Bungie Explains (Internally) Controversial Halo: Reach Ending

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 NEXT
 

SirBryghtside:

Eclectic Dreck:

SirBryghtside:
Yeah - although when my brother played that, he was too good - he had to suicide...

He would have lost eventually I suspect. The simple weight in numbers (and the fact they are unlimited) would eventually lead to an erorsion of his forces as minerals and gas started to dwindle. He was certainly taking losses, just presumably very slowly.

He was only playing it on Normal Mode, so I'm guessing that's why.

remember on normal once i hit the cap i just pulled my guys back to the final ramps and killed another 500 or so then i lost.
but the first time i could have played it i was just like fuck it when i saw you couldnt win.

Spartans at a futuristic Thermopylae people, come on everyone knew this was how it was going to end.

(stop crying)

Thing is, they already have it in the lore that all the other spartans were killed on Reach. So they'd kind of already made their bed on that one.

I think.

CTU_Loscombe:
I defend the Noble 6 dying ending for a few reasons. Its a powerful ending to have at the end of a game, having your main character die but since the game is about the destruction of a planet its the best logical ending.
Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back had a similar approach to the ending with the Rebels in retreat and Luke finding out that Vader is his father. Its a case of the bad guys win, which was always going to be the case with reach.

Also, Im sure that Master Chief is the last Spartan Super Soldier (I may be wrong with that though, cant remember where I read it) so having Noble alive still would kinda fuck with the canon

chief was far from the last spartan super soldier. he was just the last once close enough to earth to do anything

remember that you have red team. grey team. and the half a dozen or so stuck in onyx. (maybe more, i dont remember who exactly survived that)

I thought the ending was easily the best bit in the game. And probably the only memorable bit.

I'm just sorry that it was used in Reach. Because now if another, better, game uses a similar scenario then a million squawking Halo fans will start accusing them of copying Reach. And that makes me sad.

I'm just waiting for the youtube videos of people putting it on legendary and surviving as long as they can.

Then again when I was playing on normal, I got the 'death' cutscene when I swore I still had half my shield and full health, so it could also be triggered after a certain time.

Jorge's death was touching.

Six's death just left me irritated at a forced defeat.

What the hell sense would it have made to keep him alive? There were no more Spartans after Reach fell, besides John. (Besides in books, comics, spin offs etc. They sure as hell weren't helping when humanity was on the edge of extinction in the games) That's why Halo 1-3 star Master Chief, not him plus some random Spartan that has no story or set characteristics.

They just executed the entire Noble team, sans Jun, right before our eyes. What makes Six so special that he/she gets to survive? That would have been incredibly dumb. I would have been pissed if they had Six survive.

When you see the cracked helmet in the dust in the beginning of the game, everybody's like (if they weren't already), "Yeah, so that means I'm going to die". But I think it would have been a great twist of sorts if they surprised everybody by finding a way to tear off 6's helmet without actually killing him (perhaps as an alternate ending), not to mention that hated to see my baby bite the dust. Perhaps an elite tears it off trying to snap 6's neck, but 6 somehow grabs the elite's plasma rifle, or sword, or stabs him with the knife, and then maybe they had a short (Think mile-high club from CoD) lone wolf mission in a phantom or other covenant aerial craft.

I'd dig that, not to mention it would be interesting knowing that there's another Spartan out there off the grid. Some people might get pissed if they find out that there's another spartan out there, even if he's not a soldier anymore, but really? How is it possible that every last single solitary spartan went KIA, as opposed to, say, retired?

Plus, I don't believe that Bungie's going to be able to keep its hands away from its single greatest money-making franchise forever. And keeping 6 alive gives it more options.

WanderingFool:
I think its the perfect ending. We all know what happens, why sugar coat it? Semi-related, thats how I would like to see Gear 3 end, as well. Basically all human players will take a final stand (preferably, as the original Delta sqaud) and fight the Locust till the end; like the vibe you got from the teaser trailer some time back.

I personally hope that the Lcust win at the end of Gears 3, with the original Delta Squad going down fighting.

On Topic: I found that the end of Reach was one of the best moments I have ever had whilst gaming, and that's saying a lot, as I have played so, so much. It was just watching you, Noble 6, get stabbed over and over and over and over again.

It moved me.

bioware needs to do a halo rpg

Wakikifudge:

Delock:

Jun's did piss me off, if only because it wasn't detailed in the game, but is almost definitely assured.

