BlizzCon 2010: Billions of Class Builds Await in Diablo III

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Well at least they have replayability in mind, just hope they do it right x3

So what if most of these builds aren't viable? It's still a cool amount...I'm looking forward to this :)

EDIT: Aww this was my 3000th post. I didn't realise until too late....*sigh* ah well :)

How about you release it? It feels like I have waited as long for this as I have for Duke Nukem!

Yeah I am impatient!

I would blame Wow, but its too much fun to be blamed for anything.

Oh and I have played Torchlight so much I have worn a hole in it!

YAAAAAY

D3, a game that has been in development for a time only shorter than Duke Nukem Forever and now they finally have the classes worked out. Now if they start work on the landscaping and game mechanics we might see a release sometime before I hit 55 (am 23 nao).

In all seriousness.

Who cares if there are 97 billion ways to take down a monster as long as its fun and violent.
If there is just 1 spell that will let me make an enemies head explode in a gory finale I will class the game as a win.

There's a lot of things this game seems to be doing that I don't like, especially the lack of attribute customization. But there are things, like the rune system, that interest me.

I'm hoping this is something that just comes together, good and bad working well as a whole, but at this point I still remain sceptical of how much customization the player has.

EDIT:

SnipErlite:

EDIT: Aww this was my 3000th post. I didn't realise until too late....*sigh* ah well :)

If it helps, that reminded me to check my post count. 300, I'm almost at your level!

Sigh....wish I could have made this year's Blizzcon. Last years was great and I spent so much time in the D3 area the developers gave me a signed poster! I later won a cataclysm one while farting around with the goblin starting zone. They look great framed and hanging on the wall.

bit of D2 math
attribute math:
98levs*5=490 points
+15(for quest)=505
Skill math:
98+9(for quest)=107

107*505=
54035 different builds per class in D2(before any gear)
(theirs less combos then this because of the 20 point cap and the skill tree but still theirs alot of options)

me thinks this is just PR talking about something they overheard and decided to run with it

still happy D3 is coming out though

matrix3509:
Here come the "Blizzard sux" crowd. *sigh*

Sorry, but they are just showing off pointless statistics. If anyone had done the math like this for Diablo 2, I'd bet my ass it would be in the trillions.

Grouchy Imp:
Well if you want to calculate permutaions generally speaking you use factorials, and 14!=87,178,291,200 - so what, they have 14 different options in character creation? Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to Diablo 3, but that doen't sound like too many. Even taking long scale (rather than short scale) billions into account, that's only 16 options. Then again, I suppose if that's 14 (or 16) options for each class then that looks a bit more like it.

the factorial calculation is an oversimplification because you are just saying that there are 16 different objects which can be arranged in any order with each one counting as an option. unfortunately when skill branching and prerequisite skills come into play the maths gets much messier.

Why would you do combinations AND permutations??

Why are people so angry about this? It's just a fun little fact, course they know they're not all usable!

Trizshjen:

Grouchy Imp:
Well if you want to calculate permutaions generally speaking you use factorials, and 14!=87,178,291,200 - so what, they have 14 different options in character creation? Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to Diablo 3, but that doen't sound like too many. Even taking long scale (rather than short scale) billions into account, that's only 16 options. Then again, I suppose if that's 14 (or 16) options for each class then that looks a bit more like it.

the factorial calculation is an oversimplification because you are just saying that there are 16 different objects which can be arranged in any order with each one counting as an option. unfortunately when skill branching and prerequisite skills come into play the maths gets much messier.

They're still all factorials, for example k samples out of a population of n with respect to ordering but without replacement is n!/(n-k)!

I'd say the 'messiest' one is with replacement but without respect to ordering, but that's still just the binomial (n+k)-1 over k, in other words (n+k-1)! / k!(n-1)!

And for any extraneous cases it's just the multiplicative principle, so although unwieldy to do by hand, I wouldn't call it messy.

Neither would I call Grouchy Imp's numbers oversimplified, if we abstract out 14 unique choices, that you chose in order (ie through progression) then indeed you get close to 9*10^10. In mathematical terms: we choose fourteen samples out of a population of fourteen, without replacement but with respect to ordering =>
n = k = 14 =>
14!/(14-14)! =>
14!
.

In other words, fourteen choices (w/o replacement, wrt ordering) are enough to get ~90 billion permutations and that's the important part.

Of course, the order in which we choose these defines what a "build" is, so those abstract choices might be a lot more complex than, say, a stat/skill increase or a skill rune.

Probably we could find a better abstraction using k out of n w/o respect to ordering, but with replacement (ie spend k skill points on n skills), but it probably won't tell us anything more than the 14! one. We call it a heuristic, apply Occam's and accept 14! as our measure.

So, during your leveling up you will make about 14 choices about where to take your character that will be defining for your build. Now that sounds pretty good, imo!

With just six 8-stud LEGO bricks you can build over 102 million combinations...doesn't mean that they are all unique, good, or viable...

GoGo_Boy:

matrix3509:
Here come the "Blizzard sux" crowd. *sigh*

It's actually faster than the fan crowd to be honest. They're lurking in the dark just to strike swiftly with each new Blizzards news / article!

Yeah, the fan crowd doesn't even try anymore. There is no point.

Moffman:
Why are people so angry about this? It's just a fun little fact, course they know they're not all usable!

Because the "Blizzard sux bawls" crowd is the most numerous crowd on the forums, thats why. Every article regard Blizzard, no matter what it is, is filled with these trolls. Its like 4chan, only worse. Plus, it seems like John puts out a majority of the articles for no other purpose than flame bait.

WanderingFool:
The first person that says "over 9000" is getting mentally stabbed in the face.

...and I have nothing else to say but awesome.

OVER 9000 THOUSAND MILLION.

Novskij:

WanderingFool:
The first person that says "over 9000" is getting mentally stabbed in the face.

...and I have nothing else to say but awesome.

OVER 9000 THOUSAND MILLION.

Somebody already said it first, so no mental stabbing in the face for you...

Meaningless. If you consider all the builds in D2 (say, getting 9 points in an ability, then 8, then 7) I'm sure the total number of builds would have been staggering too.
In truth, you could only build each class in five or six ways.

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