Thief Will Feature a "Less Goth" Garrett - UPDATED

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Well my hopes about this game were already fairly low, so either it'll be a shite game that I figure it'll be or I will be pleasantly surprised.

"We wanted to bring him more for the modern audience of today's console market," Cantin said. "He's now in the game doing more action moves and that's how we wanted the costume and the suit to reflect that."

Okay, the developers can officially go fuck themselves. Thief was not an action game, nor was it ever supposed to be.

Change Altair's main color from white to dark blue and it'll already look more like Garrett than what they're going with

Which is rather ironic on multiple levels

"We wanted to bring him more for the modern audience of today's console market"

"He's now in the game doing more action moves..."

"Time has moved on," Narrative Director Steve Gallagher added. "We're not still in 1998."

Cantin's statement that Eidos has toned down Garrett's "gothic" look to make him more mainstream.

Oh man, I'm not even a Thief fan and even I can hear the howls of heartbroken rage about to echo through the tubes.

Also, spot the goth:



Hey guys, chill out, it's only a hair colour change, what's the big deal?

There are a couple of things to keep in mind here. One, Eidos Montreal took on Deus Ex, a project fraught with risk, and nailed it. Human Revolution was a proper, full-on and entirely satisfying DX game, and that buys the studio a LOT of credibility. Two, as others have mentioned, the look is less important than the man, and the man will be dependent upon The Man - Stephen Russell. I'm willing to put up with a lot, but if Stephen Russell isn't back on board it's going to be a problem. Remember when Rockstar first announced that it wasn't going to use James McCaffrey for Max Payne 3? Leaving out Russell would probably be even worse. A Robert Smith-esque Garrett I can handle, but the real test will be when the cast is announced.


My heart leapt with joy when I head that there would be a new Thief, and not even a week after the initial announcement, my excitement is ebbing away and being replaced with a sound similar to "urrrrrggggggnhhhggghhhhuuuuh..."

Garrett was never very goth to begin with. Shady and misanthropic, yes, but he wasn't flipping his hair and listening to awful music in his bedroom with all of the lights off.
And he never wore any really stupid eye shadow.

That image certainly gives credence to this:

*holds face in hands*

I'm not even going to read the posts before me, because I know they will be filled with outrage and much butthurtedness.
Regardless.....developers..he looks "goff" in that picture, ie teenagers who dress in black everything and wear entirely too much makeup and think they have to be dark and brooding all the time.
Shows how much they know about what goth is.

And for the record, he never really was goth, aside from his cynical understated snarkiness.

*sighs heavily*

EDIT: For anyone saying something like "You're going to dismiss/judge the game based on how the main character looks?"
YES.... a degree.
I think most Thief fans would agree one of the many joys of the game is hearing Stephen Russell snark on and on in his lovely tone about the goings on the player is witnessing. His look is most certainly going to have an effect on how he talks and behaves. And that character up there looks about as fun as a wet blanket.

EDIT 2: Still going to wait. If the gameplay is still as varied and satisfying, I may be able to get over the redesign.

Wait, this is the less goth version? What, did the previous iteration drown out the light surrounding him? If so, they probably should have left that in, since being able to steal light would be pretty cool.

I wouldn't jump of the hate train just yet, Human Revolution showed they know their stuff. So i'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now.

I wonder if they meant that they'll improve the combat engine and make it a viable option to get through the game, but a crappy option when compared to stealth with little to no reward. It could also possibly mean that garret's movements will be more dynamic. "Action moves" is a really vague phrase when you get down to it and it could mean their making Generic Action Game #45621654, or a proper thief game with an improved combat and movement engine.

Either way, poor choice of words on the game designers part.

They're redesigning a character to have less of an attribute he never had, which actually seem to result in him getting more goth. That speaks volumes about how well they know their source material. Bracing for disappointment.

Devil May Cry fans: is this how you felt about that Dante kid? Suddenly I understand. I am so sorry.

But Deus Ex: HR had terrible character design. Adam Jensen had a ridiculous overgrown emo-child voice that no functioning person, much less a corporate security chief (i.e. successful management personnel) could ever pull off in real life without being ridiculed. He did this strange valley-girl side-lean animation every time he was in conversations at the same time that he would cross his bizarrely inflated arms. The sunglasses and trench coat gave him the vibe of one of those mallrats who just finished watching The Matrix circa 1999 for the first time and was desperate to look as cool as Neo. And most silly of all was the pointy chin -- what in the hell was going on there?

