Pachter: DLC Codes Not Hurting Pre-Owned Sales

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Pachter: DLC Codes Not Hurting Pre-Owned Sales

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Despite being designed specifically to make buying new games more appealing, analyst Michael Pachter says that Project Ten Dollar and its ilk are yet to make a dent in pre-owned sales.

Michael Pachter says that retailers haven't experienced any decline in their pre-owned sales since the launch of schemes like EA's Project Ten Dollar or the online pass for EA Sports titles. Speaking in a post-financials report of GameStop, Pachter said that the retailer estimated that only a quarter of gamers who bought used games played them online, so having to shell out for things like the online pass wasn't much of a disincentive.

But while the DLC bonuses might not have hurt retailers, Pachter doesn't think it will especially help them either. Again speaking about GameStop, he believes that the company's attempts to sell DLC via in-store kiosks would not be a major boost to sales, despite having exclusive content like Spartan armor for Halo: Reach. Instead, he thought it would, at best, "forestall the inevitable cannibalization of physical disc sales and allow GameStop to capture a small percentage of this cannibalization, with relatively insignificant margin contribution."

There's always going to be a place for physical game sales, just as some people will prefer physical books over e-books, but as Pachter suggests, the balance will eventually shift over to digital distribution as people become more used to the idea. Exactly when that will happen, however, is very hard to say.

Source: MCV

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I thought the main point of Project Ten Dollar was to get back some of the money lost on pre-owned sales.

People will always buy pre-owned... the best you can hope for is to make some of that loss back... not entice people to change their ways.

In fact I'm going to go right ahead and say once again 'Patchers words are't newsworthy'.

Why are we even still listening to this guy...

I really don't think I'll ever prefer having a digital copy of my game over a physical copy but who's to say?

Also I'm sure it wont effect them that much, people who buy used will buy used simply because maybe they can't afford it new. That sure wont change even with the extra bonus's.

The question is has there been an increase of the actual sales of the DLC. To me it seems that "project $10" is half encouraging new sales and half recouping the loss of used sales. So if they aren't seeing much of an increase in new sales while no decrease in used sales that is only half the equation. How many sales are they seeing for "Stone Prisoner" or "Cerberus Network"?

Guess he had to make up some shit. It has been a few days since he opened his trap to let the stupidity out. We don't want to be around if it reaches critical mass.

They're really going to have to gimp out their "on disc" versions of games to make it affect used sales.
What is a good idea are things like bonus dlc for pre-orderers. I pre-ordered 2 games this year for bonus dlc and I never used to pre order games.

Makes sense to me. When I buy an old game, I know I'm getting less value than when I buy its sequel. Many customers of used games don't mind getting older versions of long-running franchises, and therefore won't mind missing some DLC.

squid5580:
The question is has there been an increase of the actual sales of the DLC. To me it seems that "project $10" is half encouraging new sales and half recouping the loss of used sales. So if they aren't seeing much of an increase in new sales while no decrease in used sales that is only half the equation. How many sales are they seeing for "Stone Prisoner" or "Cerberus Network"?

That's something I wonder as well. I didn't think things like Project $10 would have a big impact on used game sales, but I am curious if it's actually doing anything to help the game companies. I would hope that it is working in it's current form as I'm sure we all can agree that if it's not we're much more likely to just see even deeper cuts to initial on disc content than we are to see companies toss the idea altogether.

I thought project $10 would make people keep their games for longer so they get free DLC. Like with Mass Effect 2,BFBC2 and all the EA sports game.

It would help if the DLC one gets wasn't laughably minuscule. I pre-ordered Mass Effect 2 because I enjoyed the hell out of the first one, but the DLC that came free was a joke. Had I been a lesser fan I can most assuredly say that I would have bought it used.

This has taught me that there's nothing to fear I'm missing out on as far as content goes. If the rest of the $10 "projects" are just as vanilla, I will remain indifferent to the whole thing entirely.

