Kickstarter Video Project Attracts Misogynist Horde

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Lionsfan:

yeti585:
Am I the only one that went back 61 pages of comments and found that 99% of comments are actually complaining about the comments section being full of sexist comments

1. Yes you probably are
2. I'm not disagreeing with you, but maybe some of the comments were deleted?
3. This is just how the news works, take the loudest group of any position (oftentimes these groups are very small and rarely represent the overall group), then try to present it as what "everybody" is thinking.

Now I'm not saying that there isn't sexism in Video Games, but shouldn't we try to get stronger arguments/sources than fucking YouTube comments? The YouTube comments section is probably one of the worst places on the internet, how is this news? I would be willing to bet that almost all of those sexist comments were made by people who either A- created an account for the sole use of trolling, or B- don't use their real names on YouTube so they can get away with whatever they feel like. Anonymous sexist comments really don't mean anything

I was thinking A) the comments are being moderated, or B) The amount of sexism is being blown out of proportion. It's there, but how much? I agree that using the comments section is a horrible place to show that the community is sexist. Isn't she trying to show the industry is sexist, anyway?

You know, let's forget the youtube comments for a while, and remember that they also tried to flag her video as terrorism AND get her Kickstarter off the site.

That is hardly just malicious comments, that's all out vandalism. And for a documentary about sexism in games, that's pretty terrible.

A bunch of chavvy cunts who think they're hard because they downgrade people who are "different" and like pop-music and go around pissing in rivers and have college-weekend parties involving naked woman fighting.

Fucking. Pathetic. While I really don't like her, she made a good point: woman are continually getting sexually demonised in video-games, and it's really fucking disgusting, but the people in the comments are worse (knowing YouTUBE, they're still not even a 1/1000 to moderately bad compared to slightly worse ones).

yeti585:

I was thinking A) the comments are being moderated, or B) The amount of sexism is being blown out of proportion. It's there, but how much? I agree that using the comments section is a horrible place to show that the community is sexist. Isn't she trying to show the industry is sexist, anyway?

Thus far I've seen five replies to my post on that video(I basically said I was freaking embarrassed to be male. And put it in CAPS because CAPS GIVES ATTENTION ON YOUTUBE YO~). Four of the replies basically said I was gay and had a small penis, before proceeding to insult the video, and are now deleted.

...yeah, I think it's safe to go with the "this is getting moderated"-option.

To start off, what the youtube commentators did is wrong. That's easy to see. But of course, there will always be such stupid people that say stupid things. I for one don't believe there will ever be a day where every single person in the world is perfectly enlightened, and won't resort to such tactics. It really is just impossibly, too many people, too many variables. Unless we have everybody hooked up to a system that controls their brains and blocks anything deemed bad, then a perfect world will never happen. And I for one really don't want live in such a controlled world in the first place.

Seriously, say they are stupid, in a constructive manner, and move on. Just don't act like it is the intellectual "end times" or act like this is some new proof that your point is true and this new proof shows that things need to change. This isn't new proof. Everybody that is even worth informing, knows people like the youtube commentators exists. Anybody connected to the technology of today knows this. And if they don't, and it isn't effecting their lives and they don't want to get involved, leave them out of it.

Again I don't agree with what the youtube commentators did.

I will say that I don't like what the woman is doing. People talk about greedy cash grabs, I think this is one disguised behind a veil of a moral cause, a cause that is old and the work she is doing for her videos, is work that has already been done by countless video game discussion video groups, like Extra Credits. Nothing I watched of what she said, and in her other videos is new stuff. All the stuff out there about this subject is free.

Every dime she makes from this kickstarter better go to a charity, or to me her credibility is shot.

ARCTIC_EAGLE:
Well...I find myself lacking the words to properly denounce the actions of the scum that seem to be latching onto that video. I for one believe that she brings to light an important topic and I am glad to see the financial support she is getting.

The problem is that while it is an important topic, it has been brought to light a long time ago, and given so much light, it has been thrown into the sun and burnt up. Look up any game discussion video shows, and there will most likely be a video about this subject. I watched her video, and I yawned. I yawned because I heard it all before. And if I, a person that doesn't actively search out videos that discuss the subject, find it old news, then the vast majority of anybody that is anybody, knows everything she has talked about.

