From Software is Having Trouble Porting Dark Souls

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The Plunk:
ITT: Whining, entitled PC elitists being whiny and entitled, as usual.

As a proper PC gamer, I'm always first when it comes to entitlement, whining and joining the band wagon hate, don't get me wrong on that part.
But I have no clue about how bad/good dark souls runs on the PS/Xbox and how bad the lag really is. So it might just as well turn out ok on a proper machine, you know O.o

archvile93:

Baresark:

archvile93:

Well they have no one to blame but themselves for that. Thay really should have known how horrible that thing is. I'd rather have the Flame virus on my computer than that abomination.

OT: Well this is sad, I guess they just don't want to make many sales on the PC. Most people won't put up with a game that barely works, and it will almost certainly be that way, at least far worse than the console versions. Then again, maybe that's the point; make a shit port, so when their next game comes out and people want a PC version they can point to Dark Souls and claim that there's no money in PC games. That way they don't have to do as much work.

There is no way they could have "known" it was that bad. They don't develop for the PC. How could they know. They are also a Japanese company, the PC market is nonexistent in Japan. I think you are being a bit dramatic by saying you would rather have a virus than GFWL. And if that is the truth, your priorities need to be rearranged.

They have not released any statements saying it will be worse than the console version, so I don't know where you are getting your information. They literally said it will be the same as the console version. There is even a chance that it will be better since it is running on much more powerful hardware.

I do love the conspiracy theory bit at the end though. They want it to fail so no one will bother them anymore. That made me lol.

Yeah, I wasn't being very serious with that last part, though if it turns out this game has all the stability and performance of a Bethesda game, it will not surprise me even slightly. And I'm certainly not taking their word for it that it will work just as well as the console versions; I've seen companies lie way too many time to believe them, not to mention the inumerable times the PC versions were pathetic cash grabs that only worked if you define "work" as loosely as possible. One example is Saints Row 2, but just look up porting disasters at tvtropes for a much bigger list.

Haha, I never played the PC version, but Saints Row 2 is the gold standard of bad ports. And lets be honest with ourselves. The only reason they decided to do a PC version was because of the number of signatures on that petition. I hope they recoup their cost of porting it, but I can hardly blame anyone for not being all that happy with it. Since I'm expecting it will run about the same as the PS3 version, I'll gladly trade my PS3 version of the game in for it, but I'm gonna wait to see if it does that first.

Kheapathic:
Yes they're inexperienced but at least they're trying. While we're on the topic of bugs and glitches, how's Skyrim and Fallout: New Vegas treating you?

lmao, i love you for this :3

OT: they admitted it'll be buggy, takes stones to admit your work will be flawed on release, unlike SOME company's RPGs that constantly come out buggy and unplayable in some cases, and never say a word about it.

so I'll still get it, finances willing.

I really like how they came out and said this. I mean developing for the PC is not an easy task, Almost every computer has a different hardware configuration. Im looking forward to this and if it is price reasonably around maybe 20 25$ i will def be picking it up.

Rainforce:

The Plunk:
ITT: Whining, entitled PC elitists being whiny and entitled, as usual.

As a proper PC gamer, I'm always first when it comes to entitlement and whining, don't get me wrong on that part.
But I have no clue about how bad/good dark souls runs on the PS/Xbox and how bad the lag really is. So it might just as well turn out ok on a proper machine, you know O.o

In some areas, the frame rates took a dramatic dive. For instance, the much maligned Blighttown would drop to the single digits. That area had so much going on though, I think it won't be bad on the PC. It was a massive indoor area lit almost exclusively by torches. It had a massive pool of red swamp water at the bottom. You descended to the bottoms over a massive series of wooden scaffolding. And you could see just about everything. In all honestly, it was way way way beyond anything the consoles were built to handle. I think that area will turn out much better on the PC. Or at least, I hope it will.

Well, that's kind of refreshingly honest, I guess... I almost feel bad that I'm probably not going to get it. (Not because of this. Just because I'm not a big fan of the "bang head against wall, check wall for blood, repeat" style of gameplay.)

Oh dear, oh dear, this will not end well. GTA IV anyone? I can just about play that on my latest PC without it slowing to a crawl when the sun comes up.

Baresark:

Rainforce:

The Plunk:
ITT: Whining, entitled PC elitists being whiny and entitled, as usual.

