Weird Razer Ad Promises PC Gaming Is Not Dead

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Akalabeth:

OutrageousEmu:

Akalabeth:

Accusing someone of lying because their concept of gaming is too broad for your own narrow-minded view of the subject is not a valid criticism. Gaming is a very broad medium that casts a wide net and the AAA market is just one portion of that.

Yeah, I'm sure Razer really moves a tonne of high end gaming PC and PC peripherals's to 40 year old housewives who only play Farmville.

At what point did they claim to?
And seriously what constitutes gaming?

Only AAA titles?
What about XBA or PSN titles that cost 5 dollars or less, is this gaming?
What about free flash games online, is this gaming?
If Age of Conan and Bejeweled are both free to play, is one gaming while one is not?
What about open source mods running modified engines that don't require the original game (ie cost nothing), are they gaming?

Point being just because a game doesn't meet a certain level of cost, or a certain level of complexity doesn't make it invalid as a game. A game is a game.

And a film is a film. So Transformers 2 and Citizen Kane are the exact same.

OutrageousEmu:

Akalabeth:

OutrageousEmu:
Yeah, I'm sure Razer really moves a tonne of high end gaming PC and PC peripherals's to 40 year old housewives who only play Farmville.

At what point did they claim to?
And seriously what constitutes gaming?

Only AAA titles?
What about XBA or PSN titles that cost 5 dollars or less, is this gaming?
What about free flash games online, is this gaming?
If Age of Conan and Bejeweled are both free to play, is one gaming while one is not?
What about open source mods running modified engines that don't require the original game (ie cost nothing), are they gaming?

Point being just because a game doesn't meet a certain level of cost, or a certain level of complexity doesn't make it invalid as a game. A game is a game.

And a film is a film. So Transformers 2 and Citizen Kane are the exact same.

They're exactly the same in that they're both movies, and both can be enjoyed by "moviegoers" in the same way that Farmville and SimCity are both games, and can be enjoyed by gamers, albeit, gamers of different tastes. But gamers who both enjoy the game on the same platform. Ie the Personal Computer.

Yeah it's a broad category.
But if you take one guy who strictly plays games like Modern Warfare, Battlefield, Halo and take another guy who plays strictly games like Civilization, Shogun Total War, and take another guy who only plays fighting games like Street Fighter and Tekken and you call them all gamers then isn't that a broad category? You're taking 3 guys who play COMPLETELY differnet games and throwing them into the same group?

What then is the difference between throwing a 40 year old woman who plays addictive facebook games in the same camp as a 30 year old guy who plays addictive MMORPG games?

Each group has members who are dissimilar from eachother as the other, the only difference is where you arbitrarily draw the line.

OutrageousEmu:
And a film is a film. So Transformers 2 and Citizen Kane are the exact same.

image

I thought we were talking about how many PC gamers there were.

The_root_of_all_evil:

OutrageousEmu:
And a film is a film. So Transformers 2 and Citizen Kane are the exact same.

image

I thought we were talking about how many PC gamers there were.

Fine, if you really feel the need to add those who game on facebook, then do so. But apart from simply self congratulating little speeches and saying "lol, PC gaming so totally has so many people" those who game on facebook are meaningless to you. They aren't going to attract any publishers or developers worth a damn, they aren't going to assist the sales of anyone besides Zynga, they don't care about graphics, processing power or anything remotely like that, they won't say shit against DRM because they already agreed to always on DRM, they don't want innovation or improved storytelling - besides simply existing as a faceless mob you can count under PC gamer, they mean nothing to you.

OutrageousEmu:
... they mean nothing to you.

They mean PC gaming isn't dead. Which means they're quite important to me.

The 4 million on Steam last night mean that much more.

I think it's a problem with the trend in the industry today. PC gaming is dying because PC gamers have different standards.

A console game can get away with semi-poor graphics, lack of options, mods etc. A shoddy PC port rarely catches momentum, but it earns the developers money by the massive console sales.

The publishers will probably use piracy as an excuse, maybe the smaller market, but in the end they are missing out on a potential market where the buyers have more disposable income (PCs cost potentially a lot more money).

