Ender's Game Trailer is Finally Here

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FargoDog:

Baresark:
Meh, people need to grow up. Your opinion of a man should not influence your opinion of a man's work. Looks interesting enough. Truth be told, I never found OSC all that interesting of a writer. Probably something to do with people always telling me I should like his work.

It's less about an opinion of a man informing an opinion of his work - though that is more of a subconscious issue - it's that he's not the sort of person many people want to support financially.

I can see that, but the truth is he is very well off and if the movie doesn't do well it probably won't hurt him or change his opinion on gay marriage. People want to paint him like this evil man, but he is only standing up for what he believes in. I don't agree with him one bit on it, but the fruition of hard work should not be denied because I disagree with that one aspect of the man. Maybe he is evil besides that, but the one thing I know he feels differently about than myself should not logically dictate my whole opinion on the guy. That is something I would think everyone can agree with when applying a bit of rational thought to the situation. Also, it is completely subconscious. If his opinion is different from yours and you know nothing else about him but this one thing, the mind will always make the decision for you. Kahneman was pretty explicit about it when he did his research.

Baresark:

FargoDog:

Baresark:
Meh, people need to grow up. Your opinion of a man should not influence your opinion of a man's work. Looks interesting enough. Truth be told, I never found OSC all that interesting of a writer. Probably something to do with people always telling me I should like his work.

It's less about an opinion of a man informing an opinion of his work - though that is more of a subconscious issue - it's that he's not the sort of person many people want to support financially.

I can see that, but the truth is he is very well off and if the movie doesn't do well it probably won't hurt him or change his opinion on gay marriage. People want to paint him like this evil man, but he is only standing up for what he believes in. I don't agree with him one bit on it, but the fruition of hard work should not be denied because I disagree with that one aspect of the man. Maybe he is evil besides that, but the one thing I know he feels differently about than myself should not logically dictate my whole opinion on the guy. That is something I would think everyone can agree with when applying a bit of rational thought to the situation. Also, it is completely subconscious. If his opinion is different from yours and you know nothing else about him but this one thing, the mind will always make the decision for you. Kahneman was pretty explicit about it when he did his research.

You are acting like believing other human beings are less of a person and deserve less rights just because they are different is a small thing. It is not, that is big thing, something very telling about a person. In this instance, that Orson Scott Card is a terrible person, one that deserves scorn.

moggett88:
I will probably go to see this - I love the book, and as long as it doesnt go too Michael Bay it shouldnt be awful...although that said, it annoys me that

Lets hope that OSC keeps as far away from it as possible.

Actually...

Man lots of people complaining when they dont even know what they are lookin at ~.~

As for the OT: The artist or OSCs name being attached isnt that big of a deal, those who are as whiny as that DC artist are a very very small minority.

Hell if people got all butthurt over every persons view they would never see a movie, as there are hundreds of people that go into making them, and I promise you that not all of them are drum circle enjoying hippies all about love peace and equality.

Somewhere on that cast will be people whos views you dont agree with, and going to that movie will be putting money in their pocket.

Desert Punk:

moggett88:
I will probably go to see this - I love the book, and as long as it doesnt go too Michael Bay it shouldnt be awful...although that said, it annoys me that

Lets hope that OSC keeps as far away from it as possible.

Actually...

Man lots of people complaining when they dont even know what they are lookin at ~.~

Sure, in the book. I betcha dollars to donuts that whoever is directing this wont be able to resist ending the film on a shot of

, even if that wasnt really what happened.

DVS BSTrD:

moggett88:

DVS BSTrD:
"bugger" is english slang for turd burgling.

I am English, and technically it does, but no one says that...bugger is just a general everyday expletive, like crap.

