Teens Sedate Parents For Net Access

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well they said it was a 10pm curfew on internet access, not a 10pm curfew overall.

I used to have a one hour limit on the game consolse and internet combined when i lived at home for crying out loud and i never drugged anyone. A ten pm internet shut down is bloody fair if i say so myself

10:00 curfew isn't generous, nor is it strict. It's exactly what it should be for teenagers still in school. I had to be up around 6AM to catch a bus and ride its whole route, over an hour total, every morning before school. If I had been up past 10 the previous night, I'd be sleeping the whole day. Restricting internet access is just another way to tell kids "Time to put away the toys and go to bed". That's what the internet is for a teenager - a toy. While drugging the parents is kinda extreme, getting the police involved is even worse. No permanent harm was done to the parents but permanent harm can be done to the children if they end up with a record due to this incident. It will not matter when this happened, if it's on their record it will make them effectively unemployable and yet another strain on society in a country full of people who are stuck in a vicious circle of crime and poverty.

Belated:

FFP2:

McMullen:

I think that sentiment is part of where the moral panics against games come from. It's quite possible they're no more screwed up than we were, we just hear about them more than we heard about us. I mean, think about it. This case is shocking because it's so unprecedented. That means it's rare.

Some kids over here killed their parents because they refused to get them a Blackberry, and another because he didn't get a PS3 for his birthday... Stuff like this is child's play compared to the shit that goes down here. Sorry if I came across as prejudiced.

I don't know. I mean I'm with you on the "don't jail me bro" thing, but

omega 616:
It could be worse, they could have bound and gagged them.

The way I see it is, "no harm, no foul" just teach them it was a wrong thing to do.

Some people seem to think this was a major thing that happened and I just don't see it that way, it was bad but not juvie bad.

Anyway, 10 curfew? For 16 year old? Treat them with respect and maybe they won't drug you

I don't know, I mean, I"m with you on the "don't get the law involved" part, but 10 seems pretty fair to me. The parents just want them to get adequate sleep. My bed time was 9:30 until I was about 14. It was pretty much unlimited when I was 15, but that's because my mom passed away and my dad was overly nice because he was afraid of losing my love. And now I've developed seriously bad sleeping habits that I've been very slowly breaking over the course of the last five years.

Wow. That turned dark quickly. The point is, what curfew do you think is fair for a teenager?

Yeah, my curfew was at 7 and I still have sleep issues... Granted, I didn't abide by it most of the time but still.

Belated:
snip

Well that is a broad question, teenager is 13 to 19 and I wouldn't consider having the same bed time for a 13 year old and 19 to be fair.

At 14 I had an 11 bed time. I moved out at 17 so I controlled my bed time then but I am far from a typical boy, never been drunk or anything so I can't say what's normal.

I would say the same for kids though, at 14 go to bed at 11, after 16 you're big and ugly enough to look after yourself... If you think a 5 am bed time is a good idea then you suffer the results.

I lived in a very free house, my mum wasn't strict at all, she might say "don't do that" but only if I was doing wrong or would hurt myself/break something. I was playing resident evil at 8 and watching horror films at 9.

I think it's better to let kids be guided but let them do what they like, within reason. Instead of a Kim Jong il style cos I think that is when they rebel and do this kind of stuff

Belated:

-snip-

Your criminal record is wiped clean at 18. The fact that they're minors is exactly why they should get either jail time or some other state-mandated punishment.

You know, they learned how to do that on the internet.

Man, the worst I ever did when I was 16 was stay out at an all night coffee shop playing D&D...granted This was pre-interwebs so who knows what I'd have done if deprived of my drug of choice.

Which brings up an interesting thought, what they did almost smacks of drug seeking behaviour, in the sense of going to extremes to get your drug of choice. (and let's face it Internet addiction although debated by medical professionals is starting to be considered a real thing.) Or alternatively excess internet usage can be a sign of some other disorder etc.

