Microsoft Threatens Console Bans for Gears Pirates

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Zombie_Moogle:

Lucane:

If they did that they'd be fools. They could just as easily put in an actual device wired in such a way that removing it breaks your Xbox anyway, unless expertly done and if the device is activated it physically breaks the Xbox when it receives a code from Xbox live. The worst case scenario for this however isn't Microsoft shutting down your Xbox it's a hacker getting into the network and sending a world wide shutdown code to anyone online at the time. The only way back from that would be to replace the units but recovering the shaken trust if it ever happened would be nothing short of impossible, let alone if individuals were wrongfully targeted.

(Not that I'm advocating piracy... really I'm not! What if this happened to Aliens: Colonial Marines would someone who pirated it have attempted to "warn" others of actually buying it if some "pirates" say they only want to try before they buy?)

Oh, I agree entirely. It'd be public relations hari-kari. My point is that it wouldn't be especially difficult from a technical standpoint, as some might suggest.

I don't play Xbox often (only my friend's console) & I practically never play online (XBL is an open sewer), so I have no personal stake in any of it. It just struck me as odd when they said "account and console bans"; it would appear I took their public chest-beating a bit too literally

No' it's something they could attempt to pursue but would be a step to far to repair if judged in error. what they currently do is enough for them since if someone would attempt to play a burned copy online then online play is important to them and they might likely buy or "acquire" a new 360 and get a new gold account as well.

Shoggoth2588:

Andy Shandy:
Wait, the new Gears Of War is coming out in a month?

Is it just me or has that game flown completely under the radar?

Gears of War 3 flew under my radar and that was a numerical sequel to a game I played through and beat. Judgement is...what, supposed to be Gears of Reach? I'm actually really curious to see what the people who played Judgement thought of it. I've only played the first two Gears titles and just don't really care for the franchise but I'm still curious about those first impressions.

Zombie_Moogle:
Is it just me, or do "console bans" irk anyone else?

Right here. The thought of Microsoft being able to disable my console as a whole as opposed to my account is really disquieting to me. I can't log on to Xbox Live much anyway so I know I'm on the 'watch this asshole' list for those few times I am able to log on for long enough to update my console.

I wonder if it's the new standard now for companies to brick users' hardware, I remember a while back that Nintendo said they had that system in place for the 3DS.

EDIT: Ah, my mistake. Microsoft isn't bricking the system, they just disable the ability to connect to live.

Microsoft, cut your losses. Once you start wasting time, energy, and money blocking pirates, you'll have to block everything until you have no customers. And when that happens, even Bill Gates won't save you.

Baresark:
This is all very funny. You see, they are making a big deal out of this, but it happens all the time. All the, "PC is full of pirates", nonsense that was espoused not too long ago looks tame in comparison to this. I mean, you usually can't even find a PC game prior to release, and then if you do, it tends to not be unlockable before actual release day. Consoles on the other hand, it's not uncommon to find them multiple weeks before release. Especially 360 games. But it happans often with PS3 titles as well. I just find it amazingly ironic that consoles are so badly afflicted by piracy when that was, for a long time, the main complaint from big publishers and Microsoft's point precisely for being against PC gaming.

I'm not condoning piracy, I'm just saying the way it is. And in that, I don't have any complaints about their methodology for trying to deal with it. I mean, it won't really work; no one is using a 360 that they use for official online XBL gaming to play downloaded games... well no one with two brain cells to rub together.

While its true there is piracy on consoles its a fraction of what it is on PCs. It is also a lot harder and requires you to have multiple consoles which puts a lot of people off it.

FalloutJack:
Microsoft, cut your losses. Once you start wasting time, energy, and money blocking pirates, you'll have to block everything until you have no customers. And when that happens, even Bill Gates won't save you.

This is actually standard procedure and microsoft has been doing it for years. It doesnt require all that much effort or money to detect if somebody had modified their console and ban it.

Little Gray:

Baresark:
This is all very funny. You see, they are making a big deal out of this, but it happens all the time. All the, "PC is full of pirates", nonsense that was espoused not too long ago looks tame in comparison to this. I mean, you usually can't even find a PC game prior to release, and then if you do, it tends to not be unlockable before actual release day. Consoles on the other hand, it's not uncommon to find them multiple weeks before release. Especially 360 games. But it happans often with PS3 titles as well. I just find it amazingly ironic that consoles are so badly afflicted by piracy when that was, for a long time, the main complaint from big publishers and Microsoft's point precisely for being against PC gaming.

