Pachter: "Nintendo Is Doomed"

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008Zulu:

Garak73:
Besides, if that statement about success right after a disappointment were true then the Gamecube would have put them on top because the N64 was also a disappointment.

I thought the Gameboy Advanced was released between those two consoles.

The Game Boy series has always been successful but on the console side of things Nintendo had two bad generations back to back before the Wii put them back on top. Thing is, in the handheld area, they have always been on top.

Nintendo pretty much defined the handheld market, does this man seriously know what he's talking about?

No. Mr. Reynolds of Zynga, you're not making "social games for everybody". I'm offended that you even call them "games" at all. They're programs designed to be addicting via a strict regimented reward system. All you're creating is ad-fuel. NINTENDO makes games. Not you.

It was bound to happen, the only way I see Nintendo not be "doomed" is if they make another kind of handheld system and add more screens because we know all to well they love to do that.

SuperTrainStationH:
The only Wii game that Nintendo's put out that's genuinely lacking in quality or could be considered "bad", (besides Other M, but at least Team Ninja TRIED, it wasn't like they just didn't care) was Wii Music.

All the shovelware on the Wii pretty much amounts to third parties looking at Wii Sports and Wii Fit, assuming that Nintendo put minimal effort into it just because its not a graphically intense, in depth adventure, and then assign their third string teams to cobble together a "Wii (noun/verb)" series wannabe. Then they start complaining when their game sells poorly and blame Nintendo for "dominating the market" with their own games.

I think Miyamoto actually said something to the effect of "Don't assume our Mii based games are just rubbish we slapped together. We put our top teams into those games, third parties have to do the same if you want to sell well.".

That aside, "Nintendo is doomed" is pretty much par for the course whenever Nintendo's on the verge of their greatest success yet.

Well said.

Iwata's just ahead of the curve. As latecomers to the "casual boom", companies like EA just aren't understanding what's made the Wii and other big casual games successes. They think it's all about just pumping out crap tailored for people who don't play games.

Iwata realizes that casual gamers can be as discerning as the most "hardcore", they are only limited by their selection. That's why nobody is buying the shovelware on Wii, because they can buy good games instead.

Now, in a few areas, such as Zynga, some not-so-great game makers made it big with some not-so-great games. However, it's typically because they were in the right place at the right time, taking advantage of a situation nobody else was. It's probably safe to say that boat has sailed already, and if you want to compete now, then you're going to have to invest more money to fight for market share. Y'know, just like Iwata is saying.

Irridium:
Nintendo has been in business in the games industry for well over, what, 25 years? I think they'll be fine.

Sega has been in the business for 46 years. Look at them now...

Yes Nintendo is doing well now, this is the first time they've seen leading success in 3 console generations, long term saying Nintendo is doomed is a stretch, but they will not be as successful as they are now with home consoles at least. Handheld wise the iPhone/iPod touch is Nintendo's major competitor and are quickly catching up in sales. I personally think Nintendo's third party support (or lack there of) will hurt them long run.

jpoon:
I would definitely agree with Iwata about needing less of the bullshit social games and have the devs focus on making real games!

me too, its too bad that theres hundreds of millions of people playing those game who don't even think about it.

The fact that it's Pachter saying that Nintendo is doomed, tells me to buy stock in Nintendo immediately, as it is going to prosper for all eternity.

Garak73:

008Zulu:

Garak73:
Besides, if that statement about success right after a disappointment were true then the Gamecube would have put them on top because the N64 was also a disappointment.

I thought the Gameboy Advanced was released between those two consoles.

The Game Boy series has always been successful but on the console side of things Nintendo had two bad generations back to back before the Wii put them back on top. Thing is, in the handheld area, they have always been on top.

Maybe I'm from some crazy alternate universe, but the N64 was a great console with a strong library of great games. Whoever says it was a failure? Compared to what? The PS1? PS1 was good, but it wasn't blowing the N64 away. It had better RPGs, N64 had better action. The Xbox wasn't out yet. Now the Sega Dreamcast was a pretty epic failure.

Meanwhile, Iwata's keynote comments, that he feared the industry would be hurt by the current emphasis on making low-cost social games instead of high-quality titles, aren't being accepted by some rather high-profile members of the videogame industry.

