U.K. Religious Leaders Hate On Modern Warfare 2

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U.K. Religious Leaders Hate On Modern Warfare 2

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U.K. leaders from Islam, Christianity and Judaism all claim that the violence in Modern Warfare 2 went too far.

Several religious leaders discussed the implications of the violence in Modern Warfare 2 on a panel on BBC One's talk show, "The Big Questions." The panel consisted of Alex Goldberg, CEO of the London Jewish Forum, Fazan Mohammed of the British Muslim Forum, and the Rt. Reverend Stephen Lowe, former Bishop of Hulme. The three leaders took umbrage [SLIGHT SPOILER ALERT!] with the now notorious airport scene, pitting the player as an undercover CIA posing as a terrorist. [END SLIGHT SPOILER ALERT!]

"When I was young, [society was] worried about horror comics - because they were going to pollute the minds of young people and make them violent," said Reverend Stephen Lowe, an admitted World of Warcraft fan. "This [game] is very different from that; this is [ANOTHER SLIGHT SPOILER ALERT!]taking on the role of a terrorist in a way that relates to the news - what we actually see on our [TV] screens. That is fundamentally different. It somehow says: 'Maybe this is all right.' It isn't."

Fazan Mohammed had this to add:

"You can't equate it with watching TV or a movie or reading a book. This is a much more intimate experience. You're mentally playing out the effects of violence. A lot of people make the excuse that this is sport - that it's just entertainment. But Joseph Goebbels - the propaganda minister of Nazi Germany - said his entertainment did more for the German people, in terms of creating the psyche for war and hostility towards others, than the speeches of Adolf Hitler. The idea this is entertainment is not justification whatsoever."

The biggest head-scratching quote was from Alex Goldberg, from the London Jewish Forum. He said, "In the Holy scriptures, when Cain kills Abel, God asks him one question: Are you your brother's keeper? The rest of the bible is an answer to that - and it's a big yes. When I play this game I don't get that answer - I get upset."

I'm not sure that the bible I read specfically stated that I was my brother's keeper, but I won't get too much into religious debates here.

Finally, the spokesperson for the gaming community on this panel actually had a decent rebuttal, contrary to the Fox news segment from last week. Future Publishing's James Binns said, "You need to see it in the same way you'd see a movie, TV show or book. There are movies, books and TV shows for kids, and there are those for adults. This is an adult piece of entertainment. We can make all entertainment for children, or we can take proper steps to try and protect children from adult entertainment."

To me, that is the argument that is never sufficiently discussed here in the U.S. It is culturally ok that there are pieces of art, theater and cinema that are made specifically for adults and pieces of the same media that are made for children. Videogames are just a different form of entertainment media and must be treated the same way.

Source: MCV

Permalink

Greg Tito:
Religious Leaders [...]

/care.

Shocking news, Modern Warfare 2 creates controversy.

Move along people, nothing to see here.

Caliostro:

Greg Tito:
Religious Leaders [...]

/care.

I hate the term but /thread

A certain religious leader also believed that condoms were evil. This is just going on the list of why I shouldn't listen to them

Greg Tito:
pitting the player as an undercover CIA posing as a terrorist.

For fuck sake, would you PLEASE MENTION there are STORY SPOILERS involved?!?!?! Other articles on this site, that reveal nothing about the game, were at least so kind. It's the ones that DON'T have it that seem to have something relevant. And honestly, I don't care how soon into the game it is, or how insignificant, for those of us that want it to be FRESH, it's a pretty big disappointment with the writing staff.

I'd just like to put it out there that the phrase "hate on" should be obliterated from common usage, along with the people who use it.

I couldn't agree more with your closing statement - this is not a child's game, and people who consider this to be the case are still under the impression that games have been for kids since the 80's. I'm not sure if anyone has told them that many games have been made with adults in mind for the last 20 years.

Still, I suppose it was only a matter of time before this went religious. I can only hope this doesn't get as extreme as things like this tend to do.

