Rumor: PlayStation 4 Will Feature PS3 Game Streaming

 Pages PREV 1 2
 

Tank207:
And for those of us who already own a mountain of physical PS3 games? I'd rather have actual backwards compatibility or none at all. The more I hear about this next generation of consoles, the less interested I am with owning one.

Especially since 0% of it is confirmed and not much of it is at all likely to be true. Good reason to lose interest.

What's the point of streaming if you had to rebuy games anyway?
Sounds like an awkward, cost intensive way around porting games.
Surely having servers compute and stream games in real time online 24/7 is more expensive than the 1 time cost of porting it and offering it for download?

I'm kind of hoping for something like this: PlayStation Plus subscribers get access to every game for free. Regular user get access to all of Sony's first party titles for free. (and maybe some promotional free weekends for certain new releases)

FinalDream:
I have the perfect backwards compatibility method for the PS4 already, it's called a PS3! It will live in my cupboard until I feel the need to replay a game!

Even then it's unlikely I will need it, I don't really replay games at all, once I have beaten them once.

This. I have all my consoles and original games kicking about somewhere. If you want to continue enjoying older games it's really the only way. Takes up a lot of space though...

OT: I didn't buy a PS3 until long after it had been released. It meant that I then had a large back catalogue of games to keep me occupied. I'll do the same this time, if indeed I even buy a PS4 at all.

Well if I have to rebuy my copies of Tales of Graces F, Record of Agarest War 2, Tales of Xillia (when it releases), Tales of Xillia 2 (If it releases), The Last of Us, The Last Guardian and numerous other titles I still have this system for, Sony can kindly go fuck themselves.

I'm not rebuying shit for their new console if this is true.

Burst6:
I have no idea how much putting a ps3 chip in the ps4 would cost, but i imagine it would be very expensive. Isn't sony using a coding system that's not a nightmare for developers to design this time? I imagine adding hardware that lets you play ps3 games will be very expensive.

You know what would be nice though? An optional attachment that would add PS3 compatibility. Just a small box you can buy and plug into a port on the side or something.

Well you see it would be quite difficult for them to achieve this on the PS4 for very real reasons. The PS3 uses a custom CPU from IBM - Cell as you might have heard. The easiest way to put it is that Cell has it's own instruction sets and needs very specific coding. It won't execute much else (again, all of this is simplified).

The PS4 looks like it will be using more traditional CPU architecture. This brings it in line with a PC CPU. A CPU like this will be unable to process instructions and code aimed at a Cell CPU. This rules hardware compatibility out completely.

The only realistic solution (besides the rumor this thread revolves around) would be software emulation. That is to place something between the PS3 game and the PS4's CPU that translates the instructions to something usable. This would require an incredible amount of resources to accomplish though. The system would need to be very strong to accomplish this. A lot stronger than the rumored specs.

Unfortunately whilst an attachment in theory could hold software to achieve this, the full system specs of the PS4 would need to allow for the emulation which just isn't going to happen.

It's kind of like the whole PS2 compatibility problem with the PS3 - Only significantly worse.
(For the record, I am aware of the emotion engine emulation on the early PS3 models, but it cost Sony far too much to keep going with.)

This is all a very basic explanation but you get the idea I hope.

More On-Topic: Streaming seems to be a rather iffy solution at best. Latency would be the biggest issue. Controls will be way to slow for any sort of twitch-gameplay.

If I get a PS4, I will just be keeping the PS3 next to it.... And still use the PC more than either >.<

you don't need to buy into the new games. Just keep the one you have. Hopefully this streaming will allow us who hadn't bought those games to do so on the PS4 and hopefully slightly cheaper. otherwise you already have a method to play them. The Ps3 hasn't been backwards compatable since it's fat days. Even now, not all games are on the PSN. people still resort to their PS2 or PS1 to scratch that itch. I see this as being no different.

