Microsoft Exec: "If You're Backwards Compatible, You're Really Backwards"

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 NEXT
 

What is it with Microsoft and insulting their customers especially when their valid concerns/requests? Seriously do they want the system to fail or are they really that stupid and up themselves that they can't see the use. Do they really only care about the newest shiniest game and don't understand that older games are still fun and often better than their newer versions?

My money is yes, they are that dumb, ignorant and up themselves, so they can get stuffed.

Well it sounds like I'm in your five percent. Thank you for alienating me, you've just given me another reason not to buy the next Xbox.

While he's probably right, the sheer arrogance of his statement is astounding. I keep my old consoles so I can play my old games on them but the problem is I also have to keep a standard definition TV to play them on.

Ok Microsoft, how many Adam Orth clones did you whip up? Be honest now!

I imagine that his figure of 5% is somewhat skewed by the fact that the last generation was, what, seven years ago? On top of that add in the fact that backwards compatibility was never that great on the 360. Most people playing Xbox games on their 360 would have done so in the first year after it launched, the time that they are transitioning between consoles and when there is still a steady stream of Xbox games coming out to play backwardsly. Seven years on people aren't playing old titles because they have better games to play or they just plain aren't able to.

Maybe the Xbone is just Microsoft's attempt to steal EA's 2014 Golden Poo? It certainly looks like they aren't trying to actually sell this thing.

Lovely. Just lovely. The PS2 being backwards compatible is what cemented the deal for me 12 years ago, sure, I only had Metal Gear 2 and Silent Hill 2, but I already had a shitton of PS1 games that I could play with improved loading times and smoothed out graphics.

I only had like 2 or 3 games on my GBA when I bought it, but I already had a bunch of GB/GBC games to play, same with my NDS, I could still play Yoshi's Island on it and it's still one of the very best platformers ever (screw Yoshi's Island DS).

Same with the Wii, I could finally play all my GameCube games with a widescreen TV with Component cables and ramp up the graphics to 480p.

Being able to play Wii games on the WiiU with an HDMI cable sounds sexy, even if they don't display in HD, heck, it's pretty much a nice incentive to replace my Wii (and repair my Cube... and hunt down for those fabled component cables).

If I had a substantial library of 360 games, I'd definitely be rather pissed off.

Just keep digging Microsoft, maybe you'll find some gold in you're stupid remarks.

Considering that I have more PS2 games for my old-school PS3 than actual PS3 games... well, you can guess my thoughts on this.

Seriously though, what exactly is going on with Microsoft? Not only have they alienated the majority of their gaming-centric customer-base with all the anti-game announcements as well as the massive focus on television of all things, but now they're actively insulting potential customers because their gaming preferences. Did they think that this would help their tanking PR in any way? Do they even realize how little confidence an extremely large portion of the gamer-market has in them right now?

I've had a few PS3s in my time, and although I can't speak for Xbox, the PS3 backwards compatibility was so hot and cold it was virtually not worth using.

But that said, not having owned a PS2, I did use it. And I think if anyone is looking to steal players from other consoles it would have been a smart move to have backwards compatibility.

DVS BSTrD:
Well pretty soon Don is gunna wish he could take back-words

This, i must greatly agree with this.

So only 5% plays games from the previous generation. On consoles that don't allow you to play games from the previous generation. I want you to meet Nintendo. Their handhelds always were backwards compatible for at least ONE previous generation. In essence doubling their library, offering better hardware and making it easier to adopt because whilst I wait for new games these other awesome gameboy games can be played on my gameboy advanced.

But who wants to emulate Nintendo am I right Kinect? You decided to emulate Sony from the PS2 era!

Not only is this idiot willing to ignore 5% of his customers which amount to a few million people, he also wants to forgo a feature that would give them a HUGE step up on their direct competitor all for the sake of down the line selling old games over their online store. Re-releasing old titles for quick cash.