In the Legendary Edition, the developer commentary says that Jun is actually the only member of Noble to survive. I don't know if this makes you less pissed or not. I agree that the deaths were all handled very well.

That actually makes me extremely hopeful for the character. Hell, if 343 decides to make the next game with him as the character, I may actually rethink my opinion on never buying another Halo game (I don't like Microsoft viewing the francise as "easy money printer" rather than the nintendo approach of "when you milk it, make sure it's premium milk"). It would be interesting to see how the events affected him (will he become more chatty to hide his feelings, become a silent protagonist after not having the courage to speak up, turn on the UNSC, train new recruits, or do something completely different? The possiblities for development are amazing). Hopefully it will just be put in a book instead.

I'm still a little angry that it was only known in developer commentary, as it seemed like the thought was that you have to care enough to spend double the price of admission to have a plot thread wrapped up, when said plot thread was the fate of a major in-game character. Still, it's better than "shot off screen" for an ending.

M4CE of Spades:
When you see the cracked helmet in the dust in the beginning of the game, everybody's like (if they weren't already), "Yeah, so that means I'm going to die". But I think it would have been a great twist of sorts if they surprised everybody by finding a way to tear off 6's helmet without actually killing him (perhaps as an alternate ending), not to mention that hated to see my baby bite the dust. Perhaps an elite tears it off trying to snap 6's neck, but 6 somehow grabs the elite's plasma rifle, or sword, or stabs him with the knife, and then maybe they had a short (Think mile-high club from CoD) lone wolf mission in a phantom or other covenant aerial craft.

I'd dig that, not to mention it would be interesting knowing that there's another Spartan out there off the grid. Some people might get pissed if they find out that there's another spartan out there, even if he's not a soldier anymore, but really? How is it possible that every last single solitary spartan went KIA, as opposed to, say, retired?

Plus, I don't believe that Bungie's going to be able to keep its hands away from its single greatest money-making franchise forever. And keeping 6 alive gives it more options.

Actually, that's what I was hoping for the entire time, which is what made the scene even more powerful. You are desperately hoping in that very scene that maybe 6 gets away and just leaves the helmet behind, after all, his/her fate wasn't completely sealed, right. It makes it all the more chilling to watch the screen fade to black while the struggle is still ongoing. And then you get such an emotion sock to your core to hear of their death, which makes the scene beautiful. You were just sitting back and trying to hope the character to win an impossible battle only to feel sad when the obvious fate is the truth... in a videogame. If that doesn't prove videogames are art (and I NEVER thought I would be saying a Halo game would fit this phrase), then I don't know what is. It got an emotional response from the player and deeply touched them. It proved you can do something similar to the Titanic in an interactive medium.

Anyways, as for your little theory about the future, unless Microsoft gets rid of 343 Industries and Activision allows Bungie to work with them, another Bungie Halo isn't happening. Microsoft owns it now.

Magnalian:
No complains here about the ending, that part was awesome, but Kat's death... c'mon, could you really not think of anything better to do with that?

I loved Kat's death more than almost any other in a video game. For once in a millennium, a game shows that if you're in the middle of a war (even if you are a main character!) death can and will strike at any moment. It was quick, brutal, surprising, and extremely effective. They didn't sit there for two hours like "Okay, Kat is important and she is going to die so its going to be long and drawn out, you better get ready!" like most developers would have done. Hats off to Bungie for that. Fucking awesome.

ffxfriek:

Kalezian:
it would of been better had a covenant ship started glassing the area instead of the waves of enemies.

the current ending is pretty bad in my opinion, sure the planets doomed, so why let us fight for an extra five minutes?

spartans never die thats why. They are always MIA. If you read the books (highly recommend their SOOOOO MUCH BETTER then the games themselves) they state that a few times.

John Funk:
Bungie Explains (Internally) Controversial Halo: Reach Ending

image

The finale sequence in Halo: Reach is one of the most memorable parts of the game, but members of Bungie's dev team had to fight to put it in the game in the first place.

Okay, there's no easy way to say this, but - if it wasn't obvious enough from the headline and teaser - this news post will contain severe spoilers for the ending of Halo: Reach. In other words, if you read past the part marked "Spoilers," and you get spoiled, it's your own damn fault.

