Capcom Defends Locked Content in Street Fighter X Tekken

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Capcom Defends Locked Content in Street Fighter X Tekken

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Capcom says the locked on-disc content in Street Fighter X Tekken is exactly the same as conventional DLC.

There was no small amount of stinko raised when it came to light that planned DLC for Street Fighter X Tekken is already on the retail disc, locked away until some future date and for some future price. The feeling among a significant number of gamers is that if the material is ready for release alongside the game, it should be released as part of the game and not held back to be unlocked later as faux-DLC.

But Capcom is having none of that. In a response to complaints made to the Better Business Bureau that was also sent to aggrieved gamers, Capcom said Street Fighter X Tekken is a well-loaded game that "provides great value for all players from day one." More to the point, it asserted that DLC is DLC and the only question is one of delivery method.

"While Capcom is sorry that some of its fans are not happy about the chosen method of delivery for the DLC, we believe that this method will provide more flexible and efficient gameplay throughout the game's lifecycle," the publisher wrote. "There is effectively no distinction between the DLC being 'locked' behind the disc and available for unlocking at a later date, or being available through a full download at a later date, other than delivery mechanism. We hope that this addresses [censored]'s concerns."

Does it? I'm inclined to think that if you're satisfied with the game you got for the price you paid, it should be irrelevant whether "extra" content is hidden on the disc or released online two months later. But I'm also pretty sure that gamers angry enough to file formal complaints to the BBB probably won't be super-happy to be so casually dismissed. Capcom may well have at least an arguable point, but it will almost certainly be drowned out by furor over the unfortunately cavalier way it's trying to make it.

Source: Cinema Blend

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THIS is my problem with On-Disk DLC: I don't think it should be free, I think it shouldn't even exist! If we accept paying extra for content that had finished production AND testing soon enough to be included with shipping, we're essentially giving them a blank check to withhold as much of the game as they please. If they produce bonus material at a latter date I'll pay for it, but if it's included on the disk it should be included in the game. No gimmicks!

I haven't been keeping up with this topic, but is this DLC like Mass Effect 3's where the content on the disc is just a placeholder for future DLC or is it all actually on the disc? If it's the latter then that just really rubs me the wrong way.

Well done Capcom. I FEEL SO MUCH BETTER NOW THANKS!

I haven't bought a Capcom game since Resident Evil 5 and my boycott is still going strong. It's not exactly the fact that Capcom does stupid stuff with DLC, it's the fact that Capcom had everything lined up and printed on the discs but tells you, you can get it later after paying more money. SFxTK is a major case of blatant greed when all console DLC characters were already on the Vita version of the game.

http://www.joystiq.com/2012/03/02/street-fighter-x-tekkens-12-ps-vita-characters-will-come-to-con/

So not only did they have all 12 special characters finished enough for the Vita, they also had all the character data on the disks when the game launched. Imagine if an author wrote a book and decided to have it released on paper and digital but only the digital version had extra chapters but the publisher announced that there will be an amended version for the paperback coming out eventually that you'll have to pay for. Would you buy that book?

I can't wait until Angry Joe gets wind of this. I bet he'll go on a massive tirade.

when i pay my sixty euros, i pay for all the work that is finished so far. all the DLC on disc is finished and working only hidden. now you expect from me that a pay again for content that i paid already for in my mind?

what happened to the expansions? i bought those for 30 euros without any problem because it was created and finished after the initial release. i paid for the work done on that expansion. then we got DLC which should have been the same idea, but with the possibility to get smaller content for lower prices. what happens now it that they create a game. decide what will be DLC, make that too, make the game work and then lock the pre- determined content. that is not DOWNLOADABLE CONTENT! it is CLOD: Content Locked On Disc.

and capcom being capcom, if for some reason they decide to give a popular game some new content, they make a new disc release, like what happened with MvsC3. at that moment they never heard of DLC.

The sad part is this isn't even the worst thing they've done recently. They are already selling the ending to Asura's Wrath as DLC and not even bothering to hide it. Go find the youtube video of it and it will say the "true ending DLC" for $6.

I have to say, it's actually sort of refreshing for a company to just come out and say it. None of this meandering around the point, trying to justify it in a way that doesn't make them look like the 'bad guys'. So, in conclusion Capcom has actually become Umbrella; huge, focused on money and trying to justify their actions with harsh but none the less sound (if slightly insane) logic.

Keep it up you silly, silly people! Can you at least start your next AGM with: "Plan for 2013: complete, global, saturation."