Let me tell you this dear Mensa member working at Microsoft.

Backwards compatibility means more early adopters. Because they basically invest in the next upgrade in anticipation of new games whilst they can still buy the old ones. You are basically padding out your sure to be piss poor starting library with a fucking string of excellent games from the previous generation. You see you shouldn't really care on which version of your console people play your games. You will still get that 10$ for EVERY game you sell. So the more people that buy a X1 the more people will buy 360 games whilst they wait for the good games.

Sony has a huge problem because they were idiots and made the Cell chip, you however always worked on regular hardware, you can easily make the backwards compatibility a thing. Fuck you could give a bunch of hackers free access to your tool kits and have them MAKE an emulator for you. It'd probably take them a month with access to the code itself. This emulator could be made for next to nothing, even if it failed you could just rewrite the games and allow people to download X1 versions through LIVE using the codes from 360 cases. Though I doubt that because it would run on supposedly superior hardware meaning it would not tax the system and it could potentially boost your sales because people are less cautious about adopting the new X1... but you'd be backwards for including it...

Sometimes I wonder how these people ever got into positions of control in industries they barely understand. It's like putting a vegan in charge of a meat packaging plant.

And here comes the shitstorm. Man, Microsoft is just on a rapid streak eh? Come on, keep em coming, these assholes deserve every single bit of shit that is getting thrown at them.

IamLEAM1983:
Oh, Microsoft. You silly goose. Throwing your customers a bone is so 2001. Throwing them an Xbone, now - THAT'S the future!

I can't wait for sales numbers to start showing up.

Do you mean you can't wait for sales numbers to start showing down?

I'm not a hardware expert; I am but a fan/enthusiast who likes to jump around tech articles, nevertheless I can say with full confidence:

It's not possible to emulate a 3.2ghz IBM Power thread on a 1.6ghz core* running Intel's x86 arch (licensed by AMD). Period. Full stop. It is completely, absolutely impossible.

[The following graf may only be legible to fellow PC enthusiasts, sorry]
Jaguar is not exactly a Bulldozer/Ivy Bridge class instruction juggling juggernaut; it's far more comparable to current gen ARM or Atom (which is why there are 8 of them in both the PS4 and one). Even if it where powered by the latest and greatest and (literally) hottest either AMD or Intel has to offer, and said CPU was overclocked to 5GHZ and beyond, that still would not be enough to effectively run even "dynamically recompiled" power code at reasonable speeds. Ask anyone who ran legacy software and games on the first Intel powered Macintosh computers.

(*though the core is definitely better than the particular in-order Power Core used in the PS3 and the 360)

Likewise the next xbox is not "emulating" the first xbox (as the PS3 emulated the first Playstation); both the first and the next xbox use Intel's instruction set, and both are running under the Windows kernel (version 5 and 6 respectively) using the Direct3D graphics library (version 8 and 11 respectively). There should be not much more issue running a game published on the first xbox on the one than there is running a game designed for Windows XP 32bit on Windows 8 (kernel 6.2) 64bit. Depending on how "close to metal" a game designed for the first xbox is, getting a game that cannot run as is to work on the One should not require a massive overhaul.

Of course, none of this made Don Mattrick's cute little neologism any less asinine.

Edit: Seriously doubt Mattrick put much more thought into his phrase beyond how clever and cutting it must be, how disarming his terse "one in twenty (as a percentage)" non-statistic must be for those who would passionately disagree. It seems, based on his statements, that MS did not look much deeper into their data: e.g how much overlap there is between xbox and 360 owners or the number of games that are still not playable despite Eric Traut et al's best efforts. They just took the 5% figure and ran with it as a full justification.

el_kabong:
While I kind of disagree in the way the exec said it, I certainly fall into the large majority mentioned. Once I get a shiny, new toy, my old toys seem less shiny. I had a backwards compatible PS3. You know how many PS2 games I played on it? Zero.

