BioWare Uses Stock Photo for Tali in Mass Effect 3

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TheDrunkNinja:
But here's the thing. I already knew from the moment I finally romanced her that no reveal, no matter how good or bad, would be good enough.

I'm afraid that sentence managed to register a solid 8/10 on my creepy scale. But it's probably just because I immediately leapt to the Viva Piņata meaning of the word "romanced". ;)

OT: I always thought the whole appeal of Tali was that no one knew what she looked like, so she could be anyone. While Miranda was just a generically attractive woman, Tali could be that girl you were too shy to ask out in school. So I'm a little surprised that Bioware chose to give her a face at all. But I suppose they felt they should tie up all the loose ends.

Why am I pissed off about this?

Because Bioware had a memorable character and after five years they couldn't be bothered to do her justice. They basically just did this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JwLLk3f4yU

It's this lazy artwork, their practice of cutting corners and their terrible copy-pasted level design that makes bioware an awful company.

Does it impeded on the Mass Effect gameplay? No. Is it evidence of Bioware's quality continuing it's downward spiral? Yes.

Zach Despain:
Does it impeded on the Mass Effect gameplay? No.

None of Mass Effect's story does. This is why people jumped on Jennifer Hepler. Her comments about skipping gameplay made a lot of people realise that Bioware leaves all exposition to the cutscenes and leaves the gameplay to just be repeated running and cover shooting sections. They never cross the two, it's bad design.

You can play through Mass Effect and ignore all the gameplay sequences and stick exclusively to the cutscenes and you'll be missing quite literally none of the story.

Tali could have been Bruce Campbell and people still would have been disappointed. There was no way they were going to win with this sort of thing.

Darkmantle:

Waaghpowa:
I'm not going to get enraged about this, but it all comes off as somewhat suspicious. I just can't tell if it was intentionally done or laziness.

I've heard it was intentional actually, but sorry if someone already mentioned this to you :P

I mentioned in a later post that I don't have TV, so that's why I didn't know.

Strain42:
Tali could have been Bruce Campbell and people still would have been disappointed. There was no way they were going to win with this sort of thing.

Why bother with the time and money of creating our own unique characters when we can just use royalty free images? There's no difference right? It's not like it was an important character or anything, right?

No one was pissed off about this until they found out what bioware did. It's not about revealing the face or what it's relevance was to the story, it's that they put zero effort, time, money or creativity into doing it, with a character we've grown to know and like for over five years. At least if they had Bruce Campbell they would have actually had to put a bit of work or thought into it.

Everyone needs to watch this video:
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2011/04/22/mass-effect-3-creating-garrus.aspx

Its from Bioware, and they say (about 5 minutes in) that Tali DOES INDEED HAVE HAIR!

And long hair at that. Everyone needs to stop saying that Quarians shouldn't have hair.

I think part of the issue with Tali is simply that she was intended to be a secondary character intended for very specific lore and plot purposes that happened to take off in popularity to the point where Bioware was kind of unprepared to expand on it to the extent that the so called "Talimancers" wanted.

As far as using a stock image goes, you have to understand that Bioware has been dialing it in for years now. Mass Effect 2 & 3 and Dragon Age 2 were undergoing most of their development during the meat of developent of The Old Republic. Given the budget for their MMO, Bioware was doubtlessly being made by EA to focus most of their energy on their big product, while at the same time juggling the simultenaous development of multiple franchises. Something that doesn't work for a company that achieved it's level of quality by focusing on one title "until it's done". When it comes to creation, it's about the people making things, simply hiring more people and putting them on projects does not make them as good as the original creators as well... and I think with the energies of the original Bioware staff so heavily divided, the quality is doubtlessly suffering.

To put things into perspective this is the "lazy" version of what they did with Dragon Age: Origins which had years of dev time according to their hype before they started ToR, which was in part why there was some varying graphics quality due to the time things were created (which many people have talked about). For the ladies in DA:O they hired live models (whom were promoted when they game came out) to act as the physical/facial prescences they were going to animate. With Tali they found they needed a real actress rather than being able to keep her a cartoon, and grabbed a pic, rather than finding someone to actually play the character. The result being kind of obvious... though I suppose it works.

It all comes down to cutting corners, and part of the problem is that as ME-3 was being developed you had some portly EA Overseer probably wandering the offices with a whip and cattleprod going on about the needs to get TOR out as the #1 priority.

With ToR out, it remains to be seen if Bioware will get back to their old patterns and produce some truely exceptional games again, of course it might just mean that EA will heap tons more projects on them, or demand they focus their attention entirely on the inevitable ToR expansions.

