Ninja Turtles: The Next (And No Longer The Worst) Mutation

Ninja Turtles: The Next (And No Longer The Worst) Mutation

Good news for Michael Bay: The geek-o-sphere finally has a nostalgia reboot it hates more than his Transformers movies!

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The next mutation came out in '97? Really? That long ago? I watched that when it came out... I feel really old now. dang it.

Yeah, it wasn't great and the whole "we're not blood relatives" thing was creepy and awkward as hell, but I watched it. If only because I was so used to having SOMETHING Ninja Turtles in my life.

I grew up watching the live-action films and cartoon, so I remember wanting to get into this when it came out, but for whatever reason I couldn't stick with it. I remember being really bummed that Shredder gets his ass kicked permanently in the very first episode - how could they just shelve him like that? - but, despite recalling pretty clearly how stilted and "mystic" Venus came off for some reason I never actually hated her. I don't completely remember if I saw the TMNT + PR crossover (I know it was during the "Rangers in Space" arc) but I know I was really, really happy to find out that was a thing.

Also, other baddies included Asian martial arts vampires, 2 of them played by children dubbed over with demonic voices, and the "Kraven knockoff" is played by 80's voiceover mainstay Scott "Wolverine + Ocean Dub Piccolo" McNeil.

I remember watching about two episodes of this show, and not hating it. I don't remember feeling very positive about it though. Plus I was six, so I didn't have much of refined pallet back then anyway. Much like six years olds seeing the new Turtles movie today, I probably liked it because it was Ninja Turtles and I didn't know any better.

I do remember liking Venus as an addition to the team though, but I also liked the Green/White Ranger, the White Beetleborg, and Vegetta so maybe I just liked new characters mixing up the status quo, regardless of quality.

Hmmm, I liked Venus. There. She wasn't JUST another ninja, had her own thing, got into the fights. She could have been better but I didn't hate her.
She brought in a new and interesting dynamic. BEFORE TMNT capitalized on it Next Mutation followed that "okay we aren't teens anymore so now what" and moving out, in part, of their original dynamic. She was both a possible love interest but more an adoptive teen sister. I also never resent a wet blanket, especially as it meant Leonardo was actually allowed to expand.
Plus I liked the vampire arc where she was challenged in various ways, failed, and but back up. That was more dynamic than I was used to in girl characters who were just added.
However I am not a girl or a serious Turtles fan and I understand any combination of that loathe the idea of her.

Yeah, that whole thing was a mess. I hink what they're were trying to do was make Venus the responsible, mature one...but we already had LEO for that. She was really just an addition that couldn't justify her existence and people having to bend over backwards clearly showed that. She really was a mess, though Laird throwing a gynophobic hissy fit over her was just stupid.

I remember nothing about this show except Venus. No episodes, no lines, no villains...I even forgot that the turtles had their masks redesigned. But I remember Venus because I remember thinking, "Cool. A girl Ninja Turtle." Apparently that wasn't enough to make me really enjoy the show though.

People don't like the 'Team Mom' now? I thought it was a positive trait, showing a woman in a leadership role and telling the others to be rational.

There actually was another female character that was going to be Raphael's girlfriend.

Ladies and gentlemen, I present, Mona Lisa.

http://turtlepedia.wikia.com/wiki/Mona_Lisa

Hell, I wish my bad news would result in 95 million dollars and counting income...

RaikuFA:
There actually was another female character that was going to be Raphael's girlfriend.

Ladies and gentlemen, I present, Mona Lisa.

http://turtlepedia.wikia.com/wiki/Mona_Lisa

Yet another female turtle named after an art object instead of an artist. Yeesh.

Optimystic:

RaikuFA:
There actually was another female character that was going to be Raphael's girlfriend.

Ladies and gentlemen, I present, Mona Lisa.

http://turtlepedia.wikia.com/wiki/Mona_Lisa

Yet another female turtle named after an art object instead of an artist. Yeesh.