***SPOILER ALERT. SPOILER ALERT.***

One of the most surprisingly poignant moments (for me, anyway) in the entire Halo franchise was Noble Six's - that is, your own - last stand at the very end of Reach. After covering the launch of the Pillar of Autumn to set the events of Halo: Combat Evolved in motion, you are given a single objective: "Survive." It's ultimately impossible, as more and more Covenant swarm you on the now-desolate surface of a destroyed Reach, and Noble Six eventually goes down fighting.

When asked by UGO to explain the inspiration for the scene, creative director Marcus Lehto said that they ultimately saw the game as a "tragedy overall."

We wanted to tell the story of the Spartans sacrificing everything they had, and we thought it would be a cop-out if we didn't really bring it to a true ending with the Spartan that you create and that you fight with through the entire campaign and all the way to the very bitter end. If we didn't actually do the right thing to that character and bring them down with the planet ... After they had already succeeded in making sure that one thing that gave humanity any hope was actually saved, (we decided) they were going to go out all gung-ho and guns blazing.

Still, said Lehto, it was hardly a unanimous decision within Bungie. "It was a crazy, controversial thing within our studio. We had a lot of people who were like, 'No, we shouldn't end it that way. We should allow the player to play on and, in their heads, keep living.' But we wanted to bring it to a close."

"[It] was one of the parts of the game that we wrestled with for months, and there were many different iterations with the ending," agreed executive producer Joe Tung. "There was a point where the ending didn't happen at all like it happened now. It was so important to us that the game ended well."

It was important, of course, because this wasn't just Bungie's farewell to Noble Six and the planet Reach - but to the studio's Halo franchise as a whole. It was important "from the perspective of Bungie saying goodbye to the entire universe," said Tung. "We spent so much time wrestling with how to end the game, and I think it ended up being such a great farewell, not just for the game, but for the entire involvement in the universe and a fitting farewell to Halo from Bungie."

"And there wasn't really anything we could do with the end, the demise, of Noble 6 because that leads into the events just prior to Halo 1," said Lehto. "It was a great way just to bring everything full circle for the franchise."

I certainly thought so, anyway.

(UGO)

Permalink

Mr. Funk spartans never die!

spartan-II's never die. these are spartan-III's. cheap expendable versions of the spartan II program.
well, look at me, being a smartass.

OK, well then WHAT HAPPENED TO JUN???

Just like to say to everyone who wishes Halo: Reach didnt end like it did.
There's a REASON Master Chief John-117 is (at first glance) the only surviving Spartan. Read the first three novels, they sum it up pretty well as well as adding some characterization to the Chief's personality. The UNSC would have known if there were survivors on Reach. Try surviving your entire planet's surface melting to glass. The Covenant even glassed their OWN troops to make sure the humans were pinned down for the glassing. The only way to survive would have been not to be on the planet.
Glass.

I was hoping Master Chief was in the Pelican with Keyes so we could hand Cortana off to him. That would have been awesome. I really liked the ending though. It was very powerful and I liked watching 6 kick some total ass right before the elites finished him off.

sh0tgunenclave:

ffxfriek:

Kalezian:
it would of been better had a covenant ship started glassing the area instead of the waves of enemies.

the current ending is pretty bad in my opinion, sure the planets doomed, so why let us fight for an extra five minutes?

spartans never die thats why. They are always MIA. If you read the books (highly recommend their SOOOOO MUCH BETTER then the games themselves) they state that a few times.

John Funk:
Bungie Explains (Internally) Controversial Halo: Reach Ending

image

The finale sequence in Halo: Reach is one of the most memorable parts of the game, but members of Bungie's dev team had to fight to put it in the game in the first place.

Okay, there's no easy way to say this, but - if it wasn't obvious enough from the headline and teaser - this news post will contain severe spoilers for the ending of Halo: Reach. In other words, if you read past the part marked "Spoilers," and you get spoiled, it's your own damn fault.

***SPOILER ALERT. SPOILER ALERT.***

One of the most surprisingly poignant moments (for me, anyway) in the entire Halo franchise was Noble Six's - that is, your own - last stand at the very end of Reach. After covering the launch of the Pillar of Autumn to set the events of Halo: Combat Evolved in motion, you are given a single objective: "Survive." It's ultimately impossible, as more and more Covenant swarm you on the now-desolate surface of a destroyed Reach, and Noble Six eventually goes down fighting.

When asked by UGO to explain the inspiration for the scene, creative director Marcus Lehto said that they ultimately saw the game as a "tragedy overall."