Jeff Brown, VP of corporate communication at Electronic Arts, didn't completely dismiss Mr. Iwata's opinions, but he didn't agree with them either. "He may be right, but then the 200 to 300 million people who play games on Facebook are wrong," he said. "Social gaming as a whole aggregates into a business that is undeniably big money. When it's that big you are forced to pay attention."

Is it just me, of did Mr. Brown TOTALLY miss his point?

KaiusCormere:

Garak73:

008Zulu:

I thought the Gameboy Advanced was released between those two consoles.

The Game Boy series has always been successful but on the console side of things Nintendo had two bad generations back to back before the Wii put them back on top. Thing is, in the handheld area, they have always been on top.

Maybe I'm from some crazy alternate universe, but the N64 was a great console with a strong library of great games. Whoever says it was a failure? Compared to what? The PS1? PS1 was good, but it wasn't blowing the N64 away. It had better RPGs, N64 had better action. The Xbox wasn't out yet. Now the Sega Dreamcast was a pretty epic failure.

I think the N64 and the Gamecube were great. I think the Gamecube was better than the N64, not only did it have a better controller but better larger games. Still the N64 is a disappointment compared to it's competition, the PS1. The N64 had very little third party support as well, compared to the PS1 and even compared to the NES/SNES. In every way the N64 was a disappointment.

The N64 controller was fine at the time but looking back on it, it doesn't hold up well today. Compare that to the PS1 controller that is still alive and well today.

ETA: Did you know that Sega was terrified of the PS2 launch and that ultimately led to their abandonment of the Dreamcast? They weren't terrified of a new Nintendo console because at that time, the PS1 was the top dog and even Sega knew that Nintendo was no longer the biggest threat to them, it was Sony. Sure enough, the PS2 launch was successful and even though there were PS2 shortages, Sega still abandoned the Dreamcast right after the PS2 launch. We all know who won the PS2/GCN battle. The N64 was the beginning of Nintendo's losing streak, not the Gamecube.

...Doomed? Nintendo?

He might as well say China will have a fair government by noon tommorow and the Moon is infact a Death Star.

It's all idle talk. The combined forces of Zynga and EA can't even begin to grasp how big of a force that Nintendo is in the industry.

Well technically nothing last forever so everyone is doomed eventually but somehow I don't see Nintendo going down and the world of gaming post-Nintendo happening in the very near future. In the next decade or so... maybe. Still, the idea that low-cost social games will hurt the industry is like saying small scale painters selling their products locally are going to hurt the entire art world.

Mackheath:
...Doomed? Nintendo?

He might as well say China will have a fair government by noon tommorow and the Moon is infact a Death Star.

*Goes outside to look at moon*
...wait... that's no moon!

Twilight_guy:
Well technically nothing last forever so everyone is doomed eventually but somehow I don't see Nintendo going down and the world of gaming post-Nintendo happening in the very near future. In the next decade or so... maybe. Still, the idea that low-cost social games will hurt the industry is like saying small scale painters selling their products locally are going to hurt the entire art world.

Mackheath:
...Doomed? Nintendo?

He might as well say China will have a fair government by noon tommorow and the Moon is infact a Death Star.

*Goes outside to look at moon*
...wait... that's no moon!

..it's a space station...LOL

Anyway, the thing to remember here is that here in the US the industry did crash in 1983 and it was because of crappy, low quality games and consumers lost confidence. It can happen again and IMO social games are both crappy and low quality cash ins. Farmville is a low quality, crappy version of Harvest Moon, for example.

Garak73:

Twilight_guy:
Well technically nothing last forever so everyone is doomed eventually but somehow I don't see Nintendo going down and the world of gaming post-Nintendo happening in the very near future. In the next decade or so... maybe. Still, the idea that low-cost social games will hurt the industry is like saying small scale painters selling their products locally are going to hurt the entire art world.

Mackheath:
...Doomed? Nintendo?

He might as well say China will have a fair government by noon tommorow and the Moon is infact a Death Star.

*Goes outside to look at moon*
...wait... that's no moon!

..it's a space station...LOL

Anyway, the thing to remember here is that here in the US the industry did crash in 1983 and it was because of crappy, low quality games and consumers lost confidence. It can happen again and IMO social games are both crappy and low quality cash ins. Farmville is a low quality, crappy version of Harvest Moon, for example.