Eh, screw you Capcom and your anti-consumer BS. I feel no pity for you and your falling profits. If you mess with consumers and screw them over, you deserve to go out of business, and I will feel no pity when you do. That is how proper capitalism works, baby. >:(

Seriously, if stuff is finished, ready to go, and on the disc, include it in the game. Doing otherwise makes you look like a magnificent ass and only gets consumers angry. Like my mother says "If you continue to poke a badger, do not be astonished when the badger eventually bites back".

BreakfastMan:
Eh, screw you Capcom and your anti-consumer BS. I feel no pity for you and your falling profits. If you mess with consumers and screw them over, you deserve to go out of business, and I will feel no pity when you do. That is how proper capitalism works, baby. >:(

Seriously, if stuff is finished, ready to go, and on the disc, include it in the game. Doing otherwise makes you look like a magnificent ass and only gets consumers angry. Like my mother says "If you continue to poke a badger, do not be astonished when the badger eventually bites back".

Capcom only has "failing" profits when they release something that doesn't feature Ryu. Even if it doesn't they had relative success with other games but they want everything they make to have the force of Street Fighter. Devil May Cry 4 did well with 3.something million copies sold. So the brains at Capcom decided to screw everything that's been established, go on record as saying they want to alienate the fans and they say they want at least 5 millions copies of DMC5 (DmC) sold.

Capcom will never see 5 million units sold, will blame the fans and it will go on the shelf next to Darkstalkers, Power Stone and many other good games so they can focus on putting Ryu in a gold Elvis jump suit for the next DLC... that many people will buy because the dedicated SF fanbase is one of the most blind fanatical groups around.

Kheapathic:

BreakfastMan:
Eh, screw you Capcom and your anti-consumer BS. I feel no pity for you and your falling profits. If you mess with consumers and screw them over, you deserve to go out of business, and I will feel no pity when you do. That is how proper capitalism works, baby. >:(

Seriously, if stuff is finished, ready to go, and on the disc, include it in the game. Doing otherwise makes you look like a magnificent ass and only gets consumers angry. Like my mother says "If you continue to poke a badger, do not be astonished when the badger eventually bites back".

Capcom only has "failing" profits when they release something that doesn't feature Ryu. Even if it doesn't they had relative success with other games but they want everything they make to have the force of Street Fighter. Devil May Cry 4 did well with 3.something million copies sold. So the brains at Capcom decided to screw everything that's been established, go on record as saying they want to alienate the fans and they say they want at least 5 millions copies of DMC5 (DmC) sold.

Capcom will never see 5 million units sold, will blame the fans and it will go on the shelf next to Darkstalkers, Power Stone and many other good games so they can focus on putting Ryu in a gold Elvis jump suit for the next DLC... that many people will buy because the dedicated SF fanbase is one of the most blind fanatical groups around.

And that makes me sad that gamers are so loyal to brand names that they cannot see anti-consumer practices when they are right in front of their face. We, as a group, really need to learn how to vote with our wallets...

I see Capcom is pushing the envelope as far as gamers will let them.

You know what to do.

DVS BSTrD:
THIS is my problem with On-Disk DLC: I don't think it should be free, I think it shouldn't even exist! If we accept paying extra for content that had finished production AND testing soon enough to be included with shipping, we're essentially giving them a blank check to withhold as much of the game as they please. If they produce bonus material at a latter date I'll pay for it, but if it's included on the disk it should be included in the game. No gimmicks!

You only give them a blank check if you're a blind enough sheep to buy a game that has no content. What I want to know is why you think people will buy a game where they've withheld everything?

There is enough on the Street Fighter X Tekken disc to justify the price without the extra characters. Therefore, what you're doing is demanding extra content for free. When they made this extra content is completely and utterly irrelevant.

blackdwarf:
when i pay my sixty euros, i pay for all the work that is finished so far.

So by your logic, deleted scenes in a movie is tantamount to theft.

Foolproof:

DVS BSTrD:
THIS is my problem with On-Disk DLC: I don't think it should be free, I think it shouldn't even exist! If we accept paying extra for content that had finished production AND testing soon enough to be included with shipping, we're essentially giving them a blank check to withhold as much of the game as they please. If they produce bonus material at a latter date I'll pay for it, but if it's included on the disk it should be included in the game. No gimmicks!

You only give them a blank check if you're a blind enough sheep to buy a game that has no content. What I want to know is why you think people will buy a game where they've withheld everything?

There is enough on the Street Fighter X Tekken disc to justify the price without the extra characters. Therefore, what you're doing is demanding extra content for free. When they made this extra content is completely and utterly irrelevant.

blackdwarf:
when i pay my sixty euros, i pay for all the work that is finished so far.

So by your logic, deleted scenes in a movie is tantamount to theft.