We wanted to tell the story of the Spartans sacrificing everything they had, and we thought it would be a cop-out if we didn't really bring it to a true ending with the Spartan that you create and that you fight with through the entire campaign and all the way to the very bitter end. If we didn't actually do the right thing to that character and bring them down with the planet ... After they had already succeeded in making sure that one thing that gave humanity any hope was actually saved, (we decided) they were going to go out all gung-ho and guns blazing.

Still, said Lehto, it was hardly a unanimous decision within Bungie. "It was a crazy, controversial thing within our studio. We had a lot of people who were like, 'No, we shouldn't end it that way. We should allow the player to play on and, in their heads, keep living.' But we wanted to bring it to a close."

"[It] was one of the parts of the game that we wrestled with for months, and there were many different iterations with the ending," agreed executive producer Joe Tung. "There was a point where the ending didn't happen at all like it happened now. It was so important to us that the game ended well."

It was important, of course, because this wasn't just Bungie's farewell to Noble Six and the planet Reach - but to the studio's Halo franchise as a whole. It was important "from the perspective of Bungie saying goodbye to the entire universe," said Tung. "We spent so much time wrestling with how to end the game, and I think it ended up being such a great farewell, not just for the game, but for the entire involvement in the universe and a fitting farewell to Halo from Bungie."

"And there wasn't really anything we could do with the end, the demise, of Noble 6 because that leads into the events just prior to Halo 1," said Lehto. "It was a great way just to bring everything full circle for the franchise."

I certainly thought so, anyway.

(UGO)

Permalink

Mr. Funk spartans never die!

spartan-II's never die. these are spartan-III's. cheap expendable versions of the spartan II program.
well, look at me, being a smartass.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Spartan-3's originate in the novel Ghosts of Onyx? And not enter service until the events of Halo 2? And have the shitty armor with no shields but a little camo?

TheTaco007:
OK, well then WHAT HAPPENED TO JUN???

Developer commentary in the legendary edition says he lived.

Zhukov:
I thought the ending was easily the best bit in the game. And probably the only memorable bit.

I'm just sorry that it was used in Reach. Because now if another, better, game uses a similar scenario then a million squawking Halo fans will start accusing them of copying Reach. And that makes me sad.

Don't worry; Crisis Core did the exact same ending allowing the player fight against an endless horde of enemies but ultimately you were gonna die.

JUMBO PALACE:
I was hoping Master Chief was in the Pelican with Keyes so we could hand Cortana off to him. That would have been awesome. I really liked the ending though. It was very powerful and I liked watching 6 kick some total ass right before the elites finished him off.

There's an easter egg where you can shift the camera to the right during the cutscene where a pelican lands in the pillar of autumn hanger. You have to know when you hold the analog stick the the right. When done at the correct time you can see Master Chief in his cryo stasis thing.

JUMBO PALACE:
I was hoping Master Chief was in the Pelican with Keyes so we could hand Cortana off to him. That would have been awesome.

He was, no?
There's an easter-egg that shows him in stasis inside. Or perhaps that was inside the Pillar.. my memory is a little fuzzy.

[edit]damnit, beaten to it :(

I liken the ending to the overwhelming onslaught at the end of Crisis Core: Final Fantasy 7. In the psx ff7 Zach dies saving Cloud, but he's downed by a couple of riflemen. In Crisis Core his death is more touching because the final boss is LITERALLY his final fight, as you fight waves upon waves of soldiers with no hope of winning. I think you have to lose to end the battle but I don't remember. You will win in the cutscene, barely, but you are not leaving that cliff. I also like how that ending gives a reason WHY Cloud has selective amnesia and thinks he's who Zach was. Mako sickness combined with... well I'm not going to repeat my self.

I liked the ending. Reach falls, the Spartans die and, John 117 is humanity's last hope. It had to be that way and the means by which they showed that fact was done wonderfully. I'm not glad that N6 died but he went down like a true Spartan.

oh no the spartans died that somehow makes it emotive
didn't you guys listen to how the developers droned on and on and fucking on about how "reach falls" its pretty obvious they would die in the end

They should make it so if you manage to kill 100 enemies at the end. You get a special cutscene of 6 standing around piles of dead covenant walking and finishing a few off as he goes. Then you see a glassing beam go towards his area.

kyzill:
oh no the spartans died that somehow makes it emotive
didn't you guys listen to how the developers droned on and on and fucking on about how "reach falls" its pretty obvious they would die in the end

It was pretty obvious the Titanic was going to sink in the movie. It still moved some people.