Yeah but this one only was in 1 episode. Was a physics major and helped Ralph beat the villan of the week. Better than Venus in my eyes.

Burnouts3s3:
People don't like the 'Team Mom' now? I thought it was a positive trait, showing a woman in a leadership role and telling the others to be rational.

It really depends on how the rest of the team balances out. If there were a "team dad" who could share the finger-waving/moralising duties with her, then it could be okay, as long as it's only a facet of her personality and not the sum of it.

But if she's the only responsible character in a team of boisterous "aw, I just wanna have fun!" types, then it just makes her look like a buzzkill, which isn't the most endearing trait for a character in what's supposed to be a fun kids show.

Interesting article... Until the part that looks for sexism in a show for little kids.

The idea of a female turtle is not a bad idea the main issue is that I feel it generally needs to be done in a fresh continuity with a general overhaul of the franchise. Fitting a new character into an established closed story like TMNT rarely works.

On the other hand it just adds to the turtlecest issues

inu-kun:
Interesting article... Until the part that looks for sexism in a show for little kids.

I'll ignore that time that a kid's show directly mentioned sexism (Sorry, about the fanart rather than an image from the show. It's all I could find on short notice):
image

I'll ignore those times sexism was a topic later on as well.

Now, you're welcome to argue that Avatar: The Last Airbender had and still has a following among an older demographic, but it was still classified as a kid's cartoon and put on a network that tries to attract kids. Obviously, this is in the opposite direction of being a sexist show, but it does demonstrate, whether in a positive light or not, sexism does get brought up in kid's shows. When discussing the universe of ATLA the creators have also brought up how sexism has seeped into kid's shows as well. It's not like it doesn't happen.

You can argue whether Bob is grasping at straws with TMNT, but don't try to disregard his argument by acting as if it's not a legitimate thing that happens in kid's shows just because they're for kids, a byproduct of critic over-analysis and nothing more. It does happen. It's kind of insulting to kids honestly to say their entertainment must always be so pandering and so underwhelming it can't even have a semblance of issues of that seriousness or complexity. It's that kind of mindset that leads to so many terrible shows for kids who are craving something more.

jamail77:
snip

inu-kun:
snip

People seem to forget that kid's shows are still made, produced, and written by adults, it's not like kids with no concept of gender roles or stereotypes make these things, sexist stereotypes and tropes are definitely capable of sneaking into kid's shows. Hell, some stereotypes are even more common than in adult entertainment, boiling a character down into simple stereotypes is a common kid's show trope (even if it is a bit lazy), so negative gender stereotypes can sometimes end up being really blatant in an effort to simplify everything for the viewers, the token girl trope is also common in kid's entertainment, so if you've only got one female character and she's a walking negative stereotype, people are going to criticize it.

Of course, Bob may have been reaching a bit with his critiques, I never saw Next Mutation so I wouldn't know, I always thought Venus appeared in the cartoon somewhere. I never realized she was introduced in a live action show, or that the power rangers crossed over with TMNT, but I guess I missed it because I was a teenager at that point and wasn't watching TMNT or power rangers any more.

I've heard of this version of the Turtles, used as a derision of the franchise, as well as the "Coming Out of Their Shells" Live musical shows.

Kmadden2004:

Burnouts3s3:
People don't like the 'Team Mom' now? I thought it was a positive trait, showing a woman in a leadership role and telling the others to be rational.

It really depends on how the rest of the team balances out. If there were a "team dad" who could share the finger-waving/moralising duties with her, then it could be okay, as long as it's only a facet of her personality and not the sum of it.

But if she's the only responsible character in a team of boisterous "aw, I just wanna have fun!" types, then it just makes her look like a buzzkill, which isn't the most endearing trait for a character in what's supposed to be a fun kids show.

That sounds like both Marge and Lisa Simpson.