Well everyone still knows what crap means, and the context is rather heavily

I honestly thought he was making some kind of "catholics are aliens" comment...I havent been here long, dont know how tolerant people are of religions and whatnot.

moggett88:

Desert Punk:

moggett88:
I will probably go to see this - I love the book, and as long as it doesnt go too Michael Bay it shouldnt be awful...although that said, it annoys me that

Lets hope that OSC keeps as far away from it as possible.

Actually...

Man lots of people complaining when they dont even know what they are lookin at ~.~

Sure, in the book. I betcha dollars to donuts that whoever is directing this wont be able to resist ending the film on a shot of

, even if that wasnt really what happened.

We will just have to see.

Oh, and why is battleschool in orbit? It was supposed to be in one of the outer asteroid belts to keep its location secretive Not very secret if its in orbit.

valium:

sleeky01:

CriticalMiss:
... but I have no intentions of putting money in the pockets of a bigot if I can avoid it.

Baresark:
Meh, people need to grow up. Your opinion of a man should not influence your opinion of a man's work. Looks interesting enough. Truth be told, I never found OSC all that interesting of a writer. Probably something to do with people always telling me I should like his work.

I would tend to agree. Can a piece of work not be viewed for it's own sake without a prejudgment?

I'm sure an artist would appreciate the effort.

CriticalMiss:
... but I have no intentions of putting money in the pockets of a bigot if I can avoid it.

*sigh*

Captcha=right left

Oh. You are on fire today Captcha, :)

Art is the expression of the artist. If you want to call something art, you then cannot separate the art from the artist.

No matter the content of that artist?

valium:
On that note, literature is not art.

?!?
Really?

I think there are quite afew authors who would disagree with you immensely.

valium:
But when the Author then centers his works around his beliefs, that is where problems arise.
Ender's Game does not center around OSC's offensive beliefs, but a lot of his other books do.

So you ARE able to seperate a peice of work from the artist. Or is it content creator? :?

Desert Punk:
[

Oh, and why is battleschool in orbit? It was supposed to be in one of the outer asteroid belts to keep its location secretive Not very secret if its in orbit.

If I recall correctly the Battleschool was indeed in earth orbit. The facility(s?) in the asteroid belt was where the fancy Command and Control gizmo was located. It was were Mazer Rakum showed up in the story.

OSC being the producer gives me some hope that the movie might convey the same meanings the books did. This trailer, however, is awful. I hope it's not at all indicative of the movie. Also, I love Harrison Ford, but he is cast as Graff?

Can't wait for this, one of my favorite books when i was younger, and recently re read it to discover it was even better than i remembered. Just hope they haven't been forced to cut too much out of it.

this has to be one of my favorite books ive ever read, so i only have one thought regarding this movie, PLEASE BE GOOD PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE BE GOOD.

looking forward to November, i'll reserve my judgment till then and ignore the trailers

moggett88:
I will probably go to see this - I love the book, and as long as it doesnt go too Michael Bay it shouldnt be awful...although that said, it annoys me that

Lets hope that OSC keeps as far away from it as possible.

valium:

Baresark:

FargoDog:

It's less about an opinion of a man informing an opinion of his work - though that is more of a subconscious issue - it's that he's not the sort of person many people want to support financially.

I can see that, but the truth is he is very well off and if the movie doesn't do well it probably won't hurt him or change his opinion on gay marriage. People want to paint him like this evil man, but he is only standing up for what he believes in. I don't agree with him one bit on it, but the fruition of hard work should not be denied because I disagree with that one aspect of the man. Maybe he is evil besides that, but the one thing I know he feels differently about than myself should not logically dictate my whole opinion on the guy. That is something I would think everyone can agree with when applying a bit of rational thought to the situation. Also, it is completely subconscious. If his opinion is different from yours and you know nothing else about him but this one thing, the mind will always make the decision for you. Kahneman was pretty explicit about it when he did his research.

You are acting like believing other human beings are less of a person and deserve less rights just because they are different is a small thing. It is not, that is big thing, something very telling about a person. In this instance, that Orson Scott Card is a terrible person, one that deserves scorn.