It's plain sad, but then again I have had a lot of fun times playing consoles.

OT: Nice little marketing campaign, but their keyboards will NEVER beat my Das Keyboard! :D

The_root_of_all_evil:

OutrageousEmu:
... they mean nothing to you.

They mean PC gaming isn't dead. Which means they're quite important to me.

The 4 million on Steam last night mean that much more.

In one ear, out the other. Fine, pc gaming is not dead. PC gaming now stands for lower standards, no story, no innovation, no player respect, no player choice, no mods, and nothing but products designed to treat you like a lab rat, but pc gaming is not dead.

OutrageousEmu:
In one ear, out the other. Fine, pc gaming is not dead. PC gaming now stands for lower standards, no story, no innovation, no player respect, no player choice, no mods, and nothing but products designed to treat you like a lab rat, but pc gaming is not dead.

You remind me very much of a certain person who hates sex even though he's never tried it. You should see the rants he makes against it while the rest of us enjoy it.

But try the indie side of PC gaming one time. You know, like Bastion. Or Amnesia. Or Dwarf Fortress.

That's where PC gaming started, and it's never even got a cold.

The_root_of_all_evil:

OutrageousEmu:
In one ear, out the other. Fine, pc gaming is not dead. PC gaming now stands for lower standards, no story, no innovation, no player respect, no player choice, no mods, and nothing but products designed to treat you like a lab rat, but pc gaming is not dead.

You remind me very much of a certain person who hates sex even though he's never tried it. You should see the rants he makes against it while the rest of us enjoy it.

But try the indie side of PC gaming one time. You know, like Bastion. Or Amnesia. Or Dwarf Fortress.

That's where PC gaming started, and it's never even got a cold.

....did you suffer some form of blackout and now think this is a totally different conversation? "Try Bastion. That game that was on the 360 and also has nothing to do with Facebook gaming which is what we were talking about."

But, yeah, try the indie games on XBLA and PsN. What, if anything, is your point, and how does it relate to how accepting the facebook PC gamers means you must accept everything they mean for PC gaming?

image

What the fuck is that second thing? its an optical illusion. What the hell?

OutrageousEmu:
Thats adorable. They're actually so desperate they need to include the farmville numbers. Okay, fine, we console gamers concede that PC gaming is the best medium for giving the creators of substandard timewasters like Zynga money for some of the shoddiest games and most evil behaviour gaming has ever seen.

There are avenues to prove the validity and worth of PC gaming, but as long as Zynga exists, numbers is definitely not one of them. And not giving context to those numbers just makes you look like a liar.

Well stuff like the existence of mods, the numbers on Steam and Xfire, MMOs, vibrant communities in games that would have died years ago on consoles, a much larger indie community(Call of Cthulhu sold more in 1 week on Steam than in whole time it was on console indie market.).

You know what is funny handheld market is bigger than consoles so yes numbers aren't everything but there other indicators which you are ignoring. Yes there Farmville and stuff are "games" they are Social games that you play while you wait for people to message you on Facebook and I've never heard people let a child die due to Halo so that must mean those people are more "hardcore" than console gamers. Something a vocal of the community is so obsessed with.

In one ear, out the other. Fine, pc gaming is not dead. PC gaming now stands for lower standards, no story, no innovation, no player respect, no player choice, no mods, and nothing but products designed to treat you like a lab rat, but pc gaming is not dead.

Console gaming is much better in these regards? Kotick wanting to charge a sub for CoD, paying for online full stop, so many AAA games so little to no innovation. There is plenty of all of the opposite of that on PC just in other places there are always stagnant portions on every platform and genre.

....did you suffer some form of blackout and now think this is a totally different conversation? "Try Bastion. That game that was on the 360 and also has nothing to do with Facebook gaming which is what we were talking about."

But, yeah, try the indie games on XBLA and PsN. What, if anything, is your point, and how does it relate to how accepting the facebook PC gamers means you must accept everything they mean for PC gaming?