Not to burst your bubble, but the economic, social, and political environment of games has changed. Its now a billion dollar industry and a form of media consumed by millions of people. That's a long ways from where it was in 1983 and I don't think it can crash the same way.

Twilight_guy:

Garak73:

Twilight_guy:
Well technically nothing last forever so everyone is doomed eventually but somehow I don't see Nintendo going down and the world of gaming post-Nintendo happening in the very near future. In the next decade or so... maybe. Still, the idea that low-cost social games will hurt the industry is like saying small scale painters selling their products locally are going to hurt the entire art world.

*Goes outside to look at moon*
...wait... that's no moon!

..it's a space station...LOL

Anyway, the thing to remember here is that here in the US the industry did crash in 1983 and it was because of crappy, low quality games and consumers lost confidence. It can happen again and IMO social games are both crappy and low quality cash ins. Farmville is a low quality, crappy version of Harvest Moon, for example.

Not to burst your bubble, but the economic, social, and political environment of games has changed. Its now a billion dollar industry and a form of media consumed by millions of people. That's a long ways from where it was in 1983 and I don't think it can crash the same way.

Indeed it can, it may just take longer but what poisons a small industry will still poison the bigger version of the same industry.

You think the industry is invincible I suppose, it isn't. There are a few industries here in the US who failed and needed to be bailed out by the taxpayers, they still failed when no one thought they could.

I hate captcha!

Great, more bandwidth wasted with Pachter's BS.

What is worse, Iwata is completely right about social games. You can do quality social games, but quality social games is not what 200-300 million people are playing. They are not wrong (it it EA in the wrong), they just have way too much time in their jobs.

And I expected better from Brian Reynolds. From Civ2, Alpha Centauri and Rise of Nations to Frontierville?. Please... I hope the checks are big, because his talent is completely wasted.

If anyone's doomed it's Sony and Microsoft. What will happen after their "hardcore" FPS demographic grows up and moves on? Nintendo on the other hand, with their games where anyone can jump in and have fun, will continue to survive.

Azure Knight-Zeo:
If anyone's doomed it's Sony and Microsoft. What will happen after their "hardcore" FPS demographic grows up and moves on? Nintendo on the other hand, with their games where anyone can jump in and have fun, will continue to survive.

Isn't a large part of the FPS demographic already grown up? Honestly, every adult gamer that I know loves these damn FPS games.

Nintendo is doomed? Haha Pachter, good one.

Wait, your serious...??

Someone please give him his Dayquil.

Worst case scenario Nintendo uses their own IP for mobile games. Productivity plummets, and they get rich... again.

teh_Canape:

Icehearted:
Almost happened before, bub.

Iwata's starting to sound like Ken Kutaragi when the PS3 was announced. We saw how that turned out.

I know, basically the reason of what I posted

you just can't truly kill Nintendo XD

How do you kill that which is already dead?

Ekonk:
How do you kill that which is already dead?

Quake 3, Cadavre

yes, I remember XD

idk, but more than being a zombie, Nintendo is a resurrection =P

Man, I read four pages of this and nobody has said what this Patcher is. Isn't he Rob Courdreys character on The Office? Duh, he's an idiot!

But seriously what teh is a Patcher, Michael?

I hate Nintendo.

Never has my opinion of a company shifted as quickly as it did with them.

My love for them died with the gamecube and the gamebody advance sp.

They're not even on my radar anymore.

Garak73:
The Game Boy series has always been successful but on the console side of things Nintendo had two bad generations back to back before the Wii put them back on top. Thing is, in the handheld area, they have always been on top.

I have never really counted handhelds and consoles as seperate divisions, although they clearly are. But I didnt think the N64 was a failure, it did gives games like Goldeneye 64 and Perfect Dark.

008Zulu:

Garak73:
The Game Boy series has always been successful but on the console side of things Nintendo had two bad generations back to back before the Wii put them back on top. Thing is, in the handheld area, they have always been on top.

I have never really counted handhelds and consoles as seperate divisions, although they clearly are. But I didnt think the N64 was a failure, it did gives games like Goldeneye 64 and Perfect Dark.

That you and I loved the N64 doesn't make it a success. Compared to it's competitors and even past Nintendo consoles it was a failure. Third party support just wasn't there either. However the NES and SNES enjoyed alot of third party support so you can clearly see where things went downhill for Nintendo.