As always, taking the high road is not the popular thing to do around here. You are attributing evil to something that is a difference of opinion. Just like he lobbies to prevent it, they lobby to see it happen. All of this is separate from his work as an author. I have never heard him say that homosexuals are second class citizens or they deserve less rights. It's all just a difference of opinion on how you define marriage. The fight has literally become stupid in a lot of places because civil unions are allowed the same rights as marriage, but it's not called "marriage". Oh the evil that is done, my god. I'm all for them fighting for their rights as they see them, likewise, I cannot hate someone for having the opposite opinion. Unless of course he said the words, "gays are bad and they should be treated as second class citizens. But, that is still separate from his authored works.

Baresark:

valium:

Baresark:

I can see that, but the truth is he is very well off and if the movie doesn't do well it probably won't hurt him or change his opinion on gay marriage. People want to paint him like this evil man, but he is only standing up for what he believes in. I don't agree with him one bit on it, but the fruition of hard work should not be denied because I disagree with that one aspect of the man. Maybe he is evil besides that, but the one thing I know he feels differently about than myself should not logically dictate my whole opinion on the guy. That is something I would think everyone can agree with when applying a bit of rational thought to the situation. Also, it is completely subconscious. If his opinion is different from yours and you know nothing else about him but this one thing, the mind will always make the decision for you. Kahneman was pretty explicit about it when he did his research.

You are acting like believing other human beings are less of a person and deserve less rights just because they are different is a small thing. It is not, that is big thing, something very telling about a person. In this instance, that Orson Scott Card is a terrible person, one that deserves scorn.

As always, taking the high road is not the popular thing to do around here. You are attributing evil to something that is a difference of opinion. Just like he lobbies to prevent it, they lobby to see it happen. All of this is separate from his work as an author. I have never heard him say that homosexuals are second class citizens or they deserve less rights. It's all just a difference of opinion on how you define marriage. The fight has literally become stupid in a lot of places because civil unions are allowed the same rights as marriage, but it's not called "marriage". Oh the evil that is done, my god. I'm all for them fighting for their rights as they see them, likewise, I cannot hate someone for having the opposite opinion. Unless of course he said the words, "gays are bad and they should be treated as second class citizens. But, that is still separate from his authored works.

He wants Sodomy laws on the books to keep gay people in the closet, claims that Gay Marriage proponants want to destroy Democracy, and said this.

"[W]hen government is the enemy of marriage, then the people who are actually creating successful marriages have no choice but to change governments, by whatever means is made possible or necessary... Regardless of law, marriage has only one definition, and any government that attempts to change it is my mortal enemy. I will act to destroy that government and bring it down...."

So he can go fucking straight to hell.

Andy Chalk:
Ender's Game Trailer is Finally Here

This... this is different from the Ender's game I was stuck reading in high school...

I love the book, but I don't care. I won't be seeing this in theaters. I have too much of a problem with Orson Scott Card to give him money, I don't care how good this turns out.

Though it doesn't look that good anyway, so... NBD.

A note on the 'outrage' this film of the novel has provoked in the 'battle-room' of the Net:

Why care about Card's views on marriage when they're not in the novel, and even if they were, would certainly not be in this film. The artist and the art while intrinsic, are ultimately separate things. Yet in this Twitter age of instant outrage, ego-polls and spam campaigns, we have become alarmingly hypocritical, in that we reserve the right to rage and condemn so particularly when surely thousands of artists out there also have beliefs which we do not agree with. Shall we boycott the Louvre or our local theatre because of it?

And consider for a moment the society in which the character, Ender lives, where religion has been outlawed for generations, and which people dear to him may secretly hold religious views of all kinds (no spoilers). On top of that, it is a society which systematically designates children as commodities, to be tallied, objectified and abused.