That said, for those who read this far, when I say "go back to making exceptional games" I mean that literally. Seriously, what does "Mass Effect 3" have in it that makes it all that wonderful right now. All those cinematics were awesome back when Bioware started doing them in the last decade but they really haven't evolved. The gameplay has turned into a shooter, and reslly there are tons of third person shooters out there, and none of those aspects are things we haven't seen before, or probably haven't seen done better... perhaps even by Bioware itself. "Mass Effect 3" is a good game, but I'm not sure if it can be called exceptional because very little of it actually stands out from things I've seen before. I can look at games of a similar sort done by Bioware in the past (without going into other companies) and say that as a game they were better. Knights Of The Old Republic, Jade Empire, Dragon Age: Origins, and others. The technology/graphics quality for ME-3 is better but there is more than that to a game.

Oh and I did kind of spoil the endings for myself, but I won't do it for others, I will doubtlessly say some things about it before... but a lot of the things I said in comparing Mass Effect to Saberhagan's Berserkers and things that we were likely to see, I was right about a lot of them, especially one major ending possibility. While writing can't be totally unique, especially nowadays (just about everything arguably being based on something else) I must say that I don't think the direction they wound up going with quite delivered on the promise of the first game.

To the poster that said that he doesn't like having to pay '$870' to 'fully' enjoy the game; you don't.

The full game is only about $80. Its the stuff on the disc (you know, the full game as intended to be played by Bioware) and the DLC mission 'From Ashes'. The other DLC is stuff for multiplayer. Stuff that you can also unlock by playing the multiplayer.

That DLC is for impatient people who want it 'NOW!', instead of working for their weapons, mods, and characters.

Gotham City Impostors does the same with their DLC, its all available for free if you play the game, or you can buy it and get it 'NOW!'.

It's not about it changing the game experience, it's about the attitude toward aspects of the game by the developer.

Just disappoints me. It's like, "C'mon, guys, seriously?". Not worth the rage really, just...meh.

Hmm...Mass Effect & Dragon Age: Origins were quality products, genuine works of art in the gaming medium. Smelled like victory.

When I played Mass Effect 2, I occasionally smelled a faint waft of feces, like I had unknowingly tread in dogshit on the walk home. That said, I thought it was overall an excellent product which made significant improvements to many of ME1's core mechanics.

When I was playing Dragon Age 2, there was an ever-present foul sewer stench with intermittent periods of torrential shit-rain. I figured the entire Bioware staff had a brain-fart/gone-drinkin'. Everyone makes mistakes, that's life.

After hearing about them using a stock photo for a notable supporting character, my expectations of ME3 changed from mostly positive to slightly suspicious. I decided to spoil the From Ashes DLC and the three different endings by taking a browse through youtube. I am a little disappointed with what I have seen so far, but am still hopeful that the meat of the game will be enjoyable. From the Tali photo, to the manipulative Prothean DLC (not integral to Shepard's story but still very lore heavy), to the questionable quality of the writing...it all hints at a project which has been hastily and/or lazily developed, an increasingly common compliant of recent Bioware products (I'm not talking about bug or glitches. Bioware has released products in a buggy state for many years). I shouldn't judge as I haven't even purchased the game yet, but did...did somebody tread in dogshit? Check your shoes before you come into the house...

Ouch, that is some laziness on their part.

I'm not even a fan of Mass Effect but fucking hell that is a dick move and a half.

Abedeus:

Roganzar:
Eh!?!
This is not game changing in any way. Mass Effect 3 is a great game with a well crafted story and using stock photos to create something else is not a bad thing. We all need inspiration.

They spend hundreds of dollars to launch several copies of the game that make a handful of people will find (if they don't fall into the ocean), but when it comes to unveiling a race of previously permanently veiled aliens, they take some random kid off the street, $15 photo and half an hour in photoshop later they put this piece of crap in an AAA game.

And you expect us to be happy? Bioware isn't a God damn indie developer, it's a massive and probably one of the oldest active developers on the scene.

There is a difference between EA and Bioware. Bioware made the game, EA published and marketed the game.
Beyond that I don't care about anyone else's opinion of this. I simply offered my own.
However if this causes you, and other people get anger, you all need something better to do.
Now if you'll excuse me I'm off to play more Mass Effect 3.

Roganzar:

Abedeus:

Roganzar:
Eh!?!
This is not game changing in any way. Mass Effect 3 is a great game with a well crafted story and using stock photos to create something else is not a bad thing. We all need inspiration.

They spend hundreds of dollars to launch several copies of the game that make a handful of people will find (if they don't fall into the ocean), but when it comes to unveiling a race of previously permanently veiled aliens, they take some random kid off the street, $15 photo and half an hour in photoshop later they put this piece of crap in an AAA game.

