Diablo 3 "Feels Even Better" With a Controller

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Oh, goodie. Another great series getting consolized. I'm not saying it will, but if Diablo 3 feels even a little bit dumbed down when compared to D1 & 2, I'll know why. If it turns out like DA:O's PC version, though, then I see no problem.

Satsuki666:
You can only use 6 skills at once in diablo 3, I controller has something like 18 buttons. I dont see the issue here.

Like I said once...this is exactly his point. They've already developed it with consoles in mind so they can do it while doing the least amount of work.

Despite saying otherwise about console cash-ins, they are going for them. I linked back to an article that was on this very site that said as much in an earlier post.

And moving your mouse to a location and clicking is in fact far faster than using an analogue stick. Whether you want to believe it or not. More accurate too.

Didn't they say like a week ago they weren't gonna make games for consoles? I smell delicious sellout

You mean I might have to share one of my favorite game series with console users? That's ridiculous!

I'm going to go boycott and petition for unnecessary changes until this is rectified!

Seriously?

Dyme:
Diablo 1 was on Playstation and it worked just fine.

Yeah, I played a lot of Diablo 1 on the PC, but when a buddy got it for PSX, we had a really great time, never mind the graphics seemed crummier than the PC counterpart and both heroes had to stay on the same screen. Ah, but you had your PC reflected in the water outside, that was a neat touch.

No one's forcing people to grab a controller, just that it's there if you want it.

captcha: mentation. tornds

I think it's trying to tell me something about Dune...

It took this long to figure that out?

I think Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance and Champions of Norrath games on the PS2 proved that Diablo works well on a console a long time ago.

Frostbite3789:

Satsuki666:
You can only use 6 skills at once in diablo 3, I controller has something like 18 buttons. I dont see the issue here.

Like I said once...this is exactly his point. They've already developed it with consoles in mind so they can do it while doing the least amount of work.

Despite saying otherwise about console cash-ins, they are going for them. I linked back to an article that was on this very site that said as much in an earlier post.

And moving your mouse to a location and clicking is in fact far faster than using an analogue stick. Whether you want to believe it or not. More accurate too.

You havnt made an actual point though. You are just throwing wild acusations with no point to stand on. Tell me how many active skills did you actually use at the same time in Diablo 2? I doubt you even needed to use more then six skills at once in that game. Plus you could only even have quick access to two skills at once. It is honestly far to early for you to be bitching about this since you know fuck all about the final product.

As to your mouse point in a RTS what you are saying would be relevent but in a game like Diablo it is not.

but doesn't this game only have 6 skill slots? Why wouldn't that work on the PS3 or 360 controller? You can use the shoulder buttons to fire, block, dodge/roll, and open menu. the d-pad and face buttons can be used for skills. Or they can do whatever Torchlight did, I dunno I don't own a 360

Satsuki666:

Frostbite3789:

Satsuki666:
You can only use 6 skills at once in diablo 3, I controller has something like 18 buttons. I dont see the issue here.

Like I said once...this is exactly his point. They've already developed it with consoles in mind so they can do it while doing the least amount of work.

Despite saying otherwise about console cash-ins, they are going for them. I linked back to an article that was on this very site that said as much in an earlier post.

And moving your mouse to a location and clicking is in fact far faster than using an analogue stick. Whether you want to believe it or not. More accurate too.

You havnt made an actual point though. You are just throwing wild acusations with no point to stand on. Tell me how many active skills did you actually use at the same time in Diablo 2? I doubt you even needed to use more then six skills at once in that game. Plus you could only even have quick access to two skills at once. It is honestly far to early for you to be bitching about this since you know fuck all about the final product.

As to your mouse point in a RTS what you are saying would be relevent but in a game like Diablo it is not.

I'm not even bitching. But that's cool. I'm pointing out what's an actual thing in the world.

And what are Diablo/MoBA games except RTS games where you control one unit? In both instances speed and accuracy are extremely important if you need to target something on the quick in the middle of a mob. Accuracy a

Also funny you say 'throwing around wild accusations'...while doing it yourself. I don't think having proof for one thing, and stating an opinion for another is throwing around wild accusations anywhere except where you're from apparently.

High five, guy!

Satsuki666:
Its impossible to actually say that for sure. Very very few console games have ever had inventory management or targeting problems. There have been plenty with a similiar style to diablo 3 the most recent of which was torchlight which didnt have any problems on the 360.

Absolutely not impossible. You have to scroll through each button with a controller, whereas with a mouse you're not constricted to buttons and can move the cursor freely, and, as such, multitudes of times faster.