I'm not condoning piracy, I'm just saying the way it is. And in that, I don't have any complaints about their methodology for trying to deal with it. I mean, it won't really work; no one is using a 360 that they use for official online XBL gaming to play downloaded games... well no one with two brain cells to rub together.

While its true there is piracy on consoles its a fraction of what it is on PCs. It is also a lot harder and requires you to have multiple consoles which puts a lot of people off it.

FalloutJack:
Microsoft, cut your losses. Once you start wasting time, energy, and money blocking pirates, you'll have to block everything until you have no customers. And when that happens, even Bill Gates won't save you.

This is actually standard procedure and microsoft has been doing it for years. It doesnt require all that much effort or money to detect if somebody had modified their console and ban it.

No one knows the exact numbers of piracy. That is a belief that can't either confirmed or denied. My main point was that console games leak early consistently. PC games usually have to at least wait till release. Piracy is rampant on all consoles that you can pirate on. The funniest part of this for me though was that MS pulled Gears of War 2 on the PC because of piracy, but all the Gears releases have been pirated significantly since that statement was made, and the games have consistently leaked up to a month early.

Baresark:
No one knows the exact numbers of piracy. That is a belief that can't either confirmed or denied. My main point was that console games leak early consistently. PC games usually have to at least wait till release. Piracy is rampant on all consoles that you can pirate on. The funniest part of this for me though was that MS pulled Gears of War 2 on the PC because of piracy, but all the Gears releases have been pirated significantly since that statement was made, and the games have consistently leaked up to a month early.

Games leak earlier on consoles because they only have one layer of protection (Xbox firmware) and can't implement much in the way of exotic measures while PC games have tons of options. Also, the certification process probably creates quite a few more gaps for leaks. According to this is 2008 article that explores piracy, the few numbers piracy sites have given show significantly more illegal downloads of PC titles than consoles. That makes way more sense because console piracy is a long, sordid affair involving hardware tweaking and really specific firmware modification that either costs a ton of money to outsource or can easily break a system.

Regardless what effect piracy actually has on the industry, game developers just have a way larger economic incentive to develop for consoles because they consistently outsell PC versions by more than 10 to 1 (for example, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 sold 14.83 million on Xbox 360, 12.60 million on Playstation 3, and 1.55 million on PC). That's the real reason PC versions don't get made; because they usually don't sell enough to justify the development cost.

* gets pop corn and laughs*

this will be fun, i cant wait to hear about all the people being console banned and then whining they got caught

I don't understand something. How can Microsoft actually ban the ones who pirated GoW Judgement if those people usually aren't even connected to the XBOX Live service? I'm curious.

Adam Jensen:
Yeah, man. Ban the consoles a couple of days before Sony announces their next gen console. That will make people buy your next console, for sure.

Don't get me wrong. They have every right to do it. But sometimes exercising your rights isn't in your best interest.

If the people are stealing games, they aren't good customers in the first place. So f*ck 'em

votemarvel:

shameduser:
OT: Who would be dumb enough to use Live on an Xbox with pirated games on it?

Given some of the posts on the "why was I banned" board of the xbox.com forum, quite a few people.

It seems as if they don't want to pay for their games but still have the fun of playing online with their friends.

Also, the console keeps track so if you play pirated games at all and then go online with a legit game, the record gets sent to MS and they will know and ban appropriately.

AlexanderPeregrine:

Baresark:
No one knows the exact numbers of piracy. That is a belief that can't either confirmed or denied. My main point was that console games leak early consistently. PC games usually have to at least wait till release. Piracy is rampant on all consoles that you can pirate on. The funniest part of this for me though was that MS pulled Gears of War 2 on the PC because of piracy, but all the Gears releases have been pirated significantly since that statement was made, and the games have consistently leaked up to a month early.

Games leak earlier on consoles because they only have one layer of protection (Xbox firmware) and can't implement much in the way of exotic measures while PC games have tons of options. Also, the certification process probably creates quite a few more gaps for leaks. According to this is 2008 article that explores piracy, the few numbers piracy sites have given show significantly more illegal downloads of PC titles than consoles. That makes way more sense because console piracy is a long, sordid affair involving hardware tweaking and really specific firmware modification that either costs a ton of money to outsource or can easily break a system.

Regardless what effect piracy actually has on the industry, game developers just have a way larger economic incentive to develop for consoles because they consistently outsell PC versions by more than 10 to 1 (for example, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 sold 14.83 million on Xbox 360, 12.60 million on Playstation 3, and 1.55 million on PC). That's the real reason PC versions don't get made; because they usually don't sell enough to justify the development cost.

