a lot I don't like about the film, the villain designs are all to safe and thus forgettable, Peters parents were a lazy set up tool and the plot near the back end of the film has some real stupid parts in service to world building. Also, Harry breaking in to Ravencroft so he could break out Electro so he could help Harry break into Oscorp ~BREEEEEEATH~ was just dumb.

But Garfield and Stone were good and the insywinsy spider scene was badass, the film was okay... but the world building could go F itself.

Ugh! All I have to say is everything I hated about Peter Parker's new iteration could be summed up in that one scene Jim decided to show at the end of this episode as he claimed it was "genuinely funny." All I have to say is that, no, I do not think that these scenes were genuinely funny and I found them quite irritating and dumb.

I have to say though, that scene where Spider-Man and Electro fight for the first time was actually pretty good. Well paced, well directed, and even coherent. Things I can't use to describe everything else about this movie though.

Oh, and I have to point out, this movie actually trying to attempt a less gritty approach would probably have been a breath of fresh air had it not been for Iron Man, The Incredible Hulk, Iron Man 2, Thor, Captain America, The Avengers, Iron Man 3, Thor: The Dark World, and the upcoming Guardians of the Galaxy. Yes, I realize these are all Avengers movies but...well, they're there! I guess the only thing I have to leave out is the new Captain America movie, but that movie had some sly, snarky dialogue I find to be way more funny than anything that was trying to be funny in either of the Amazing Spider-Man movies.

Holy shit, I never realized how much of a hot topic this movie turned out for me.

how dare u have a differing opinion. I demand Jim Sterling's immediate removal from the escapist because moviebob told me this was a bad movie and now my small brain is starting to hurt from hearing 2 different opinions that do not match

Sseth:
how dare u have a differing opinion. I demand Jim Sterling's immediate removal from the escapist because moviebob told me this was a bad movie and now my small brain is starting to hurt from hearing 2 different opinions that do not match

I'm at work and can't watch the video. Did Jim say that it wasn't a bad movie, or that he liked it? Because there is a difference.

Kitsune Hunter:
I'm on the side that sees that both Spiderman films have their pros and cons such as the Rami films having better villains (I mean come on, Dafoe as the Green Goblin, it's an automatic win) but there is one thing that the reboot does beat the original in and that is this:

Gwen Stacy is a better girlfriend than Mary Jane, there I said it. MJ is the reason why I didn't like the original trilogy, she's not a character, she's a tool to make Spiderman look good, their relationship is just bland, there's the constant breaking up and getting back together bullcrap for all three films and of course "MJ is in some kind of danger cliché". Gwen on the other hand, helps Spiderman, has a more interesting character and their relationship is more believable compared to MJ's blandness

Did you watch Nostalgia Critic's New Versus Old on these movies? You might enjoy it as he gave both a lot of credit where it was due. Hell, when it comes to the villains, he actually has a very interesting take on it.

Oh I imagine this caused no small amount of arguing with MovieBob.
As for me I have not seen any of the ASM movies, but I will say that I did not like Toby MsGuire so any alternative would be an improvement.

tdylan:

Kitsune Hunter:
Gwen Stacy is a better girlfriend than Mary Jane, there I said it. MJ is the reason why I didn't like the original trilogy, she's not a character, she's a tool to make Spiderman look good, their relationship is just bland, there's the constant breaking up and getting back together bullcrap for all three films and of course "MJ is in some kind of danger cliché". Gwen on the other hand, helps Spiderman, has a more interesting character and their relationship is more believable compared to MJ's blandness

Rewatching the original recently I thought "Jesus Christ! Mary Jane is a whore!" A bit of hyperbole, but I thought "Christ! How many guys is she "in love with" in this movie? First it was Flash, then they broke up and she got with Harry. Then, while dating Harry, she did the upside-down kiss with Spiderman. Then, while still dating Harry, she "had a moment" with Peter while in Aunt May's hospital room that Harry witnessed, told Norman Osborne about, and Norman realized he could use her to get to Peter. Then, she tells Peter that she loves him, and kisses him, in the cemetery where Harry's (the guy she was still sorta dating - we never see them officially break up, though they had the spat at thanksgiving when he didn't defend her to his father) father was JUST BURIED.