So yeah, there may well have been a very valid reason for the parents to forbid internet use after a set time, and as the ones footing the bill for the connection, they can damn well do as they please.

Wow. other teenagers these days are starting to have ABSOLUTELY no respect for their parents. Indeed, 10 is a crap time, but really? Drug them? It doesn't matter how harmless it was, what happens if you accidentally give your parents an overdose and kill them?

"Sorry judge, but my parents wouldn't let me stay on the internet past 10!"

yeah, I can see that going down well. When I wanted a curfew lifted, or anything for that matter, I just nagged. These kids most certainly deserve to have their internet taken for a bloody month or something, have the modem moved to another house.

Honestly, this was probably minor overall, but the overarching consequences, and what COULD have been, are simply too large to ignore. Who's to say this doesn't go around as a clever idea to sneak out of the house, or other things?

Oddly enough, before the internet, this would have been viewed as what it is: silly.

I've no sympathy for the teens.

Drugging a person is a very big no no, and if it takes a scare from the cops to kick this concept of basic morality into these kids heads, all the better.

Better to learn it now from your folks calling the cops who still have your best interests at heart, than to learn it the hard way as an adult and serve a jail sentence for it

Greets!

I see quite a few people in this thread laughing and saying the parents are shitty. Hold on a minute while I facepalm.

*slap*

Kids will generally try to find a way around restrictions to get what they want and there is nothing wrong with that, but a problem does come when they are using medication to achieve this. Indeed, this particular event could be considered the equal of drugging someone you like at the bar so that you can 'take them home'

I would love to see the comments here if the parents died as a result of a bad mix of sedatives or sleeping pills put into that magic milk shake. Believe me, it can be easier to kill someone with sleeping tablets than you might think! Especially if they are on another type of medication already.

Reminds me of my ex-gf whose mother set the internet to turn off at 2AM. Makes me wonder what she did to get around it.

Incoming scary thought.

Baldry:

Well in this case it requires my kid to want to drug people and the only reason i'd see my child do it would be for shits and giggles.
Tantrum maybe not, getting violent and what not maybe, if there's a threat of death then sure call the police but they shouldn't of let it get this far in the first place.

Yeah but if we use the example above they would've drugged you to skip curfew, maybe it's just to use the internet now but they might decide to drug you later to go to a party next time is all I'm saying.
I can agree with this part though.

At first I was 'o.0 why did they call the cops'

then, I saw what state it happened, this explains much about why the parents where so gutless as to not sack up and handle the situation them selves.

from what I'm understanding of the story the blames lay with the parents s well as the teens. First of all, 10 PM cut off, at 15 is to restrictive, so it wouldn't surprise me to learn of other violations of this ill suited rule. kids grow up, and treat a 15 year old like a 12 year old is going to cause problems in short order. but, California parents *rolls eyes* I kind expect this kind of half assed attitude from that state.

The teens however, should not have gone so far as to drug some one just to get back online, and should face jail time so they learn that drugging some one is not the appropriate reaction to anything. Sneaking out and darting over to a friends house would have been a much better plan.

Honestly, had I done this to my dad (with non-prescription sleep aids) as a teen, he would probably laugh about it more than be serious about it. Doesn't practically every house have a bottle of sleep aids around for just in case? Yeah, I'd get in a bit of trouble, but it'd be something we'd laugh about in the future. I understand the article says it was prescription-strength, but other than an overdose risk, the mere act alone seems like something out of a sitcom more than a drama, with very little risk of negative consequences (other than a very tired night). By "very little risk," yes, there's a chance for allergies or bad mixing, but, again, the chances of that are pretty slim.

Call me old-fashioned, but it really doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me, and DEFINITELY not something worth police involvement over.

The girls should be informed of the risk of accepting prescription drugs from other people, absolutely, but I don't think that what they DID with said drugs is anywhere near as dangerous as the acceptance of them in the first place.