Ender was only allowed to be born for the prospect that he be taken from his family and trained as a child soldier. As a 'Third', ie an abhorred third child, had he not been selected for war, he'd have lived despised and hated. His own parents are already marginalised as assumed dissidents for having a third child. Are these not incredibly intriguing ideas for any story? They are certainly not unique in themselves, and other authors, and also real world governments have employed them irrespective of their opinions on gay rights.

Simply put, Card's views on LGBT issues are irrelevant to the story of Ender's Game. I don't agree with his politics on this and on a great many things. His is a Mormon after all and quite devout. Being a famous author automatically makes anything he says 'out-spoken', does it not? Perhaps we should boycott corner stores run by Mormon families, because it is quite likely they'd agree with Card.

Also, if any reply to me hinges on an assertion that literature and film are not art, I shall not respond, at least until I have read the accompanying treatise on why that is surely so.

sleeky01:

valium:

sleeky01:

I would tend to agree. Can a piece of work not be viewed for it's own sake without a prejudgment?

I'm sure an artist would appreciate the effort.

*sigh*

Captcha=right left

Oh. You are on fire today Captcha, :)

Art is the expression of the artist. If you want to call something art, you then cannot separate the art from the artist.

No matter the content of that artist?

valium:
On that note, literature is not art.

?!?
Really?

I think there are quite afew authors who would disagree with you immensely.

valium:
But when the Author then centers his works around his beliefs, that is where problems arise.
Ender's Game does not center around OSC's offensive beliefs, but a lot of his other books do.

So you ARE able to seperate a peice of work from the artist. Or is it content creator? :?

Then those authors are delusional, literature is educational and/or entertainment. Movies are not art, video games are not art. Does not mean these things can not be so good that people can compare them to art, still does not make them art.

valium:

sleeky01:

valium:

Art is the expression of the artist. If you want to call something art, you then cannot separate the art from the artist.

No matter the content of that artist?

valium:
On that note, literature is not art.

?!?
Really?

I think there are quite afew authors who would disagree with you immensely.

valium:
But when the Author then centers his works around his beliefs, that is where problems arise.
Ender's Game does not center around OSC's offensive beliefs, but a lot of his other books do.

So you ARE able to seperate a peice of work from the artist. Or is it content creator? :?

Then those authors are delusional, literature is educational and/or entertainment. Movies are not art, video games are not art. Does not mean these things can not be so good that people can compare them to art, still does not make them art.

What definition of art are you using? Literature and movies have been considered art for a very very long time.

EDIT: Not to mention the "Video games are not art" can of worms. How are any of those things not art?

Ftaghn To You Too:

Baresark:

valium:

You are acting like believing other human beings are less of a person and deserve less rights just because they are different is a small thing. It is not, that is big thing, something very telling about a person. In this instance, that Orson Scott Card is a terrible person, one that deserves scorn.

As always, taking the high road is not the popular thing to do around here. You are attributing evil to something that is a difference of opinion. Just like he lobbies to prevent it, they lobby to see it happen. All of this is separate from his work as an author. I have never heard him say that homosexuals are second class citizens or they deserve less rights. It's all just a difference of opinion on how you define marriage. The fight has literally become stupid in a lot of places because civil unions are allowed the same rights as marriage, but it's not called "marriage". Oh the evil that is done, my god. I'm all for them fighting for their rights as they see them, likewise, I cannot hate someone for having the opposite opinion. Unless of course he said the words, "gays are bad and they should be treated as second class citizens. But, that is still separate from his authored works.

He wants Sodomy laws on the books to keep gay people in the closet, claims that Gay Marriage proponants want to destroy Democracy, and said this.

"[W]hen government is the enemy of marriage, then the people who are actually creating successful marriages have no choice but to change governments, by whatever means is made possible or necessary... Regardless of law, marriage has only one definition, and any government that attempts to change it is my mortal enemy. I will act to destroy that government and bring it down...."

So he can go fucking straight to hell.