I think you're missing the point a bit. I know a car analogy doesn't work well with games but I'm gonna try it. You buy a new car, a 4 door sedan with possible seating of 3 in the back. But because the corporation/dealer wants to be a shady mug they block off the entire backseat area and make it impossible to access. Yes there's enough value of the car there but you're blocked from accessing what it was built with.

Extremely hypothetical but I hope it gets the point across.

So, in Capcom's looney nonsense world, DLC, downloadable content, content that you DOWNLOAD, is no different than content on the disc you NEVER download?

Seriously, someone answer me; how can it be advertised as DLC, downloadable content, if the content is NOT DOWNLOADED?

There's characters aren't even unfinished. Hackers have been playing as them online in FULL.

Kheapathic:

Foolproof:

DVS BSTrD:
THIS is my problem with On-Disk DLC: I don't think it should be free, I think it shouldn't even exist! If we accept paying extra for content that had finished production AND testing soon enough to be included with shipping, we're essentially giving them a blank check to withhold as much of the game as they please. If they produce bonus material at a latter date I'll pay for it, but if it's included on the disk it should be included in the game. No gimmicks!

You only give them a blank check if you're a blind enough sheep to buy a game that has no content. What I want to know is why you think people will buy a game where they've withheld everything?

There is enough on the Street Fighter X Tekken disc to justify the price without the extra characters. Therefore, what you're doing is demanding extra content for free. When they made this extra content is completely and utterly irrelevant.

blackdwarf:
when i pay my sixty euros, i pay for all the work that is finished so far.

So by your logic, deleted scenes in a movie is tantamount to theft.

I think you're missing the point a bit. I know a car analogy doesn't work well with games but I'm gonna try it. You buy a new car, a 4 door sedan with possible seating of 3 in the back. But because the corporation/dealer wants to be a shady mug they block off the entire backseat area and make it impossible to access. Yes there's enough value of the car there but you're blocked from accessing what it was built with.

Extremely hypothetical but I hope it gets the point across.

No it doesn't, because you've mixed up a necessity with an extra. Lets try a better analogy.

They build you the four door sedan, and they throw in the rear headrest DVD players at no extra cost. They never once advertised this feature, and there are no ads promising you this feature for free. There have been news reports, but the car manufacturer is not legally accountable for news reports made about them. However, they don't activate it. In order to activate the rear headset DVD player, they're gonna have to charge you extra. If you don't want it, thats fine, just don't pay them for it. If you do, just pay them what you owe for the in-built DVD players.

Understand me yet?

Foolproof:

Kheapathic:

Foolproof:
You only give them a blank check if you're a blind enough sheep to buy a game that has no content. What I want to know is why you think people will buy a game where they've withheld everything?

There is enough on the Street Fighter X Tekken disc to justify the price without the extra characters. Therefore, what you're doing is demanding extra content for free. When they made this extra content is completely and utterly irrelevant.So by your logic, deleted scenes in a movie is tantamount to theft.

I think you're missing the point a bit. I know a car analogy doesn't work well with games but I'm gonna try it. You buy a new car, a 4 door sedan with possible seating of 3 in the back. But because the corporation/dealer wants to be a shady mug they block off the entire backseat area and make it impossible to access. Yes there's enough value of the car there but you're blocked from accessing what it was built with.

Extremely hypothetical but I hope it gets the point across.

No it doesn't, because you've mixed up a necessity with an extra. Lets try a better analogy.

They build you the four door sedan, and they throw in the rear headrest DVD players at no extra cost. They never once advertised this feature, and there are no ads promising you this feature for free. There have been news reports, but the car manufacturer is not legally accountable for news reports made about them. However, they don't activate it. In order to activate the rear headset DVD player, they're gonna have to charge you extra. If you don't want it, thats fine, just don't pay them for it. If you do, just pay them what you owe for the in-built DVD players.

Understand me yet?

Different idea but same outcome, stuff that's not a necessity is there and you need to pay extra to access it. You call the DLC extra content when it was obviously finished before the games went to print and all 12 characters were already available on the Vita version of the game. It's not like they're hurting for disc space if all the characters could fit on the Vita but not on 360/PS3. Do you really see this as extra content and not Capcom being greedy shits?

Capcom might be finished by next year and hopefully someone who knows what to do(like Atlus) will buy the AA series and FREAKING RELEASE AAI2!!!

Besides AKSYS makes better fighters.

"There is effectively no distinction between the DLC being 'locked' behind the disc and available for unlocking at a later date, or being available through a full download at a later date"

This made me lol super hard...since there is a huge difference...

Oh, this argument is still raging?