So the most controversial decision the team fought over was that the good guy loses? I don't have Reach and don't plan too, but from what I can tell it seems just like Transformers, extremely one sided, the Humans are always right and always morally right and the Aliens are always wrong and always morally wrong. Surely there's something to sympathize you with the Aliens for a brief moment?

But if Reach is like the rest of Mainstream its probably the aforementioned situation, no startling thoughts just kill Aliens cause their bad.

Warforger:
So the most controversial decision the team fought over was that the good guy loses? I don't have Reach and don't plan too, but from what I can tell it seems just like Transformers, extremely one sided, the Humans are always right and always morally right and the Aliens are always wrong and always morally wrong. Surely there's something to sympathize you with the Aliens for a brief moment?

But if Reach is like the rest of Mainstream its probably the aforementioned situation, no startling thoughts just kill Aliens cause their bad.

To be fair, the humans aren't "morally right", and the Aliens aren't always morally wrong. For example, spartan 2s are kidnapped children who have been brainwashed and trained since the age of six, and you can see the motives of the covenant and you even team up with some of them in halo 3 (and the end of 2), and surely people can sypathise with the arbiter?

my question is

what the FUCK was the pillar of autumn doing on reach? in everything except this game, the ship blatantly AVOIDS landing on the planet because of the unnecessary risk it would pose to everyone

Old Trailmix:

DazBurger:
Is it just me or didn't Jun die? He just escorted Halsey off the planet.

And Jorge got teleported... Somewhere, with an intact covenant corvette and 2/3 of a super carrier :P

Yeah in the commentary of something Bungie says that Jun survives.

I liked the ending, although I hope after

and Reach murdering the protagonist isn't the new cool thing to do.

Spoiler tag that! This is a spoiler thread about reach not

Anyway I loved the ending and i'm glad they kept it in. I feel a bit depressed every time I start that mission and love it. I don't think Reach should've ended every other way.

Irridium:
Glad they kept it in. One of the greatest moments of any game I've played.

Absolutely. I didn't find it depressing, it just made me want to play Halo again and continue the fight (in the least cheesy way possible)

John Funk:
One of the most surprisingly poignant moments (for me, anyway) in the entire Halo franchise was Noble Six's - that is, your own - last stand at the very end of Reach. After covering the launch of the Pillar of Autumn to set the events of Halo: Combat Evolved in motion, you are given a single objective: "Survive." It's ultimately impossible, as more and more Covenant swarm you on the now-desolate surface of a destroyed Reach, and Noble Six eventually goes down fighting.

This sounds kinda like the ending of

I thought the ending was executed perfectly. Not too cheesy, not too dramatic, but powerful where it needed to be. When Six was told to get on that Pelican, it didn't take him long to say "you go on ahead sir" and man that gun. But he didn't do it with the 'I'M A PATRIOT ./PROUD' act, he didn't do it with a heavy conscience. He did it as a Spartan and he did it knowing that he was going to die a man. (Or woman, i'm using the term 'he' because that was my Six) This wasn't some Metal Gear bullshit about sacrificing oneself for their country, nation or people, nor was it some Master Chief 'Nothing i do ever fazes me' man of steel stuff either. It was purely acceptance of the situation and what's the come. Manning that MAC gun and firing the orbital round into the gut of that super carrier was the player's final 'fuck you' to the covenant. When they come to put you down like an animal that's gone feral, it's very subdued. They aren't hunting you vindictively and you're not meant to feel like they're killing you out of spite. The solemn atmosphere and minimalist surroundings amplified by the ever increasing but not too busy Covenant forces reinforce this. Six didn't go down kicking and screaming, it's like watching someone gently suffocate a victim to end their suffering. The covenant probably didn't even need to kill Six in the manner they did as the planet was going to be glassed anyway; it was a matter of honour and recognising a worthy and honourable opponent. That's how i like to see it, anyway. When we, the player, look through the visor at Six fighting for his life right up until he's killed, it's like we (the 'soul') have left the body of Six. It's powerful stuff. The very fact Six went down fighting means that his sacrifice of staying behind wasn't cheapened by an overkill laser beam from space. He went down like a soldier, something which has been seen as a strong positive in culture for a long time, that it's 'honourable to die on one's feet than to bend on one's knees'.

Why is it so controversial? Besides the Arbiter, only Master Chief survives the first series anyway. Was anyone really surprised?

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 NEXT

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Register for a free account here