Some Russians Think Chelyabinsk Meteor Wasn't A Meteor

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If it can be explained by normal means there is no need to attach an extraordinary claim. Some people will just always be looking for validation for their beliefs. A meteor crashed to earth and broke my window, that's just god saying hi.

Idiots.

Do4600:
It can't be a UFO, because it's been identified as a meteorite.

It's also no longer flying. So 'unidentified' and 'flying' are both out.
It's an O! My god, we have an object on our hands!

I find it kind of disturbing with guys like Putin in charge that they act like the "Soviet Era" and it's mentality is a thing of the past, while still reacting this way, and with so much ignorance. It's pretty much back to square one.

That said a US weapon test makes little sense (though being a test would explain why it hit such a remote location) truthfully we'd be more likely to want to "test" on something like North Korea, China, or The Middle East, than on Russia, which is annoying, but hardly our #1 priority.

Skepticism is however always healthy and I wouldn't entirely dismiss the idea of it not being an actual meteor or exactly as it seems. Plenty of wierd stuff happens during disasters. For example people tend to forget that The Pentagon was also hit during the 9/11 attacks in the US and there have been some creepy cover ups about that side of things, while the media tends to mostly focus on The World Trade center, although The Pentagon being hit is actually a much bigger deal in the scheme of things. When I say "creepy cover ups" there are bits about people having seen odd things (like missles, or energy pulses) flying at a low altitude towards The Pentagon. While few people have been able to prove that, they were able to prove that the goverment did run around and confiscate pretty much every video tape and record around the site, including those that weren't exactly next to the impact location, and aimed at levels that are totally irrelevent to the idea of a plane crash. I'm not saying it nessicarly means anything... but the way the goverment acts it pretty much makes everything look like a bloody conspiricy.

I'd also point out that meteor bombardment was an old strategy during the cold war, basically the super powers had tons of eyes on each other directed towards placing missles or actual manufactured weapons in space. As any science fiction fan can tell you, one of the best ways of wiping out a planet is to fire meteors or aserroids at it. Apparently during The Cold War there was a lot said about the powers basically modifying existing satellites to either intentionally crash into the planet for a more limited impact (instead of a missle) or to put "peaceful research cargos" up into space that could secretly be deployed for a similar effect. Basically you put geological samples up into space to research the effects of zero gravity on whatever, in reality it's a huge honking chunk of mineral that will survive atmospheric re-entry with enough mass and speed to do damage that can be dropped from the satellite.

Now, I am NOT saying this is what happened, but when it comes to paranoid, consider that if Russia had actually done something like this, one of their best moves post-cold war would be to move the satellite(s) into an orbit over their own territory where they would attract less attention, and also still be up there if things changed and they wanted to use them later (and also to avoid attracting attention by taking them down and admitting what they did). Putting something like this over sparsely populated areas like Siberia in case of a malfunction would make sense, and to be honest given the general quality of vintage soviet engineering a malfunction would be inevitable, especially in the
long term since they probably didn't originally anticipate just leaving these things sitting there for decades on end like actually happened... I mean assuming this happened at all.

The point here being that in many cases truth is stranger than fiction, some of the garbage outed after The Cold War (never mind what goverments are still sitting on) is absolutly borked. You basically had mad scientists planning out doomsday weapons on both sides of the equasion. As any relatively informed person will tell you, with the time to develop new stuff nukes are probably the least of our worries since they are like 60+ years old now. Anyone who thinks militry technology peaked there and didn't move on, while the rest of civilization did is kind of naive. As guys like Robert Heinlan kind of pointed out real war usually comes down to "X weapons" X standing for unknown, whoever innovates the most winds up winning, and people even plan for this during peacetime. A-Bombs/Nukes were pretty much the defining X weapon of their day, being a big deal at the time. During The Cold War, neither the US or USSR was really content with a nuclear stalemate and were looking for anything they could get for an advantage.

Just some food for thought, Occam's Razor would propose that a meteor strike is the most likely culprit, since stuff like that does happen, and it was inevitable we'd see things like this. However there is plenty of room for it to be other things to the point where conspiricy theories aren't entirely out of line, since there is plenty of fuel for it beyond the obvious ridiculousness like a premeditated attack, or aliens chucking rocks for whatever reason.