We're trusting these guys to redesign Garrett, one of the greatest characters of gaming history. Ugh.
Hopefully the cutscenes will be in FPV and they keep Stephen Russell as Garrett's voice.

He looks like a mopey little bastard. I hope he doesn't ever start whining about how terrible it is stealing everything that isn't nailed down.

Okay, fine, I'm just a little bitter they took out the supernatural elements. Doesn't mean this won't be good of course.

Wait, WHAT?

They did? Are you freakin' kidding me? That was the entire point of the franchise! That is what differentiated itself from every other tom dick and harry in the industry! Well... that and the excellent stealth gameplay. HOWEVER! That doesn't excuse them for taking away the cool parts of the game! What's next? Disgaea removing my sardines and prinnies?

Thief 3 wrapped up Garrett's story pretty nicely, I don't see why they even needed to use him at all. The Thief games were always more about the City and its inhabitants than Garrett. I'm guessing they felt fans would reject a Garrett-less game. I'm not particularly married to the character, nor do I even feel Stephen Russell needs to voice him. New Thief for a new generation; nothing wrong with that.

I'm willing to give this team some credit after the solid job they did with Human Revolution. The "more action" focus was inevitable, and while I agree that Garrett shouldn't be some one-man army hacking and slashing his way through hordes of dudes, giving him more options to deal with foes is just fine. Again, Human Revolution had some pretty solid stealth mechanics so I'm not too worried.

In any case it's way too early to call the game. The hype train is only just leaving the station...

i guess ill wait for reviews of how the port to pc is before i get it.

Putting fingers in ears now because everything I hear about the game disappoints me more and more.

La la la la la la.

"We wanted to bring him more for the modern audience of today's console market,"

Those are words I always fear. I got nothing against consoles, but shit if I don't hate when they take a good old game and make it extra shitty so people will like it. Not that Deus Ex HR was bad, I quite liked it, but it wasn't it's predecessors and I think it's unfair to hold them in the same light. Just make an honestly good stealth game. Make it so you can fuck up without dying instantly(I'm looking at Splinter Cell here). Make it so you can just leave the enemies alone if you're really good. Dishonored nearly did this, but there needs to be more shadows. Also letting us teleport around makes it too easy. I did like possessing rats in order to escape or sneak.

THAT is their idea of less Goth? He looks like a frikking cross between Nosferatu and Ezio - if they shopped at Hot Topic! What the hell did they think Garret looked like in the first place?

This seems somehow appropriate

And of course this

Lt. Rocky:
He reminds me of the merchant from Resident Evil 4, only with a more monotone appearance.

Holy crap you're right. I was wondering why he looked so familiar!

Mike the Bard:
"Action moves" is a really vague phrase when you get down to it and it could mean their making Generic Action Game #45621654, or a proper thief game with an improved combat and movement engine.

Hey come on now you have to admit Generic Action Game #45621653 was pretty fucking awesome! Didn't you SEE the level of detail in the protagonist's stubble?


Grimdark, grim-and-gritty, scowly-mcmean-scowl bs character design like this makes me lose respect for developers.

Is he still wearing a man corset and has a complete lack of pouches? Because if so ya fail.

Doesn't seem too bad to me. Though I never have played Thief, but I really want to. Seems like they are going to the Assassins Creed look with hood and single shoulder piece. The eye shadow is a bit much though.

I don't think action would be too bad as long as it makes sense within the context of the game. The name of the game is "Thief" not "Assassin" I would think a thief wants to avoid combat. Yeah the AAA treatment might not fit in well here.

for comparison

Yeah they made him both a goth and a ninja. Even if they toned it down slightly. Also, "black nails"? when was that ever a thing? You never even see his nails...

Ah, I forgot how Eidos Montreal is addicted to stylized visuals. I'm thinking this will be about as good incomparison to Thief II as Deus Ex: HR is to the original Deus Ex. Above average, but not as enjoyable as the original. It will probably be gorgeous, but...thief has never been a game that really wanted to be gorgeous.

