Metro: Last Light Developer Dumps on Wii U

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Metro: Last Light Developer Dumps on Wii U

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Don't expect Metro: Last Light to turn up on Nintendo's new console anytime soon.

The Wii U is finally here and unlike its underpowered predecessor, its library will feature a number of high-profile shooters, like Black Ops 2, Aliens: Colonial Marines and Homefront 2. One game it probably won't be getting, however, is Metro: Last Light, the upcoming sequel to Metro 2033.

Why? For one thing, "[The] Wii U has a horrible, slow CPU," as 4A Games Chief Technical Officer Oles Shishkovtsov put it rather bluntly.

Huw Beynon, THQ's global communications manager, was a little more diplomatic about it. "We had an early look at it, we thought we could probably do it, but in terms of the impact we would make on the overall quality of the game - potentially to its detriment - we just figured it wasn't worth pursuing at this time," he told Now Gamer. "It's something we might return to. I really couldn't make any promises, though."

One problem facing the Kiev-based 4A Games is a simple lack of manpower. Metro 2033 was released only for the Xbox 360 and PC, and Beynon said that developing the PlayStation 3 version of Metro: Last Light represents a "significant addition" to the workload. And unlike heavyweights Activision or Electronic Arts, which can bulk up studios as necessary or even bring in entirely separate studios to help out, Metro publisher THQ is currently in no position to offer any sort of practical assistance.

Metro: Last Light is slated to come out sometimes in 2013 for the Xbox 360, PlayStation 3 and PC.

Source: Now Gamer

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Not very diplomatic, but completely fair.

THQ are probably THRILLED with the statement, though.

Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

It should noted that the Wii U is a new system so having hardware equivalent to last gen's systems is nothing to be proud of.

OT: Just means they can focus more on the PC version which I am very much looking forward to. Also I love how blunt he was.

Well, if they were to add the extra work of making a Wii U version, they'd just be increasing the chances that THQ will have gone out of business before the game is released.

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

And people have been complaining about them for years now.

lacktheknack:
Not very diplomatic, but completely fair.

THQ are probably THRILLED with the statement, though.

I continue to mostly not sympathize with a publisher that is incapable of reaping profits from Warhammer 40k and Saints Row. I do feel for the developers stuck with them.

I say mostly because EA and Activision are the ones too entitled for my ire.

Xan Krieger:

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

It should noted that the Wii U is a new system so having hardware equivalent to last gen's systems is nothing to be proud of.

I wish more people understood this fact instead of stupidly defending a blatantly underpowered console.

You should note I'm not calling it a terrible system, I'm calling it 6 years late to the party.

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

It's basically on par yes. Maybe a little better or a little worse. But that does mean that when the next generation playstation and xbox come out, Nintendo will be in last place in terms of pure hardware power again. Not that it worked out badly for them this time around, mind you.

Uh...i wasn't opening debate. Im on epic pc, so I dont really care. Just an odd statement to say they dont care about wii U period and more about Last gens consoles. It doesn't exactly add up if the cpu is on par.

Two things that I glean from this:

1) Developers need to grow the hell up and stop trash talking like they are still in the school yard.

2) If they are talking about how effort is required to get a PS3 version I predict a poor port. Which will be a pain if it is true, as it's probably the platform I'd choose.

Legion:
Two things that I glean from this:

1) Developers need to grow the hell up and stop trash talking like they are still in the school yard.

2) If they are talking about how effort is required to get a PS3 version I predict a poor port. Which will be a pain if it is true, as it's probably the platform I'd choose.

1) Developers are entitled to there opinions too

2) The PS3 has been regarded as notoriously hard to code for since release.

flarty:

Legion:
Two things that I glean from this:

1) Developers need to grow the hell up and stop trash talking like they are still in the school yard.

2) If they are talking about how effort is required to get a PS3 version I predict a poor port. Which will be a pain if it is true, as it's probably the platform I'd choose.

1) Developers are entitled to there opinions too

2) The PS3 has been regarded as notoriously hard to code for since release.

2) Not so much hard to code for specifically. The 360 is basically a low quality PC, so developing for both at the same time is pretty easy (supposidly.) Because of the PS3's architecture, you actually need to rework a lot of the memory and processor interface code or you get things like Skyrim, where the game just wanders around begging for memory that doesn't exist and eating it's own foot.