Yes it would certainley be a message from god who lives in heaven which should be somewhere in the clouds(by judeo-chrystian mithology) saying to stop using planes and space shuttles because they mess up theyre pack yard... Right... and aliens wouldn't crash land on some meteor who passes the earth to jump off it and land in russian outback... they should hawe landed in US desert like theyre friends did...

Doclector:
I find this interesting, actually. Governments seem to forget their people's trust is a finite resource. Break that trust badly enough, and it becomes "the boy who cried wolf" or more like "the government who cried meteor". They lied before, why would they not lie again?

Here we have a country where government deception, it seems, has become imbedded into the national consciousness, to the point where it isn't crazy to think up conspiracies, it's wise.

Exactly, I almost feel sorry for the Russians. I mean, I do not trust the US government half the time, but I do still believe that they are mostly honest about the major things (mostly). But for the Russians, I can not blame them, they were told lies of epic proportions for so many decades that I would estimate 3 generations (from now) before they will trust their government again.

Sad to see that even in the era of information and education, people still turn to the supernatural when there's a perfectly reasonable explanation.

Some Americans think that black people should be euthanized.
Some French people think that the Earth is flat.
Some Taiwanese people think that Harrison Ford is irradiating our testicles.

poiumty:
Sad to see that even in the era of information and education, people still turn to the supernatural when there's a perfectly reasonable explanation.

You don't know much about Eastern Europe, do you?

If You want a really far out explanation that makes no sense... maybe it's a frog temple, and Homestuck is Right.

After all, smaller Meteorites show up about every few months, larger ones like this show up every few years.

This is an extremely stupid hypothesis, and unlikely to be true, but I really hope the Russians discover a frog temple in that region anyways and send us the codes up there so we can go all Heroes and stuff.

Heh, if this unlikely event does come to pass, I get the feeling everyone will be aiming for a 144 player session or something.

Thyunda:

poiumty:
Sad to see that even in the era of information and education, people still turn to the supernatural when there's a perfectly reasonable explanation.

You don't know much about Eastern Europe, do you?

Please, tell me about Eastern Europe.

TheSYLOH:
Sigh....
Why would the US government want a meteor launcher when they got nuclear ballistic missiles.
Also, if the US gov up and decided to nuke Russia for no reason, Why pick the middle of fucking nowhere, Siberia.

Because a launch from the surface can be detected. Finding a hidden mechanism to launch stuff amid space-deris is harder.

Clearly, it was the Blisk and Crypto-138 handled them already, so there is no cause for alarm.

...except, you know, for the sake of our brainstems.

The Russian's should ignore this peasant rabble.

Every time something interesting and unusual happens, there is a conspiracy. Every once in a while the conspiracy turns out to be true, but this is not one of those times.

It's Christian Science Monitor. What do you expect?

poiumty:

Thyunda:

poiumty:
Sad to see that even in the era of information and education, people still turn to the supernatural when there's a perfectly reasonable explanation.

You don't know much about Eastern Europe, do you?

Please, tell me about Eastern Europe.

In the past sixty years, while America was screaming 'Communist' as the source of all the world's problems, Eastern European governments were acting very shady indeed. Look at your average American "wide awake in a world that sleeps" teen and everything he says the US government secretly does, these European governments actually did. A lot of people in Russia today will still treat their government like it's the past government, and have literally zero reason to buy even the most reasonable reaction.

This wasn't "That's not a UFO, it's a weather balloon."
It was "That wasn't an explosion. It was a thunderstorm."

A tragedy with a high degree of randomness which the victims cannot find a way to attach significance to ends up having wild stories used to explain it in a meaningful way? Yeah, that is what everyone in the world does. Imagining it is a weapons test or a UFO or a divine sign is a lot less scary then imagining a vast and mostly empty and aimless universe that sometimes just drops rocks on things with no concern for if the rock is hitting intelligent lifeforms, because that sort of thing happens is a chaotic and unfeeling universe in which you are an insignificant speck.

Thyunda:
In the past sixty years, while America was screaming 'Communist' as the source of all the world's problems, Eastern European governments were acting very shady indeed. Look at your average American "wide awake in a world that sleeps" teen and everything he says the US government secretly does, these European governments actually did. A lot of people in Russia today will still treat their government like it's the past government, and have literally zero reason to buy even the most reasonable reaction.

