Middle-Earth: Shadow of War Will Sell Loot Boxes as Microtransactions

 Pages PREV 1 2
 

Darth Rosenberg:

erttheking:
And you're acting like only weak willed people have their experience negatively affected. What about strong willed people like me, who will hold out against the temptation but didn't want to be tempted in the first place? Hm? What about people like me, who don't buy microtransactions but, nevertheless, want them to piss off?

Newsflash: not everything's about you. This isn't your medium, industry, or society. So yes indeed, what about you? What makes you so special as one individual consumer with a subjective perspective?

This isn't a choice.

It quite literally - objectively, factually - is, no matter how you perceive it.

It's only a short cut because they made the main road tedious and tiring.

Eh... I'm getting a little tired of stressing the point, but once more with feeling: care to cite how you know they're making a system tedious and tiring in order to pump weak willed people for money?

If you have no proof - and let's face is, no one seems to, or will likely ever know for sure - then surely you need to dial back the certainty and just admit you're just speculating wildly. You are simply assuming malicious intent.

If we're talking about giving consumers choice, where's the choice to buy Shadow of War without microtransactions, because that's the choice I want.

...again, you have exactly that if you choose not to engage with them.

BTW I'm still waiting on people who actually like spending money on games, instead of just being able to easily access the in game content.

Not quite BTW, given you shifted the goalposts; "Is there actually anyone who prefers paying money for content instead of just having getting the content not being a hassle of grinding?" - so you've dropped "hassle of grinding" for just everything being "easily" accessible?

Care to try to impose a definition of what, exactly, equates to easy access in a game? Where and how are you drawing the line?

I mean for the love of God, acting like microtransactions in full price give anyone who isn't the publisher something positive...for God's sake.

You've ignored something I said previously: life isn't simple or binary, it's not just this or that, left or right, up or down. I said it's easy for micros to be both a negative and a positive, especially when value for money comes into it.

I legit have no idea why you're giving them the benefit of the doubt. They have done nothing to earn it.

Perhaps I don't want to take any critical position until we know exactly how the system plays out? Maybe that? It doesn't matter that I already have a low opinion of the company, or that I already loathe this very IP. Punters need to get their hands on it properly, and see how the progression system pans out first.

...of course given the biases of so many people it's a given that some will simply claim it's been intentionally nerfed in order to incentivise micros. And, as I've said a few times now, the grind is subjective as it is, so various people will have very different thresholds, which will then impact where they perceive the micros to come into potential play.

And stop acting like this is pro-consumer. Microtransactions are never, EVER pro-consumer.

Clearly we disagree on that.

You want pro-consumer? You want more choice for the players? Put in cheat codes. When I was a kid, you could get more lives in a game if you punched in a code, more weapons, access levels, all that stuff, and it didn't cost me a dime.

Really? 'Back in my day this was all fields'?

The landscape of the entire medium has changed, so it's not productive to compare what's happening now to ye olde consoles or computers.

And you remember that this is a business, right? They are well within their rights - in every sense of the word - to try to monetise their products. If reviewers take against what WB are implementing, and punters react to that, then the market will dictate what happens and WB will abandon the idea, and likely look at other opportunities.

First of all, you're kidding yourself if you think I'm making this all about me. I've pointed out how pissed people are. Second, what makes the people who think microtransactions improve a game so special? Because the people who hate them actually exist outside of insignificant isolated pockets.

It's a choice in the same way it's a choice to choose whether you want to lose your right eye or a left eye. A bullshit one that doesn't help the person making it

Tell me why I should give them the benefit of the doubt. I don't trust them. They burned my trust s long time ago by being a typical AAA publisher. That's my evidence that they'll try to fuck me. It's what they do. It's more than the nothing suggesting they won't try to fuck me. They're bringing in daily quests to get resources, games with microtransactions that do that have a bad history of being stingy with in game money,because they're pushing microtransactions

Where's the choice to play the game without it? Where's the choice to buy the microtransaction free version? For all your talk about player choice, there seems to little meaningful choices

Legit question. What's the difference? In my mind, there isn't. Lack of grinding is easy access

How about something that doesn't feel like overwatch' loot boxes for a start? Something that gives you a bountiful supply of good stuff, and not just piles of junk with the occasional thing you want, given out in painfully small intervals. Not being too radical am I?