I'm with the girls, assuming they did it thinking it was a harmless stunt, since it WAS a harmless, if uneducated, stunt. Next time, I'd suggest using over-the-counter sleep aids instead.

I must be old or something, 10PM internet cut-off time = Nazi parents?

This will probably be from the same people who say that parents should monitor what their kids do while on the internet. The parents probably have jobs to go to and can't afford to stay up making sure their offspring isn't posing to strangers on webcam until the early hours of tomorrow.

While I agree that there was no need to get the police involved, I think that - if I was one of the parents - I'd find it hard to think of a suitable punishment for drugging me and my wife. The actions of the children were not justified because of the rules of the parents, no matter how 'strict' you think they are.

Christ, parents really can't win can they?

Blablahb:
snip

treating them like a small child? i would've loved to have a 10pm curfew at their age, mine was between 8:30 and 9:30pm, the parents likely just wanted the kids to get enough sleep.

Kuratius:
snip

you have heard of the term 'doli incapax' haven't you? it means conclusive presumption.

"The presumption under common law is that a child under 10 cannot be held legally responsible for their actions. The presumption that a child cannot form Mens Rea or the thought or intention to commit a criminal act as they do not yet have a sufficient understanding between "right and wrong". In the context of Australian law, doli incapx acts as a rebuttable presumption for children aged at least 10 but less than 14."

So basically, once you get to about 15 or 16, there is a presumption that you know the difference between seriously wrong (which is what this issue is) and naughty/mischievous. Besides, these kids would still be treated as a youth and not tried as an adult (they'd be put through the childrens court/family court) as their offence is not severe enough to warrant being tried as an adult.

While yes, the legal system is flawed, a child would neither have the understanding or the money to go to court with a lawyer and file a lawsuit. Besides how many 15 or 16 year olds will understand the law enough without prior learning in the subject?
There was a very real possibility that these girls could have overdosed the parents with those sleeping pills. These girls are very unlikely to be convicted and face jail, if they do get charged, they will most likely get some form of community service and have their record expunged after.

ThingWhatSqueaks:
snip

I agree, though i will say, and it concurs with your statement, a conviction will not solve this issue, it's been shown that people who are convicted of crimes are more likely to become recidivist within the system (they'll commit more crime in the future).

Belated:
snip

'minor' does not always mean stupid, it can mean lack of understanding too. What you've said about "Their brains are physically incapable of comprehending the severity of their actions because they're not fully developed yet" is only a partial truth, by the age of 15 or 16 kids will know the difference between seriously wrong and naughty/mischievous, but likely not have the understanding of the full repercussions of their actions. You are completely right about a criminal conviction not helping, if they do face charges, they'd likely go through the childrens court, if they are sentenced it would likely be community service and having the charges expunged from their record afterwards, as while what they did was seriously wrong, it is not enough to warrant prison time.

You wouldn't care if your child murdered someone or was a contract killer? That is a serious issue within itself, so you wouldn't care if your child was a serious threat to other people? Would you care if your child was a serious threat to your friends or their children? Where do you draw the line?

This kind of behavior is despicable. I hope the parents throw the proverbial parenting book at them. Such a betrayal of trust.

Kopikatsu:
They should face jail time regardless. Drugging someone standing between you and something you want because you can't just wait until the morning is not the mark of a well adjusted individual.

Blablahb:

Milanezi:
I guess now the girls made their point of how MATURE they are and how SAFE it is to let them roam around the internet.

Look at it the other way: Their parents treated them like small children, and it made them act like small children, what a surprise...

You think that an acceptable response to a curfew (And 10PM is very generous) is to drug the authority figure so you have free reign?

I'm going to play devils advocate and say yes. If someone is in your way, it's not the worst thing in the world to non-violently subdue them. At least it isn't another "Teen kills mother for taking away his keyboard" story. People get pissed when they can't have their way. And don't call it immature, the republicans of the US are doing the same damn thing.

mysecondlife:
Reminds me of my ex-gf whose mother set the internet to turn off at 2AM. Makes me wonder what she did to get around it.