I don't have a problem with the subject, I have a problem that she's grossly profiting from it. As I said above, every dime should go to charity.

Kahunaburger:

Buretsu:
snip

Well, considering that the entire point of this project is to educate (and it's part of a larger effort to express feminist theory in an accessible manner to non-academics) I'm having a hard time seeing where you're coming from here.

I believe where he is coming from is that what she is bringing up is old news and work done by countless other video game discussion video groups, and she will be making obscene profits from it.

Again I say, she better give every dime to charity. In addition, if she doesn't, I will consider the whole thing as a scam for her to make money off of naive people that think those old and out dated material videos, will actually make a difference.

anamizuki:
You know, let's forget the youtube comments for a while, and remember that they also tried to flag her video as terrorism AND get her Kickstarter off the site.

That is hardly just malicious comments, that's all out vandalism. And for a documentary about sexism in games, that's pretty terrible.

Add also all the shit that was done to her page on Wikipedia (insults + linking to porn).

The irony of it all is as bad as male fantasy portrayal of the female gender can be, women are starting to catch up in this regard with their own female versions of male fantasy's. See: Twilight, Shades of Grey, etc.

So what do women want? Well you start with an ambiguous female lead, the less you detail her character the easier it is to insert yourself into her shoes. Then create the alpha male: ridiculously good looking wealthy young men with chiseled abs/bodies, who will begin a single minded pursuit of or romance with the protagonist for no apparent reason. Even better yet, add a second alpha male character also pursuing the protagonist setting her up with a love triangle, or more accurately a fantasy of 'these two perfect men want oh whoever shall I choose!'

This really isn't anything new either, it just recently hit mainstream popularity. I don't know exactly what this Shades of Grey book is about, but I'm sure I've seen the basic movie version of it already when I watched a Mickey Rourke (back when he was basically a young Brad Pitt) movie with my girlfriend called Nine 1/2 Weeks made in 1986. They're out there if you look for them.

So in an ideal world hopefully the girls version of the silly gender fantasy game can catch up to the boys so we can stop worrying about it and make fun of each other on equal ground.

I'd like to say this outcry is surprising...but....meh..I've given up defending the subculture in some respects.

Brilliant, really, you've flushed the misogynist wankers out of hiding. I assume by now they've all been added to the government depopulation list, yes?

OMG, Youtube commenters can be nasty!?!?!? :O My world has been turned up-side-down.

"Fucking downvoted and flagged for terrorism. Dumb ass nazi cunt," adds BoxxyizQueen.

I'm not to lie, that one made me laugh.

But yeah, welcome to the youtube comment section. The only place on the internet where there will be a raging debate on whether or not Hitler hated jews on a My Little Pony video.

Sonic Doctor:

Kahunaburger:

Buretsu:
snip

Well, considering that the entire point of this project is to educate (and it's part of a larger effort to express feminist theory in an accessible manner to non-academics) I'm having a hard time seeing where you're coming from here.

I believe where he is coming from is that what she is bringing up is old news and work done by countless other video game discussion video groups, and she will be making obscene profits from it.

$6000 was the funding goal, and is pretty normal cost-wise for a video series of FF's production quality. The fact that the kickstarter made 10x that amount:

A) indicates that the community apparently does not think we've reached the saturation point for incisive criticism of sexism in game design.

B) should not lead to assumptions that the money will be spent unwisely. There's nothing that supports the "ZOMG Anita Sarkeesian will pocket the money!1!!!" conclusion some folks seem to be jumping to.

Smeatza:
She's on almost £60,000 now.
I wonder what car she'll buy.

In today's market with prices tanking, she can by herself a decent sized house and a new car.

Naeras:

yeti585:

I was thinking A) the comments are being moderated, or B) The amount of sexism is being blown out of proportion. It's there, but how much? I agree that using the comments section is a horrible place to show that the community is sexist. Isn't she trying to show the industry is sexist, anyway?