Show me a game where they improved anything. A full price game where my above suggested system wouldn't have worked just as well. Because I struggle to think of any game that's full priced that justified having them without making it hard to get in game content.

Once again, precedent. This is WB and they're adopting quite a few microtransaction staples. Nothing about this looks good.

Pretty sure you're in the minority.

Yeah you're right. There's even more freedom today. They could put in cheats if they wanted. They care more about money though. "It's a business" yeah I know. They only care about their bottom line. Not helping you. So which argument are you going with? "Oh it helps people" or "it's their right to make money (like I care about them fattening up the bottom line, not my job)" it can't be both

erttheking:

Tell me why I should give them the benefit of the doubt. I don't trust them. They burned my trust s long time ago by being a typical AAA publisher. That's my evidence that they'll try to fuck me. It's what they do. It's more than the nothing suggesting they won't try to fuck me. They're bringing in daily quests to get resources, games with microtransactions that do that have a bad history of being stingy with in game money,because they're pushing microtransactions

Where's the choice to play the game without it? Where's the choice to buy the microtransaction free version? For all your talk about player choice, there seems to little meaningful choices

Please, elaborate on how exactly WB burned your trust by being a "typical AAA publisher" because the only bad thing on their track record that comes to mind is bungling Arkham Knight PC and it seems like a pretty big jump in logic to go "this company really fucked up that one PC port, spent months trying to fix it and even offered full refunds, they're just the WORST"

Also, the choice to play the game without MTs is right there. You just... play the game without using the MTs? Unless they intentionally skew the game to push for MTs, which again, we have -evidence suggesting they won't because they haven't with their MTs in the past-, it doesn't make a lick of sense to say "why can't I play an MT-free version" because said version would be completely identical sans the ability to spend $ to speed shit up.

Also, daily quests have been around -long- before F2P mobile shit picked them up, they date all the way back to World of Warcraft, if not earlier, as a means to get you to keep playing the game every day. The intent is to keep player count higher over time by giving everyone incentive to constantly boot the game up, it has nothing to do with "pushing MTs".

Xorph:

erttheking:

Tell me why I should give them the benefit of the doubt. I don't trust them. They burned my trust s long time ago by being a typical AAA publisher. That's my evidence that they'll try to fuck me. It's what they do. It's more than the nothing suggesting they won't try to fuck me. They're bringing in daily quests to get resources, games with microtransactions that do that have a bad history of being stingy with in game money,because they're pushing microtransactions

Where's the choice to play the game without it? Where's the choice to buy the microtransaction free version? For all your talk about player choice, there seems to little meaningful choices

Please, elaborate on how exactly WB burned your trust by being a "typical AAA publisher" because the only bad thing on their track record that comes to mind is bungling Arkham Knight PC and it seems like a pretty big jump in logic to go "this company really fucked up that one PC port, spent months trying to fix it and even offered full refunds, they're just the WORST"

Also, the choice to play the game without MTs is right there. You just... play the game without using the MTs? Unless they intentionally skew the game to push for MTs, which again, we have -evidence suggesting they won't because they haven't with their MTs in the past-, it doesn't make a lick of sense to say "why can't I play an MT-free version" because said version would be completely identical sans the ability to spend $ to speed shit up.

Also, daily quests have been around -long- before F2P mobile shit picked them up, they date all the way back to World of Warcraft, if not earlier, as a means to get you to keep playing the game every day. The intent is to keep player count higher over time by giving everyone incentive to constantly boot the game up, it has nothing to do with "pushing MTs".