Incoming scary thought.

Boot into the BIOS and change the system clock? That's what I did :p

EHKOS:

Kopikatsu:
They should face jail time regardless. Drugging someone standing between you and something you want because you can't just wait until the morning is not the mark of a well adjusted individual.

Blablahb:
Look at it the other way: Their parents treated them like small children, and it made them act like small children, what a surprise...

You think that an acceptable response to a curfew (And 10PM is very generous) is to drug the authority figure so you have free reign?

I'm going to play devils advocate and say yes. If someone is in your way, it's not the worst thing in the world to non-violently subdue them. At least it isn't another "Teen kills mother for taking away his keyboard" story. People get pissed when they can't have their way. And don't call it immature, the republicans of the US are doing the same damn thing.

Greets!

Nice.

I am curious how you feel about drugging kids to make sure they stay within curfew hours.

Surely, making sure they are sleeping by a certain time by using medication is reasonable right? I mean if the kids are allowed drug their parents non-violently to circumvent these restrictions, parents should be given the right to return the favor, right?

A kid refusing to adhere to curfew hours is 'getting in the way' of the parent, right? Right?

Or is this all a big double-standard?

Compared to some of the other stuff people have done to their parents because of restricts and such, this is a pretty good outcome

Madgamer13:

EHKOS:

Kopikatsu:
They should face jail time regardless. Drugging someone standing between you and something you want because you can't just wait until the morning is not the mark of a well adjusted individual.

You think that an acceptable response to a curfew (And 10PM is very generous) is to drug the authority figure so you have free reign?

I'm going to play devils advocate and say yes. If someone is in your way, it's not the worst thing in the world to non-violently subdue them. At least it isn't another "Teen kills mother for taking away his keyboard" story. People get pissed when they can't have their way. And don't call it immature, the republicans of the US are doing the same damn thing.

Greets!

Nice.

I am curious how you feel about drugging kids to make sure they stay within curfew hours.

Surely, making sure they are sleeping by a certain time by using medication is reasonable right? I mean if the kids are allowed drug their parents non-violently to circumvent these restrictions, parents should be given the right to return the favor, right?

A kid refusing to adhere to curfew hours is 'getting in the way' of the parent, right? Right?

Or is this all a big double-standard?

It wouldn't be a terrible idea. Parents use a different method, by threatening usually, but I don't think people would throw too much of a fit if childrens "Sleeping Shots" were introduced. Parents also use Ritilan to keep their kids in line.

lunavixen:
You wouldn't care if your child murdered someone or was a contract killer? That is a serious issue within itself, so you wouldn't care if your child was a serious threat to other people? Would you care if your child was a serious threat to your friends or their children? Where do you draw the line?

That's not what I meant by "I wouldn't care..." of course I would "care". Yeah it would be terrible and I'd be disappointed in him. But for one, everybody is capable of murder. Everybody. And with the right damage, the right thing to really break you down, even you could kill someone. One terrible mistake that he would forever regret? No, that would not make me hate my kid. Psychosis? Serial killer? Sociopath? Okay, then I'd have him committed. If my child was like this? Sure, fair enough. But if he's not a psycho, if he just made the biggest mistake of his life in the heat of the moment? Or if he's a career criminal? No, I wouldn't betray him. Family first.

The only time it's okay to betray family is in the interest of protecting yourself after they've betrayed you. Parents who bring their kids to small claims court over some trivial bill or rent disgust me. What happened to the parents who truly loved their kids? What happened to the parents who would protect their kids no matter what? What happened to the parents who would do anything for their kids?

And contract killers are not the same as serial killers. They don't do it for fun, they do it for money, and typically they work for organized crime. When you think about it really, the contract killer's just the middle man. Who's worse? The guy who did the job, or the guy who hired him? I'm not saying it's a good thing to do, but I wouldn't turn in my own son if he did it.