As a proper PC gamer, I'm always first when it comes to entitlement and whining, don't get me wrong on that part.
But I have no clue about how bad/good dark souls runs on the PS/Xbox and how bad the lag really is. So it might just as well turn out ok on a proper machine, you know O.o

In some areas, the frame rates took a dramatic dive. For instance, the much maligned Blighttown would drop to the single digits. That area had so much going on though, I think it won't be bad on the PC. It was a massive indoor area lit almost exclusively by torches. It had a massive pool of red swamp water at the bottom. You descended to the bottoms over a massive series of wooden scaffolding. And you could see just about everything. In all honestly, it was way way way beyond anything the consoles were built to handle. I think that area will turn out much better on the PC. Or at least, I hope it will.

sounds good enough to me

There's going to be voice chat; I'm buying it anyways.

SmashLovesTitanQuest:
*6 months later*

"...And also, we will not be doing a PC version of Darker Souls, due to piracy and low sales."

Reading the comments here its more likely "Darker Souls" won't happen on PC because of an incredibly picky consumer base that's hugely overreacting to issues that didn't stop about a million people from enjoying the hell out of this incredible game.

Really, this covers it perfectly.

The Plunk:
ITT: Whining, entitled PC elitists being whiny and entitled, as usual.

From isn't a big company, they work on maybe two projects at the same time and regularly jump from publisher to publisher for their sales outside of japan because they don't have the money to do it themselves. There's no way they could possibly afford a third party clean up job from someone with more experience, and if anything From doing it themselves is a good thing assuming the whiners don't make up the majority of the market and wreck its sales. With them gaining experience developing for PC it means any potential title in the future will be that much better on it.

Seriously, this is the PC crowd's chance at an amazing series(and with modding could be even better for its PVP and balancing with different mechanics) and it sounds like they're more than willing to throw it away just because every little thing isn't perfectly catered to them from the get go.

The Plunk:
ITT: Whining, entitled PC elitists being whiny and entitled, as usual.

are you drunk or have you simply not thought about it?
for example
if you buy a chair and that chair is broken or somewhat unusable or sometimes even if it has only scratches you return it and get your money back. you ARE entitled to a functioning product for you money it's even set in laws of many countries

WHY should that not be the same for software?

you are entitled to a working product doing for what it was intended if the game crashes often it's broken. yeah you CAN play it for a while but that is irrelevant, compare it to a car if a car crashes every few kilometers or miles it's most definitely BROKEN!!!

the fact that console gamers don't enforce stuff like working games at not stuttering framerates is just their leniency that does not mean they don't have the right to it.

and it also does not mean they have the right to expect acceptance for these flaws everywhere

PS: it's not elitist it's called common sense

This thread is hilarious.

I read over it twice, and the majority of the posts seem to be supportive of From. None-the-less the scattered whinny, angst filled, rager posts are just so obnoxious they somehow take over the entire thing.

So instead of doing the right thing and fixing these problems through experimentation and taking the time to learn everything they can about how to port, they're just going to cram it in and hope we're going to praise them for making a game we can barely play?

I was supporting them until they decided to skip the actual porting and just cut straight to "how to make it work on PC for dummies: for dummies."

If I ever did that kind of stuff in a paper, my English teacher would have thrown it out of his office.

ok heres some facts, From isn't a very big company they may not EVEN HAVE the money to get outside help.
you petitioned for this, if sales bomb its very likely From won't bother porting the next souls game to PC and never look back.

here is what it comes down to: do you want to make it worthwhile for From to invest in porting their games to the PC platform?
if so buy the fuck out of the PC version and shine From with a shit-eating grin.

LastGreatBlasphemer:
PC Gamers: "We're tired of getting the shitty ports. But let's bitch at developers to get them anyway."
Developers: "Okay, here comes game that you all wanted. Due to us being a mainly console creator we have little experience in porting for PC. There may be some bugs."
PC Gamers: "Fuck you, you suck. We're tired of getting the shitty version."

Did you guys want the game or not? When consoles get a port of a PC game we always get the dumbed down shitty version too. STFU please.

What's wrong with the PC community showing console devs there is a market for them to come into? As a linux user I know all about sending e-mails, posting comments and showing support to companies like Valve (and so on) to make sure they know that we are out there.

Sure, we complain when games like Limbo are released under WINE instead of native code; but as long as it works, we deal with it because something is better than nothin'.