Hmmm, how about that, I stand corrected. He is a huge dick because of his misguided opinion. I guess it's true, bitches be crazy.

Ftaghn To You Too:

valium:

sleeky01:

No matter the content of that artist?

?!?
Really?

I think there are quite afew authors who would disagree with you immensely.

So you ARE able to seperate a peice of work from the artist. Or is it content creator? :?

Then those authors are delusional, literature is educational and/or entertainment. Movies are not art, video games are not art. Does not mean these things can not be so good that people can compare them to art, still does not make them art.

What definition of art are you using? Literature and movies have been considered art for a very very long time.

EDIT: Not to mention the "Video games are not art" can of worms. How are any of those things not art?

Artistic =/= art.

Books, movies, and video games are meant to be entertainment sold to the vast public, that is why they exist. That kind of automatically disqualifies them as art.

Doesn't look bad. Although I have a bad feeling that the Bean character is going to be a sliver of what he was in the books. In the books the war was won largely due to the combined efforts of both Ender and Bean. I really hope they don't short change the Bean character in the movie.

I'm seeing some serious fade to black in this trailer.

Super Not Cosmo:
Doesn't look bad. Although I have a bad feeling that the Bean character is going to be a sliver of what he was in the books. In the books the war was won largely due to the combined efforts of both Ender and Bean. I really hope they don't short change the Bean character in the movie.

bean really didn't have all that large of a role in the actual ender's game (which I will refer to as EG) book, in ender's shadow (ES) they reveal how large of a role he played, but he was barely mentioned in EG. wow this thread has really gotten hung up on OSC as a person. while I may not agree with the man, that really isn't the point of a thread talking about a movie trailer.
also


I hope this movie is good, but I have my doubts seeing as it will be really difficult to fit the source material in a two hour movie that will interest people who didn't read the books (read EXPLOSIONS, they don't need all that many, but they probably will have quite a few)

sleeky01:

Desert Punk:
[

Oh, and why is battleschool in orbit? It was supposed to be in one of the outer asteroid belts to keep its location secretive Not very secret if its in orbit.

If I recall correctly the Battleschool was indeed in earth orbit. The facility(s?) in the asteroid belt was where the fancy Command and Control gizmo was located. It was were Mazer Rakum showed up in the story.

this is correct, however this may be quite nitpicky, but battle school was just pretty much a ring, not that long space station that appeared in the trailer.

Eh..... Looks way too much like a generic Sci-fi action movie when the book is much more thoughtful.

Also, they totally spoil the ending in the trailer....

Well, now.

This looks cool, but you really have to separate the man from his literary production. I hate what Card stands for and I don't understand his opposition to gay marriage, but that doesn't mean I don't understand that the Ender series is some of the most important sci-fi we've ever written. It's not Azimov and it's not quite Karel Kapec or Mary Shelley; but it's interstellar wartime with an actual brain.

I might see this. Although I'll admit I always approach OSC the same way I approach Doug TenNapel: I remind myself why I used to love him as a kid, back when I knew nothing of the guy's political and moral stances and didn't care to learn about them, either.

Ratfist and Earthworm Jim are both utterly awesome, even if their creator is kind of a douche.

I personally have strong doubts that the movie will succeed. For starters, the book isn't exactly action-heavy. But worse than that, it's not particularly dialogue-heavy, either. In fact, much of the book consists of the characters thinking to themselves reflectively. Ender reflecting on the philosophies of war, Graff considering about the ethics of breaking a child mentally - it's people just thinking to themselves for about half the book. How do you show that on the screen?

Answer: You don't. Instead, you add in dialogue and amp up the action. I imagine the Battle Room will suddenly be the central setting of the story, rather than something that appears roughly halfway into the book.

I also imagine that's the reason why Major Anderson is now a main character and being played by a big-name actress (I would also imagine gender balance is why Major Anderson is now a woman). Presumably, she and Graff will be carrying much of the story.

