Double Standard

Double Standard

The age ceiling for female actors to be cast as romantic leads is far lower than the one for male actors, and this has a deleterious effect on Vikings.

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"It also adds to what is fast becoming an unfortunate implication,"

"Unfortunate implication" would imply this is mere happenstance, which isn't the case. People aren't accidentally casting younger women, which is them saying they believe only younger women are attractive, people are deliberately casting younger women because they believe (or they believe their audiences believe) that only younger women are attractive. Nor is this "fast becoming" anything, like you say, Moore had this same issue (he found out he was older than the mother of the actress playing the love interest in A View to a Kill, which supposedly was why he quit the Bond franchise).

Also:

"To be fair, for a James Bond movie, this makes a degree of sense - the Bond films are very much male action fantasies, and Bond getting the beautiful girl at the end is an established trope"

You are defending casting young women on the basis that they have to cast beautiful ones. That is, older ones just aren't attractive. Now, I don't mean that as an attack, the idea that (female) beauty requires youth is one we are constantly bludgeoned over the head with, but there definitely is an unfortunate implication to what you said there.

Having said that, I do agree with your general point, there certainly is a rather blatant double standard.

It's always been like that, but the difference is that now we're finally pointing it out.

Aging is a rather deeply rooted double standard in real life too...

Our society puts so much emphasis on beauty being the only thing attractive in a woman.

Wisdom and kindheartedness? Maturity? These things are not seen as romantic. Which is sad.

To be fair, Rollo and Floki don't appear to have aged as much as Ragnar either. I figured that Ragnar's appearance represented his decline in status and fortunes.

Then there is Marvel, casting 47 year old Cate Blanchett together with a 33 year old Chris Hemsworth. Maybe there are more examples for this type of casting, when you look close enough?

Biologically, there are two things you would look for in a woman... Well, one sure thing and another iffy thing. The sure thing would be reproduction. The iffy thing would be sex, as I don't know if sex is a biological imperative.

Teenage years notwithstanding.

Media is all about short hand. The lowest common denominator. This lead actor is the one you want to root for because as you can clearly see, he possesses all of the attributes we take on a primal level to denote leadership: Strong jaw, imposing presence, good skin (so he must be able to feed himself properly). The romantic lead will make a suitable partner due to her youth and beauty, which would make good offspring.

You want it done? Stop going to summer blockbusters. Stop reinforcing the idea that we don't care about story, just give us explosions and/or and suitable leads that our reptilian minds tells us should mate. Until we challenge story tellers and say we aren't going to accept their simple crap any more, they'll serve up even more simple crap and expect us to eat it with a smile on our faces.

Thaluikhain:

Also:

"To be fair, for a James Bond movie, this makes a degree of sense - the Bond films are very much male action fantasies, and Bond getting the beautiful girl at the end is an established trope"

You are defending casting young women on the basis that they have to cast beautiful ones. That is, older ones just aren't attractive. Now, I don't mean that as an attack, the idea that (female) beauty requires youth is one we are constantly bludgeoned over the head with, but there definitely is an unfortunate implication to what you said there.

While this is overwhelmingly the case in Bond movies, I do think it's worth pointing out that one of the "Bond girls" in Spectre was Monica Belluci, who at 51 (At the time) is the oldest woman to be a love interest for Bond. I completely agree with you that typically youth is associated with female beauty (and let's be honest, the aging process isn't kind to any of us) but even in one of the most in your face examples of male power fantasy we've got we got an older, beautiful woman. She does die soon afterwards and is essentially used as a prop but... baby steps?

Robert B. Marks:
Double Standard

The age ceiling for female actors to be cast as romantic leads is far lower than the one for male actors, and this has a deleterious effect on Vikings.

Read Full Article

Yeah lets ignore the fact that avg. life expectancy is this era was below 30 yo and whole show dangles actors that are simply too old to be believable if they actually cut down age of characters to be believable. Lets also ignore the fact that show's theme and setting is just an excuse to reuse same mold = (sex + brutality + plot twist every episode), all 'popular' recent series use.

It's almost as if we're ignoring the need to put in young, attractive body parts of both genders into that gory porn galore pot just to complain that society *slurp*, prefers *slurp* younger female body parts *slurp*. Fascinating. That awful, awful society *slurp*.

fractal_butterfly:
Then there is Marvel, casting 47 year old Cate Blanchett together with a 33 year old Chris Hemsworth. Maybe there are more examples for this type of casting, when you look close enough?