Plus, I don't care about you not having problems. I don't care it if you didn't have problems playing it on a god damn SNES controller. I didn't have problems playing MoH: Underground on my PS1. Doesnt' change the fact that the targeting utterly and completely sucked in comparison (being controlled with the directionals +L1).

Because clicking a button on a keyboard is so much faster then clicking one on a controller.

Because clicking on the keyboard does not require you (in the case of the XYAB/PS3 equivalent) to take your only active finger off of another input (in this case the analog stick) to reach the buttons, then place it back.

You can only use 6 skills at once in diablo 3, I controller has something like 18 buttons. I dont see the issue here.

You can access a billion skills if you start taking possible (although not convenient in any way) variation buttons/button combinations into account. Note the quickly part, you can only access 4 abilities the fastest way possible, which is already slower than PCs to begin with. Then you can start getting into scrolling through spells with R1/L1 or the radial menu, but that's just ridiculous considering the pace of the game.

Yep cause those headset things are just so terrible and so much slower then typing.

You're making this too easy for me. I did say without calling people. There are multiple advantages to it: You don't have to listen to people (turn your music down, whatever) and you can participate in several conversations without it getting at all inconvenient.

And don't tell me pretty much being restricted to one really narrow type of conversation is good on any level.

Satsuki666:

E) You, being the generic console gamer, lose the ability to chat without calling people.

Yep cause those headset things are just so terrible and so much slower then typing.

Actually, if your decent at typing, you actually type faster then someone saying it, just depends on length and all that, but saying it just keeps your hands free.

It doesn't even matter guys because the game's going to be shit, even if it's good. When you think about it, the game is just a highly polished free to play that you also have to pay for.

The targeting issue can be rectified on consoles quite easily, by removing the cursor entirely. To attack, a character can simply walk up to an enemy (aim with the other stick if blizz is incorporating more complicated melee, rather than walk-up and swing), hit a, and the character will swing their weapon in that direction. To pick up items, walk to an item until they get a prompt (with the item's name) and hit x. If they want to pick up a specific item in a pile, hold down r trigger and hit x (and a list of items within pick-up range will appear with a box high lighting the one you can select, scrollable with the stick).

For spells, they could auto-target. Tilting the stick in a particular direction means they auto-target the furthest enemy in view in the given direction, etc. It's possible to miss enemies this way by aiming in a completely wrong direction. It could take some getting used to, but it shouldn't be all that painful for those used to the PC version. The same applies to ranged weapons; and it might make aiming easier if they incorporate both sticks into the mix; even use another button to set up an aim; I'm pretty sure characters have to pause to shoot ranged weapons anyway, don't they?

Playing diablo 1, I found it annoying to require precision clicking skills in order to pick up the exact item you needed (or sort through a pile of items from top to bottom via picking up every single one of them).

All that said, requiring online support is BS though.

Yay! Flame-bait! Really people, if the fact that some Blizzard twat prefers using a console controller to a K & M (which is entirely reasonable) it doesn't mean that the game will be "dumbed down" in comparison to the first two. For f*ck sake, the first Diablo was on the PS1, and the port was absolutely fine. And besides, top-downs are one of the few genres that work better with a controller. Yeah, I f*cking said it. Heresy, I know.

From what I've read in Torchlight reviews of the 360 version is that the controls worked well with a controller, so hopefully Blizzard can do the same with Diablo 3.

faspxina:
It took this long to figure that out?

I think Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance and Champions of Norrath games on the PS2 proved that Diablo works well on a console a long time ago.

Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance, for one, proved nothing except that even the most generic [piece of shit] dungeon crawler can sell on consoles. There is nothing about the dungeon crawler genre the game got right.

Hm...the only problem I had with Diablo on the PlayStation is that when I or my brother opened the menu, it paused the game for both of us. So if one of us wanted to keep going, we pestered the other person to hurry up. Can't remember if it did that while we were shopping too.

If you like using pretty much every skill in you inventory, then I think a mouse and keyboard is the better way to go. Easier to just hit one button than two or three. But I rarely used more than three skills, so a controller layout would be fine for me.
A good question though is how is Blizzard going to deal with the always-online stuff for the consoles. Not everyone has their console hooked up to the internet.

Well, if it does come out for the PS3 and it's the same game as the PC version, then I'm getting the PS3 one.

John Funk:
I'm sorry, but it's just not Diablo if you aren't breaking a mouse with clicking.

Many a mice have fallen in my gaming time with Diablo. Their sacrifices were for a greater cause and/or victims of unjustified rage.