Cybylt:
snip

Well, while we're at it, I'll just throw you over here with the xbox fan base (12 year old trickshotters who play nothing but COD while calling each other faggots), the other guy in with the PS3 fans (fat weeaboo virgins who spend their days worshipping JRPG characters) and everyone else with the Wii crowd, which is made up exclusively of 3 year old children and soccer moms.

Seriously, quit the damn generalizations. I'm a PC gamer, I signed that petition once and was done with it. I will be buying the game in the first week of release, performance issues be damned. I'll get it to run, that's why I'm a PC gamer; I enjoy getting stuff to run better.

And how is it entitled to want a decent frame rate? Seriously?

ITT: People say stupid things.

So the frame rate issues on the console version are going to be carried over the PC as well? Ok? Did you expect anything else?

Ports are generally subpar anyway and since From ain't worked with the PC much before then wtf do you want them to do?

I hate to call everyone complaining about this whiny bastards... But you really sound like whiny bastards at this point.

"Oh yay a PC port!"

"Booooo GFWL, switch to something less sucky!"

"What? A company who has never really worked with the PC before can't pull off the best PC port avaliable? Fuck this, uninstall my life."

Anyway, the frame rate issues weren't that bad... Until you hit Blighttown then ohhhhhhh shit you can't even move the camera. DX

This could even be a moot point once it comes out, it might be all sunshine, rainbows, sprinkles and the fucking Bell Gargoyles!

burningdragoon:
How often do games ported to PC end up better in the first place?

not often enough, sadly =P

While it's unfortunate that the framerate/bugs aren't being patched for PC (actually there aren't any bugs from the console version that stick out in my mind and haven't been patched already), I think this is kind of being blown out of proportion a little bit.

From the sounds of things, the PC version is going to run more or less exactly as it does on consoles, which is to say pretty damn good. I suspect that the people who say the lag is terrible have systems that are starting to wear down.

For my part, I have it on both 360 and PS3 and have only really experienced notable lag in one area, Blight Town, when multiple enemies are on screen and there're lots of effects happening. Even in these moments the game was still very playable.

I can't blame you if you're upset and wont buy it because its not being patched, but for those of you who wanted to play the game but couldn't because you didn't have the required system, I don't think this should dissuade you. You're getting the game.

It was great on consoles, and it sounds like it'll be great on here too. Plus added content.

Frostbite3789:

SinisterRamen:
Oh this is so rich.

People wanted a port, and now they are all whining over it, because it will have performance issues...

What the hell did you people expect? It is a PORT! Ports are by default, bad (with only a few exceptions).

This truly made my day. Get a console instead of crying over this.

LastGreatBlasphemer:
PC Gamers: "We're tired of getting the shitty ports. But let's bitch at developers to get them anyway."
Developers: "Okay, here comes game that you all wanted. Due to us being a mainly console creator we have little experience in porting for PC. There may be some bugs."
PC Gamers: "Fuck you, you suck. We're tired of getting the shitty version."

Did you guys want the game or not? When consoles get a port of a PC game we always get the dumbed down shitty version too. STFU please.

Except 90% of the posts have been positive/supportive. But I guess if you need to be on your high horse, go ahead.

I'm getting it day one. Like most people said, mods are a thing.

I've seen a ton of people on other sites saying they're not getting it now, saying no 60 FPS = no sale.

I expect there will be yet ANOTHER petition by the end of the day.

Gorilla Gunk:
Snip

Then those people are idiots. When something is ported to the PC, what I look for is for it to be as good as the console version. I don't consider it a shoddy port if it contains the same bugs, but if it's rife with new ones and vast problems from shoddy port work, then I have a problem.

Would it be neat if they fixed the problems? Sure. But they're also adding extra content at no extra cost. And bringing to PC at all. And after my experiences with Diablo 3 (a game made by a dedicated PC gaming developer) I really don't think I can be that frustrated by the release of this.

Also I will pray every night for people who pirate this to get kicked right in the balls by an NFL kicker.

Dryk:
Swallow your pride and get help guys

Swallow your pride and throw your money away?

Why does it matter that it's got the same bugs as the console version? That was never that buggy. They are doing the best they can, they can't afford to spend a lot of time or money on this, and we should just be grateful they are doing it at all.

DaHero:
So instead of doing the right thing and fixing these problems through experimentation and taking the time to learn everything they can about how to port, they're just going to cram it in and hope we're going to praise them for making a game we can barely play?

I was supporting them until they decided to skip the actual porting and just cut straight to "how to make it work on PC for dummies: for dummies."