Are they a couple in the movie? As far as I can tell, Blanchett playing the wicked witch type character (aka, the default fantasy role for all women over 40).

Jamcie Kerbizz:

Robert B. Marks:
Double Standard

The age ceiling for female actors to be cast as romantic leads is far lower than the one for male actors, and this has a deleterious effect on Vikings.

Read Full Article

Yeah lets ignore the fact that avg. life expectancy is this era was below 30 yo and whole show dangles actors that are simply too old to be believable if they actually cut down age of characters to be believable. Lets also ignore the fact that show's theme and setting is just an excuse to reuse same mold = (sex + brutality + plot twist every episode), all 'popular' recent series use.

It's almost as if we're ignoring the need to put in young, attractive body parts of both genders into that gory porn galore pot just to complain that society *slurp*, prefers *slurp* younger female body parts *slurp*. Fascinating. That awful, awful society *slurp*.

That's a common misconception. The lower average life expectancy in olden days didn't mean people were dropping dead at the age of 30 (i.e. during a person's healthiest age period), they were dropping dead at childbirth. If a person survived past childhood, then they could often expect to live to 60 or 70, a lot like people today.

But it's only considered a double-standard because so many women find older men attractive. Sean Connery and Harrison Ford were considered extremely sexy into their 60's just to name a couple examples off the top of my head.

I think this has more to do with how many people are wired because it's always been this way, even before visual mediums of TV and Film. Of course there's exceptions to the rule.

JUMBO PALACE:

While this is overwhelmingly the case in Bond movies, I do think it's worth pointing out that one of the "Bond girls" in Spectre was Monica Belluci, who at 51 (At the time) is the oldest woman to be a love interest for Bond. I completely agree with you that typically youth is associated with female beauty (and let's be honest, the aging process isn't kind to any of us) but even in one of the most in your face examples of male power fantasy we've got we got an older, beautiful woman. She does die soon afterwards and is essentially used as a prop but... baby steps?

I remember when her casting was announced and everyone was saying "are they finally breaking the trend of young Bond girls". A lot of reference was made to Moore's age gap. But, like with most things about Spectre it was a disappointment; she gets one scene with Bond, then rolls over and dies so Lea Seydoux can be the Bond girl. One step forward two steps back.

maninahat:

Jamcie Kerbizz:

Robert B. Marks:
Double Standard

The age ceiling for female actors to be cast as romantic leads is far lower than the one for male actors, and this has a deleterious effect on Vikings.

Read Full Article

Yeah lets ignore the fact that avg. life expectancy is this era was below 30 yo and whole show dangles actors that are simply too old to be believable if they actually cut down age of characters to be believable. Lets also ignore the fact that show's theme and setting is just an excuse to reuse same mold = (sex + brutality + plot twist every episode), all 'popular' recent series use.

It's almost as if we're ignoring the need to put in young, attractive body parts of both genders into that gory porn galore pot just to complain that society *slurp*, prefers *slurp* younger female body parts *slurp*. Fascinating. That awful, awful society *slurp*.

That's a common misconception. The lower average life expectancy in olden days didn't mean people were dropping dead at the age of 30 (i.e. during a person's healthiest age period), they were dropping dead at childbirth. If a person survived past childhood, then they could often expect to live to 60 or 70, a lot like people today.

It is actually a common misconception to assume that infant and children mortality rates were in any way included in available data of that age. Truth is nobody cared. Short life expectancy derrived from poor higiene, lack of any form of social or medical support to almost whole population or as with this particular tribe, lifestyle. I'll just laugh for a moment at your 'often expect to live to 60 or 70' nonsensical comment, which translates to below 5% chance. Good joke!
By this standard you are 'often' correct :D

I'll just say goodbye & goodluck
since you're prone to call in favours with moderation as soon as your argument goes south.
pip pip cheerio mates

Jamcie Kerbizz:

maninahat:

Jamcie Kerbizz:

Yeah lets ignore the fact that avg. life expectancy is this era was below 30 yo and whole show dangles actors that are simply too old to be believable if they actually cut down age of characters to be believable. Lets also ignore the fact that show's theme and setting is just an excuse to reuse same mold = (sex + brutality + plot twist every episode), all 'popular' recent series use.