COD is actually an anomaly. No one is denying that they sell better on the console than the PC. But usually PC sells only slightly less than each system separately. In some cases, it sells more than either console though. The lesson is, there are no definitive ideas in regards to how good or bad PC sales are compared to the console sales.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/02/18/mouse-keyboard-still-a-major-player-in-fps-market/

One of the main points of this article is that PC sales are largely unknown. PC's major distribution is done almost completely through digital means. Those are numbers that are largely unknown. 70% is controlled by Steam, and they don't release those numbers. The remaining digital distributors combine account for, at most, 30% of PC sales. But they aren't complaining, they are still profitable and show no signs of going anywhere.

Console piracy, circa 2008, was extremely hard. I had a friend who modded his 360 in around 2007. By 2008 it was still extremely hard. Fast forward to 2013, it's way easier now than it ever was before. Combine that with the fact that PS3 was completely locked up at that point. Piracy is still bad on PC, no one is denying that. But it's a fantasy to think that it's not nearly as bad on consoles. Even if it's not, think of all the games that are console exclusives that leak all over the place. And they are everywhere to be found, usually weeks before actual release, being downloaded by the thousands. I also find the owning multiple systems idea being prohibitive completely off base. People who pirate games done usually care about playing online, so a banned system or even profile doesn't usually mean anything to them. You are applying the rules and conditions (ie. XBL being a really good and therefore a reason to own the system) to something that does not have the same goals. Pirates don't usually try to keep up on their XBL achievements or challenge friends to Halo 4 matches. They just want to play the game and that is that, usually.

Twilight_guy:
Yeah and...?

People pirate games, an illegal activity, owner bans console as punishment. You mind as well have a story about how if you don't pay your bills they turn your lights off. ('course knowing this forum some guy would still try to claim its not right for the electric company to cut your power).

more close resemblence would be if you dont pay your electric bills they come and trash your fridge, microwave, steal all the bulbs and claim it was "Right" right from their side because you didnt pay. what we are talking here is making your hardware unusable, and you dont do that unless you know you can get away with it. so i hope the pirates will actually sue the ship out of microsoft for such illegal damage to property because thats what it is.

and with the cost and difficulty of breaking console security, it's guaranteed they're not casual pirates

you mean the diffuculity of callnig the guy on the advertisement and paying him 10 bucks? yeah, that is very difficult.

Strazdas:

Twilight_guy:
Yeah and...?

People pirate games, an illegal activity, owner bans console as punishment. You mind as well have a story about how if you don't pay your bills they turn your lights off. ('course knowing this forum some guy would still try to claim its not right for the electric company to cut your power).

more close resemblence would be if you dont pay your electric bills they come and trash your fridge, microwave, steal all the bulbs and claim it was "Right" right from their side because you didnt pay. what we are talking here is making your hardware unusable, and you dont do that unless you know you can get away with it. so i hope the pirates will actually sue the ship out of microsoft for such illegal damage to property because thats what it is.

and with the cost and difficulty of breaking console security, it's guaranteed they're not casual pirates

you mean the diffuculity of callnig the guy on the advertisement and paying him 10 bucks? yeah, that is very difficult.

You'll have to excuse me as I've never had a problem with this, please explain exactly what banning a console entails.

Twilight_guy:

Strazdas:

Twilight_guy:
Yeah and...?

People pirate games, an illegal activity, owner bans console as punishment. You mind as well have a story about how if you don't pay your bills they turn your lights off. ('course knowing this forum some guy would still try to claim its not right for the electric company to cut your power).

more close resemblence would be if you dont pay your electric bills they come and trash your fridge, microwave, steal all the bulbs and claim it was "Right" right from their side because you didnt pay. what we are talking here is making your hardware unusable, and you dont do that unless you know you can get away with it. so i hope the pirates will actually sue the ship out of microsoft for such illegal damage to property because thats what it is.

and with the cost and difficulty of breaking console security, it's guaranteed they're not casual pirates

you mean the diffuculity of callnig the guy on the advertisement and paying him 10 bucks? yeah, that is very difficult.

You'll have to excuse me as I've never had a problem with this, please explain exactly what banning a console entails.

Basically, that console can no longer connect to Xbox Live. A bunch of people seem to think that a console ban is making it so that console can no longer work. That's not the case. It's just a more extreme version of an account ban, where not only that account, but any account linked to that console, are automatically banned from Xbox Live.

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