Microsoft Patents In-Home Consumer Monitoring System

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What if you use this service to buy porn...

RhombusHatesYou:

doggie015:

RicoADF:

Actually I've already looked into it, EULAs must abide by our laws, not the other way around. When I got bf3 it had a sticker with the federal emblem and a msg saying that our local consumer etc laws override the EULA.

I didn't know that... Brilliant! I can block microsoft from using that service in my house!

Yes... and in return Microsoft can stop you accessing any of it's services.

That's why they have a EULA for things like handware and software and ToS for services.

Joke's on them! I don't even have an Xbox (Original or the various 360 models) and have no plans to get one in the immidiate future. And if they cut off my Windows 8 install then I can just roll back to 7!

This is also a great way to stop piracy. Oh wait...

I'll just stop buying products that try to do something like this. Not a problem. I'm not a sheep.

"This is in no way doing anything to halter the people already pirating, let's fuck around with the honest and loyal consumers we have!"

It is a sentence of less than 25 words. Comprehend. Right. Now. Industry.

Evil Smurf:
simple, Just don't buy that product Microsoft are making.

Thing is, it'll probably come bundled with every single Windows system and games wil be requiring you to use it.

Seriously though, this is not just running against a single privacy law, it's running head first into all of them. Let's hope the head cracks open before law does.
Knowing how politics in the U.S. are oriented, I'm happy I don't live there.

Quaxar:

The power to file for a patent? Yeah, it's ridiculous I say!

No, the power to file SUCH patents. Try that in any more or less sane country and you'll either get laughed at or shot.
Apple filed a patent for "a box-shaped object with a screen and a button".
MS filed a patent for using beamers along with TV sets.
Biggest problem is: most of these patents are valid internationally. Which makes companies able to fight patent lawsuits in Germany, where the rules for defending a patent are much more evolved (as are the patent filing procedures, that's why they file them in the U.S.)
See what I mean?

This system is also HUGELY effective when it comes to piracy. It encourages people to download a clean version from sites like The Pirate Bay and watch it with friends instead of paying, only being able to watch it alone and being filmed.

RicoADF:
meh, if they ever impliment it I'd just sit back with popcorn and watch them be smashed by the law. Heck in Australia they'd be charged with filming minors without permission, numerous privacy laws etc etc, it'd never be allowed.

This is what would happen in Norway too, we have a bunch of laws making this all kinds of illegal (until our government decides to be assholes like with the Data Retention Directive). So yeah, they wouldn't be allowed to implement this here at present at least. And thank you Microsoft, I wasn't ever planning to get any product like the Kinect, good to know you keep giving me more reasons not to.

Also, to whoever at Microsoft came up with this and thought it was a good idea:

ITT: The forum rule prohibiting approval of piracy gets revoked. Escapist community not surprised.

More at 18:00

Matthi205:

Quaxar:

The power to file for a patent? Yeah, it's ridiculous I say!

No, the power to file SUCH patents. Try that in any more or less sane country and you'll either get laughed at or shot.
Apple filed a patent for "a box-shaped object with a screen and a button".
MS filed a patent for using beamers along with TV sets.
Biggest problem is: most of these patents are valid internationally. Which makes companies able to fight patent lawsuits in Germany, where the rules for defending a patent are much more evolved (as are the patent filing procedures, that's why they file them in the U.S.)
See what I mean?

This system is also HUGELY effective when it comes to piracy. It encourages people to download a clean version from sites like The Pirate Bay and watch it with friends instead of paying, only being able to watch it alone and being filmed.

I don't see a problem with the patent, it's a valid concept. As is the "iconic" iphone design, of course you'd want to protect your designs and logos.

What is ridiculous is the patenting of abstract concepts, as in "sending of news via email", that are then used for patent trolling. But German patent filing is just as flawed, at the start of the year a Bavarian company held a patent for an Austrian common-use phrase and started admonishing various Austrian printers for selling clothing with the words printed on.

And now I am going to be getting one of these http://tinyurl.com/kinectsafe
Your move Micro$oft.

..... what the flying fuck is this bullshit. o.o;; they're talking about actual cameras? in the home? to monitor how many people are viewing their media? have they lost their damn minds?

I am SOOOOOO GLAD M$ patented it!!!
This ensure no other company can come up with such shit!

There is a war coming.

Microsoft vs the world.

BloodRed Pixel:
I am SOOOOOO GLAD M$ patented it!!!
This ensure no other company can come up with such shit!