Yes there are indie games but see my point on Call of Cthulhu and there are many other games like this. Given that there is a large number of console gamers out there a large proportion of them seem to not give a fuck about the indie market as fuck all people bought Call of Cthulhu comparatively speaking to PC sales.

Publishers are trying very hard to stamp out PC gamers. You know they think we are all criminals. Even the ones that actually buy their games. lol

That switchblade looks freakin' sweet tho. :D Wonder what the resolution is gonna be.

Glademaster:

Well stuff like the existence of mods, the numbers on Steam and Xfire, MMOs, vibrant communities in games that would have died years ago on consoles, a much larger indie community(Call of Cthulhu sold more in 1 week on Steam than in whole time it was on console indie market.).

False comparisson on Call of Cthulu. Call was listed under the XBLIG section which most people avoid cause its mostly shit. It was also given jack shit promotion. On Steam they promoted the fuck out of it. Thats a promotional thing, not a community thing. A better comparison is between Braid on XBLA, PSN and Steam. While recieving equal promotion, sales were far higher on consoles than on Steam.

You know what is funny handheld market is bigger than consoles so yes numbers aren't everything but there other indicators which you are ignoring. Yes there Farmville and stuff are "games" they are Social games that you play while you wait for people to message you on Facebook and I've never heard people let a child die due to Halo so that must mean those people are more "hardcore" than console gamers. Something a vocal of the community is so obsessed with.

I'm missing the part where anyone could think "Crazy people use this platform" is a positive thing. Encouraging that kind of behaviour doesn't show dedication, it shows those people are completely fucking unhinged.

Console gaming is much better in these regards? Kotick wanting to charge a sub for CoD, paying for online full stop, so many AAA games so little to no innovation. There is plenty of all of the opposite of that on PC just in other places there are always stagnant portions on every platform and genre.

That idea from Kotick? That was last year, and instantly got shut down. Meanwhile, Ubisofts DRM? Frm DUst, Driver, Assassins Creed Revelations, and I assure you, more games everyday. Paying for online - I'm sorry, have we not heard of the PsN? As for "no innovation" in major games, you remember the part about how PC games take from that pool, right? Skyrim doesn't instantly become less innovative when its on a console, any claim of a lack of innovation is laid on PC's as well. But as for games that don't see the PC - I'm currently playing a AAA title about a man stuck in an emotional tryst between two women while every night he is dragged to a hellish torture while suffering thew deepest fears of his mind, and this game will never see light of day on PC. What was that about a lack of innovation? Hmm?

Yes there are indie games but see my point on Call of Cthulhu and there are many other games like this. Given that there is a large number of console gamers out there a large proportion of them seem to not give a fuck about the indie market as fuck all people bought Call of Cthulhu comparatively speaking to PC sales.

Once again, that was a bad comparisson and you know it. Lets compare Braid, shall we? Oh look, far more people on consoles care about indie games than PC gamers when the games are given equal promotion on both.

I've always found the "master race" arguments to be quite dumb. Pc's are the most powerful machines, no doubt, but also the hardest places to play. A game like the witcher needed 4 patches to tweak and correct issues, for example, and it's a bit of a nightmare to get the most out of it unless you spend a lot of time tweaking options, enabling and disabling things like SSAO which we're, to be fair, not even exactly sure what it is (which leads to some amusing forum debating where people say the exact opposites about each and every tweak). Not to even mention that games might react different depending on the hardware and sometimes, even gamers with above average machines find themselves locked out of the full experience.

Consoles, on the other hand, for all their being a bit old in the tooth, allow us to simply turn it on and play with the game already mostly optimized to the system it's being played on and with all the comfort of a huge ass tv and sofa. To me, the graphical trade off (and what, are we going to say that console games this days don't still offer us amazing visuals?) isn't enough to justify the hassle of having to buy a whole new pc just to have tesselation on Deus Ex.

OT: looking at this Razer switchblade thingie, it looks impressive technologically, but completely useless. And are we truly making a case for superior pc gaming without having a mouse into the equation?

SirBryghtside:

Is anyone still actually losing sleep over this?