If not for the Game Boy line of handhelds I don't if Nintendo would have survived the N64 and Gamecube era.

I think people are just misinterpreting Mr. Iwata. I think he's saying that too many of these social games is going to choke the market, making it harder for the better games to succeed or get noticed. All of these social games are lowering the overall quality of the games industry. And people don't think that a lack of high quality titles will hurt the industry? Get your heads checked people, high quality titles are the only reason the game industry is around.

BrunDeign:
I think people are just misinterpreting Mr. Iwata. I think he's saying that too many of these social games is going to choke the market, making it harder for the better games to succeed or get noticed. All of these social games are lowering the overall quality of the games industry. And people don't think that a lack of high quality titles will hurt the industry? Get your heads checked people, high quality titles are the only reason the game industry is around.

He seems concerned that $50-$60 titles won't sell at all when people get used to getting games for free or for really low prices (like $1). He's right too, when you get in the habit of buying games for cheap, you start really wondering if that $60 game is really worth $60. Also with social networking games and micro-transactions, it seems cheap because most people never add up how much they spend on micro-transactions, much like DLC. I can't remember how much I paid for DLC for any specific game.

Hey guys, did you know that Nintendo is doomed?

I have come to the conclusion that there is only one consistency in the game industry, and it is this: Nintendo is doomed.

No matter what Nintendo's profits are, no matter what the currency exchange rate is, no matter whether Nintendo is winning in the market or not, only one conclusion is permissible: Nintendo is doomed.

If the sky is blue, if water is wet, if birds sing, then, by all means, Nintendo is doomed.

If you say, "Nintendo is not doomed", you are a fanboy, a viral marketer, one who wishes to upset the applecart ridden by glorious analysts.

I, myself, wish for at least some variety.

One can only hear "Nintendo is doomed" over and over and become bored. Perhaps they ought to switch it around. Maybe twist it to "Doomed is Nintendo..." just for kicks. But alas, I ask too much.

Nintendo was doomed in 2005 ( http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_1/6-The-Contrarian ) so it ought to be doomed today.

Doom-Doom-Dickity-Doom!

satorisatya:

Nintendo was doomed in 2005 ( http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_1/6-The-Contrarian ) so it ought to be doomed today.

Doom-Doom-Dickity-Doom!

Fun bit of reading. Specially this bit

That's why the Sony PSP is going to win. Publishers understand it: powerful 3D, familiar controls, absolutely zero innovation. That's how they like it. They can take Ghost Recon and slap it out for the PSP. Why not? It isn't fundamentally different from a PS2 or an Xbox; it's just portable.

Well always easy when looking back at things.
I will like nintendo until the day they do go down. Though i do not think it will be anytime soon. Specially now with the 3ds they will keep the reign on the handheld at least.

Pachter is a total hack. He couldn't predict where his own bunghole is located.

I mean it's not like the gaming pundits and 'experts' have got Nintendo wrong for the last 4 years, they were bang on when they told us the Wii would fail myserably and openly laughed at Nintendos stratergy and how absurd it was- no wait Nintendo changned the industry pretty drastically forever, created a whole new audience, pre-empted all this social game bullshit by years and made a butt-load of money doing it.

Anyone who thinks the future of gaming is Farmville can't see past the tip of their nose. EA made this mistake when they bought playfish. The 'Social' market has pretty much leveled off and a whole heap of bad-will is being stored up for the entire sector.

The social gaming boom as they see it has come and gone in my eyes; the next step is implementing their systems in decent experiences Ala having an add-on to a game that resemebles something as good as Echo Bazzar or systems in place within a game that minic these functions. You know real games. Not HTML/ java coin-hoovers coded by unscrupulous, money grabbing, audience abusing talentless retards.

I think the comments are meant to spurn Nintendo to do some more innovation and forward thinking actions. Hopefully this will translate into some new franchises and deaths of some of the older ones.

Worgen:
patcher is an idiot, we all know this

He's paid to "analyze", "read trends" and state the obvious. I'd be an idiot too if I get paid for that.

I agree with the man about Social Gaming being the harbinger of destruction. A "game" should at least have some skill involved. What they make are massive clickfests (I'm looking at you Zynga).

Offtopic: If last year is any indication, I'll wait at my nuke shelter when March Madness officially starts.

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