And you expect us to be happy? Bioware isn't a God damn indie developer, it's a massive and probably one of the oldest active developers on the scene.

There is a difference between EA and Bioware. Bioware made the game, EA published and marketed the game.
Beyond that I don't care about anyone else's opinion of this. I simply offered my own.
However if this causes you, and other people get anger, you all need something better to do.
Now if you'll excuse me I'm off to play more Mass Effect 3.

I have to agree with you.

I got the game today and I can't believe how much better everything is. Getting pissed off at something like this seems trivial compared to how great the rest of the game is.

While there's nothing wrong with using stock images, it pays to put in some effort in the untimely depicition of a main character who players have grown attatched to. I wouldn't see all this as a reason to be upset over, however; Dissapointed, maybe, but not royally upset.

Besides, it's still a good game in the end, isn't it? Not that I would know..I could never get through the first game..too boring :p

Trishbot:
Trust me, when these fans get to the ending of the game, they'll have something WORTHWHILE to rage about. Compared to the endings, the Tali controversy is negligible and will be quickly forgotten.

But those endings.... WOW. I think the official Bioware poll has it at 96% of nearly 3,000 polled hate the endings.

Why do they suck? I've been avoiding them so far, and I would like to get the gist of why people hate them.

THATS what ive been fantasising about... I gotta admit, im fairly disapoint...

i can live with that. At least she is hot and not say that one comic i saw where it turns out she had a tentacle face. (it was either on PA or here i can't remember heh)

It's a terrible thing, it really is. I'm sorry, but if all you want to do is wave around your story, then make a movie, graphic novel, something. But to make a game, you need to make GAMEPLAY, it has to be the top priority. That is not to say that story isn't important, in no way. I personally hate it when a game has a haphazard story, just sort of thrown together.

It does seem kind of lazy to use a stock photo instead of creating the the image themselves. At the same time though that is how I imagined Tali would like so it really doesn't bother me all that much.

Machine Man 1992:

Trishbot:
Trust me, when these fans get to the ending of the game, they'll have something WORTHWHILE to rage about. Compared to the endings, the Tali controversy is negligible and will be quickly forgotten.

But those endings.... WOW. I think the official Bioware poll has it at 96% of nearly 3,000 polled hate the endings.

Why do they suck? I've been avoiding them so far, and I would like to get the gist of why people hate them.

Honestly the best way I can say it without spoiling it is they ripped them from one of the most popular sci-fi games in existence. I won't say which since odds are you know of it but when you best it if you don't know just go google it and it will be apparent immediately. Also if/when you do and you don't get it I will say that game is probably the most influencial game for any developer making anything even remotely like it so there's basically no chance Bioware doesn't know it. Especially since many of the writers have said they know of the game and love it.

Well I'm very disappointed. Tali is my favorite character in the mass effect universe and to see her big face reveal treated in such a lazy way just annoys me greatly. They should have kept her behind the mask.

FenixZero:
Everyone needs to watch this video:
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2011/04/22/mass-effect-3-creating-garrus.aspx

Its from Bioware, and they say (about 5 minutes in) that Tali DOES INDEED HAVE HAIR!

And long hair at that. Everyone needs to stop saying that Quarians shouldn't have hair.

He was referring to the hood on Tali's suit as representing her hair. He doesn't actually say that she has hair.

80Maxwell08:

Machine Man 1992:

Trishbot:
-Snip-

-Snip-

Honestly the best way I can say it without spoiling it is they ripped them from one of the most popular sci-fi games in existence. I won't say which since odds are you know of it but when you best it if you don't know just go google it and it will be apparent immediately. Also if/when you do and you don't get it I will say that game is probably the most influencial game for any developer making anything even remotely like it so there's basically no chance Bioware doesn't know it. Especially since many of the writers have said they know of the game and love it.

imageDo I win the prize?

I always said they should've kept Tali's face a mystery.

I think its a decently pretty picture of a woman whos been part of my ME team for several years now.

There is nothing wrong with what they did, if they payed the licencing fee. I couldnt care less if the editing to the image is good, or bad, or if the person they picked doesnt look anything like Tali i imagined. ((Its not far off, but i excepted a more Roundish nerdy face.))

I dont see why people are freaking out. Its a picture. The world isnt going to end because they decided "Lets just use a good picture to begin with, instead of spending tens of thousands of dollars and a lot of development time trying to get a photographer, camera equipment, and the PERFECT WOMAN WHO WILL MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY just so we can make a single photo of a fictional character."

I personally see nothing wrong with it. Its morally neutral and doesnt deserve any reaction at all. Its a picture.

Why does the escapist let Tito publish stories on BioWare? He's gone on record as a fanboy of the studio. The man simply cannot be trusted to reliably report on anything about the studio.