Is backwards compatibility a neat feature? Sure, but it's far from a deal-breaker for me if the system is without it.

I have a backwards compatible Ps3 and I play more Ps2 games and Ps1 games than Ps3 games. I'm probably that 5% but still no backwards compatibility is a dealbreaker for me no matter what games or features they have. I hate clutter and having 6 systems in my room so if they are telling me to add more clutter they can kindly stick that Xbone and Ps4 where the sun doesn't shine. :)

cricket chirps:

IamLEAM1983:
Oh, Microsoft. You silly goose. Throwing your customers a bone is so 2001. Throwing them an Xbone, now - THAT'S the future!

I can't wait for sales numbers to start showing up.

Do you mean you can't wait for sales numbers to start showing down?

Nah, I mean sideways. #trollface

Yeah, I don't think they'll see more than the usual shooter and sports fans, in terms of audience.

The_Darkness:
Hoo boy...

Take the Wii. Now, it was a less than brilliant console with regards to its library (I was much happier with the Xbox 360's selection) but that seems to be Nintendo's running problem. However, it did backwards compatibility properly. I can play Eternal Darkness on it. I can play Second Sight on it. I can play Star Wars: Clone Wars on it. But I can also play Super Smash Bros Brawl and Metroid Prime Trilogy on it. And I still do play all of these games. The Wii's somewhat lacklustre library was bolstered by its predecessor, and I didn't have to worry about wanting for games when I first bought it.

Of course, I've already been put off the Xbox One (What was wrong with Xbox Infinity? I know that's a minor complaint, but really?), so this hardly matters here. But Backwards Compatibility is definitely not a bad thing, and definitely not backwards.

The only good counterpoint I can come up with is that, if they included backwards compatibility, the price of the console would become impractical for most consumers to buy it. I paid $700-800 for my PS3, there weren't many others willing to pay that for the backwards compatibility. I find it understandable that they would drop it to keep the price in a range that would allow more people to buy it.

Since the reveal I've played some Fable: Lost Chapters, Whacked (anyone remember that game?) and, Crimson Skies but I had to use my original Xbox because...well I don't think either would work on my 360. I recall some games working but there's some kind of sound distortion I remember happening last time I tried.

When it comes to old games on a new console, I do that a lot with my Wii U but that's mainly because I'm that one person who hasn't beaten Donkey Kong Country Returns or, Mario Galaxies yet. What this really says (to me) is that I should probably not expect the XBone to get compilation discs. What I mean is something like the Kirby Dream Collection: a game disc (or downloadable title) made up of previous games from a franchise.

Now it's back to my Xbox since there's seems to be a new mission based around Chickens somewhere in Albion...or maybe I'll try Otogi again.

-Dragmire-:

SNIP

The only good counterpoint I can come up with is that, if they included backwards compatibility, the price of the console would become impractical for most consumers to buy it. I paid $700-800 for my PS3, there weren't many others willing to pay that for the backwards compatibility. I find it understandable that they would drop it to keep the price in a range that would allow more people to buy it.

That's true - and if they'd used that as their explanation, I'd be happier. It's the sentiment behind the statement that bothers me, rather than the actual decision to not have backwards compatibility. (Let's face it - I have an Xbox 360, I don't need the Xbone to play 360 games.) Microsoft fires off a backhanded comment at people who would have appreciated backwards compatibility, which is what they'll be remembered for, rather than any sensible reasons for not offering it. It's as if they are actively training their PR officers the wrong way...

The_Darkness:
Hoo boy...

Take the Wii. Now, it was a less than brilliant console with regards to its library (I was much happier with the Xbox 360's selection) but that seems to be Nintendo's running problem. However, it did backwards compatibility properly. I can play Eternal Darkness on it. I can play Second Sight on it. I can play Star Wars: Clone Wars on it. But I can also play Super Smash Bros Brawl and Metroid Prime Trilogy on it. And I still do play all of these games. The Wii's somewhat lacklustre library was bolstered by its predecessor, and I didn't have to worry about wanting for games when I first bought it.