Thus far I've seen five replies to my post on that video(I basically said I was freaking embarrassed to be male. And put it in CAPS because CAPS GIVES ATTENTION ON YOUTUBE YO~). Four of the replies basically said I was gay and had a small penis, before proceeding to insult the video, and are now deleted.

...yeah, I think it's safe to go with the "this is getting moderated"-option.

Youtube must have an anti-trolling taskforce. SFWTF, Special Flame War Task Force, Trained to moderate comments without leaving a trace. But I've said too much alr-

So if we now live in a intellectually enlightened age where science has shown that homosexuality(and in fact any gender bias attraction) can largely be linked to a combination of genes and environmental factors that overrides a persons cognitive ability to pick who they find attractive, Why are heterosexual men still being attacked for their per-disposition to find women attractive? The companies know who they are marketing too and who buys their stuff.

Why are women jealous of digital pixels being looked at but guys that(if the stereotypes hold true) are a bunch of basement dwelling, pony watching, ugly, fat virgins that they wouldn't give the time of day to if they met on the street? What? does it sound like I have a sore spot because attractive women don't usually talk to me and assume I'm some sort of creep that would attack them in a dark alley so if I want to hear women talk to me I need to listen to pop music or play video games where I don't have to fear judgement? Yeah just a little.

Kahunaburger:

Sonic Doctor:

snip

$6000 was the funding goal, and is pretty normal cost-wise for a video series of FF's production quality. The fact that the kickstarter made 10x that amount:

A) indicates that the community apparently does not think we've reached the saturation point for incisive criticism of sexism in game design.

B) should not lead to assumptions that the money will be spent unwisely. There's nothing that supports the "ZOMG Anita Sarkeesian will pocket the money!1!!!" conclusion some folks seem to be jumping to.

Considering that it is obvious she already has the gear to do the videos, the only expense there is is the expense of, "Well, I'm taking up my free time to make these videos about old news, are you going to pay me for it?"

There are plenty of people out there that make videos of better quality and actually bring interesting new points about what they are discussing, and they do it for free.

If she needs money to live on, she can go do something that is actually new and constructive, find somebody to actually hire her on whatever talents she has.

A.) As I said, naive people in the community. If saturation of the exact same thing and message over and over again truly worked, nobody would be smoking cigarettes and those companies would have been put out of business.

B.) If she spends it on herself in any way, she is spending it unwisely and she has taken advantage of said naive people.

...don't really see why anyone would be upset over some woman asking for money for her feminist analysis documentary. I don't believe Internet fundraising is illegal, and if people want to pay up based on the scarce info on what the money will specifically be used for, that's their own risk and responsibility entirely.

She's free to analyse whatever she wants, and publicize it however she wants using her own money and private donations. I suppose it could be a slight annoyance if some of the more radical feminists frame cucumbers at the grocery store as a public symbol of male power fantasies and rape culture or whatever, but that doesn't seem to be her game, and there's really no need to get upset about accusatory analysis if it doesn't actually have any merit anyway.

Either she has a point, or she can simply be ignored. Complaining about her and her privately funded pet project is just irrational.

Kahunaburger:

$6000 was the funding goal, and is pretty normal cost-wise for a video series of FF's production quality.

AHAHAHAHA You can't be fucking serious. I'm looking through her videos, all she does is stare at a camera with a cheap mic, and edits in some pictures. People make videos with twice as much quality at no fuckin cost. It costs her exactly $0 to do those poor quality videos of hers.

Captcha: taken aback

You said it captcha.

Seriously, when I see something like this, I want to smash up my gaming systems. The treatment of women by my "brothers" in the gaming community is nothing short of disgusting.

MrBrightside919:
...i'm not touching this with a ten foot pole...

I came here for the free pizza and beer?

>_>

<_<

*slowly backs*

I'll uh...yeah..

Why should people pay for propaganda? It's ridiculous. If you have extremist views you want to express, don't expect everyone to rush at you baring their cash in anticipation.

Sure give her money just so she can keep screamabout how all men are sexist.
How about if you want games to be more for you,MAKE THEM YOURSELF!

Misogyny still exists? I thought we had moved on from this by now.