I thought people would have moved onto Asura's Wrath having the real ending as paid DLC by now. Which, for the record, im fine with because i would rather have it now than having it in 2 years as a drawn out sequel.

Also why cant someone put thier naming habits into gear and call it On-Disc Locked Content? Its just that much easier to understand when put that way.

Foolproof:

blackdwarf:
when i pay my sixty euros, i pay for all the work that is finished so far.

So by your logic, deleted scenes in a movie is tantamount to theft.

That's not really an apt comparison.

There is a difference between a filmmaker removing scenes that are detrimental to the overall quality of the finished product, and a publisher deliberately locking away content on a game disc with the express motivation of charging an extra 10-15 to unlock it later.

To run with the new car analogy that another poster has used here, it's like your dealership charging you 5% extra for the key to the trunk.

Jorec:
I can't wait until Angry Joe gets wind of this. I bet he'll go on a massive tirade.

sure, why not.
he did over the Asura's Wrath DLC

Am I the only one sensing hypocrisy here? They put content on the disc that they were planning on charging for at a later date. I don't entirely see a problem with that they can choose whatever goofy delivery method they feel is appropriate. The biggest problem is they are surprised and angry that die hard fans FOUND the content and are using it. Call me crazy but I think that if you put it in the game and don't expect at least Some of the millions your selling it to to find it we have now left the realm of idiotic hypocrisy and entered the realm of preposterousness. Any one else agree?

At first, I didn't mind the fact that the stuff was already on the disc. I was willing to let that slide, but Capcom's handling of this is very poor indeed. And the fact that we're having to wait until much later in the year to use the "DLC" that's already there isn't helping their case at all.

Well it doesn't matter anyway since there's gonna be Super Street Fighter X Tekken in about 6 months or so XD

Say what you will about Capcom's weird business tactics but the Super/Ultimate edition is pretty well balanced and non buggy (running off UMVC3 as an example.) Almost as if they use the previous versions as a beta rather than actually testing the game fully... But really who would be so cynical as to notice that?

I just want UMvC4, preferably with some extra Ace Attorney characters. Team Ace Attorney must be created!

Oh and why do I cringe whenever someone tries to compare ondisk DLC to cars? It just doesn't work! Let it go man!

As for the actual subject of DLC, meh I don't care. It's Capcom being Capcom as far as i'm concerned. They're comedy gold!

DVS BSTrD:
THIS is my problem with On-Disk DLC: I don't think it should be free, I think it shouldn't even exist! If we accept paying extra for content that had finished production AND testing soon enough to be included with shipping, we're essentially giving them a blank check to withhold as much of the game as they please. If they produce bonus material at a latter date I'll pay for it, but if it's included on the disk it should be included in the game. No gimmicks!

God, you people are so entitled.

>.>

No, but I think it's weird that this complaint to the BBB about the misrepresentation of DLC (which it's not) has drawn no ire, when doing the same with Mass Effect was entitled and ruining gaming and childish and stuff.

But I agree, this stuff shouldn't be exist. I'm just going a step further because any on-disc DLC is lying to your customer base. Especially when the justification is that it's content that wouldn't have made it to the final disc.

This should actually be a legal and consumer issue.

Pendragon8:
Am I the only one sensing hypocrisy here? They put content on the disc that they were planning on charging for at a later date. I don't entirely see a problem with that they can choose whatever goofy delivery method they feel is appropriate. The biggest problem is they are surprised and angry that die hard fans FOUND the content and are using it. Call me crazy but I think that if you put it in the game and don't expect at least Some of the millions your selling it to to find it we have now left the realm of idiotic hypocrisy and entered the realm of preposterousness. Any one else agree?

You seem surprised that a company is angry that it it got caught.

I generally support a lot of what Capcom does, and I see what they are getting at with their argument. The on disc DLC is basically funded the same way actual downloadable DLC is. It's development categorized under a different revenue stream (Stream A funds Content A, Stream B funds Content B). I also agree with them in saying that the experience you get with the current content of SFxT is a complete one.

I do, however, find myself uncomfortable with the time line. They have already stated that the locked content will, in general, not be unlockable until the fall when the Vita version of SFxT is released. Yet it's completed and playable already. I do definitely see a slippery slope issue here as it's blatantly obvious that, while funded differently, the locked content was developed during the same development period as the base game. This isn't a case of spending the last month of development on the DLC because you're stuck waiting for approval of the base game. This literally is content that could have been in the game for Day 1 but was withheld for the intent of selling it later on.