What...the...fuck? It struck me, "Mary Jane isn't a character...she's just a plot device." Re-watch and see how much time she spends screaming. It got really old really fast.

Agreed also I forgot about that last bit and sure she may have discovered her love for Peter, but I agree, you just don't do that, that was a really shitty thing for her to do.

Saltyk:

Did you watch Nostalgia Critic's New Versus Old on these movies? You might enjoy it as he gave both a lot of credit where it was due. Hell, when it comes to the villains, he actually has a very interesting take on it.

Actually I did, at first I thought that it would get pretty heated and one sided, but it was very fair and balanced. People can say what they will about the NC, but he knows how to make a good argument.

JimB:

If you insist on ragging on someone's review, please rag on things the review actually says.

You mean things like "I'm depressed" and "I can't look at the red right now" or the title with that "Broke Moviebob" shite?

And the tweets.....oh man those tweets. They were ragable as hell!

You know I will say this, I don't think it's a coincidence that all my friends who hated this movie were kinda geeky (I mean this in the least derogatory way possible), and all my friends who loved it were barely into comics and games at all.
I mean hate it love it, they're doing something right.

Sorry Jim nope.

It wasn't fun because the story kept getting in the way. It made the otherwise entertaining action scenes feel stupid because the context either wasn't there or wasn't very good.

It went for camp, sure, but there is good camp and bad camp. This was clearly in the bad camp section. The mere fact that anyone would compare performances from this to those from the reviled Schumacher Batmans should be evidence enough of that.

But at least Schumacher, in deciding to go for camp, went with artsy, from the page of comics style looks for his villains. These villains have to be the worst designed characters in ages. Roger Corman's Fantastic Four is looking at these villains and saying "you know, I don't feel so bad anymore".

Finally, this iteration of Parker is just insufferable. It's hard to care about the outcome when I am really rooting for the protagonist to lose. They should have killed off him instead. At least it would have made for a twist that no one saw coming. And people could speculate on the opportunity to introduce Miles Morales.

I've always found it funny about Spiderman as a character, not that he can't get a decent movie to save his life, but that he's the character that you can't revolve a decent story around to save its life.

Spiderman is only a decent character as long as his environment involves strife concerning his life in general, which you can only do if he's young and inexperienced and unused to dealing with it. Which of course means that he has to perpetually be high school or college aged, because once he gets old and experienced enough to deal with his problems, you suddenly have a character who worked past his initial weaknesses... and turns into something Marvel can't deal with anymore.

Spiderman's weaknesses has always been his personal life, which is something that you either work out or you don't. So you're either forced to continually reboot Spiderman as some high school kid unwilling to deal with his new responsibilities, or you turn him into some kind of unlikeable man-child who doesn't want to deal with modern times, neither of which is fun to work out in comic book form or movie form. Hell, it'd be uncomfortable to deal with in series form, and that's the story form that Spiderman would tend to work best.

I'm convinced that if Spiderman was eventually given back to Marvel by Sony, Spiderman would be thrown into the sidekick business along with Black Widow and Hawkeye, someone who just doesn't have any business of being a fully fledged hero because the formula of creating that is just to goddamned contrived. Spiderman isn't a good premise because it's too ham-fisted and doesn't work for modern times, and any modern attempt at an origin story has either pissed off the purists or just not worked in general.

Spiderman is a bad character for anything modern. His origin is horrible, his rogues gallery is horrible, his circumstances are horrible. Nothing about it makes for a good story other than a warning for how you really shouldn't set up any new modern comic characters. He's Silver Age Lobo, a testament to how you really shouldn't latch a character onto the culture of the times as a whole, unless you can use it as a constant plot point, ala Cap America's background.

Sorry Jim, I just can't agree with you. I knnow its early, but I've pretty much made this movie my worst of 2014 (with really only two [well three counting the atlas shrugged movie but I know that's going to be awful and at least those people believe in their movie with genuine sincerity] films for the foreseeable future looking ready to take that (those being transformers and TMNT). That end clip pretty much epitomizes how forced garfield comes off in this movie trying to be funny when he's not just being a douchebag instead

I love this movie, to be honest. In my opinion, Rise of Electro's one of the best superhero movies I've ever seen. I'll even go as far to say that it's a perfect counterpart of The Dark Knight Rises and Man of Steel, doing everything those movies were trying to do MUCH better.

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