Not working on the buggy Arkham Origins because they were too busy working on DLC, sectioning off playable characters via pre orders, easy fatalities, the fact that they should've known Arkham knight was a mess and shouldn't have put it up in the first place, only pulling it when it was clear they weren't going to get away with it, putting it back up when it's STILL a mess, shit like that.

Oh, does that mean there's a version without the bullshit freemium currency that got slapped into the game to justify microtransactions, constantly putting my will to the test and making the game less fun? Oh wait no there isn't. And if you think they'll put them in and not skew it towards them, your expectations are unrealistically optimistic. They haven't done it in the past? In the past they didn't put in dual currency either, a staple of blood sucking F2P games, so pardon me if I don't share your bountiful, misplaced optimism. And even if you're right, the game is asking for sixty bucks and is pimping limited editions, MTs can still fuck off because they're unfettered greed.

And if this was an MMO, that would mean something. It isn't. It's a single player game with microtransactions

erttheking:

Not working on the buggy Arkham Origins because they were too busy working on DLC, sectioning off playable characters via pre orders, easy fatalities, the fact that they should've known Arkham knight was a mess and shouldn't have put it up in the first place, only pulling it when it was clear they weren't going to get away with it, putting it back up when it's STILL a mess, shit like that.

Oh, does that mean there's a version without the bullshit freemium currency that got slapped into the game to justify microtransactions, constantly putting my will to the test and making the game less fun? Oh wait no there isn't. And if you think they'll put them in and not skew it towards them, your expectations are unrealistically optimistic. They haven't done it in the past? In the past they didn't put in dual currency either, a staple of blood sucking F2P games, so pardon me if I don't share your bountiful, misplaced optimism. And even if you're right, the game is asking for sixty bucks and is pimping limited editions, MTs can still fuck off because they're unfettered greed.

And if this was an MMO, that would mean something. It isn't. It's a single player game with microtransactions

Uh, Injustice 2 has dual currencies (If not four, but iirc 3 are non-MT)?

Also, plenty of non-MMO games have dailies. Even single-player shit like Binding of Isaac and Deus Ex.

Also Also, thanks for bringing up Easy Fatalities, because they only help prove my point. The fatality inputs in MKX were no more complicated than any other MK game, the Easys were included as a "if you don't feel like learning the fatality inputs you can buy some of these instead". You can even earn like 10-20 of them for free from the Krypt.

Also also also, if you're going to hate a fighting game based on it having a free-for-preorders character, then enjoy playing Street Fighter V, King of Fighters 14, and literally nothing else, because unfortunate though it may be that's basically standard practice now, but thank god that nearly every recent fighting game (Streets V being the one exception, go figure!) has been solid enough to be worth $60.

Also once again, if the game's systems are in no way skewed to try to get you to buy currency, how is it "making the game less fun"? The game is -exactly the fucking same-, you just have the -option- to spend extra money to get extra edge.

If just the notion that you could maybe decide to drop $5 on a box of epik loot is testing your will -that much-, to the point that the game is actively unfun to play, you may wish to consider that the problem may come from somewhere inward, rather than outward as you seem so convinced.

And finally, to address your claim that MTs are "unfettered greed", you seem to have a total lack of understanding of the economic side of this industry. Is it unfortunate that AAA devs elect to charge for what are essentially cheat codes? Sure. But on the same note, back in the era of cheat codes, you could make an AAA game on less than $500k and still sell it for $60 a pop. Nowadays, -especially- in the case of these big open world sandbox type games, your budget can run a minimum of $100 million, -plus- marketing. Considering that they need to not only make back the money they spent on the game, but -also- make the profit necessary to fund the next game, something had to give at some point.