OT: Well at least this time they made more a confirmation that it will be for consoles other than a 'Well, I don't know, it would be cool though huh?'

While this does annoy me a little, I will still be playing it on a PC since it would feel weird to me otherwise.

Blizzard is just like Harbinger. They love assuming direct control.

Meh, it doesn't matter. The consoles aren't portable enough to take with me on business trips and without a steady connection I can't play anyway.

As long as they don't trend towards making the UI and mechanics more controller centric, and push the keyboard off to the side, no big deal. Might even be fun to try with my ps3 controller for a while.

Mad Stalin:
Didn't they say like a week ago they weren't gonna make games for consoles? I smell delicious sellout

They didn't say they won't be making console games at all. They said that they won't port games which can't really be ported due to game mechanics. After all they have ported their games to consoles before.
And sellouts? Really? You know that you are talking about one of the biggest commercial game developers. They are literally swimming in money. But I don't know, maybe you have them confused with some indie studio.

Hammeroj:

A) You lose speed in any type of menu management and targeting.
B) You lose speed and convenience in selecting/executing skills.
C) You lose the amount of skills you can quickly access.

A is, by far, my biggest issue with any game like this. Menu navigation, especially with item heavy games like Borderlands or Oblivion, is normally so much easier with a mouse and keyboard. B & C are also very valid concerns - the only way round that would be mapping skills to the D pad and having a second bank available with a trigger pull.

Fiz_The_Toaster:

John Funk:
I'm sorry, but it's just not Diablo if you aren't breaking a mouse with clicking.

Many a mice have fallen in my gaming time with Diablo. Their sacrifices were for a greater cause and/or victims of unjustified rage.

OT: Well at least this time they made more a confirmation that it will be for consoles other than a 'Well, I don't know, it would be cool though huh?'

While this does annoy me a little, I will still be playing it on a PC since it would feel weird to me otherwise.

WTF do you people do to your mice playing Diablo games that breaks them so much, I've played quite a bit of Diablo and finished Diablo 2 plus hour and hours of gameplay afterward on an old first generation Microsoft optical mouse and it still works just like the day I bought it.

As for the use of a gamepad for Diablo 3, if it's an option in the PC version I'll give it a shot as long as I can use my Logitech Dual Action, I'm not buying a 360 controller for this. I think that it'll be a little weird at first but something that could be gotten used to. As long as I can put the controller down and use my mouse for inventory management and selling stuff and navigating dialogue trees.

I really see no reason to be all upset by this, maybe I've been doing it wrong all this time but I didn't have every key on my keyboard bound to something in the game and I barely used the number keys for anything other than drinking potions. I always had attack as left click and a skill as right click.

I kinda agree with that guys assesment that a game like Diablo lends itself for using a controller, better then any FPS game anyway.
If it "Feels better", is still a matter of comfort and taste so that's a stupid comment all together.
I wasn't gonna get it anyway with all the ridiculous DRM and the real-money auction house.
This is just another minor reason for me to be glad for passing on it.

As Long it isnt like Hunted :Demons Forge for PC, I don't mind.
The controls were horrible for pc.

I really dont see a problem with branching out your fan base, and the next logical step would be moving to consoles. I mean, look at it from the company's standpoint, they have a firm hold on computer gamers with WoW and starcraft, so where can you go from there that doesnt involve consoles? As long as they dont sacrifice quality, I say more power to them.

This will be my first Diablo game so I hope it comes to console because my computer can't handle most games and I do not have money to spend on a gaming computer.

As a veteran of Baldurs Gate: Dark Alliance I can say this kind of game works fantastically with a controller. They just need not to fall into the pitfall nearly every developer of that kind of games does (Including the first BA DA). Face Buttons = Spells. It doesn't matter if you have to press a modify key to use them, or if environment interaction has to be done via menu, you need easy access to your main spells; a single quick-spell button does not cut it. (Take note Magicka guys. Controller users are getting schooled by keyboard users. Make 4 face buttons = first 4 elements; 4 face buttons + right trigger = next 4 elements)

Andy Chalk:
Diablo 3 "Feels Even Better" With a Controller

"We don't see ourselves as a PC developer - we see ourselves as a game developer"

This, however, is still worrying. If they start developing for multiple platforms not only will their games lose the gameplay-first focus they're known for, they'll also be tied down to console hardware and licensing crap. Never a good sign.

Good. If you put it on the xbox, I will buy it.

Jodah:

Sober Thal:
What's sad is that this will probably upset some PC gamers. Why? I have no idea.