It's almost as if we're ignoring the need to put in young, attractive body parts of both genders into that gory porn galore pot just to complain that society *slurp*, prefers *slurp* younger female body parts *slurp*. Fascinating. That awful, awful society *slurp*.

That's a common misconception. The lower average life expectancy in olden days didn't mean people were dropping dead at the age of 30 (i.e. during a person's healthiest age period), they were dropping dead at childbirth. If a person survived past childhood, then they could often expect to live to 60 or 70, a lot like people today.

It is actually a common misconception to assume that infant and children mortality rates were in any way included in available data of that age. Truth is nobody cared. Short life expectancy derrived from poor higiene, lack of any form of social or medical support to almost whole population or as with this particular tribe, lifestyle. I'll just laugh for a moment at your 'often expect to live to 60 or 70' nonsensical comment, which translates to below 5% chance. Good joke!
By this standard you are 'often' correct :D

I'll just say goodbye & goodluck
since you're prone to call in favours with moderation as soon as your argument goes south.
pip pip cheerio mates

Now that I've gone and looked into it and you seem to be right. Shame you aren't here for me to retract my argument.

You are wrong about me running to the mods though. Maybe onlookers don't like the way you make these things personal?

maninahat:

Jamcie Kerbizz:

maninahat:

That's a common misconception. The lower average life expectancy in olden days didn't mean people were dropping dead at the age of 30 (i.e. during a person's healthiest age period), they were dropping dead at childbirth. If a person survived past childhood, then they could often expect to live to 60 or 70, a lot like people today.

It is actually a common misconception to assume that infant and children mortality rates were in any way included in available data of that age. Truth is nobody cared. Short life expectancy derrived from poor higiene, lack of any form of social or medical support to almost whole population or as with this particular tribe, lifestyle. I'll just laugh for a moment at your 'often expect to live to 60 or 70' nonsensical comment, which translates to below 5% chance. Good joke!
By this standard you are 'often' correct :D

I'll just say goodbye & goodluck
since you're prone to call in favours with moderation as soon as your argument goes south.
pip pip cheerio mates

Now that I've gone and looked into it and you seem to be right. Shame you aren't here for me to retract my argument.

You are wrong about me running to the mods though. Maybe onlookers don't like the way you make these things personal?

Good show mate! Still kicking but with recent stalking and sniping at my every post I doubt it will be for long. If it weren't you then I owe and extend my apologies - although still given 4 strikes were out of engaging You alone either me or you have a die hard 'fan' following.
About being personal I don't make fun of you and who you are. Just what someone say and actions one takes. I must have missed the part when these were classified as 'personal' and not part of rubbing your mistakes in your face as part of banter.

Use to be attacking/questioning people actions/ideas/statements/views part of normal discourse and clashing opinions. Only rule sticking to facts and logic but keep emotions and personal feelings out of it. Now, it seems like a heaven for trolling.
Dump edgy comment or ridicolous opinion but backed with your feel-feels --> watch someone bite the bait and prove it wrong or irrational --> watch another person jump in defense of 'personal opinion' --> shit storm enabled --> moderation smacks whoever was a poor, naive idiot pointing out absurdity of initial bait --> troll laughs.
Best part, pointing out and saying 'wait a minute this is troll bait, don't fall for that', is also ...'offensive' to the poor, poor troll's feelings \O/

I'm not a fan of this at all, but it's not new. I remember being really weirded out by Vertigo, a film in which a 50 year James Stewart's love interest is 25-year old Kim Novak, and nobody even acts like it's weird. I have female friends who are 25. If one of them said they had a new boyfriend and then showed me that it was a 50 year old man, that would be fucking strange. If he was 40 that would still be strange. Hell it would be a bit weird if he was 35, but in movies that stuff happens and people don't even mention it, and it does affect my enjoyment because of it. There are lots of attractive women who are over 30, 40, even 50. Lisa Ann is the most popular porn star in the world and she's 43. I think this idea of "men won't like women who aren't in their early 20s" is a load of shit.

maninahat:

fractal_butterfly:
Then there is Marvel, casting 47 year old Cate Blanchett together with a 33 year old Chris Hemsworth. Maybe there are more examples for this type of casting, when you look close enough?