Consider that AAA releases have been $60 for something like the past 10+ years. If your game sells 3 million copies, that's $180 million, minus distributor cuts (in this case, let's use Steam's 30% cut as an assumed cost), which leaves you with around $126 million, when you need to make -at least- $200 mil to stay afloat. Even if you add in a $30 season pass and assume literally everyone buys it you -still- only have $189 mil. And let's not even forget that $200 mil is the absolute bear minimum. A big AAA dev can afford to have that happen from time to time, but numbers that low would be unsustainable in the long term due to all of the other costs that the company will have. So devs had a choice. Either they raise the price of their games, or they add an alternative method to make extra income, and WB chose the latter. They decided to add microtransactions so that they could make up that needed cash gap, and with luck they won't have compromised the balance of the game to do so, and it's perfectly well-placed optimism to think they won't fuck it up considering that they haven't done so with any of their past games that had MTs so far.

Shitty practices remain shitty and I could take more complainers seriously if games like these stopped being profitable.
"Ooh..aah..so bad!" -Yes, yes it is.

"I would cancel pre-order but..excuse."
"I cancelled pre-order, will buy after launch."
"Won't buy until price has dropped."
"Will only buy used."

...You are still giving them money, you know?

Sigh!

Xorph:

erttheking:

Not working on the buggy Arkham Origins because they were too busy working on DLC, sectioning off playable characters via pre orders, easy fatalities, the fact that they should've known Arkham knight was a mess and shouldn't have put it up in the first place, only pulling it when it was clear they weren't going to get away with it, putting it back up when it's STILL a mess, shit like that.

Oh, does that mean there's a version without the bullshit freemium currency that got slapped into the game to justify microtransactions, constantly putting my will to the test and making the game less fun? Oh wait no there isn't. And if you think they'll put them in and not skew it towards them, your expectations are unrealistically optimistic. They haven't done it in the past? In the past they didn't put in dual currency either, a staple of blood sucking F2P games, so pardon me if I don't share your bountiful, misplaced optimism. And even if you're right, the game is asking for sixty bucks and is pimping limited editions, MTs can still fuck off because they're unfettered greed.

And if this was an MMO, that would mean something. It isn't. It's a single player game with microtransactions

Uh, Injustice 2 has dual currencies (If not four, but iirc 3 are non-MT)?

Also, plenty of non-MMO games have dailies. Even single-player shit like Binding of Isaac and Deus Ex.

Also Also, thanks for bringing up Easy Fatalities, because they only help prove my point. The fatality inputs in MKX were no more complicated than any other MK game, the Easys were included as a "if you don't feel like learning the fatality inputs you can buy some of these instead". You can even earn like 10-20 of them for free from the Krypt.

Also also also, if you're going to hate a fighting game based on it having a free-for-preorders character, then enjoy playing Street Fighter V, King of Fighters 14, and literally nothing else, because unfortunate though it may be that's basically standard practice now, but thank god that nearly every recent fighting game (Streets V being the one exception, go figure!) has been solid enough to be worth $60.

Also once again, if the game's systems are in no way skewed to try to get you to buy currency, how is it "making the game less fun"? The game is -exactly the fucking same-, you just have the -option- to spend extra money to get extra edge.

If just the notion that you could maybe decide to drop $5 on a box of epik loot is testing your will -that much-, to the point that the game is actively unfun to play, you may wish to consider that the problem may come from somewhere inward, rather than outward as you seem so convinced.

And finally, to address your claim that MTs are "unfettered greed", you seem to have a total lack of understanding of the economic side of this industry. Is it unfortunate that AAA devs elect to charge for what are essentially cheat codes? Sure. But on the same note, back in the era of cheat codes, you could make an AAA game on less than $500k and still sell it for $60 a pop. Nowadays, -especially- in the case of these big open world sandbox type games, your budget can run a minimum of $100 million, -plus- marketing. Considering that they need to not only make back the money they spent on the game, but -also- make the profit necessary to fund the next game, something had to give at some point.