Seriously, I personally don't see a problem with BioWare using stock photos. I think it's lazy, but there's nothing inherently wrong with it, and frankly, I'd rather they spent their time on more important development things. However, Tito can't report on anything about BioWare without defending them.

Tito is the worst kind of Fanboy. Not only does he seem incapable of admitted fault with the company, he also has, several times, made comments that indicate that he thinks anyone with something negative to say has ulterior motives or is just deluding themselves.

I have no problems with anything else Tito does here on the escapist (barring his LotR: War in the North review), but reporting on BioWare is just something he should not do. Yes, I know he's really interested in the company and what they do. Yes, he has a right to post what he wants. He shouldn't do it in an official capacity, though. If he wants to post something, do it as a normal post, not a news item. Let other, more objective people make the news posts.

OT: I just think they should have left Tali's face covered. That was part of her appeal, imo.

Me: OMG CANT WAIT TO SEE TALI'S FACE!
Bioware: -Hands me a 'shopped postcard- there you go!
Me: uhm...that is it.
Bioware: Yep!
Me: Well...should have seen that coming.

kouriichi:
I think its a decently pretty picture of a woman whos been part of my ME team for several years now.

There is nothing wrong with what they did, if they payed the licencing fee. I couldnt care less if the editing to the image is good, or bad, or if the person they picked doesnt look anything like Tali i imagined. ((Its not far off, but i excepted a more Roundish nerdy face.))

I dont see why people are freaking out. Its a picture. The world isnt going to end because they decided "Lets just use a good picture to begin with, instead of spending tens of thousands of dollars and a lot of development time trying to get a photographer, camera equipment, and the PERFECT WOMAN WHO WILL MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY just so we can make a single photo of a fictional character."

I personally see nothing wrong with it. Its morally neutral and doesnt deserve any reaction at all. Its a picture.

well considering other character models are based on their voice actors i find it odd they didnt just edit a picture of tali's voice actor

then there's the terrible editing of the picture itself...look at the hand...how many knuckles are there?

then there's the setting, 'tali' is outside of her suit on a planet. also has very long hair. this kind of goes against the lore of the quarians over all

so aside from not using their own resources, ignoring the background lore and general bad quality of the edit i completely agree with you

Ah, fanboy pissing and moaning, thou hast not stopped being an invaluable fount of enterainment.

Just have one thing to say. "So?"

Also which lore states that Quarians lack hair? Because if its from the books, then consider this this (from the core lore source: the game) to be a retcon.

This is one of the reason that I NEVER read any of the expanded universes of any of the series that I like. They make good stories, but then the core creators change something and people go crazy.

I admit.

I'm disappointed.

Tali's face is of course not a deal breaker for me, but...so many cut corners, for fucks sake, it really bothers me. so many bloody retcons and plot holes.

The gameplay is good, but I feel....so, so bothered at all these things. Mass Effect 2 was the best of the series, in my opinion.

Hmmm you know before ME3 was released I said no matter what there is going to be poeple complaining about her face if it is/isn't revealed but now that what we see is a photo with 10 minutes of photoshop done on it all I can say is Bioware that's really Fucking lazy

The Great JT:
Ah, fanboy pissing and moaning, thou hast not stopped being an invaluable fount of enterainment.

Who's pissing and moaning? It seems that most of the unnecessary whingeing is coming from the people defending this. As was already mentioned, there are far worse reasons to piss and moan at Bioware about this game (like the ripped off endings for one example, and i'm not talking about the Winter Space picture either...), most people posting here aside from the few loonies (in both camps) are legitimately upset about the fact that a major character in a AAA role playing game, after Bioware themselves hyping it up (see: http://kotaku.com/5817782/mass-effect-3s-makers-arent-ready-for-talis-closeup ), was just seemingly shoe-horned in at the last minute with an extremely poor photoshop job. Not to mention the fact that it completely contradicts their own lore, you know, the reason most people play games like this.

I understand that Bioware wanted to "bring in the Call of Duty audience", and that they wanted to make Mass Effect 3 "the entry point into the series", which would actually explain why a lot of you just toss this aside and don't care. But for the people who actually enjoy RPGs and have been following the game series from its early beginnings, only to watch it slowly degrade over time into the blundering mess it has become, it's just saddening.

I don't see how this is hard for some of you people to understand.

18.99PlusTip:
On a slightly lighter note, here's a video that made the whole thing worth it in my eyes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIzzCIQAm7Y

(embedding - how does it work!?)

I think after watching that video and laughing a bit I find it disturbing that someone changed the color for the comparison. In that video you posted clearly see it in full color and not the black and white of the comparison.

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