I only ever watched the 2003 series to any great extent but seriously guys if you want a female Character there were female artists during the Renaissance Artemisia springs to mind

Huh, its funny, this series was actually the first to introduce me to the ninja turtles. As a little kid I remember really liking the show, but even then, I recognized a lot of it as crap. I loved parts of the show, but I could always tell it was made on a zero budget and that the lack of Shredder always bothered me.

Its funny, you'd think Venus would be ripe for a redesign, at least a fanmade one. But I haven't even seen fanart of her.

The real shame is that Bay's TMNT will still be a huge success (purely from a box office standpoint) thus ensuring more of the same crap and my faith in humanity sinking ever farther.

The current intro theme to this is terrible, something about losing the rights. A shame, because that was one of the best things about the show.

Now, compared to this:

For a while I thought this was actually the US opening but it turns out I was wrong. After hearing the original US version...it's pretty naff compared to the UK version.

Burnouts3s3:
People don't like the 'Team Mom' now? I thought it was a positive trait, showing a woman in a leadership role and telling the others to be rational.

more often their just a wet blanket....its like their not allowed to have any personality or fun YES there are places for such a charachter but more often than not its relegated to women

I remember times as a kid not relating to such charachters because.....well it wuld be "me" doing the silly things in my mind

another (worse) variation of that charachter would be the boring sexy charachter....take a look at "Lola bunny" from space jam

what exactly was the point of this charachter? she's not funny, she's not "looney" she just hangs around being sexualised, when she is in risk of getting squished and bugs "rescues" her by getting squished himself....why couldn't she be squished?...its basically the epitome of the problem female charachters have...its not a good thing that she can't "join in" with the others, she's just a thing for Bugs to go goofy over

now compare her with how she is in the new-ish Looney tunes show...she's actually "looney" and funny and has a personality, she's "allowed" to have shit happen to her

Darth_Payn:

That sounds like both Marge and Lisa Simpson.

marge and Lisa have more going on though...Lisa as I remember her isn't perfect and does her own dumb-ish kind of things

and Marge doesn't hate fun! every simpson dance now!

inu-kun:
Interesting article... Until the part that looks for sexism in a show for little kids.

oh trust me...I used to notice thease things all the time...I just could never articulate the "issues" or think about them too much

thats why for a long time I identified more with male charachters than I did female ones....

Burnouts3s3:
People don't like the 'Team Mom' now? I thought it was a positive trait, showing a woman in a leadership role and telling the others to be rational.

The problem is that that description is what most men would call a "nag". Not sayin' it's right, just that it be like it do.

Does anybody know if there's ever been a storyline, in any of the shows or comics, dealing directly with the fact that the turtles have nobody to mate with? I mean, do they get turned on more by regular turtles or maybe by humans? I don't think they can be with either. If they could, what fruits would that yield? There's so much to explore! For example, if one of the turtles (probly Donnie, that weenie) had a personal motive to discover the origins of the Ooze in hopes to replicate the process with female turtles... and all the complications that implies.

It went pretty downhill for the Turtles after the third movie, which I actually liked because of Feudal Japan. My only gripe was the suits, they should have kept with the ones from the first or second movie.

So... a worthless and ineffective villain, a hackneyed plan, a stupid origin explanation for the origin of the Turtles, and April O'Neill not really being a reporter or even remotely the same as in the cartoon and comics, paired with subpar acting and a shitty ninja rap.

You think I'm talking about the Bay movie, don't you? Why does no one accurately remember the original live action movie? Kill the sacred cow and realize that the man who ruined transformers inadvertently saved TMNT.

Actually, the idea of a female Ninja Turtle is kind of silly when you think about it. I mean, how ludicrous is it that there just so happened to be another mutant turtle from the same bowl that they never knew about or heard of? It's a gimmick, plain and simple.

The proper way to go about it would be to introduce a female character in another fashion that isn't tied so closely to the turtles' origins. A great example of this would be Alopex from the IDW comics. She's a fantastic, and doesn't have to be "the female turtle" just because.

 

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