Are they a couple in the movie? As far as I can tell, Blanchett playing the wicked witch type character (aka, the default fantasy role for all women over 40).

If they need to be a couple: Zoe Saldana is older than Chris Pratt in GotG. Her character is as well.

Nurb:
But it's only considered a double-standard because so many women find older men attractive. Sean Connery and Harrison Ford were considered extremely sexy into their 60's just to name a couple examples off the top of my head.

I think this has more to do with how many people are wired because it's always been this way, even before visual mediums of TV and Film. Of course there's exceptions to the rule.

Keep in mind that doesn't mean older woman cant be sexy, but we tend not to see as many of them in tv and movies so we assume that they aren't. It's the same reason why its annoying to see male characters get a wide array of body types but female ones tend to just get one. Sure you can say its because 'sexy' but it totally ignores the possibility of being into anything else for women.

fractal_butterfly:

maninahat:

fractal_butterfly:
Then there is Marvel, casting 47 year old Cate Blanchett together with a 33 year old Chris Hemsworth. Maybe there are more examples for this type of casting, when you look close enough?

Are they a couple in the movie? As far as I can tell, Blanchett playing the wicked witch type character (aka, the default fantasy role for all women over 40).

If they need to be a couple: Zoe Saldana is older than Chris Pratt in GotG. Her character is as well.

She is one year older than him (39 and 38). That difference is barely noticeable, specially in adults.

If you wanted to make a better example, how about Adams (42) and Cavill (34)?

fractal_butterfly:

maninahat:

fractal_butterfly:
Then there is Marvel, casting 47 year old Cate Blanchett together with a 33 year old Chris Hemsworth. Maybe there are more examples for this type of casting, when you look close enough?

Are they a couple in the movie? As far as I can tell, Blanchett playing the wicked witch type character (aka, the default fantasy role for all women over 40).

If they need to be a couple: Zoe Saldana is older than Chris Pratt in GotG. Her character is as well.

They're only a year apart! It's hardly in the same league as Woody Allen or Sean Connery.

I think the perception is largely rooted in biology. A 70-old-man is, generally speaking, still able to successfully father a healthy child. Certainly not as well as a man in his 20s, but still able to do so. A woman in her 70s is generally not able to father a healthy child. Seeing as standards of beauty are basically just fertility markers that have been warped through the filter of society, E.G. large breasts would mean the ability to produce more milk, wide hips the ability to rear children, big strong physique the ability to protect said children, ect, it makes sense that older men would be overall more regarded as attractive than women in a similar age bracket, simply due to the fact that one is much more likely to be able to create a child. This is compounded by the fact that a failure on a man's part biologically is easily remedied through trial and error, whereas the woman's role requires a lot more resources and time.

I don't know if these are legit, but they look legit

http://yourfertility.org.au/for-men/age
http://yourfertility.org.au/for-women/age/

I think you could have come up with a better movie for an example than a movie about a time period where men got married to females who were underage by our modern standards.

I don't usually break into a comment thread for one of my columns, but in this case, I feel it is necessary - Sir Roger Moore, the man who this installment began its discussion with, passed away today from cancer at the age of 89. He will be missed.

Source: https://twitter.com/sirrogermoore/status/867005447018086400/photo/1

Robert B. Marks:
I don't usually break into a comment thread for one of my columns, but in this case, I feel it is necessary - Sir Roger Moore, the man who this installment began its discussion with, passed away today from cancer at the age of 89. He will be missed.

Source: https://twitter.com/sirrogermoore/status/867005447018086400/photo/1

My condolences to the family. May one of the best (if not the best) James Bond rest in peace.

Nothing new under the sun.

"Men are judged on their accomplishments. Women are judged by how fuckable they are."
- Susan Arendt, former Escapist Magazine Editor in Chief (2011)

This won't change. It's not a result of societal conditioning as some would have you believe.

Thaluikhain:
...the idea that (female) beauty requires youth is one we are constantly bludgeoned over the head with...

It's human nature.

Men seek women who will provide them with plenty of healthy children and women seek men who will provide for said children. Therefore, the accomplished man who is often older and who looks more distinguished, a look Roger Moore had, will be more desirable. Additionally, a younger woman has more opportunities to have children and is therefore more desirable.

 

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