I think keeping your old PS3s is the best option. You will most likely have to re-buy any old PS3 games for much more than you could get them used, and even then you'd have a bad experience if you don't have state-of-the-art internet. There's also the issue that this is pretty much always-online DRM and any instance of that is fuckin' shit.

kiri2tsubasa:

thesilentman:
Right, so I paid for all those hard copies for nothing. Way to think smartly, Sony. I don't see this working out at all for you guys. Try harder.

You still have your PS3 right? So, what stops you from using it when you feel like playing a PS3 game? I honestly have no clue as to WHY this is an issue. Was never an issue back in the NES/SNES/N64 era, so why now? Besides, backwards computability makes things more expensive so, by not having it, the system is cheaper, isn't that what people want?

Personally I see it as a format that easily allows backwards capability. Unlike the cartridges which got a different design each time to fit the new chip, discs don't need a new read method.

Um... why not just, you know, ACTUALLY MAKE YOUR CONSOLE BACKWARDS COMPATIBLE? Sony, I get that you are pretty bad when it comes to user convinence and customer service, but you have to actually be trying to be this bad.

However, this could work if you put a PS3 game in and it either installed the game on your hard drive or read the game and gave you a downloadable copy for free.

Gearhead mk2:
Um... why not just, you know, ACTUALLY MAKE YOUR CONSOLE BACKWARDS COMPATIBLE? Sony, I get that you are pretty bad when it comes to user convinence and customer service, but you have to actually be trying to be this bad.

However, this could work if you put a PS3 game in and it either installed the game on your hard drive or read the game and gave you a downloadable copy for free.

Because the Cell that's in the PS3 won't be in the PS4, so there is no hardware compatibility.

OT: I can't help but think that if this was somehow Valve instead of Sony or Microsoft, people would be cheering the effort to play old generation games without the hardware to do so. But no, it's not the Escapist lord and savior Gabe, so whine, whine, whine.

I appreciate the effort. They know backwards compatibility won't work with the hardware differences, and are trying a solution that no one NEEDS to use. It's available if you want it. But no, whine whine whine.

NameIsRobertPaulson:
Because the Cell that's in the PS3 won't be in the PS4, so there is no hardware compatibility.

Well, that just makes even less sense. They allready have the tech, so why can't they just put it in? Failing that, maybe they could make something that you plug into the PS4, like an adapter that has the old tech, and release it sepereatly at low cost so if anyone wanted to keep playing PS3 games on their PS4, they could. I admit I don't know much about tech so this is probably impossible, but it's an idea.

NameIsRobertPaulson:
OT: I can't help but think that if this was somehow Valve instead of Sony or Microsoft, people would be cheering the effort to play old generation games without the hardware to do so. But no, it's not the Escapist lord and savior Gabe, so whine, whine, whine. I appreciate the effort. They know backwards compatibility won't work with the hardware differences, and are trying a solution that no one NEEDS to use. It's available if you want it. But no, whine whine whine.

The whining is because this does seem like a fairly illogical and ineffective solution. I don't even have a PS3 but I'm still baffeled by this. That said, I appreaciate them trying to come up with a solution and that there is at least one other person on this site that doesn't see Valve as gaming's messiah.

The thing to get angry about is how the engineers that created the PS3 decided to build something that isn't iterative and instead requires it's own set of proprietary code to work right. Nintendo is clearly doing some kind of iterative work with their consoles since we can still play Wii games on the Wii U, and Sony obviously knows how to do it since they did it with the PS Vita (only to get it wrong by not making some kind of external UMD plug in...).

There is historic evidence that in the long run, giving support to older games helps build and maintain a loyal gaming community. Heck, the PS2 is a good example of this with it's backwards compatibility with the PS1 library. What Sony has been doing for while now is slowly killing off their fan base by forcing people to have to double dip to be able to play the entirety of their library. They seem to have this disillusion that they can slowly change what people perceive by taking out backwards compatibility and getting people used to buying two consoles or repurchase their older games, which kind of fails when your opposition happens to be doing the complete opposite.

Desert Punk:

thesilentman:
Right, so I paid for all those hard copies for nothing. Way to think smartly, Sony. I don't see this working out at all for you guys. Try harder.