ForgottenPr0digy:
I thought project $10 would make people keep their games for longer so they get free DLC. Like with Mass Effect 2,BFBC2 and all the EA sports game.

Nope, they pretty much released all the free content we were gonna get in the first few months of ME2. The reason they were trying it out was a way to recoup money from the used game market, where they saw zero percent of the money, without jacking the price of new games up to compensate, which would only fuel used game sales.

As for the EA sports games, I believe the "10$" thing applies in only allowing them to play online, and thats it.

Icehearted:
It would help if the DLC one gets wasn't laughably minuscule. I pre-ordered Mass Effect 2 because I enjoyed the hell out of the first one, but the DLC that came free was a joke. Had I been a lesser fan I can most assuredly say that I would have bought it used.

This has taught me that there's nothing to fear I'm missing out on as far as content goes. If the rest of the $10 "projects" are just as vanilla, I will remain indifferent to the whole thing entirely.

I agree, I didn't pre-order, but I bought it soon as it came out, new. Nothing from the "free" dlc was worth the supposed 10$. The one character they introduced is perhaps the most hated ally of any game I've ever played, and if I could of excluded it from that 10, I would of without a thought. The weapon they gave us was rather unimpressive, and the Firewalker was only free because it would be a necessary part of a later PAID DLC.

ForgottenPr0digy:
I thought project $10 would make people keep their games for longer so they get free DLC. Like with Mass Effect 2,BFBC2 and all the EA sports game.

Maybe if they did what Alan Wake did and give you a code that when you enter it tells you that you will get your DLC in a month (if you bought it on day 1). But when you get the free DLC on launch day then there is no incentive. Especially if it is only an hour or so long. Although I do think they are trying to use achievements/trophies to keep them off the used game shelves. It is the only explanation for some of them.

Icehearted:
It would help if the DLC one gets wasn't laughably minuscule. I pre-ordered Mass Effect 2 because I enjoyed the hell out of the first one, but the DLC that came free was a joke. Had I been a lesser fan I can most assuredly say that I would have bought it used.

This has taught me that there's nothing to fear I'm missing out on as far as content goes. If the rest of the $10 "projects" are just as vanilla, I will remain indifferent to the whole thing entirely.

What??? Do you realize what they gave you? They gave you the Cerberus Network code which in itself is a store front. Then they gave us Zaaed, some weapons and armor, and 6 Hammerhead missions.

Although project ten dollar was designed to encourage people to buy new, they have failed to communicate the benefits of it to Joe Bloggs. We, as gamers, only know about it because of the endless news stories about it. Whereas, looking at the BFBC2 box, EA have only put a single meaningless sentence on the back, which I'd imagine most people wouldn't notice.

If they want it to be successful they need to raise awareness of it's benefits.

I was about to buy Dragon Age the other day, when I flipped over the box and noticed that the DLC code expired on the 18th of April, 2010. I was so annoyed at the thought of being denied content I was paying full price for that I refused to buy it after that.

The irony is that a pre-owned copy would now have the same amount of content, and be cheaper. So I'm not surprised - but then Patcher is Mr Stating the Bleeding Obvious of the gaming industry.

Ok bare with me. Here's a thought. Where are all the used Blu-Rays on the Highsteet? Where are all the used DVDs? Why is it that GAME has as much floorspace devoted to used as new yet HMV and the like have none for DVDs/ Blu-Ray? The reason is this;

New retail games at £40-50 a pop are too dammed expensive!

THIS is what supports the massive used game market. Do what every other industry in history has done. Lower your prices. Because the market is setting it's own lower price in the form of pervasive and growing used games sales. Tesco is starting a used game section for christs sake! Want more legit sales? Stop charging more for the shorter and shorted games. A 4 hour game with a luke-warm multiplayer is not worth £45. It never will be, people will buy it used for £20 or rent the thing.