They gave the option to skip it, they were warned that there was something that most people wouldn't want to experience.

Video Game hate is getting pretty old, when will society move along to the next thing. The Beatles and Elvis all had the same treatment, video games are having theirs.

I can see why they are mad and they asked Jews,Christians and shockingly they admit muslin actually have a voice in the community instead of ignoring them like they usually do.

But i don't think they want to ban this game they just want to talk about it and to make sure it doesn't get into the hands of young children.

Haha. Okay just for future posters just remember this. MW2 was supposed to go that far as a selling point. IW nor MW2 needs any defending about the violent or controversial content.

Religious leaders announce their discomfort.

God goes "meh" and the world marches on.

Who gives a shit - we've got people in parliament sticking up for it which is where it matters. If religious idiots can't actually read all the studies which say there is no link then that's there problem.

I think the facts that:

- it's an 18
- it was done for story effect
- you're asked whether you even want to play it
- you're given 2 warnings about it before hand

more than justify its inclusion. Its not gratuitous, it's there for a purpose.

I worry about these people that have the inability to distinguish games from fiction, because us gamers can. Ironic they criticise us for being too stupid to handle it, yet we're fine and they hide behind the bloody Bible (of all things! and biased studies.

*sigh*

Religious leaders angered, has about the same impact these days as an elderly man whos angry at the president

Did watch it (my Games Designer Lecturer, Dr Bobbie Fletcher was on there) and tbh it just seemed like a bunch of whiners moaning about a bit of violence. Nothing was really discussed.

Also what shocked me is that Agony Aunt allowed her 15 year old son to watch an 18 certificate game........yeah.

UK religious leaders make me laugh

especially the ones at the local church

"god made the animals appear! science says animals appeared! what's more believable hmm?"

/care for them :P

uppitycracker:

For fuck sake, would you PLEASE MENTION there are STORY SPOILERS involved?!?!?!

Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father, Bruce Willis is dead in the Sixth Sense, Neo IS the one, the cake is a lie, AND JESUS DIES!

...Seriously, the terrorist thing has been spoiled to hell and back and isn't it the VERY FIRST FUCKING MISSION IN THE GAME? What kind of spoiler is that? It's not like they're burbling the end of the game... It's the first mission... "SPOILER: YOU SHOOT PEOPLE!". Come on...

I like you Greg. You don't make stereotypical English jokes, and anyone named Greg is alright in my books.

Too bad I stopped caring what religious leaders had to say around the time of the contraceptive issue.

Caliostro:

uppitycracker:

For fuck sake, would you PLEASE MENTION there are STORY SPOILERS involved?!?!?!

Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father, Bruce Willis is dead in the Sixth Sense, Neo IS the one, the cake is a lie, AND JESUS DIES!

...Seriously, the terrorist thing has been spoiled to hell and back and isn't it the VERY FIRST FUCKING MISSION IN THE GAME? What kind of spoiler is that? It's not like they're burbling the end of the game... It's the first mission... "SPOILER: YOU SHOOT PEOPLE!". Come on...

Troll elsewhere with yer irrelevant examples and lack of attention to the rest of my post.

The sky is blue and water is wet.

Ranooth:
Also what shocked me is that Agony Aunt allowed her 15 year old son to watch an 18 certificate game........yeah.

I was about to mention this!
I was frustrated watching this as it's always the same discussion, just a different game. There's an 18 certificate on it for a reason, I think people forget it's there.

People are allowed to be offended by things. Further more, the fact that they are should not wreck your enjoyment of what is essentially, an amazing game. That is the basis of the democratic system. Get over it.

Atleast they agree on something, thats a plus isn't it?

I'm watching now on iPlayer its horribly depressing.

uppitycracker:

Troll elsewhere with yer irrelevant examples and lack of attention to the rest of my post.