Didnt you play those games already? I would hardly say it is for nothing, besides you still have your PS3 to play your games on.

I have a gigantic backcatalog going, what with Dark Souls and Persona 4 Arena sucking up all my time. -.-

As an Australian I hear the words "Streaming" paired with "Gaming" and reflexively prepare myself to be disappointed and left out.

Ugh, fuck this.
Has anyone tried a game with Gaikai or On-Live? To me, they just don't work very well. My connection averages 3.7Mbps, and you can feel the input delay. The games generally look like crap, as what you're getting is compressed video, and I just don't know why anyone would want to play a game that way.

If you want to try one, I know Tera Online used to have a streaming Gaikai demo. Go try it out if you want to experience the pain.

Since I currently have 4 consoles hooked up to my TV, I've never really been concerned about backwards compatability. Having said that, this sounds like a bad idea to me. Streaming games would chew through my monthly bandwidth cap pretty quickly, and making it so that people would need to repurchase their collection sounds insulting. Also, once we're into the ninth generation of consoles, Sony will probably stop supporting the PS4, which means that the streaming service will be shut down. If you want access to those games again, you'll probably have to hand over more money to get them on your PS5. I really don't like this pattern.

Gearhead mk2:

NameIsRobertPaulson:
Because the Cell that's in the PS3 won't be in the PS4, so there is no hardware compatibility.

Well, that just makes even less sense. They allready have the tech, so why can't they just put it in? Failing that, maybe they could make something that you plug into the PS4, like an adapter that has the old tech, and release it sepereatly at low cost so if anyone wanted to keep playing PS3 games on their PS4, they could. I admit I don't know much about tech so this is probably impossible, but it's an idea.

NameIsRobertPaulson:
OT: I can't help but think that if this was somehow Valve instead of Sony or Microsoft, people would be cheering the effort to play old generation games without the hardware to do so. But no, it's not the Escapist lord and savior Gabe, so whine, whine, whine. I appreciate the effort. They know backwards compatibility won't work with the hardware differences, and are trying a solution that no one NEEDS to use. It's available if you want it. But no, whine whine whine.

The whining is because this does seem like a fairly illogical and ineffective solution. I don't even have a PS3 but I'm still baffeled by this. That said, I appreaciate them trying to come up with a solution and that there is at least one other person on this site that doesn't see Valve as gaming's messiah.

Because they're moving away from the Cell tech because of the headaches for coding with it. Headaches that caused several developers to not work with Sony, or put out worse products. They're moving to a more universal system. Problem is, the new system won't communicate with the old because of how obtuse the old one was.

FinalDream:
I have the perfect backwards compatibility method for the PS4 already, it's called a PS3! It will live in my cupboard until I feel the need to replay a game!

This is my thought as well. I can understand that having all of your games (assumung only would only have a PS3 and a PS4) playable on a single system is easily the most convenient option, but I just don't get the uproar if that's not the case. People are saying that their physical copies of PS3 games will somehow be useless and that all of those purchases will have been wasted.. but I'm assuming they're perfectly capabale of playing all of those titles on the PS3 they currently own. Unless Sony's plan is to send covert agents in the middle of the night to steal your PS3 immediately after you buy a PS4, I really don't see the problem being anywhere as huge as many people are making it out to be.

Ugh, my ps3 is still ps2 and ps1 backward compatible so I just figured the PS4 would be to but after seeing this I realize that is probably a fantasy, I'm gonna clean that old beaut because I never want to lose it.

StriderShinryu:

FinalDream:
I have the perfect backwards compatibility method for the PS4 already, it's called a PS3! It will live in my cupboard until I feel the need to replay a game!

This is my thought as well. I can understand that having all of your games (assumung only would only have a PS3 and a PS4) playable on a single system is easily the most convenient option, but I just don't get the uproar if that's not the case. People are saying that their physical copies of PS3 games will somehow be useless and that all of those purchases will have been wasted.. but I'm assuming they're perfectly capabale of playing all of those titles on the PS3 they currently own. Unless Sony's plan is to send covert agents in the middle of the night to steal your PS3 immediately after you buy a PS4, I really don't see the problem being anywhere as huge as many people are making it out to be.