Consider that AAA releases have been $60 for something like the past 10+ years. If your game sells 3 million copies, that's $180 million, minus distributor cuts (in this case, let's use Steam's 30% cut as an assumed cost), which leaves you with around $126 million, when you need to make -at least- $200 mil to stay afloat. Even if you add in a $30 season pass and assume literally everyone buys it you -still- only have $189 mil. And let's not even forget that $200 mil is the absolute bear minimum. A big AAA dev can afford to have that happen from time to time, but numbers that low would be unsustainable in the long term due to all of the other costs that the company will have. So devs had a choice. Either they raise the price of their games, or they add an alternative method to make extra income, and WB chose the latter. They decided to add microtransactions so that they could make up that needed cash gap, and with luck they won't have compromised the balance of the game to do so, and it's perfectly well-placed optimism to think they won't fuck it up considering that they haven't done so with any of their past games that had MTs so far.

I didn't not know that. Another reason they can fuck off. I'm sorry but I don't accept "they're not as bad as they could be" to be an excuse for MTs

And how many of them have MTs?

They weren't any harder. Struggling to care. As I've said before, you could be 100% right about the MTs being lenient and I wouldn't give a damn. But

If you're trying to prove a point you're doing a shit job. But thanks for pointing out how utterly infested with cancer fighting games are.

If, if, that's a big fucking if. If WB was shameless enough to put Arkham Knight back up when it was still broken, I'm not feeling that confident. Particularly considering these BS practices have a tendency to be a downward spiral, with publishers getting worse and worse, and as mentioned, they don't have my trust. Oh the choice argument again. If devs care so much about choice, they can out in cheat codes. But no, that sweet sweet green is more important.

Yeah kinda. Maybe you don't care, but a lot of people do. It's an immersion breaking cash grab that makes me feel like a cow the publishers are trying to milk. They can fuck off, and you can kindly stop giving me shit for not wanting publishers to nickel and dime me. I really don't get why me not wanting that offends so many people.

Oh those poor poor AAA publishers. They're so poor, making millions and millions of dollars, they need more to afford a third yacht. And now a random person who probably has zero extra erience in economics is going to lecture me about economics. Thanks but no thanks. I notice plenty of AAA games that manage to make money without MTs, and I doubt it's because their devs found the Infinity Gauntlet. Publishers don't need MTs. They want them. As for me? I really don't fucking care. It's not my job to care about their bottom line, and it's not your job either. If they're so bloated they need this cash to stay afloat (citation fucking needed) then maybe they should learn how to spend money like reasonable adults. Oh, and I can't help but notice Shadow of Mordor had no MTs and aparently made enough money. Explain that. Next I suppose you'll be defending everything Activison did with Modern Warfare 4 Remastered.

Vendor-Lazarus:
Shitty practices remain shitty and I could take more complainers seriously if games like these stopped being profitable.
"Ooh..aah..so bad!" -Yes, yes it is.

"I would cancel pre-order but..excuse."
"I cancelled pre-order, will buy after launch."
"Won't buy until price has dropped."
"Will only buy used."

...You are still giving them money, you know?

Sigh!

Yeah, this purchase has been downgraded to after two price drops and a Steam summer sale for me, and it looks like other people here are different into the same. Hate to rain on your "gamers are stupid" parade.

erttheking:

Vendor-Lazarus:
Shitty practices remain shitty and I could take more complainers seriously if games like these stopped being profitable.
"Ooh..aah..so bad!" -Yes, yes it is.

"I would cancel pre-order but..excuse."
"I cancelled pre-order, will buy after launch."
"Won't buy until price has dropped."
"Will only buy used."

...You are still giving them money, you know?

Sigh!

Yeah, this purchase has been downgraded to after two price drops and a Steam summer sale for me, and it looks like other people here are different into the same. Hate to rain on your "gamers are stupid" parade.

I don't see how this is raining on my parade. It's more like adding rain to it..?
Also, I never said that us gamers are stupid. I can see how it implies that, but I think it's more to do with naivete and being weak-willed. Being weak-willed isn't meant to be derogatory either.

Vendor-Lazarus:

erttheking:

Vendor-Lazarus:
Shitty practices remain shitty and I could take more complainers seriously if games like these stopped being profitable.
"Ooh..aah..so bad!" -Yes, yes it is.