You mean apart from game companies who develop for consoles and then half-heartedly port to PC?

If Steam released sales figures, I bet this'd all be fixed.

Yeah, I bet Valve never tells developers the Steam sales for the developers games on Steam, and those developers never already take those figures into consideration.

SirBryghtside:

OutrageousEmu:

SirBryghtside:
You mean apart from game companies who develop for consoles and then half-heartedly port to PC?

If Steam released sales figures, I bet this'd all be fixed.

Yeah, I bet Valve never tells developers the Steam sales for the developers games on Steam, and those developers never already take those figures into consideration.

And I bet publishers who're looking from an outside perspective never get to see how well other peoples' games do on Steam, leading them to develop mainly for other platforms.

The hell would they care about other developers sales figures? They only care and should only care about their own.

And if a developer was doing extra well, believe me, they'd brag about it. You think Activision thought they should keep the annual 20 million+ sales of COD to the chest?

graverobber2:
someone has been watching too much V for Vendetta

remember remember the 5th of november....

I hope it is something better than a switch-blade announcement. Not that the switchblade does not look good, but releasing a netbook with a fancy keyboad does not really show that PC gaming is not dead (their words not mine). Or justify full page spreads in papers saying what they did.

Also a new line PC's will also be disappointing, as I don't think that will 'save' the PC market (if it needs saving). Haven't we already been down that road with Alienware?

For the PC gaming being dead discussion, I have had this too many times, so I can summarise the situation as follows.

The PC market is not dead by any stretch, it is just that devs now no longer spend any time building games that play to PC's strengths, so the PC has not much change at differentiating itself from other formats. Until this changes, even though by no means dead, the PC gaming market is just as not healthy as it could be....

They are going to announce that someone actually bought the Hydra?

Though the things said in the campaign are true, i don't see how overpriced gaming apparel would help with that.

*looks at Steam*

Seriously, who the hell thinks PC gaming is actually DYING?

Skizle:

Irridium:
Yeah, I'm with you. PC gaming isn't dead/dying.

Does anyone even carry that view anymore?

I'm a PC gamer, and I find this whole thing very silly.

Give the option of Keyboard and mouse on and a console and the term "PC gaming" will become extinct and the proper term will be "Gaming"

Except for consoles still being closed systems and with crap backwards compatibility.

That is going to be an eventful day. I hope I'll remember to check on it when the time comes because I'll start playing Deus Ex: Human Revolution about 5 hours before that (On my PC of course).

Awwwww... I was hoping for a Glados-like voice.

C95J:
As a console gamer by trade who has recently bought a gaming computer, I sure hope PC gaming isn't dying out!

Also...

The_root_of_all_evil:

maddawg IAJI:
300 million?...Where they heck do they get that number? Yes, there are a lot of PC gamers. We already knew that, but 300 million is an EXTREME stretch.

Well, given there are 1 billion gamers in the world..., it doesn't sound quite that much of a stretch.

In fact, it's only .3% of all gamers...pretty low really. Depending on what version of a billion we're using.

Lets say 1 billion is 1000 million. Even if PC gamers consist of 300 million, the article says that there are more PC gamers than console gamers. That leaves at minimum 400 million gamers who don't play on a PC or Console, the majority.

So what do that majority of gamers play on?

DS.

Oh yeahhhhhh.

Wish they'd move to 3DS, I need folks to help me save myself. (It's a minigame...)

grimner:

Consoles, on the other hand, for all their being a bit old in the tooth, allow us to simply turn it on and play with the game already mostly optimized to the system it's being played on and with all the comfort of a huge ass tv and sofa. To me, the graphical trade off (and what, are we going to say that console games this days don't still offer us amazing visuals?) isn't enough to justify the hassle of having to buy a whole new pc just to have tesselation on Deus

30 or so modern console games in my house. Every last one had a day 1 patch and most have had multiple patches.

and the PS3 patches slowwwwww, even on N or landline.