I look forward to trying this game on a console.

EDIT: A controller easily has 16 buttons to use, over 30 if you incorporate holding the triggers to map buttons twice. This game should be fine on a controller.

The reason most PC gamers complain is because of bad console->PC ports. While it is possible to have 16-30 buttons on a controller, very very few games actually do that. Many PC gamers want lots of options and abilities at once.

This is only part of the reason. The other part is that controls are (my god I feel like I've said this a million times...) more precise on PC. A mouse will more or less always have better pinpoint targeting than a gamepad. When creating gameplay where you can expect your players to be x good, you can make your game x hard/challenging/fun. If there is a pile of gamers that have y potential on their controls instead of x...you compromise. The gameplay cannot be hard enough to be impossible for the y crowd...so you make it easier, or different. THIS IS THE PROBLEM. The Game is not what it could have been, because of design compromise.

Honestly I feel like I've explained this a gazillion times and it really shouldnt be that hard to understand for someone who has had at least a bit of contact with both a mouse and a gamepad.

Edit: Since I'm bored I'll even try to paint an example. In your head.

Imagine the sorceress from D2. Imagine you are casting a fireball. Imagine you throw a fireball at a bunch of approaching skeletons. Imagine there are enemies approaching from the other side, or someone teleports there.

Scenario 1: Mouse: You quickly and precisely move your cursor on the other side of your toon in the middle of the crowd and fire a fireball, decimating the enemies.

Scenario 2: Gamepad: You want to target those other enemies, but how?

Possibility 1: You control a cursor with the analog sticks, and move it over to the other enemy crowd and fire a fireball. This works in the same way as the mouse: But anyone suggesting that this is equally precise will get nothing but extreme contempt and ridicule from me. You simply have no clue what you are talking about.

Possibility 2: You move your character around with the analog stick and face the other crowd, then trying to judge how you are facing, fire the fireball at the other crowd. The longer the distance the less of a failed angle is needed for the fireball to go off course and maybe not hit them at all. This is not nearly as precise. How do we solve this? Autoaim I guess.

The same example could be used for teleportation. If any of you consolers have played Diablo 2 with a high level sorceress, teleported around like crazy and thrown frozen orbs...PLEASE tell me how this gameplay could be achieved as precisely with a gamepad?

The compromise will be a slower and stupider game because gamepads cant compete with the mouses' precision.

Compromise will kill the gameplay that PC gamers love! This is what consolization is! Understand it! Dattebayo!

If it is good on the controller it will suck with a keyboard and mouse. See Fallout 3, Borderlands, Prototype, Just Cause 2, Oblivion, Bioshock as examples of consolification screwing up PC interfaces.

Basically this is Blizz admitting they developed D3 for the console because that is where the money is.

But it doesn't matter if it came with rainbow farting unicorns. Without offline single player I'm not getting it.

D3 no, torchlight 2 yes.

Stryc9:

Fiz_The_Toaster:
Snip

WTF do you people do to your mice playing Diablo games that breaks them so much, I've played quite a bit of Diablo and finished Diablo 2 plus hour and hours of gameplay afterward on an old first generation Microsoft optical mouse and it still works just like the day I bought it.

As for the use of a gamepad for Diablo 3, if it's an option in the PC version I'll give it a shot as long as I can use my Logitech Dual Action, I'm not buying a 360 controller for this. I think that it'll be a little weird at first but something that could be gotten used to. As long as I can put the controller down and use my mouse for inventory management and selling stuff and navigating dialogue trees.

I really see no reason to be all upset by this, maybe I've been doing it wrong all this time but I didn't have every key on my keyboard bound to something in the game and I barely used the number keys for anything other than drinking potions. I always had attack as left click and a skill as right click.

I've only broken a grand total of two from both Diablo games, one I've slammed down too hard and the other it stopped working because I'd grip it too hard when I got angry.

I'm not upset over this, a little annoyed because they've been teasing about it for so long because just about everyone knew this was going to happen and it's weird since I'm so used to mouse and keyboard. I'm sure it will be fine with a controller, but I'm sticking to my mouse.

Personally, the only reason I'd be upset with this is that if they sacrifice the versatility of the PC interface just to make it more console-friendly. That's the only reason why any PC gamer would complain about this sort of thing. Sadly, it seems like that is happening.

Hammeroj:
Snip.

So, just because a console version would be arguably worse (I say arguably because while your points are valid, whether that loss of speed and precision actually bothers someone is entirely up to that individual), means that it shouldn't be done at all?

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