"I would cancel pre-order but..excuse."
"I cancelled pre-order, will buy after launch."
"Won't buy until price has dropped."
"Will only buy used."

...You are still giving them money, you know?

Sigh!

Yeah, this purchase has been downgraded to after two price drops and a Steam summer sale for me, and it looks like other people here are different into the same. Hate to rain on your "gamers are stupid" parade.

I don't see how this is raining on my parade. It's more like adding rain to it..?
Also, I never said that us gamers are stupid. I can see how it implies that, but I think it's more to do with naivete and being weak-willed. Being weak-willed isn't meant to be derogatory either.

Publishers have a way of only looking at the big sales right after it comes out. A week after. That's what they boast about. That's what reinforces them. Wait a few years for sales and price drops, and you're not reinforcing their shitty behaviors. That's the important thing, and where it counts.

She sorry about the stupid thing. I've been getting a lot of people jumping on my back in this thread.

erttheking:

Vendor-Lazarus:

erttheking:

Yeah, this purchase has been downgraded to after two price drops and a Steam summer sale for me, and it looks like other people here are different into the same. Hate to rain on your "gamers are stupid" parade.

I don't see how this is raining on my parade. It's more like adding rain to it..?
Also, I never said that us gamers are stupid. I can see how it implies that, but I think it's more to do with naivete and being weak-willed. Being weak-willed isn't meant to be derogatory either.

Publishers have a way of only looking at the big sales right after it comes out. A week after. That's what they boast about. That's what reinforces them. Wait a few years for sales and price drops, and you're not reinforcing their shitty behaviors. That's the important thing, and where it counts.

She sorry about the stupid thing. I've been getting a lot of people jumping on my back in this thread.

Ah, I see what you meant now. Though you are still giving them money, but if you really want that game I suppose that's the best (legal) solution.

No problem. Heat of the moment and swift retraction. No worries.

Xorph:

erttheking:

Tell me why I should give them the benefit of the doubt. I don't trust them. They burned my trust s long time ago by being a typical AAA publisher. That's my evidence that they'll try to fuck me. It's what they do. It's more than the nothing suggesting they won't try to fuck me. They're bringing in daily quests to get resources, games with microtransactions that do that have a bad history of being stingy with in game money,because they're pushing microtransactions

Where's the choice to play the game without it? Where's the choice to buy the microtransaction free version? For all your talk about player choice, there seems to little meaningful choices

Please, elaborate on how exactly WB burned your trust by being a "typical AAA publisher" because the only bad thing on their track record that comes to mind is bungling Arkham Knight PC and it seems like a pretty big jump in logic to go "this company really fucked up that one PC port, spent months trying to fix it and even offered full refunds, they're just the WORST"

Also, the choice to play the game without MTs is right there. You just... play the game without using the MTs? Unless they intentionally skew the game to push for MTs, which again, we have -evidence suggesting they won't because they haven't with their MTs in the past-, it doesn't make a lick of sense to say "why can't I play an MT-free version" because said version would be completely identical sans the ability to spend $ to speed shit up.

Also, daily quests have been around -long- before F2P mobile shit picked them up, they date all the way back to World of Warcraft, if not earlier, as a means to get you to keep playing the game every day. The intent is to keep player count higher over time by giving everyone incentive to constantly boot the game up, it has nothing to do with "pushing MTs".

Was there not some shit about paid deals with youtubers, where they could only get review copies if they agreed to only be positive about Shadow of Mordor?

Funnily I got Arkham Knight free with a gpu. That was absolutely not the right game to show off my new hardware with...

Fully OT: Consider me soured. I don't like the sound of this at all. Somebody poke me when I can get this game for a fiver, 'cause I ain't rewarding this stuff with anything close to an RRP purchase.