I can definitely see how this all works out for Capcom. They get a base game plus very appealing DLC without actually adding to the deveopment time at all. In fact, I'd imagine that the SFxT team is already working on the next game. They aren't stuck only now working on extensins to SFxT. I can also definitely see how fans of SFxT are getting screwed on this one though.

Mydogisblue:
I haven't been keeping up with this topic, but is this DLC like Mass Effect 3's where the content on the disc is just a placeholder for future DLC or is it all actually on the disc? If it's the latter then that just really rubs me the wrong way.

Sadly, no. It's not just a placeholder at all. People who have "unlocked" the content through various means have found that all of the locked characters are 100% complete and playable. From move lists to control to art assets to sound assets, it's all there. The locked characters even have complete intro and ending cinematics already on the disc and functional. The only thing missing is maybe a balance pass though the locked characters don't seem unbalanced at all from what I have heard.

In short, the locked data is 100% complete and playable. It's just locked away until Capcom decides to let you pay for it and unlock it.

This is so fucking stupid! I honestly can't believe that anyone at Capcom would think this is ok to say publicly. The only time on-disk content downloads can be somewhat justified is if it's one of those "buy new get this extra content token, buy used no love" deals. This is just idiotic.

Kheapathic:

Foolproof:

Kheapathic:

I think you're missing the point a bit. I know a car analogy doesn't work well with games but I'm gonna try it. You buy a new car, a 4 door sedan with possible seating of 3 in the back. But because the corporation/dealer wants to be a shady mug they block off the entire backseat area and make it impossible to access. Yes there's enough value of the car there but you're blocked from accessing what it was built with.

Extremely hypothetical but I hope it gets the point across.

No it doesn't, because you've mixed up a necessity with an extra. Lets try a better analogy.

They build you the four door sedan, and they throw in the rear headrest DVD players at no extra cost. They never once advertised this feature, and there are no ads promising you this feature for free. There have been news reports, but the car manufacturer is not legally accountable for news reports made about them. However, they don't activate it. In order to activate the rear headset DVD player, they're gonna have to charge you extra. If you don't want it, thats fine, just don't pay them for it. If you do, just pay them what you owe for the in-built DVD players.

Understand me yet?

Different idea but same outcome, stuff that's not a necessity is there and you need to pay extra to access it. You call the DLC extra content when it was obviously finished before the games went to print and all 12 characters were already available on the Vita version of the game. It's not like they're hurting for disc space if all the characters could fit on the Vita but not on 360/PS3. Do you really see this as extra content and not Capcom being greedy shits?

Given it was never once advertised or promised, it is by every definition of the term extra content.

Kmadden2004:

Foolproof:

blackdwarf:
when i pay my sixty euros, i pay for all the work that is finished so far.

So by your logic, deleted scenes in a movie is tantamount to theft.

That's not really an apt comparison.

There is a difference between a filmmaker removing scenes that are detrimental to the overall quality of the finished product, and a publisher deliberately locking away content on a game disc with the express motivation of charging an extra 10-15 to unlock it later.

To run with the new car analogy that another poster has used here, it's like your dealership charging you 5% extra for the key to the trunk.

Except once again, you're going back to the retard tree by mixing up a neccesity and an extra. Use of trunk is not use of Cody from Final Fight. They are not comparable.

My car analogy is still the only good one - its a complete extra that could not be considered a neccessity for your experience, you aren't forced to buy it, there was never a single second of deception about what you would be able to use without extra payment, and without the feature it is still worth your money. Four key similarities between my analogy, that yours utterly fails at.

Andy Chalk:
More to the point, it asserted that DLC is DLC and the only question is one of delivery method.

Well I would assert that the delivery method is what defines DLC, what with it being downloadble content and all that. If you're not downloading it then it's just content. Inaccessable content, I guess.

T'Generalissimo:

Andy Chalk:
More to the point, it asserted that DLC is DLC and the only question is one of delivery method.

Well I would assert that the delivery method is what defines DLC, what with it being downloadble content and all that. If you're not downloading it then it's just content. Inaccessable content, I guess.

That's a pretty fair point.

Trishbot:

T'Generalissimo:

Andy Chalk:
More to the point, it asserted that DLC is DLC and the only question is one of delivery method.

Well I would assert that the delivery method is what defines DLC, what with it being downloadble content and all that. If you're not downloading it then it's just content. Inaccessable content, I guess.

That's a pretty fair point.

Exactly. DownLoadable Content. If they're trying to make a point (and they do have a legitimate point; whether it's good enough or not is a matter for individual debate), they need to use appropriate terminology. Maybe it muddles the issue a bit, but no more than DownLoadable Content not being DownLoaded at all. Perhaps Post-Purchase Content? Add-On Content? Extra Stuff?

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