Or so I'm told...

Good games, even to this day, are made with restrictions in mind. Making a game with barriers is how game development works. Some systems have more barriers than others, or different sorts of barriers, but ultimately it's up to the developers to figure it out. There is no "one size fits all" development structure, as much as we'd like there to be.

When making a game for the Wii U, guess what, you're going to have to make a game FOR THE WII U, and cater your game specs to suit the game. When you port it, the same thing applies. Some people can do that and do that well, while many others continue to struggle with ports or their false "one-size-fits-all" philosophy (oh hi, PS3 Skyrim!).

I'm sure the Wii U has plenty of strength and plenty of weaknesses. It's a new system; give it time and developers will figure out where to push and pull to get the most out of it.

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

This is actually incredibly unclear at the moment. But most estimates put it at more powerful than either the 360 or PS3. But Nintendo has not released all the information about it, which seems suspect. And considering it has a much more modern and a pretty powerful GPU (in relative terms), this what should matter as the GPU is where almost all of the stress is placed if you go by the first Metro game. But, it is what it is. It seems more likely that it's a manpower issue more than anything to me, but who am I to argue with random Chief Technical Officer guy.

Baresark:

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

This is actually incredibly unclear at the moment. But most estimates put it at more powerful than either the 360 or PS3. But Nintendo has not released all the information about it, which seems suspect. And considering it has a much more modern and a pretty powerful GPU (in relative terms), this what should matter as the GPU is where almost all of the stress is placed if you go by the first Metro game. But, it is what it is. It seems more likely that it's a manpower issue more than anything to me, but who am I to argue with random Chief Technical Officer guy.

Someone actualy answered me completely unbiased? Am i in the right forum? Anyways, thanks. Back to Borderlands 2 on PC :D

xedobubble:

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

It's basically on par yes. Maybe a little better or a little worse. But that does mean that when the next generation playstation and xbox come out, Nintendo will be in last place in terms of pure hardware power again. Not that it worked out badly for them this time around, mind you.

I'm not disagreeing with your statement, I just don't see how the next XBox or Playstation (which is all speculation at this point) is relevant. I think he was making a point that it's regarded as on par with the current generation so why would someone say that it's a "horrible, slow CPU".

I don't know if I'd call this "dumping" on it. From what I hear it does have a shitty CPU. Stating a fact isn't trash talk.

I don't get why Nintendo does this. I understand making a profit by using cheap, old parts, but they're really just holding their games back, and make it really hard to justify the asking price when the thing has about as much power as my cell phone.

Of course, chances are that their engine people just aren't that good with optimizing for new hardware. As I recall, the original Metro game had its own optimization issues.

A developer that doesn't know to make an optimized game complains about hardware power.
If he CPU was that weak, why is the Aliens developer saying how the WiiU version is the best working and best looking version, excluding the PC ofc.

Call me all sorts of names but I can't be the only one who was most shocked by the fact that Homefront is getting a sequel. Medal of Honor was critically and, I think commercially a greater success than Homefront 1 if I'm not mistaken and people thought it killed Medal of Honor (before Warfighter happened and killed the franchise for real or so I've come to believe)

So...he complains its weak and still develops for the 360 which is definitely weaker than the WiiU?

Is there some sort of logic to this I'm missin?

shintakie10:
So...he complains its weak and still develops for the 360 which is definitely weaker than the WiiU?

Is there some sort of logic to this I'm missin?

THANK YOU. Thats really all im saying here. Its not fanboyism, its just the fact it doesn't fit logically.

So to translate: We don't like the Nintendo system because when we saw preliminary specs that put it slightly slower then the systems we were developing for. We just stopped looking at it even though those specs have changed, and are not only on par, but actually better then (in output potential) then the system we are developing for, and IT'S JUST HARD"

OT:

Xan Krieger:

Darmy647:
Im curious about something, and im Defidentally sure the escapist community would be happy to fill me in, but isn't the wii u cpu on par with the 360 and ps3?? I have not been keeping up, pc gamer elites and what-not.

It should noted that the Wii U is a new system so having hardware equivalent to last gen's systems is nothing to be proud of.