The reason I think this is because eventually it's going to be damn near impossible to find a PS3 anywhere just like it's getting pretty hard to find a ps2, then eventually technology degrades, it falls apart and breaks, dust scratches the lens reader, a small jostle breaks some delicate connection, it overheats and something gets burnt. When that happens, without backward compatibility, the games become little more than shiny bits of plastic encased in tiny hard shells forever doomed to be nothing more than a nostalgic reminder of days past...

unless of course you have all the proper tools to maintain your tech and are extremely careful with it never loaning it out or letting more careless hands handle it, but on the other hand that means if you want to show someone a fond memory from eons past they just so happen to have to possess the same carefully preserved technology which is a pretty rare sight.

In a nutshell tech has a average life expectancy so that's not really the best solution.

Well, I still have my PS3, so backwards compatibility wouldn't be that much of a problem... I'm more worried about when companies start plugging out their servers for PS3 games (looking at you, EA). Anyway... I was missing my PC gaming days more and more recently, might switch back to PC once the next generation comes knocking... Then maybe getting a new console 2 years into the gen, once prices drop and libraries expand.

RyQ_TMC:
Well, I still have my PS3, so backwards compatibility wouldn't be that much of a problem... I'm more worried about when companies start plugging out their servers for PS3 games (looking at you, EA). Anyway... I was missing my PC gaming days more and more recently, might switch back to PC once the next generation comes knocking... Then maybe getting a new console 2 years into the gen, once prices drop and libraries expand.

I am worried about when the PS3 can no longer connect to PSN and you'll have to buy a PS4 to play your PSN games.

Kinda sad how many people are trashing Sony over this idea when they were the first ones to ever even bother making a backwards compatible console.

::geezer voice:: back in my day when a console came out you had these things called cartridges, when a newer console came out you called them paperweights!

You know what would be nice? If gamers everywhere would grow a set of balls and show Sony what they think of this and NOT ACTUALLY BUY THE CONSOLE. But know. Most gamers will say one thing, and when the system releases, they will take back everything they say and spout that it is the greatest thing ever, all the while forking over money hand over fist and grumbling that it should have this or that feature.

Sometimes I really hate the gaming industry...

The Hungry Samurai:
Kinda sad how many people are trashing Sony over this idea when they were the first ones to ever even bother making a backwards compatible console.

::geezer voice:: back in my day when a console came out you had these things called cartridges, when a newer console came out you called them paperweights!

Yeah, it's terrible for people to actually expect technology to progress...

Forgive my ignorance here, but how is this a hardware problem and not software?

I mean, if I have upgraded the hardware on my pc and an old game ceased to work, I tend to find that getting new drivers and/or patching the game fixes it. Never had to add the old cpu/gfx/ram to the current stuff to get it to work.

Also, since my PS2 broke and my PS3 didn't have compatibility I ended up downloading an emulator for pc, it's not perfect and not every game works but it wasn't made by sony and the installer was like 9mb large. Are you telling me Sony couldn't do a better job if they tried?

Hell, Microsoft provides an xp emulator for win7, so it can't be that hard. can't it?

Wuvlycuddles:
Forgive my ignorance here, but how is this a hardware problem and not software?

I mean, if I have upgraded the hardware on my pc and an old game ceased to work, I tend to find that getting new drivers and/or patching the game fixes it. Never had to add the old cpu/gfx/ram to the current stuff to get it to work.

Also, since my PS2 broke and my PS3 didn't have compatibility I ended up downloading an emulator for pc, it's not perfect and not every game works but it wasn't made by sony and the installer was like 9mb large. Are you telling me Sony couldn't do a better job if they tried?

Hell, Microsoft provides an xp emulator for win7, so it can't be that hard. can't it?