Welcome to the slippery slope. Where where the gambling and "pay to skip" from mobile/phone games have spread to the console/PCs. Could have been avoided if the majority of players boycotted the practice at inception, but its to late now.

erttheking:

I didn't not know that. Another reason they can fuck off. I'm sorry but I don't accept "they're not as bad as they could be" to be an excuse for MTs

And how many of them have MTs?

They weren't any harder. Struggling to care. As I've said before, you could be 100% right about the MTs being lenient and I wouldn't give a damn. But

If you're trying to prove a point you're doing a shit job. But thanks for pointing out how utterly infested with cancer fighting games are.

If, if, that's a big fucking if. If WB was shameless enough to put Arkham Knight back up when it was still broken, I'm not feeling that confident. Particularly considering these BS practices have a tendency to be a downward spiral, with publishers getting worse and worse, and as mentioned, they don't have my trust. Oh the choice argument again. If devs care so much about choice, they can out in cheat codes. But no, that sweet sweet green is more important.

Yeah kinda. Maybe you don't care, but a lot of people do. It's an immersion breaking cash grab that makes me feel like a cow the publishers are trying to milk. They can fuck off, and you can kindly stop giving me shit for not wanting publishers to nickel and dime me. I really don't get why me not wanting that offends so many people.

Oh those poor poor AAA publishers. They're so poor, making millions and millions of dollars, they need more to afford a third yacht. And now a random person who probably has zero extra erience in economics is going to lecture me about economics. Thanks but no thanks. I notice plenty of AAA games that manage to make money without MTs, and I doubt it's because their devs found the Infinity Gauntlet. Publishers don't need MTs. They want them. As for me? I really don't fucking care. It's not my job to care about their bottom line, and it's not your job either. If they're so bloated they need this cash to stay afloat (citation fucking needed) then maybe they should learn how to spend money like reasonable adults. Oh, and I can't help but notice Shadow of Mordor had no MTs and aparently made enough money. Explain that. Next I suppose you'll be defending everything Activison did with Modern Warfare 4 Remastered.

So basically what I read here was that you're going to look at any point against your case and say "well I don't accept that as an argument" or "I don't care lol" and continue to just be filled with utter hate and contempt for WB, yeah?

Also, it's not the notion that you don't want MTs that's offending anyone (if anything I'd even find it a stretch to say anyone is offended, just bringing in opposing viewpoints/arguments), it's the fact that you act like MTs being in a game is like the coming of the Antichrist and completely ignore any of the people trying to get you to calm down and realize it isn't the end of the world.

(Also the point with the fighting game thing was that it's a bit unfair to get mad specifically at WB for that. Rather, you should be mad at the entire fighting game industry)

Xorph:
Snip

I pointed out a large number of problems I had with WB, and you did a very poor job of arguing against them. Easy fatalities was the closest you got, ignoring the fact that I've already pointed out that even if MTs aren't skewed to pressure you into using them, I still hate them. Nor was your argument about their pre-order characters. Everyone else does it with fighting games? They all have my contempt too. I don't accept "well everyone else does it too" as a defense. I'm not grading on a curve.

I treat it as the coming of the anti-christ. Not really.

erttheking:
And fuck off. Fuck off, fuck off, fuck right the hell off. You just got downgraded to me waiting for two price drops and a Steam Summer sale before I buy this.

That's...pretty much on par with everyone else. I'm just kind of pissed because people just couldn't let that statement stand and had to challenge it. Then keep challenging my counter arguments. And kept going from there. Needless to say, I'm in a bit of a bad mood, particularly after I've written reply after reply about people defending this stuff, something I see as a blight on the industry and overall bad for consumers.

Done.

Sexual Harassment Panda:

Was there not some shit about paid deals with youtubers, where they could only get review copies if they agreed to only be positive about Shadow of Mordor?

Indeed there was, TotalBiscuit blew the whistle on that. WB claimed they were shocked the marketing company they contracted to promote the game would do something like that without their knowledge...

erttheking:

and you did a very poor job of arguing against them.