To be honest none of this DLC is "Must have". Project $10 is a failier becuase 1) many pre-owned titles are more than $10 less expensive and 2) many people will buy the game not knowing about it and just get scewed on the back end. In terms of a solution it is, yet again, placing pay-walls in the face of cunsumers who are making it known will million of pre-owned games sales that games are just too dammed expensive for most people at full reatail price.

DLC hurting Developpers Integrity, and feeding Gamers Wrath...

Scrumpmonkey:
Ok bare with me. Here's a thought. Where are all the used Blu-Rays on the Highsteet? Where are all the used DVDs? Why is it that GAME has as much floorspace devoted to used as new yet HMV and the like have none for DVDs/ Blu-Ray? The reason is this;

New retail games at £40-50 a pop are too dammed expensive!

THIS is what supports the massive used game market. Do what every other industry in history has done and lower yout prices because the market is setting it's own, lower price in the form of pervasive and growing used games sales. Tesco is starting a used game section for christs sake! Want more legit sales? Stop charging more for the shorter and shorted games. a 4 hour game with a luke-warm multiplayer is not worth £45. It never will be, people will buy it used for £20 or rent the thing.

To be honest none of this DLC is "Must have". Project $10 is a failier becuase 1) many pre-owned titles are more than $10 less expensive and 2) many people will buy the game not knowing about it and just get scewed on the back end. In terms of a solution it is, yet again, placing pay-walls in the face of cunsumers who are making it known will million of pre-owned games sales that games are just too dammed expensive for most people at full reatail price.

i can just agree and support your comment buddy!

Scrumpmonkey:
Snip

This man speaks the truth. £50 for a game is absolutely ridiculous.

This smacks of "You the consumers are wrong, and we have to educate you on how you are wrong.

What exactly is with this being such a dire thing over the last couple years for developers? If im not mistaken every year the industry grows and sees more money than the last. So why was this a non issue for the previous... six console generations, but now they are becoming outspoken and dare I say indignant about it.

Perhaps it is just me.. But I wonder if the catalyst for this is MMOs. Developers saw that MMOs had a model where there was basically no such thing as a used resell market and thought... Uhhh.. Why arent we getting that? without ever taking a moment to consider why there is a difference, or consider having to offer the same levels of content as MMOs.

EA's Project 10 Dollar hasn't really given anything worth 10$.

"Buy this game new, get a special code that adds a character that has no effect on the actual game, as well as one that gives you this neat hat!"

Put something worthwhile in the new games, and maybe it would have an effect.

Yawn.

Pachter again?.

I actually have to disagree with the "New games are too expensive" argument. That's not to say that I think their pricing isn't excessive but that the industry wouldn't stand to gain anything by lowing prices.

Put simply: If you can get pre-owned games for less than their shelf price, why wouldn't you?

The whole point of the pre-owned games market is that, minus the cost of re-acquiring the title, it's pure profit for the retailer. If the shelf price of games drops, we won't see a fall in either returned games or their prices when pre-owned. People buy pre-owned games not because the RRP of the product is too expensive, but because the pre-owned title is cheaper - you won't alter this dynamic by reducing the price games retail for. The best you could hope is to see an increase in overall sales but even then you're doing so at a reduced price point that means you need more sales to turn a profit.

Say the cost of a new game falls to £39.99, are you really going to choose that over the pre-owned copy that saves you even more money?

Orcus_35:
DLC hurting Developpers Integrity, and feeding Gamers Wrath...

Again this, DLC is a headache for many gamers since it's been implemented is ways that seem designed to deliberately squeeze the consumer for most money for the least effort. On disk DLC is the worst offender. All this does is makes gamers fell ripped off because they were locked out of data they already physically owned. All they have done is made you pay more to take back a peice of the game that you feel was stolen from you in a bait and switch. "Want the full content Hmmm? Hmmm? The full purchased experience?" the game sneers at you Do ya? Hmmmm? Do ya?.... Well fuck you! We've locked you out. Now where is our £5 for 10k of data?"