It's not that it's hard, it's that there is no money in it. Sony is a business, and businesses are in it to make money, not to be altruistic, and this way they can re-sell you all your old games, again and again. They become their own "Gamestop" without allowing you to trade in your old games. It's win-win for them and lose all-round for the consumer. They are banking on most people being too stupid or too uncaring to realize or fight against it.

That they (along with most modern corporations) are a short-sighted business is besides the point.

Elijin:
As an Australian I hear the words "Streaming" paired with "Gaming" and reflexively prepare myself to be disappointed and left out.

You're not the only one. I live in a rural part of Canada and my internet speed is often not fast enough to have a voice conversation over so I can't imagine ever stream a game through it.

I would be interested in buying a PS4 for backwards capability but not this streaming crap. I never owned a PS3 so being able to pick up a PS4 and play those games I missed plus new ones would be appealing. Streaming games just doesn't work for me.

How expensive would the games be on Gaikai? When a new console comes out the older console games become dirt cheap along with the older console itself so why would anyone want to stream games with all the disadvantages it brings?

This has terrible written all over it. Sony can't manage a server to save their lives.

Wuvlycuddles:
Forgive my ignorance here, but how is this a hardware problem and not software?

I mean, if I have upgraded the hardware on my pc and an old game ceased to work, I tend to find that getting new drivers and/or patching the game fixes it. Never had to add the old cpu/gfx/ram to the current stuff to get it to work.

Also, since my PS2 broke and my PS3 didn't have compatibility I ended up downloading an emulator for pc, it's not perfect and not every game works but it wasn't made by sony and the installer was like 9mb large. Are you telling me Sony couldn't do a better job if they tried?

Hell, Microsoft provides an xp emulator for win7, so it can't be that hard. can't it?

Its a hardware issue because Sony decided they wanted to be special and instead of usin hardware that was logical and in line with everythin else the competition was doin they went with Cell. If it had worked out it would have been a huge step forward for consoles. Unfortunately its a piece of crap thats difficult to code for and completely screws up any chance of backwards compatibility for the PS2.

Surprise surprise, this decade (includin guessed time of development) old decision has come back to bite them in the ass yet again for the PS4.

Neat :) But I never played a game via stream, I saw movies in HD via Apple TV but I think it's hardly the same, movies are easier to stream (right? I'm not sure) and even then at times I suffer lol

However, unless Sony comes thunder roaring ahead of X360, I'll stick with Microsoft. I had both consoles, but fact is I own trillions of 360 games and only a handful of PS3 titles, namely some exclusives, so I'd rather stick with MS... Not to mention I truly think it was better, but I'll admit, only at time it was really better, most of the times it was the same quality. Currently my PS3 broke, I'm not getting another one, not when they're about to reveal PS4, it'd be stupid.

Exclusivity pisses me off: I LOVE Gears of War, but I also LOVE God of War and Metal Gear Solid... Anyone feel my drama? :(

Gearhead mk2:
Um... why not just, you know, ACTUALLY MAKE YOUR CONSOLE BACKWARDS COMPATIBLE? Sony, I get that you are pretty bad when it comes to user convinence and customer service, but you have to actually be trying to be this bad.

However, this could work if you put a PS3 game in and it either installed the game on your hard drive or read the game and gave you a downloadable copy for free.

I agree, but both MS and Sony tried it, Sony more than once, it never works efficiently :(

Gearhead mk2:
Um... why not just, you know, ACTUALLY MAKE YOUR CONSOLE BACKWARDS COMPATIBLE?

You've got to be kidding. Why should any time, resources or money be put towards making PS4 play PS3 games, just so people who already have a PS3 can use one less HDMI port, or have a bit more space, or even sell their PS3?

I would prefer all resources, time and money to be spent towards making the PS4 being as good a console as possible - for PS4 games, nothing else.

As has been said, if one wants backwards compatibility, then keep the PS3.

I don't want any of the PS4 compromised, just to play out of date games that were made for a different console - a console that most of the people (who are wanting backwards compatibility) already own!

 Pages PREV 1 2

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Register for a free account here