This is the internet, where we communicate in image macros! Hence:

image

They've got to be kidding right? Even if the idea of this NOW is to stop other companies using it for worse means...Jesus titty f/cking Christ on a bike.

Just...no. Just no.

Microsoft's really falling on it's arse today.

Wanting to monitor people is only going to have one of two effects: they ignore your products entirely or they increase their illegal use of them Microsoft. If I could easily and cheaply have access to all the films and tv shows I am interested in I would never need to watch them on youtube/some other streaming service in some unlicensed capacity, especially since the quality of those streaming services are so irregular and often terrible. If Microsoft's Windows Live service was easier to use, cheaper and more well managed than Steam, again, all my business would go there.

Therumancer:

Evil Smurf:
simple, Just don't buy that product Microsoft are making.

Actually the point of them patenting this is so that if they develop the technology they can then liscence it to other companies. Microsoft would make the money off of something like this by selling it to movie companies, digital rental services, and similar things.

It pretty much goes down to the old arguement that if you buy a book, you don't actually own the book or the story, but simply have bought permission to personally view/read/consume it. Technically if you lend someone else your book to read, or make copies of it, your comitting a crime since everyone else consuming it should have paid the creator. Harlan Ellison (the science fiction writer) was fond of championing such arguements, and there have been cases against schools and such for photocopying sections of books for students, rather than forcing every student in a class to buy a copy of the book themselves. This being especially true in colleges where they are private businesses, and there is some motivation by teachers to try and cut costs due to the cost of books already being insane.

In the scope of a digital product like a movie, the point would be that a rental of a movie is for one person, if more than one person wants to watch the movie, they should all have to pay "admission". Something you don't currently see because there is no way to track it. If there was a way to track it, it would be embraced however, especially if all the services offering rentals collaberated to ensure there were no alternatives. Microsoft selling the tech to everyone, making a bundle, while the companies themselves make more money through rentals.

On the subject of books, they are rapidly getting to the point where they will probably be digital only. With the right tech, your reading devices could monitor how many individual users have tried to access to content. Devices are already becoming hybrids with cameras and such, and pretty much anything they put a camera on (or could put one on) could be used to monitor and control content consumption, especially as recognition software becomes more effective.

To argue that this is wrong and people would never stand for it, is more or less irrelevent. As things stand now, if big business decides to push for something en-masse there is little stopping them. people choosing to go entirely without media is probably not going to happen. As time goes on and people grow up not knowing it any other way, the complaints will vanish. We already see it now with gouging over things like video games, people complain about the abuses inherant in DLC, microtransactions, and similar things, but as every year goes by you see more people growing up (each generation outnumbering the last) who have never known it any other way. For someone who is in their late 20s, 30s, or 40 to talk about how things were or should be is kind of meaningless, as some teenager or early 20-something who has never known things to be any other way it doesn't matter since they really can't quite visualize it. This is also why there is never any kind of uprising, there are new, sheepish consumers coming into any kind of scam, in greater numbers than the ones who know better at any given point. Today's sheep will be the same way, complaining about the new flock, as they themselves are overrun when business gets even greedier.

I don't like the idea, I think it should be stopped, but honestly I just don't think people have it in them to put their foot down. This won't be here tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure it, or something like it, will be coming.

To be honest, having read a lot of speculative science fiction I always felt we'd see a retina scanning system doing the same basic thing, rather than the kinect-like camera system being talked about here. I figured the start would be when they decided to put retina-locks onto things like iPhones and iPads as a new "security system" to cut down on theft and hacking and such, once in place for those reasons it would be used for content control, and then it would gradually expand into household electronics and such, to the point where eventually you'd need a retinal scan for just about everything, with this lock "protecting your property" actually becoming one that "ensures only a paying customer" can use it. Going so far as to not only limit media, but to make it so that you'd have to pay for everyone in your family to have their retinal scans enabled to turn on the microwave, work the coffee machine, or open the fridge. I guess it's like Jules Verne and books like 20,000 Leagues Under The Sea, the basic idea is shockingly accurate to what we'd actually see, but the implenetation and specifics are far differant.

I applaud you on your well thought out, articulate post; you've made some very good points.

It kinda worries me, where will corporate greed end? There has to be a point when enough is enough, and the corporations simply cannot increase their profit margins any further - god only knows what kind of life the consumer will be living at that point.

http://xkcd.com/488/
This is all I have to say on the subject.

Piracy is a pretty grey issue at the moment, but should this insanity come to pass then piracy will pretty much be perfectly justifiable.

Maybe even morally right, as you're not submitting to an Orwellian nightmare.

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