But the reason I use the contract killer example is because, when I was just a child, and my mom was in the mid stages of her cancer, she told me on the hospital bed that she would always love me no matter what. When I asked, "Even if I was a contract killer?" (in the same way people on the internet bring up Nazis as an extreme example), she told me, "Yes. I wouldn't approve of it, and I'd try to get you to change your ways, but I would still love you." And my father loves me just as much. He takes care of me, puts up with my shortcomings, and even hugs me when I cry.

I owe my own children the same love my mother and father gave me. That's what it means to be a real parent. Unconditional love. It means exactly that. Unconditional. Without conditions. It's time to bring back REAL parents. Parents like the one I have, and the one I had.

Well, I guess it's about time to call and make an appointment to have my tubes tied.

For some reason, it kind of bothers me that people think this is no big deal. What if one of the parents had over-dosed and died because of something they had used and used too much of? The idea that there could be a copy-cat of these two girls accidentally killing his/her parent or guardian because he/she wanted more internet time, which they probably had many hours of already, gives me the chills.

Ten o'clock in the evening is not an unreasonable curfew for electronic entertainment that they've probably been glued to most of the day already. Wanting your kid to play a board game with a friend or read a book for a while, or just get adequate sleep for the next day - is not bad parenting. As far as I am concerned what those girls did was dangerous, I don't think jail-time is particularly necessary; but this isn't amusing or okay either.

Brutal Peanut:
Well, I guess it's about time to call and make an appointment to have my tubes tied.

For some reason, it kind of bothers me that people think this is no big deal. What if one of the parents had over-dosed and died because of something they had used and used too much of? The idea that there could be a copy-cat of these two girls accidentally killing his/her parent or guardian because he/she wanted more internet time, which they probably had many hours of already, gives me the chills.

Ten o'clock in the evening is not an unreasonable curfew for electronic entertainment that they've probably been glued to most of the day already. Wanting your kid to play a board game with a friend or read a book for a while, or just get adequate sleep for the next day - is not bad parenting. As far as I am concerned what those girls did was dangerous, I don't think jail-time is particularly necessary; but this isn't amusing or okay either.

Probably because the girls stuck it to the man by fighting against authoritative restrictions.

There are a lot of people on the faaaaaaaaar left on the Escapist. Comes with the territory, I guess, but there is definitely such a thing as too much freedom.

So, instead of risking jail time, they didn't think to just get the password from their parents?

"Hey mom, we're working on a school project and I need to look up sources, it's due in a couple days, can I have the password?"

EHKOS:

mysecondlife:
Reminds me of my ex-gf whose mother set the internet to turn off at 2AM. Makes me wonder what she did to get around it.

Incoming scary thought.

Boot into the BIOS and change the system clock? That's what I did :p

Funny story I just remembered. Every once in a while, she would try to guess the password to get into the system and disable the timer. Apparently she knew that the password is a name of a random city. She eventually guessed the correct password (ho chi minh city) and disabled the timer.

So now, what's your story?

Remus:
getting the police involved is even worse. No permanent harm was done to the parents but permanent harm can be done to the children if they end up with a record due to this incident. It will not matter when this happened, if it's on their record it will make them effectively unemployable and yet another strain on society in a country full of people who are stuck in a vicious circle of crime and poverty.

Juvie records are sealed. So, no, this won't make them forever unemployable.

I do see a lot saying that the parents are shitty. I generally assume that the person posting this is young and has no children. After checking a few profiles, I seem to be right. 10 pm is entirely acceptable for a high school SOPHOMORE. And even if its overly strict, drugging someone is completely idiotic and potentially life threatening. What if mom and dad had a night cap before bed? Alcohol + sleeping pills = bad idea. It shows complete lack of respect, not only for them as parents, but for them as human beings. It says "I don't like your decisions, so I will remove your ability to make decisions."