OT: Just means they can focus more on the PC version which I am very much looking forward to. Also I love how blunt he was.

no it is not equal to last gen systems it actually exceeds them in both processor, and graphics (which are large bottle necks for both of those systems), so in essence it is a next gen console because it is better then the best of the current generation (depending on which of those you believe it to be). So please stop listening to these "experts" who don't understand what they are talking about that are calling the Wii-U equivalent to current gen systems.

A lot of this is the fact that the Wii U is new, and will take developers a little more effort to learn.

But also it does have its foibles, although it has more memory than either the 360 or PS3, memory access is quite slow except to the eDRAM, which is only 32MB, so some things are harder to do with it than they are with other consoles where main RAM can be used for them (noticably, Batman: Arkham City has lower quality shadows, and some games lack antialiasing).

In time, Wii U versions of things may well be better than both of the previous generation HD consoles, but not yet. (Mass Effect 3, for instance, runs at a consistently lower framerate than the Xbox 360 version).

Anybody remember Half-Life on PS2? Remember how it was? Then remember when you popped in shadow of the colossus? Yeah. Thats exactly what will happen.

Darmy647:

shintakie10:
So...he complains its weak and still develops for the 360 which is definitely weaker than the WiiU?

Is there some sort of logic to this I'm missin?

THANK YOU. Thats really all im saying here. Its not fanboyism, its just the fact it doesn't fit logically.

More powerful than a 360? Hardly.

http://kotaku.com/5962603/mass-effect-3-on-xbox-360-vs-ps3-vs-wii-u

360 wins.

Eri:

Darmy647:

shintakie10:
So...he complains its weak and still develops for the 360 which is definitely weaker than the WiiU?

Is there some sort of logic to this I'm missin?

THANK YOU. Thats really all im saying here. Its not fanboyism, its just the fact it doesn't fit logically.

More powerful than a 360? Hardly.

http://kotaku.com/5962603/mass-effect-3-on-xbox-360-vs-ps3-vs-wii-u

360 wins.

Your link says Cinematic are for the Wii U, and that it's mostly equivalent to Xbox 360 in actual gameplay, with some minor issues. That doesn't sound like the 360 wins... If anything, it says it's a tie with 360 and WiiU, and the PS3 in last.

Also, take a look at this:

Make sure your on 1080p though, cause then the differences really stand out. The WiiU version of Black Ops 2 appears to be the best looking version of the game.

Darmy647:
Uh...i wasn't opening debate. Im on epic pc, so I dont really care. Just an odd statement to say they dont care about wii U period and more about Last gens consoles. It doesn't exactly add up if the cpu is on par.

If the Wii U follows the trend most PCs follow then it will probably have a CPU worse than last gen consoles, it'll just have more of them.

3Ghz dual cores were pretty standard a few years back. Right now 2.5Ghz quad cores seem pretty common.

Except it being a console and therefore having to be cheap it'll probably be at 2Ghz or even lower.

Having more cores works great for multithreading. But some things you can't multithread, sometimes you can't start doing thing #2 until thing #1 is finished. And is such a case having worse CPUs but more of them doesn't help at all, it'll only go slower.

The Wii U's specs aren't fully known yet I believe so I don't know if this is actually the case, but it would be a very valid argument for not even looking at the platform.

Eri:

Darmy647:

shintakie10:
So...he complains its weak and still develops for the 360 which is definitely weaker than the WiiU?

Is there some sort of logic to this I'm missin?

THANK YOU. Thats really all im saying here. Its not fanboyism, its just the fact it doesn't fit logically.

More powerful than a 360? Hardly.

http://kotaku.com/5962603/mass-effect-3-on-xbox-360-vs-ps3-vs-wii-u

360 wins.

Did you not read your own link?

Choice quotes.

the Wii U and Xbox 360 ran at virtual parity for much of the run of the play

Screen-filling effects work causes noticeable frame-rate dips on the Microsoft platform, but Wii U appears to be relatively consistent - even on the more open, challenging battlescapes of Palaven.

Even the parts that show it to have issues is explained away in the last bit.

it also is worth remembering that Mass Effect 3 on Wii U is both a port of a game made for other machines and a day-one game on Wii U. Usually developers can wring way more out of a console in year three or five than they can in year zero.