This wasn't "That's not a UFO, it's a weather balloon."
It was "That wasn't an explosion. It was a thunderstorm."

Except it's not nearly as bad as you're making it out to be, I'm a resident of Eastern Europe, and it's STILL sad that in the information age, people still resort to superstition when there's a perfectly reasonable explanation.

To be fair I'm not a resident of Russia but I'm pretty sure "my government did bad things in the past" isn't a good reason to justify thinking the meteor was an UFO or a message from God.

poiumty:

Thyunda:
In the past sixty years, while America was screaming 'Communist' as the source of all the world's problems, Eastern European governments were acting very shady indeed. Look at your average American "wide awake in a world that sleeps" teen and everything he says the US government secretly does, these European governments actually did. A lot of people in Russia today will still treat their government like it's the past government, and have literally zero reason to buy even the most reasonable reaction.

This wasn't "That's not a UFO, it's a weather balloon."
It was "That wasn't an explosion. It was a thunderstorm."

Except it's not nearly as bad as you're making it out to be, I'm a resident of Eastern Europe, and it's STILL sad that in the information age, people still resort to superstition when there's a perfectly reasonable explanation.

To be fair I'm not a resident of Russia but I'm pretty sure "my government did bad things in the past" isn't a good reason to justify thinking the meteor was an UFO or a message from God.

I imagine the sentiment is similar to if American fighter jets started bombing the Highlands and said that there were WMDs there. Suddenly God IS a more likely answer.

Oh how the mighty have fallen. It couldn't have been a secrent RUSSIAN military test, no no, it was a secret US military test. lol.

I bet you if the meteor landed in some place like Canada or England there would 500% less conspiracy theories.

In soviet Russia... a series of controlled information campaigns causes people to become so paranoid and jaded that they will believe in anything that's not the official story no matter how plausible that story seems.

The Rogue Wolf:
As much as I want to laugh at "those crazy Ruskies", I remember the video I once saw of the American woman who believed that the government put something in tap water to create rainbows when it came out of a sprinkler.

Ah, yes, Dboots. I love that crazy bitch.

The whole "meteorite striking Russia" thing has me reminded of the plot of the Resistance games, which begin with the Tunguska meteor event in 1907 in Russia spreading a deadly virus which converts humans into aliens. Time to grab my Carbine.

Biodeamon:
I bet you if the meteor landed in some place like Canada or England there would 500% less conspiracy theories.

True, but at the same time neither have been modern super powers that have been capable of the large scale insanity of the USA or Russia when they put their minds to it. This isn't to say they don't have their moments, but not quite the same way.

To put things into perspective there is a "real conspiricy theory" about the US goverment "Majestic 12" project, which was a program to use high end brainwashing and deprogramming techniques to plant sleeper agents in other nations which could later be activated with a signal and would make a suicide run on a pre-programmed target like a goverment facility, politician, etc... before killing themselves. All of which are fully in the grasp of high end psychological and chemical techniques if your unethical enough. The problem with the program is of course getting people for long enough to do this, creating the cover identities, and of course the simple fact that things change with time, your sleeper agent is pointless if a target relocates, or the guy you program him to kill winds up out of power, to be replaced by another enemy. There are a lot of practical concerns here.

This of course lead to theories about what would happen if the goverment used this on a more domestic level, to influance policies, create criminal acts that removed people it found inconveinent, etc... Most recently you have some theorizing that The White House might be using similar techniques to cause shootings to fuel anti-gun efforts, especially given the tendency towards self-pwnage of the people responsible for these sprees, and general lack of reporting on backstory or motivation outside of a very general sense.

Now it's not LIKELY, but a conspiricy theory like that comes about in the US because we really did screw around with ideas like that, and what's more it could actually happen in theory. With Canada or the UK it's not likely, because there is no indication the goverment was ever involved in anything like that. If they were it was kept quiet enough to not be excposed and thus doesn't fuel the public imagination the same way.

In a more relevent comparison, I pointed out in a previous post here, that during The Cold War, there were apparently programs, at least at a hypothetical level, about basically dropping meteor-like rocks and objects on the planet as an alternative to nukes. The very discussion raises questions when something like this happens in one of the countries that was known to have been hosting it.