Though I AM buying MORE titles for PS3 than PC... in fact... my last PC purchase was Bioshock 2, and all the games after that were all PS3... simply because My computer is too crappy to run ANY new games out there... I am a big action gamer, shooter to be exact... I HATE using pad to aim, I still like playing with mouse and keyboard, and I still like when games allow me to tweak my gaming experience to my desire/habit, if console gaming could offer me that... I'd consider my self to be a console gamer anyday... but that's not happening... so... my thing now is that I will endure the stupid pad aim... but the moment I get an upgrade (I mean the entire mother board, CPU, AND graphic card...etc), I am going to start buying PC games... simply because I like mouse aim better...but for now... I have to endure Deus Ex with stupid pad...

Haven't been worried since MovieBob made his video regarding the subject.

Why did they rip off V's speech from the first act of V for Vendetta? I don't understand. How hard is it to write an original manifesto?

maddawg IAJI:
300 million?...Where they heck do they get that number? Yes, there are a lot of PC gamers. We already knew that, but 300 million is an EXTREME stretch.

Really?

There are about 350 million people in the United States. But gamers include those in the US, Canada, Central and South America, all across both Western and Eastern Europe, Africa, The Middle East, Australia and New Zealand, and the Asia Pacific Rim.

And yes... people game in Africa. There are modern cities and nations with an infrastructure that supports modern Internet based PC gaming. Same in Brazil, Macedonia, Israel, Mexico, and many other places you can name. South Korea boasts a fully functioning and profitable professional gaming industry. Russia is the home of STALKER and plenty of other successful PC titles. My point... it's global.

300 million out of 6.5 billion... that is a very believable number of PC gamers.

I'm not even counting Chinese prisoners forced to gold farm on WoW.

OutrageousEmu:

Yeah, I'm sure Razer really moves a tonne of high end gaming PC and PC peripherals's to 40 year old housewives who only play Farmville.

My 40 year old wife is mad at me because I still haven't bought LA Noir yet. She plays on PC and xBox. She likes a lot of titles including the Dragon Age games, Fable 1,2,& 3, Neverwinter Nights... essentially any fantasy RPG. She earned her doctorate in psychology with a dissertation that focused on role playing games and their clinical and therapeutic applications. She finds time to game despite being a practicing clinical psychologist and a university professor.

My pedigree isn't as impressive as hers. I'm just a freelance writer and video producer, but at 44 I'm still young enough to be excited about the release of Rage (which I'm buying for PC) and I'm a regular TF2 and Civilization player. I've been gaming since I got my first Atari 2600 in the early 70s and I haven't looked back.

Gamers are older than you think, my friend. I'm certain you didn't mean to be... but when you cast derision upon "40 year old housewives who only play Farmville", you're being both ageist and sexist at the same time.

And... you are attacking gamers. Gamers aren't defined by how cool you think their games of choice are, but by whether or not they play games.

You are a gamer... and you know that gamers are often attacked by non-gamers. Governments want to censor games. Schools want to ban games. Gamers are often stereotyped as fat, lazy, and dumb. Claims are made that games cause crime. You know that isn't true. You know that you are a good person and a gamer.

So I guess my question is... why would anyone who is a gamer be trying to argue the point that the number of gamers is less than the number that it is? There is strength in numbers. No matter what kind of games a gamer plays, a gamer supports gaming. Don't try and kick people out of your click because they didn't pass your cool test.

PC gaming has always been, and always will be, the system of choice.

its a fact that a lot of more console exclusives are out now than say 5 years ago and that half of the pc games now are awful console ports (extreme condition anyone? they even had tutorial showing you the xbox buttons on pc). Pc does remain in few genres like strategy where consoles simply didnt find a way to dumb it down yet. but i doubt its going to take long *cough* clancys wars *cough*

long live pc gamers.
you never have the same reaction and feeling with a controller as you do with a mouse and keyboard. never could understand why people want to use a controller for a FPS game on a pc. i stick with my pc because for me, it will always be the best platform to play games. better graphics and controls.

the good thing about console though is, that you never have to worry about the requirements, wile with a pc you have too.

Looks interesting, wonder what's coming...

Did we really need them to advertise this? Okay, it's probably a front for advertising a product, but still...

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