To Ms. or Mrs. (I don't know which) Sarkeesian, I say keep up the good fight.
To the horde of misogynists that posted against Sarkeesian, I say, "go fuck your collective selves."

In games where women are objectified, so are men. Shocking revelation.

In games where men aren't Mr manly man, or some other extreme end of the spectrum of manliness, neither are women.

I must be some super intelligent hyper being, since nobody seems able to make that connection, at all.

So, sure, she can label the whole gaming community as a bunch of misogynistic pigs, who treat women as objects, so long as I can label the whole feminist community as a bunch of whining women, who want to be treated above, and not equal to everyone else, because they're women.

Edit: why does she even require this money? Just looking at the examples she has etc, these things have really low production value, and she already has the equipment.. So, what is the point of this kickstarter?

So... nothing new here. Love that people immediately started defending this in one way or another.

Phasmal:
Aaaand cue the people defending this sort of shit.

This stuff happens all the time in the gaming community and it needs to be pointed out and heckled as much as possible.

Hopefully, the gaming community will be dragged kicking and screaming towards a point where this kind of crap is at least frowned upon. (But I am sure I will be called `extreme` for even thinking there is a problem).

Another "extremist" here. You said everything I wanted to, cheers.

I actually like the idea behind this woman's ideas, not only as something that addresses subject matter that needs to be addressed, but as a starting point for larger discussions about all stereotypes.

As for the internet hate machine... it's a youtube video.

Sonic Doctor:

Kahunaburger:

Sonic Doctor:

snip

$6000 was the funding goal, and is pretty normal cost-wise for a video series of FF's production quality. The fact that the kickstarter made 10x that amount:

A) indicates that the community apparently does not think we've reached the saturation point for incisive criticism of sexism in game design.

B) should not lead to assumptions that the money will be spent unwisely. There's nothing that supports the "ZOMG Anita Sarkeesian will pocket the money!1!!!" conclusion some folks seem to be jumping to.

Considering that it is obvious she already has the gear to do the videos, the only expense there is is the expense of, "Well, I'm taking up my free time to make these videos about old news, are you going to pay me for it?"

There are plenty of people out there that make videos of better quality and actually bring interesting new points about what they are discussing, and they do it for free.

If she needs money to live on, she can go do something that is actually new and constructive, find somebody to actually hire her on whatever talents she has.

A.) As I said, naive people in the community. If saturation of the exact same thing and message over and over again truly worked, nobody would be smoking cigarettes and those companies would have been put out of business.

B.) If she spends it on herself in any way, she is spending it unwisely and she has taken advantage of said naive people.

Once again, there isn't any actual evidence to support the conclusions you are jumping to. Out of curiosity, on a scale of 1-10 (1 being "strongly disagree" and 10 being "agree,") where do you fall re: Feminist Frequency videos?

Oh hey I never heard about this person, I'll have to watch some of her vids.
I'm also quite interested in her take on video games, even though I hate people explaining tropes (which in the end means I start to see them everywhere and can't enjoy my good old mindless shows).

I'm curious as to why she needs money to make a Youtube video. Is she banned from using Google or something? The video's going to contain what? Knowledge that we are already aware of?

Her entire video reeks of confirmation bias.
Like using Batman: Arkham City as an example of sexism because of Catwoman being overly feminine while wearing a skintight suit, completely ignoring Batman being overly masculine while also wearing a skintight suit.
I'm a feminist myself, as in for equality between the sexes. But this shit isn't really helping.
She's preaching a flawed message to the choir, while non-choir people get angry.
It's lose-lose.

I don't know much about documentaries.

But regardless of the content, isn't this much money excessive? I mean, for documentaries on drugs, hate crime, or politics, the money is needed. It is spent on travel, camera crews, airing time, editing, and (biggest of all) landing interviews with doctors, officials, and other "big name" people.

For a documentary about sexism in video games, I'm really not sure where the money would be spent. Most things related to games can be found online. I guess you could interview some psychologists and some big name game executives (although I doubt they'd be caught dead in such an interview). Which may call for travel?

I watched some of her other videos. It really doesn't seem to be anything more than just a few days worth of editing and googling. Nothing worth thousands of dollars.