See, after Thief II, the original writers dropped Garrett as a character because his story was played out. The world is sufficiently vague that they could pull a completely new character and it would be fine. Which they should do when going for a heavy visual redesign.

I feel like this guy is just talking out of his butt.
As for how Garret will turn out, at least they're not rebooting him as an improbably skilled short dark haired white guy who is always justified in everything he does ever like the star of every video game made in the last decade and a half.
I mean, the game is called Thief, they may be able too pull a few Robin Hood stunts but they won't be able too make Garret a "Good guy" because although he was never an utter bastard, he was never good either.

"We wanted to bring him more for the modern audience of today's console market."

Well, you heard it here folks, the series is officially crap now.

Ahem. That's *less* goth? Seriously?

He looks like a freaking panda!

I think I'm going to have to pretend like this remake never happened.

Or that evil mage from Looking for Group.


This... does not make me feel confident. Hopefully "more action moves" means more dynamic and acrobatic ways of traversing the environment and not "more forced combat." Because fuck that noise.

I wouldn't bet on it, though :[

Chances are, it will probably mean more QTEs.

God forbid! I could not think of a worse game to have QTEs.


Ahem. That's *less* goth? Seriously?

He looks like a freaking panda!

I think I'm going to have to pretend like this remake never happened.

Or that evil mage from Looking for Group.

I'm getting the impression he either misspoke under pressure, or really needs to work on his choice of words.

Why don't they just hire the Resident 4 merchant and have it done with? I'm sure it'd be cheap since that guy doesn't seem like he found work since.

There are some serious misunderstandings going on somewhere about Thief and Garrett.

Well, I can't say that I'm too optimistic. One major thing that was very interesting about Garrett's character was that he was aspiring to be nothing more than a thief, but he kept getting dragged into heroics. Thief 2 undermined that a little, Thief 3 a good bit more (partially due to declining writing quality.) It's hard enough to build a character like that once; I really doubt the abilities of people who aren't the original writers to do so again. Particularly when the character is becoming more ninja-like.

That also was unique (and still is) among games - you played a thief, not a sneaky melee fighter with two daggers who picks locks and disarms traps. In the first two games, it was a matter of professional pride to kill no one. The Dishonored influence undermines that; although it had rewards for not killing people, the majority of the abilities were focused around the opposite.

There is also the matter of writing the Hammerites and Pagans. Especially the Pagans, which - with their speech quirks and tree-hugging proclivities - could have easily become a joke instead of the delicately balanced mixture of whimsy and savagery they were in the first two games. Of course, the reboot might cut those factions out (probably to its detriment, since they are a critical part of the setting.)

Edit: And I watched the linked video. I was somewhat heartened by hearing them saying that he wasn't really trying to be a hero.

Then... what the hell?!?! The Joker from the Dark Knight is an inspiration for Garrett?! I honestly have no bloody idea how they drew a connection between the two. And I felt a little more hope die inside.


God forbid! I could not think of a worse game to have QTEs.

I can. "Press X to not be eaten by a grue!"

Hey guys, chill out, it's only a hair colour change, what's the big deal?

Did you... Did you read the article? Or any of the posts? Or anything other than look at the picture?

I'm sorry, but to me it seems pretty clear. They are going against many of the elements of the previous games that people loved. They all but say that they are making it more of an action game. They literally said they are altering the character design to appeal to a wider demographic (going by the picture, I'd say they are aiming for the blind demographic) and everything else they've said leads us all to believe that they're sacrificing so many things we love about Thief to make a "more widely appealing" game, which is sounding less like Thief and more like a different game they threw Thief's name on for some extra attention.

And they are showing a clear lack of understanding of what "Goth" and "Gothic" both are.

I want to reserve my judgement until I see the final product, but everything I hear about this just seems to rocket downward.

Andy Chalk:

"Time has moved on," Narrative Director Steve Gallagher added. "We're not still in 1998."

Yes, and that's exactly the problem. I wish developers still had the balls to follow what they themselves wanted to see in their games like they did in the 90s, rather than now where they're so thoroughly whipped by shareholder's desires to appease a modern crowd with minimal departure from the samey games that are flooding the market.

Make a damn THIEF game- the way YOU believe it should be- not the way you just hope the crowd of 13 year olds whose parents have fat wallets just *might* like it to be.

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