There is no new information spoiled here, and you make no further arguments than "Oh noesh, you spoiled information regarding the first mission!".

i wont start with what i think about religion. or organised religion i should say but these... no wait, all religion. every aspect. but so what? three blokes with beards and a hatred for people who don't belive what they do (facists? racists? ****s?) don't like my game?

and?

no one will care. everyone who wants it has it, everyone who doesn't doesnt... the rest is just white noise.

Caliostro:

Greg Tito:
Religious Leaders [...]

/care.

Seconded.

Aardvark:
I'd just like to put it out there that the phrase "hate on" should be obliterated from common usage, along with the people who use it.

Also seconded. But let us also remember that all references to it should also be purged from public memory, if at all possible.

Religious leaders? We stopped listening to them when the Middle Ages ended.

The final paragraph of this article sums it up well, this is a game for adults and not for children. Adults (mostly) have the sufficent maturity to see the point to the airport level, it's for story effect. The critisism of that this game faces comes from the misguided notion that video games are for children.

I also don't buy the point made by Reverend Stephen Lowe. Yes, games are interactive but he has not proven that interactive entertainment is any more likely than spectator style entertainment to turn someone violent.

If that scene didn't make you feel uncomfortable, there's already something wrong with you.
Like that scene near the end of Bioshock pertaining a certain bludgeoning, you're not meant to enjoy it, you're meant to realise the horror of it and have it draw you into the story.

It makes me angry that none of these religious leaders ever studied up to at LEAST GCSE level english/film studies/creative arts, and learned to read between lines, and yet are looked upon for interpretation of their respective texts?

F, what the?

Someone needs

Greg Tito:

Fazan Mohammed had this to add:

"You can't equate it with watching TV or a movie or reading a book. This is a much more intimate experience. You're mentally playing out the effects of violence. A lot of people make the excuse that this is sport - that it's just entertainment. But Joseph Goebbels - the propaganda minister of Nazi Germany - said his entertainment did more for the German people, in terms of creating the psyche for war and hostility towards others, than the speeches of Adolf Hitler. The idea this is entertainment is not justification whatsoever."

Someone needs to introduce Fazan Mohammed to Godwin's Law. Because he just proved it (i.e. he lost).

And I must say, this is starting to sound like an old joke:

"A Priest, an Imam and a Rabbi walk into a bar... "

I mean, surely Activision/IW should get some sort of award, I mean they managed to get the (representatives of) Jews, Christians and Muslims to all agree to hate one thing... I mean they usually can't agree on ANYTHING!

Alex Goldberg:
In the Holy scriptures, when Cain kills Abel, God asks him one question: Are you your brother's keeper? The rest of the bible is an answer to that - and it's a big yes. When I play this game I don't get that answer - I get upset.

God didn't ask that.
He asked 'where is your brother?', to which Cain replied 'Am I my brother's keeper?'.
Pro theological fact: God didn't reply: 'Yes. Yes you are.'

But that's besides the point.

More on topic: People seem to keep equating video games with children, and until that stops then we won't make any head-way with this ridiculous debate. There are games, movies, books, and TV shows for kids, just as there are all of those things for adults. MW2 is an adult game. I wouldn't let my 12 year old son play it! that is, if I had a 12 year old son.

Anyways, point is: Games =/= for kids. This is why we need the ESRB.

The Rockerfly:

Caliostro:

Greg Tito:
Religious Leaders [...]

/care.

I hate the term but /thread

A certain religious leader also believed that condoms were evil. This is just going on the list of why I shouldn't listen to them

And another one convinced *insert name here* troops in the middle east the the holy cross would supply them with food and water and that they would never feel weak near it.
Everyone who was on the side of the cross died during that battle

OP, why are people playing this game is they are offended.
Speaking of offended there is a good site for you about that on a Wiki...
Wait, i am never going to mention that.
And now to make you lose 6 hours of your life

Religious leaders are offended... this is news because...?

1. the point of the airport scene is for you to realize the cruelty and harshness of the situation.
2. religious leaders, especially western ones, are idiots.
3. *cough* crusades, teutonic murder of thousands of pagan families, witch burning *cough*

I do believe this is just making it worse...

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