If I ever did that kind of stuff in a paper, my English teacher would have thrown it out of his office.

People demanded a port. They have been honest and said they don't really know what they are doing. They could have just kept tight lipped and distracted people with free extra content. From are a great company, but they are only small, they can't afford to spend too much time or money on this, and they probably won't even make a lot of money on it. It's most likely just because people asked for it, and it would be a good way to test the waters for future releases. And they said that the original bugs will be there, not that it will be an unplayable pile of shit as you are automatically assuming it will be.

Lunar Templar:

Kheapathic:
Yes they're inexperienced but at least they're trying. While we're on the topic of bugs and glitches, how's Skyrim and Fallout: New Vegas treating you?

lmao, i love you for this :3

OT: they admitted it'll be buggy, takes stones to admit your work will be flawed on release, unlike SOME company's RPGs that constantly come out buggy and unplayable in some cases, and never say a word about it.

so I'll still get it, finances willing.

Thank you, but the thing that really gets me is that From Software is really untested. They're small, usually ho themselves out to producers, and have never done a PC port but are trying their best. Bethesda on the other hand is like a drunken inbred fuckwit who people absolutely love. Their products may be unplayable, crash often, and corrupt your save data but damn they're great. THIS IS WHAT I DON"T GET! An untested developer got enough signatures and so they're trying, but the moment they admit problems people are ready to burn them to the ground; no 60 FPS = no sale and tons of other bullshit. Meanwhile the people probably bought the newest Bethesda title on launch day. Burn the new guy who hasn't even released a product while praising the fat inbred slob who can't fix stuff without fucking something else up.

Kheapathic:

Lunar Templar:

Kheapathic:
Yes they're inexperienced but at least they're trying. While we're on the topic of bugs and glitches, how's Skyrim and Fallout: New Vegas treating you?

lmao, i love you for this :3

OT: they admitted it'll be buggy, takes stones to admit your work will be flawed on release, unlike SOME company's RPGs that constantly come out buggy and unplayable in some cases, and never say a word about it.

so I'll still get it, finances willing.

Thank you, but the thing that really gets me is that From Software is really untested. They're small, usually ho themselves out to producers, and have never done a PC port but are trying their best. Bethesda on the other hand is like a drunken inbred fuckwit who people absolutely love. Their products may be unplayable, crash often, and corrupt your save data but damn they're great. THIS IS WHAT I DON"T GET! An untested developer got enough signatures and so they're trying, but the moment they admit problems people are ready to burn them to the ground; no 60 FPS = no sale and tons of other bullshit. Meanwhile the people probably bought the newest Bethesda title on launch day. Burn the new guy who hasn't even released a product while praising the fat inbred slob who can't fix stuff without fucking something else up.

yeah :/ i don't get the love for Bethesda ether, for pretty much all the reasons you mentioned (and a few you didn't). between the game breaking and not so game breaking bugs, and boring everything else it confounds me their still around, or at the very least not getting flamed like they should be.

ether way, I'm willing to give From Software the benefit of the doubt, they admitted it's harder then they though, they admitted it'll have issues, they are being HONEST about they're work. this gets lots of 'good will points' in my book.

Why not delay it or bring in outside team who are experienced with porting? The extra cost will be made up for in good will on subsequent releases.

Lucem712:

What's wrong with the PC community showing console devs there is a market for them to come into? As a linux user I know all about sending e-mails, posting comments and showing support to companies like Valve (and so on) to make sure they know that we are out there.

Sure, we complain when games like Limbo are released under WINE instead of native code; but as long as it works, we deal with it because something is better than nothin'.

There's nothing wrong with showing companies the PC market. But we're not. We're demanding they jump into it, and then scorning them when the results aren't what we wanted. And FROM is not a big company. Chances are they can't afford to bring in a third party to help with the PC development.

When you get to Blighttown and your frame rate drops to 25FPS, what will you do? On my PS3 I checked for what was causing it (particle generation on a very high level), and stopped it.
When your 1200 USD machine drops to 25FPS, that will equal a problem. By all accounts you have the hardware to run that game at 1080p, in what, 1330x760?
Well, certainly now your hardware isn't at fault, but the game.
So what do you do? Me? I'd ignore it and chug through until I hit the next room and frame rate goes back to normal (My first gamign rig was a laptop, I'm used to low end performance). The bigger, more vocal part of the PC crowd, and probably a good portion of the people who signed that petition, will write it off as a shit game from a shit developer.
When in reality, that's not fair. They're a small, console developer. They were flat out begged for this game, and they're trying to get it to the beggars as soon as they can, even offering additional content at no extra charge. But what will the reviews look like?
Probably focusing heavily on the bugs and frame rate because on a PC, they become glaring, rather than on the Xbox and PS3 which it was designed to be run on.
They don't have the kind of money to hire out another studio to fix it, so their only option is getting it running as best as possible.