I'm also guessing that they likely shoehorned in some romance story into the narrative. Off the top of my head, I'd guess that Petra, as the only significant female from the book, is now a romantic lead.

Which sort of leads me to another major problem: Ender's Game is about children. Prepubescent children. That's the entire premise. Which has certain downsides in terms of a movie.

1) You need child actors. A lot of child actors. And child actors ... tend not to be great. So the solution is to shift the focus on to the adults (again, Anderson is now a lead role) and diminish the number of significant child characters. I'd imagine that outside of Ender, Petra, Val, and maybe Peter, the other children are more or less scenery with nametags.

2) Ender's Game is about prepubescent children who are all super-geniuses. Like, doing advanced university-level calculus before they're ten. Like, getting their doctorates in all science, humanities, and engineering disciplines before their teens. And their dialogue in the book reflects that genius. How convincing will it be to have child actors discussing calculating the physics of space travel when they can't pronounce half the words? The solution: dumb down the dialogue, and decenter the story as you do so.

3) Ender's Game is about prepubescent super-genius children WHO BEAT THE CRAP OUT OF EACH OTHER. And, on a few occasions, actually kill each other. How is the audience going to respond when one kid smashes the other kid's nose up into his brain? Or when they're threatening to murder each other brutally in the hallways as the teachers look on, encouraging them with silence? It seems likely - especially since this preview is for "All Audiences" - that this film will sold as a family feature. It's got kid actors and a sci-fi plot - it'll be hard to sell it as an adult-oriented film. So the violence and the beatings and the killings will probably be removed, and just make the focus about Ender vs Aliens, which is, of course, only about the last 20% of the book.

So, what I'm expecting is that we're getting Ender's Game ... minus the reflections, the philosophy, and most of the major cast - plus Harrison Ford and Viola Davis as the headliners - plus generic teen love story - minus the violence and the fighting and the conflict of most of the book - plus a lot more ship explosions, and alien battles.

That's ultimately the main problem. The central theme of Ender's Game is the ethical and moral quandary of essentially brainwashing children into becoming humanity's most brutal killing machines, in the face of a species-wide threat. The other students are foils for Ender; some of them become brutal psychos - like Bonso - some are jealous, spiteful, and competitive - like Petra - and others burn out - like Dink. But all are systematically destroyed psychologically and spiritually by the process that Graff and Battle School put them through - and this is by design. Ender is humanity's best and brightest hope ... to become humanity's worst and most depraved monster.

So the question is - will the producers and directors of this film preserve that central theme, that main tension, and deliver it with the same impact it deserves? Or will they just make a family movie about kids fighting aliens with big explosions and special effects?


Had I had an authoritative voice in the creative process, I'd have told them to a) give up, and b) if you can't give up, then change the superficial elements of the story to preserve the fundamental themes. First, I'd say make them teenagers, not children - it'd make casting easier and the violence more palatable.

And second, I'd have told them to combine Ender's Game with its companion book, Ender's Shadow. Because Bean, the protagonist of Shadow, has a lot more action and dialogue that are conducive to a visual medium. And because Bean provides a character who can act as Ender's confidant, in order to turn those inner monologues into spoken conversation. You could try the same with some of the other characters, but Bean works best because Bean is the one kid who actually knows everything that's going on with Ender and the school anyway.

And Bean also works because he has much involvement with the school's Teachers, which could also bring out Graff's inner struggles. Ender's Shadow accomplished the task of fleshing out several key characters and ideas that were kind of thin in the original - Graff being one of them.


Anyway, TL;DR - I'm an Ender's Game fan and I expect the movie to crash and burn.

Also, had no idea about Orson Scott Card's political views. Don't really think that'll affect the crashing and burning.