Cut content DLC is another unforgiveable sin .The former employees of the tombraider wanking department admitted in interveiws that content was deliberately cut from their game in order to make it into DLC. I suspect this happens more often than we would dream as post launch DLC is brought into the developemnt time to squeeze your nuts some more and pick you up and shake you for lose change.

Also when the fuck did 5 maps become worth £12?

I have bought cheaper full games than that, full AAA games. Post launch maps used to be a nice little extra developers would throw in. It's called aftermarket community support and some people *Cough valve cough* still remember it.

It's a whole culture of contempt for the player. "Player as cash cow" is the new model. And im sick of being told to moo.

Orcus_35:

i can just agree and support your comment buddy!

erm... thanks i guess. im in a ranty mood as you can see above. : )

Logan Westbrook:

Despite being designed specifically to make buying games news more appealing,

Shouldn't that be new?

squid5580:

Icehearted:
It would help if the DLC one gets wasn't laughably minuscule. I pre-ordered Mass Effect 2 because I enjoyed the hell out of the first one, but the DLC that came free was a joke. Had I been a lesser fan I can most assuredly say that I would have bought it used.

This has taught me that there's nothing to fear I'm missing out on as far as content goes. If the rest of the $10 "projects" are just as vanilla, I will remain indifferent to the whole thing entirely.

What??? Do you realize what they gave you? They gave you the Cerberus Network code which in itself is a store front. Then they gave us Zaaed, some weapons and armor, and 6 Hammerhead missions.

Holy smokes! You're so right! A storefront! One whole mission with a fairly needless mostly muted character! And those über awesome vehicle missions that felt like a tacked on trial pack more than a part of the game! How could I be so shortsighted! That was definitely $10 worth of content.

I assume you're being sarcastic :p

Im confused, Pachter saying something not stupid? that doesnt seem like it should happen

So basically the game community as a whole is working towards no physical copies ever? ... So what are we actually buying? ... Guess my days in gaming are numbered

Ah screw this entire business.

I don't care about these incentives, I bet I will barely miss them if I don't keep up with the news regarding gaming.

I was more than happy that I purchases Transformers, half of the retail price, new & sealed. C2C websites rule son.

Worgen:
Im confused, Pachter saying something not stupid? that doesnt seem like it should happen

Don't worry, he'll be hailing the death of tradtional gaming to social gaming, mocking people who don't moneterise everything and throwing his own feces at passers by in no time. He just says so much some of it has to be not crap. It's like firing a blunderbuss of of just conjecture. Some of it has to hit something

So there's no dent in used sales, but how many of those $10 DLCs have actually sold? That would be a much more interesting statistic.
Also, could you guys please stop reporting whatever Pachter says? I mean you could pay anybody to state the obvious, and it wouldn't be quite as annoying.

You know, even if they got rid of Game Stop selling games, there are too many markets to resell games now. You can resell your stuff at Amazon.com, Ebay, Craigslist, egghead... how are they going to stop all that? Being able to play a game online is not an answer. I don't play online or multiplayer. I know I am not a typical gamer in that, but I also hardly think I am the only one. If the company cuts content from the game in order to make DLC, that's going to make me even *less* inclined to play that game in the first place. And I hate, and I mean absolutely HATE paying $50 or $60 for a game thats 10 hours long or less. At least if and when I buy a Turn Based Strategy game for $50, like Civilization, I know the game will give me phenomenal replay value for my money.

I'm not someone who torrents games or steals them. I have no problem paying for a game that gives good value for my money and isn't going to, pardon my expression, dick me around because the publisher and developer feel they haven't sucked enough cream from the cash cow. At best, it will make me want to avoid their games. And how does that help the publishers? I feel that they are painting targets on their own feet with all this scheisse.