Learn to read yo.

Mr.Mattress:

Your link says Cinematic are for the Wii U, and that it's mostly equivalent to Xbox 360 in actual gameplay, with some minor issues. That doesn't sound like the 360 wins... If anything, it says it's a tie with 360 and WiiU, and the PS3 in last.

Also, take a look at this:

Make sure your on 1080p though, cause then the differences really stand out. The WiiU version of Black Ops 2 appears to be the best looking version of the game.

Meh, on the BLOPS2 video only the textures looked better for me (most noticeble at the end in the clothes of the soldiers), the rest were just different colors (I dont get why the gun is green in the Xbox/PS3 version lol).

The thing is are people buying WiiU's just to play games they can already play but that look slightly better? Pay a whole system just for that? This seems to be the kind of tech that should have been released at least 2 years after the launch of the PS3 or something

Legion:
Two things that I glean from this:

1) Developers need to grow the hell up and stop trash talking like they are still in the school yard.

There is a difference between stating a fact and trash talking.

shintakie10:
So...he complains its weak and still develops for the 360 which is definitely weaker than the WiiU?

Is there some sort of logic to this I'm missin?

The part you are missing is the fact that it is easier to port a game from PC onto Xbox than it is to port it over to WiiU or PS3.

josemlopes:

The thing is are people buying WiiU's just to play games they can already play but that look slightly better? Pay a whole system just for that? This seems to be the kind of tech that should have been released at least 2 years after the launch of the PS3 or something

Fun fact: A Consoles Graphics improve dramatically over time. Here's an example:

This is one of the first launch titles for the Xbox 360, Condemned. Notice at how terrible it looks: It looks just like an Xbox/Gamecube/High Graphic PS2 game. Plus, it's impossible to run this game in 720p, something the Xbox 360 can do quite well. Compare it to Condemned 2:

Looks so much better, doesn't it? Characters eyes move, the graphics can be in 720p, the characters are more expressive, there's better use of the areas (Debris, coloration, etc), hair looks real, and the enemies are much more expressive/creative.

With time, the WiiU will go from "Looking slightly better then PS3", to "Holly Crud! These Graphics are so beautiful!!"

FelixG:

Legion:
Two things that I glean from this:

1) Developers need to grow the hell up and stop trash talking like they are still in the school yard.

There is a difference between stating a fact and trash talking.

shintakie10:
So...he complains its weak and still develops for the 360 which is definitely weaker than the WiiU?

Is there some sort of logic to this I'm missin?

The part you are missing is the fact that it is easier to port a game from PC onto Xbox than it is to port it over to WiiU or PS3.

Except that whole PS3 bit. The PS3 has been proven to be decidedly harder to port to than the 360 and, by all accounts, should be harder to port to than the WiiU. It, based off of evidence show so far and based off of whatever little information we've gleamed from people tearin WiiU's open, is also weaker than the WiiU in terms of sheer power.

Either he's full of shit or this was the easiest answer he could say without goin into specifics.

Mr.Mattress:

josemlopes:

The thing is are people buying WiiU's just to play games they can already play but that look slightly better? Pay a whole system just for that? This seems to be the kind of tech that should have been released at least 2 years after the launch of the PS3 or something

Fun fact: A Consoles Graphics improve dramatically over time. Here's an example:

This is one of the first launch titles for the Xbox 360, Condemned. Notice at how terrible it looks: It looks just like an Xbox/Gamecube/High Graphic PS2 game. Plus, it's impossible to run this game in 720p, something the Xbox 360 can do quite well. Compare it to Condemned 2:

Looks so much better, doesn't it? Characters eyes move, the graphics can be in 720p, the characters are more expressive, there's better use of the areas (Debris, coloration, etc), hair looks real, and the enemies are much more expressive/creative.

With time, the WiiU will go from "Looking slightly better then PS3", to "Holly Crud! These Graphics are so beautiful!!"

Isn't it different though? The Wii U is using tech similar to the 360/PS3. It's not like the transition from the last gen, where console devs hadn't had anything of that caliber before. Slight differences aside, the Wii U is really just another current gen console, and devs are already straining under those limits. I doubt there's gonna be much more they can do with the Wii U.

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