FROM is not going to get a fair deal in this. PC elitists are going to destroy them and FROM will never try again.

Or I could be 100% wrong and a decent PC set up will help fix the issues and it will run pretty damn well. We'll see.

kabooz18:

The Plunk:
ITT: Whining, entitled PC elitists being whiny and entitled, as usual.

are you drunk or have you simply not thought about it?
for example
if you buy a chair and that chair is broken or somewhat unusable or sometimes even if it has only scratches you return it and get your money back. you ARE entitled to a functioning product for you money it's even set in laws of many countries

WHY should that not be the same for software?

you are entitled to a working product doing for what it was intended if the game crashes often it's broken. yeah you CAN play it for a while but that is irrelevant, compare it to a car if a car crashes every few kilometers or miles it's most definitely BROKEN!!!

the fact that console gamers don't enforce stuff like working games at not stuttering framerates is just their leniency that does not mean they don't have the right to it.

and it also does not mean they have the right to expect acceptance for these flaws everywhere

PS: it's not elitist it's called common sense

The game is fine. The framerate only dropped in one area a little bit anyway. The game's flaws are being greatly exaggerated because people are panicking. I don't see how console players have lax standards. Bethesda is welcomed by all communities, after all.

The Rogue Wolf:
That's not a good decision on their part. PC gamers can be VERY picky about performance (I should know, that's how I am) and are not going to be happy with a poorly-ported game that has issues, whatever the game's pedigree.

People are overexaggering (shame on you escapist). None of the so called 'bugs' are game breaking. At least not from what I've seen, and I've sunk a fair few hours into the game.

Sure, there's frame rate issues SOMETIMES but nothing that breaks the game.

Also, From Software are not a heavy weight company. Most of their games are very niche. Anyone expecting a perfect port is just stupid.

Rainforce:

Baresark:
In some areas, the frame rates took a dramatic dive. For instance, the much maligned Blighttown would drop to the single digits. That area had so much going on though, I think it won't be bad on the PC. It was a massive indoor area lit almost exclusively by torches. It had a massive pool of red swamp water at the bottom. You descended to the bottoms over a massive series of wooden scaffolding. And you could see just about everything. In all honestly, it was way way way beyond anything the consoles were built to handle. I think that area will turn out much better on the PC. Or at least, I hope it will.

sounds good enough to me

Also, keep in mind that he's exaggerating when he says the frame rate drops to single digits. Blight Town would get to more like 20 fps. A noticable dip, sure, but still more than playable.

Okay! Now, who wants to start the "Increase Dark Souls PC Version's Frame Rate" Petition?

I'll still support them here. Outside of Ninja Blade, this is their first in-house port that people actually wanted. I'll be damned if I don't do my part to help show that poll wasn't a joke.

Yes, the port may not be as spectacular as we'd hoped, but the important thing is that they're taking a look at PC development in the first place. We as PC gamers need to pick and choose our battles here. We got a huge win when Namco greenlit the project, now we needto see it done and support it. Anyone who expected FS to have a masterfully done port on their first try was delusional. They lacked experience, time, and money to do anything meaningful. (Time and money is more of an issue on Namco's side.)

From Software has a lot of talent, and I'd like to see some of that talent on the PC. Bashing Dark Souls because it isn't "better" is counter to that goal.

Oh, this is going to be fun.

First, people complain and whine until it gets released on PC.

Then, people complain and whine because it's buggy, because From Software are console devs, not PC devs.

Dear PC gamers,

Stop being so entitled.

You're not the master race.

Get over yourselves.

Regards,

Everyone.

Can't wait to see elitists complain about it being "Over hyped" and "not a real RPG".

What's even better is that it's a DIRECT PORT of the console version, so there is going to be a lot of complaining about it being "streamlined" and all that nonsense.

Anyway, if anyone needs me, I'll be in the bunker waiting for the shit-storm. Call me when it's release day.

I'm not getting a super negative vibe here.

This sucks monkey balls, but at least they're being upfront about it

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