Dosnt surprise me. I kno some people who got ME2 preowned, and dont care on the stuff extra added. They just want the core game

Scrumpmonkey:
Ok bare with me. Here's a thought. Where are all the used Blu-Rays on the Highsteet? Where are all the used DVDs? Why is it that GAME has as much floorspace devoted to used as new yet HMV and the like have none for DVDs/ Blu-Ray? The reason is this;

New retail games at £40-50 a pop are too dammed expensive!

THIS is what supports the massive used game market. Do what every other industry in history has done. Lower your prices. Because the market is setting it's own lower price in the form of pervasive and growing used games sales. Tesco is starting a used game section for christs sake! Want more legit sales? Stop charging more for the shorter and shorted games. A 4 hour game with a luke-warm multiplayer is not worth £45. It never will be, people will buy it used for £20 or rent the thing.

To be honest none of this DLC is "Must have". Project $10 is a failier becuase 1) many pre-owned titles are more than $10 less expensive and 2) many people will buy the game not knowing about it and just get scewed on the back end. In terms of a solution it is, yet again, placing pay-walls in the face of cunsumers who are making it known will million of pre-owned games sales that games are just too dammed expensive for most people at full reatail price.

how many times do i have to say that games are NOT CHEAP? less money, worse game. in a day and age where graphics means everything to sales, they cannot skimp on the cash spent on it. skimp on the cash and you will suffer. the price to put games on consoles increased. the way way to go from now is up. the PC however is still sitting at the 50 dollar mark. the ONLY way they will kill used game sales is to institute a steam-like policy where your game is tied to your XBL/PSN account forever if worse comes to worse, you will have to do this.

the console game devs cannot cut the price without spending less on the game. console gaming is strangling itself to death.

It will be the end of the games market when it all goes to downloading, which the industry wants purely because it doubles their profits!

What the games industry doesn't recognise is that without retail and print media coverage, the industry will die. Mom and Pop are not going to be sure at all about little Johnny's birthday present being a game that he downloads with no box or anything for the parents to look at!

Also, having all games download only will raise the coverage of indie titles and will make abandonware sites all the more utilized. After all, look at the PC gaming format. 60% smaller coverage in retail, 68% fewer PC titles released and the likelihood that as a format (ie PC only AAA titles), it will die. I feel this started when PC games went from big boxes and therefore differentiated themselves from console games in DVD cases to being in DVD cases just like their console counterparts. This meant when you went into the store, you no longer saw a stand-out PC section with obviously bigger boxes with big manuals and maps, etc. Something that we see with Collector's Edition's ALL gamers want!

As to pre-owned. If I was heading a large games publishing business, I would be terrified of over five MILLION DOSBox downloads and the absolute explosion of abandonware sites as more and more people find they have to go back 10 years to find the gameplay they crave!

uk_john:
It will be the end of the games market when it all goes to downloading, which the industry wants purely because it doubles their profits!

What the games industry doesn't recognise is that without retail and print media coverage, the industry will die. Mom and Pop are not going to be sure at all about little Johnny's birthday present being a game that he downloads with no box or anything for the parents to look at!

Also, having all games download only will raise the coverage of indie titles and will make abandonware sites all the more utilized. After all, look at the PC gaming format. 60% smaller coverage in retail, 68% fewer PC titles released and the likelihood that as a format (ie PC only AAA titles), it will die. I feel this started when PC games went from big boxes and therefore differentiated themselves from console games in DVD cases to being in DVD cases just like their console counterparts. This meant when you went into the store, you no longer saw a stand-out PC section with obviously bigger boxes with big manuals and maps, etc. Something that we see with Collector's Edition's ALL gamers want!

As to pre-owned. If I was heading a large games publishing business, I would be terrified of over five MILLION DOSBox downloads and the absolute explosion of abandonware sites as more and more people find they have to go back 10 years to find the gameplay they crave!

this would be good. console gaming dies, PC gaming explodes and the past of complex games return. no fanboyism fights. sounds like paradise to me. let them run to their deaths. if you think gaming will die because its digital, it wont. PC gaming is actually THRIVING in its digital format.

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