The visuals remind of a J.J. Abrams movie (think Star Trek with less lens flare, or maybe Mission Impossible III). Supposedly when OSC originally wrote the script for the movie, he decided to have the "twist" already revealed to the audience but Ender wouldn't know in order to create... what's it called... dramatic irony? He also scrapped the Peter and Valentine subplot. That was years ago though, so who knows what direction the movie'll take.

The trailer looks awful haha. It's kinda cliche to say that it isn't like the source material, but the Ender story I remember was really....ugly. The book was a gritty and depressing, atmospheric.

That trailer was something more akin to Percy Jackson and the Lightning Thief, which was awwwwwwful.

I never knew that about the author though. Interesting how I can throughly enjoy his books, but not agree with him on his radical ideas. Strange.

Wait what? Scrapping Peter and Valentine takes away Ender's motivation and ruins any potential for sequels.

Samuki Elm:
*snip*

And second, I'd have told them to combine Ender's Game with its companion book, Ender's Shadow. Because Bean, the protagonist of Shadow, has a lot more action and dialogue that are conducive to a visual medium. And because Bean provides a character who can act as Ender's confidant, in order to turn those inner monologues into spoken conversation. You could try the same with some of the other characters, but Bean works best because Bean is the one kid who actually knows everything that's going on with Ender and the school anyway.

And Bean also works because he has much involvement with the school's Teachers, which could also bring out Graff's inner struggles. Ender's Shadow accomplished the task of fleshing out several key characters and ideas that were kind of thin in the original - Graff being one of them.

first of all, that was a pretty good analysis and that was pretty much what I was trying to say in my previous post
secondly I think this would be a good idea if they could make it a two part movie, because in order to do those two books justice they would need that much time if not more. I think that if they were planning on doing this however they would have included bean in the trailer, and would have had a more difficult time casting because it would have added quite a few other child actors to the cast that needed to be good, Bean and achilles being two of them

valium:
Wait what? Scrapping Peter and Valentine takes away Ender's motivation and ruins any potential for sequels.

what are you talking about, Valentine at least is definitely in the move, she will be played by Abigail Breslin, I am concerned about them cutting some of the peter stuff though (animal cruelty doesn't tend to go over well)

cursedseishi:
Honestly, I doubt having Mr. Card's name in this movie is going to really do anything.

i kind of agree.

i think The Escapist (and perhaps "geekdom" itself) has somewhat of an obsession with gender/sexual politics atm but the average moviegoers seldom know or care who wrote a film unless they are specifically going to see a film because they actually liked the book and in that case its seen as a hopefully potential plus.

they care "who's in it" and they care "if it's any good" and they may see the directors name as carrying weight but the writer ?

seriously moviegoers have always been pretty blind to a movies author(s) when stacked up against the other creative talent involved.

i bet half the people here couldn't name the writers of half their favourite films...and we're geeks ffs :P

i certainly couldn't. i'd get stumped on most of them after LOTR, Shawshank and Blade Runner.

i think the trailer looks decent and...well you could bolt on half a dozen different potential audiences from potentially different directions.

tbth i think the real threat to a non-franchise movie such as this is Sci-Fi overload...
there are and have been A LOT of flashy (and not so flashy) sci fi movies coming out...

ofc it may just be "a bad film".

captcha: vogon poetry...

valium:

Artistic =/= art.

Books, movies, and video games are meant to be entertainment sold to the vast public, that is why they exist. That kind of automatically disqualifies them as art.

So... the moment something becomes entertaining it stops being art?

Does this also mean that a painting completely loses its artistic value the moment it's sold by the artist?

Kmadden2004:

valium:

Artistic =/= art.

Books, movies, and video games are meant to be entertainment sold to the vast public, that is why they exist. That kind of automatically disqualifies them as art.

So... the moment something becomes entertaining it stops being art?

Does this also mean that a painting completely loses its artistic value the moment it's sold by the artist?

i thought "art" was supposed to involve the conveyance of emotions or ideas via the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination.

or are we just making up our own definitions now so we can cut out and disparage things we don't like ?...

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