We don't know all the facts, so we can't judge the parents based off this article. For all we know, she was already sneaking out, drinking, smoking pot, and this was simply the last straw. We can, however, say that the child (because she is a child) acted without thought, immaturely, and irresponsibly. And that deserves punishment in some form.

[quote="TheGroovyMule" post="7.397697.16238467"Hard to judge in this case, for all we know, the girl's in question may have had an issue with stay up to late on the internet, which in turn affected their studies. Really all we have here are the facts in front of us, and seeing as restricting internet times isn't exactly torture, I'd say the girl's reaction was a bit extreme...[/quote]
you clearly never had your pc autmatically shut down at certain time due to some time restriction seeded in bios and loose a weeks worth or work because your parents though that 12 pm is a good time to "study" for you, even if you already done all the studies needed. and yes, bio viruses was the only way they managed to make me not go around thier security, well that and carrying the tower box to thier work so i wont have any :P

I don't know, I mean, I"m with you on the "don't get the law involved" part, but 10 seems pretty fair to me. The parents just want them to get adequate sleep. My bed time was 9:30 until I was about 14.

i had no sleeping curfew since i was 6 and i never developed any bad sleeping habits, infact i sleep much better than most people and i was smart enough to know howlong i can stay up at PC at what day. having a set time is stupidty.

Do you know what "minors" means? It means "stupid".

i was going to type a long reply of why you are wrong, but this... lets jut leave it there or it will soon escalate into both of us banned.

Belated:
snip

well, i'm training to become a police officer so chances are i will kill someone at some point, i may have no choice, and i don't feel comfortable with that knowledge, but it may be the price i pay.

My parents are much the same as yours.

I'm sorry to hear about your mothers passing.

Thank you for clarifying your answer.

Kopikatsu:
They should face jail time regardless. Drugging someone standing between you and something you want because you can't just wait until the morning is not the mark of a well adjusted individual.

Blablahb:

Milanezi:
I guess now the girls made their point of how MATURE they are and how SAFE it is to let them roam around the internet.

Look at it the other way: Their parents treated them like small children, and it made them act like small children, what a surprise...

You think that an acceptable response to a curfew (And 10PM is very generous) is to drug the authority figure so you have free reign?

They're kids, not adults.

There's a large difference, you might not realize it, but generally a parent doesn't punish their child by sending them to prison.

I'm more shocked that Iv'e seen a couple posts that thinks the parents are in the wrong for calling the cops on idiots who think drugging people is a justifiable response to a curfew...and a fairly lax one for someone still in school.

lunavixen:

Belated:
snip

well, i'm training to become a police officer so chances are i will kill someone at some point, i may have no choice, and i don't feel comfortable with that knowledge, but it may be the price i pay.

My parents are much the same as yours.

I'm sorry to hear about your mothers passing.

Thank you for clarifying your answer.

Oh, you're becoming a police officer? Well I hope my daughter doesn't grow up to be a contract killer you have to deal with.

A Smooth Criminal:

Kopikatsu:
They should face jail time regardless. Drugging someone standing between you and something you want because you can't just wait until the morning is not the mark of a well adjusted individual.

Blablahb:
Look at it the other way: Their parents treated them like small children, and it made them act like small children, what a surprise...

You think that an acceptable response to a curfew (And 10PM is very generous) is to drug the authority figure so you have free reign?

They're kids, not adults.

There's a large difference, you might not realize it, but generally a parent doesn't punish their child by sending them to prison.

And children don't generally willingly partake in actions that can cause the death or permanent/severe injury of the adult figure. What's your point?

They're not children, they're 15 and 16. That's old enough to understand the concepts of morality and consequences. They (or at the very least the 16 year old) are sick and need to be dealt with by the state. They're proven themselves to be too much of a problem for the parents to handle if they're willing to drug them against their will.

I'm having difficulty understanding why people can't see the severity (and implications) of what they've done.

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