I don't accept "well everyone else does it too" as a defense.

I treat it as the coming of the anti-christ. Not really.

erttheking:
And fuck off. Fuck off, fuck off, fuck right the hell off. You just got downgraded to me waiting for two price drops and a Steam Summer sale before I buy this.

That's...pretty much on par with everyone else. I'm just kind of pissed because people just couldn't let that statement stand and had to challenge it. Then keep challenging my counter arguments. And kept going from there. Needless to say, I'm in a bit of a bad mood, particularly after I've written reply after reply about people defending this stuff, something I see as a blight on the industry and overall bad for consumers.

Just an fyi, I broke up beginning to make it more clear what I'm responding to, not to try to take stuff out of context since I know people pull that shit in forum arguments all the time.

First off, that's your opinion, which it will remain unless we go full stupid and ask the rest of the forum what they think about our scuffle.

Second, thanks for proving my point that you'll selectively ignore counterarguments because you "don't accept" them without any counterargument of your own to back it up.

Third, I'm not disputing that your opinion is matching others, they're -also- acting like this is some massive transgression of gamer rights. It may be unfortunate that MTs exist, but the whole point of my (and possibly Darth's but I don't wanna speak for them) argument has been that them existing is no need to go "SHIT GAME NO BUY UNTIL IT $5".

Four, you're mad that you posted an excessively angry opinion on a forum, and that people then decided to contest your opinion and have a debate, as is wont to happen on internet forums? Why are you on a forum, if not to post your opinions alongside others' and have excessively long arguments about whose are right and whose aren't?

StatusNil:

Sexual Harassment Panda:

Was there not some shit about paid deals with youtubers, where they could only get review copies if they agreed to only be positive about Shadow of Mordor?

Indeed there was, TotalBiscuit blew the whistle on that. WB claimed they were shocked the marketing company they contracted to promote the game would do something like that without their knowledge...

Thanks. I didn't think I had imagined that.

Xorph:

Third, I'm not disputing that your opinion is matching others, they're -also- acting like this is some massive transgression of gamer rights. It may be unfortunate that MTs exist, but the whole point of my (and possibly Darth's but I don't wanna speak for them) argument has been that them existing is no need to go "SHIT GAME NO BUY UNTIL IT $5".

Do you believe it's unreasonable to look at what's proposed and believe it's devalued the game? We're all constantly deciding what any given game is worth to us, irrespective of RRP, are we not? What's the problem with looking at this and deciding to take a pass? Or is it just the tone?

Sexual Harassment Panda:

Do you believe it's unreasonable to look at what's proposed and believe it's devalued the game? We're all constantly deciding what any given game is worth to us, irrespective of RRP, are we not? What's the problem with looking at this and deciding to take a pass? Or is it just the tone?

It's pretty much just the tone, yeah. Also help me out, what's RRP?

erttheking:

Publishers have a way of only looking at the big sales right after it comes out. A week after. That's what they boast about. That's what reinforces them. Wait a few years for sales and price drops, and you're not reinforcing their shitty behaviors. That's the important thing, and where it counts.

If by "where it counts" you mean where it does precisely jack you're right. For every 1 person smart enough and who cares enough to boycott anything there's a thousand more idiots out there that either don't know or don't care that they're being blatantly screwed over that will buy it anyway, and this is in no way limited to video games. It's the latter people that these companies are catering to and seeking to exploit with these awful business practices, it's why these practices came into being, why they still exist, and will continue for likely as long as corporations exist. People who are intelligent and care are always massively outnumbered by those who don't.

Xorph:

Sexual Harassment Panda:

Do you believe it's unreasonable to look at what's proposed and believe it's devalued the game? We're all constantly deciding what any given game is worth to us, irrespective of RRP, are we not? What's the problem with looking at this and deciding to take a pass? Or is it just the tone?

It's pretty much just the tone, yeah. Also help me out, what's RRP?

Recommended Retail Price.

 Pages PREV 1 2

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Register for a free account here