I'm not knocking the content. I'm questioning whether the money is really going into the documentary, or into somebody's pocket or website. This is a concern I have for many kickstarters, but for the documentaries it seems to be an especially valid concern.

Jiggy:

JediMB:

Jiggy:
If the way women are portrayed in Games didn't appeal to the demographic (sorry ladies, you aren't the demographic, buy more games and maybe that will change) why on earth would they design it that way?

Going to quote myself from my previous post:
"by unnecessarily catering to an audience they already have, the industry is both discouraging women from playing `our´ games and sending a message about the female sex to their players."

The issue is decades old. Women, and girls, have been discouraged from getting involved with technology/electronics, and as such didn't have much presence when video games became a thing. Then, while the market has started to appeal to the female gender with other forms of consumer electronics and entertainment, the video game industry has largely stubbornly been minmaxing its gender appeal stats.

You're not going to get someone to buy more games if you're unnecessarily making games unappealing to that someone.

Hot damn, you just refuted your own point for me. Thanks :)

They already have a audience, why would they go out of their way to obtain a audience they have no guarentee to obtain when that might alienate the one they already have? They don't have a reason.

Wow, just... wow. You're saying that including some female characters who aren't sexist stereotypes might alienate the existing audience? I think a large number of male gamers might want a word with you if that's your honest opinion of them.

Eamar:

Jiggy:

JediMB:

Going to quote myself from my previous post:
"by unnecessarily catering to an audience they already have, the industry is both discouraging women from playing `our´ games and sending a message about the female sex to their players."

The issue is decades old. Women, and girls, have been discouraged from getting involved with technology/electronics, and as such didn't have much presence when video games became a thing. Then, while the market has started to appeal to the female gender with other forms of consumer electronics and entertainment, the video game industry has largely stubbornly been minmaxing its gender appeal stats.

You're not going to get someone to buy more games if you're unnecessarily making games unappealing to that someone.

Hot damn, you just refuted your own point for me. Thanks :)

They already have a audience, why would they go out of their way to obtain a audience they have no guarentee to obtain when that might alienate the one they already have? They don't have a reason.

Wow, just... wow. You're saying that including some female characters who aren't sexist stereotypes might alienate the existing audience? I think a large number of male gamers might want a word with you if that's your honest opinion of them.

You mean the one's that pretend it isn't so? I think I can cope. I've yet to hear back from the guy stating that the risk totally isn't there on why they wouldn't already be doing it.

Also, I've also yet to hear a description of what constitutes this non-stereotypical female character, go ahead, give it a shot, I'm seriously interested in how many people will agree with you.

Phasmal:
Aaaand cue the people defending this sort of shit.

This stuff happens all the time in the gaming community and it needs to be pointed out and heckled as much as possible.

Hopefully, the gaming community will be dragged kicking and screaming towards a point where this kind of crap is at least frowned upon. (But I am sure I will be called `extreme` for even thinking there is a problem).

Just what I was thinking. I came into the comments expecting people to be disgusted but the first few pages are people defending the hecklers...sigh.

It seems like a few people need to know the difference between a power fantasy and a sexual fantasy. Male characters are power fantasy and are designed to appeal to men not women.

Also arguing that the demographic makes it alright is abhorrent. You wouldn't say racism is alright if the majority of the audience were white people so why is sexism okay?

Kahunaburger:

Sonic Doctor:
snip

Once again, there isn't any actual evidence to support the conclusions you are jumping to. Out of curiosity, on a scale of 1-10 (1 being "strongly disagree" and 10 being "agree,") where do you fall re: Feminist Frequency videos?

Five. There have always bee things when it comes to feminism that I think are a good point, and things I think are just overreactions.

But the discussion is about such things in video games.

I really don't see over-sexualized females in games as problem, it is just marketing to a real demographic. The problem is that there aren't a lot of normal, down to earth stylizations of women in games, but I'm not going to take someone seriously if they say there aren't any, or that the ones there are aren't to exact prefect standards for a proper representation of women(because, having encountered many everyday women, there really is no exact perfect representation, or ones that will be admitted to).

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