If the UK, Canada, or other countries ever become more powerful again in the current era and start operating on the same level, conspiricy theories will also rise in proportion to it. The US and USSR used to be involved in this kind of crap and indeed we occasionally saw things "leaked" with an eye to freaking the other side out, etc... It was all part of the game. Canada for example has never to my knowlege been even remotely accused or suspected of developing super science weapons with an idea towards global military assetiveness... who why would Canadians even suspect something their goverment did might have slipped? :)

Any of these hypothesis are pretty interesting, I'll stick with the equally interesting meteorite, though.

there is a video that speculates that the meteor was shot down and therefore exploded.
[hyoutube=3ZzG881Vii8]

so if it was indeed an ufo, we can safely calm down that guy with the "brilliant" idea of killing all of humanity just to not offend e.t. and his alien pals.

they are dead, so they wont mind anymore that we are all the root of evil/hellspawn.

Biodeamon:
I bet you if the meteor landed in some place like Canada or England there would 500% less conspiracy theories.

nope. you would just see how much the rothschild family and the illuminati were involved in it.
or sasquatch.

Our glorious lord and saviour Space Core has returned to us! Long live Space Core! SPA...ACE!

I blame NASA
They were threatened by funding cuts from government
one unexpected meteor crash later, they have justification for existing
(beyond space exploration'n'shit)
Coincidence? I don't think so :/

As a Russian, I find this stupid.
Most of us are like... "Hey a meteor fell, it's nice no one died"
Even the priests on the news were like commenting "It's God's blessing no one died. But the meteor was from space and not a sign".
Most Russian TV covered it as a natural occurrence and a call for establishing "Space defense and anti-meteor rockets"

While I myself have thrown around jokes about it being a Kryptonian pod... nobody believes it was aleins, especially considering that pieces of the meteor were found and even sold online.

So the escapist, I salute you for finding possibly the dumbest news source in Russia.

bificommander:
Considering the number of Americans who'd have believed it had been the UN, the New World Order, or something supernatural, I can't say it suprises me. This is about as stupid as claiming black helicopters perform weapon tests on american farmlands, causing the cattle mutilations. You typically don't test your weapon where the enemy can see it better than you can. You only deploy it when you know it works, and then generally only if you're at war.

I guess the captcha-generator is a conspiracy-believer too: 'first contact'.

Funny you should say that. A few months back, me and my girlfriend were looking out her windows at two black helicopters that were flying around. One was high and circling the area, the other was low and hovering. Some men rappeled from the lower helicopter. The helicopter was just under a mile away and from where we placed it over empty fields.

Doclector:
I find this interesting, actually. Governments seem to forget their people's trust is a finite resource. Break that trust badly enough, and it becomes "the boy who cried wolf" or more like "the government who cried meteor". They lied before, why would they not lie again?

Here we have a country where government deception, it seems, has become inbedded[sic] into the national conciousness[sic], to the point where it isn't crazy to think up conspiracies, it's wise.

But it is crazy to think up conspiracies. It's okay not to trust one's government (to a point). In fact, it breeds a stronger nation in many cases. It's the thought that it's UFOs or some crazy nuclear attack that is the correct explanation. I think people need more credible theories when they think the government has lied to them.

Ah so what. Conspiracy theories have been around since the dawn of our species.

Here's a new one I've just made up: It wasn't a meteor, but a damaged chem-trail aircraft that went out of control! As it plummeted to earth, the illuminati triggered explosives on board to prevent us from knowing the truth! WAKE UP SHEEPLE! WAKE UP SHEEPLE! WAKE UP SHEEPLE! THEY'RE ALL AROUND US! CONTROLLING OUR EVERY MOVE! CHEM-TRAILS! LIZARD PEOPLE! BILDERBERGS! THE UN! MOON-MEN! 9-11! ATLANTIS! They're alllllll connected! That's right, they're alllllll connected and they're on to you! Quick, get your tin-foil hat! They're gonna use space lasers to microwave your brain!

Oh conspiracy theorists. So crazy. So funny to watch, and yet, so tragic.

Given that reports have come in of people going out there hunting for meteorite fragments on account of them being worth far more than their size suggests, it seems that not everyone is quite as paranoid. Perhaps more the loss for those that are.

I'd be curious to know if anything else came in with the meteor, much as I doubt anything else survived the descent intact.

In short - a news paper made bogus poll that offers falsified information in order to sell.

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