Of course, I've already been put off the Xbox One (What was wrong with Xbox Infinity? I know that's a minor complaint, but really?), so this hardly matters here. But Backwards Compatibility is definitely not a bad thing, and definitely not backwards.

Later Wii versions dropped gamecube support. But at that point it didn't matter.

At least the WiiU can play the few Wii games I liked

Does Microsoft just have the most flamebait executives in the industry? First that Adam Orthe guy (Is that his name?) Now this? Can they explain their reasons without riling everyone up? I for one would like to play my old games on a newer console.

Also Gray, I think you are the one who started this "Xbone" phrase! It sounds better than Xbox One.

-Dragmire-:

The_Darkness:
Hoo boy...

Take the Wii. Now, it was a less than brilliant console with regards to its library (I was much happier with the Xbox 360's selection) but that seems to be Nintendo's running problem. However, it did backwards compatibility properly. I can play Eternal Darkness on it. I can play Second Sight on it. I can play Star Wars: Clone Wars on it. But I can also play Super Smash Bros Brawl and Metroid Prime Trilogy on it. And I still do play all of these games. The Wii's somewhat lacklustre library was bolstered by its predecessor, and I didn't have to worry about wanting for games when I first bought it.

Of course, I've already been put off the Xbox One (What was wrong with Xbox Infinity? I know that's a minor complaint, but really?), so this hardly matters here. But Backwards Compatibility is definitely not a bad thing, and definitely not backwards.

The only good counterpoint I can come up with is that, if they included backwards compatibility, the price of the console would become impractical for most consumers to buy it. I paid $700-800 for my PS3, there weren't many others willing to pay that for the backwards compatibility. I find it understandable that they would drop it to keep the price in a range that would allow more people to buy it.

Really?? I got the MGS4 80GB Ps3 bundle (full backwards compatibility for Ps2/Ps1) for 499 + tax. That isn't too unreasonable

The_Darkness:

-Dragmire-:

SNIP

The only good counterpoint I can come up with is that, if they included backwards compatibility, the price of the console would become impractical for most consumers to buy it. I paid $700-800 for my PS3, there weren't many others willing to pay that for the backwards compatibility. I find it understandable that they would drop it to keep the price in a range that would allow more people to buy it.

That's true - and if they'd used that as their explanation, I'd be happier. It's the sentiment behind the statement that bothers me, rather than the actual decision to not have backwards compatibility. (Let's face it - I have an Xbox 360, I don't need the Xbone to play 360 games.) Microsoft fires off a backhanded comment at people who would have appreciated backwards compatibility, which is what they'll be remembered for, rather than any sensible reasons for not offering it. It's as if they are actively training their PR officers the wrong way...

I completely agree, this has not been the greatest year for PR statements all around so I'm looking at it as par for the course.

EDIT:

GAunderrated:

-Dragmire-:

The_Darkness:
Hoo boy...

The only good counterpoint I can come up with is that, if they included backwards compatibility, the price of the console would become impractical for most consumers to buy it. I paid $700-800 for my PS3, there weren't many others willing to pay that for the backwards compatibility. I find it understandable that they would drop it to keep the price in a range that would allow more people to buy it.

Really?? I got the MGS4 80GB Ps3 bundle (full backwards compatibility for Ps2/Ps1) for 499 + tax. That isn't too unreasonable

The Canadian dollar was not on par at the time so we had to deal with inflated prices.

THIS is what you have PR departments for.

seriously, though, I wonder what the percentage would be on, say, the Wii, where you can play GameCube titles without any trouble at all.
now THAT, I really appreciated.

I won't play a game that is part of a series unless I've played the previous entries in that series. Backwards comparability makes that much easier, and therefore helps drive sales of current gen games.

So let's say I've been an avid Sony fan from day one, never once played an XBOX game. Now imagine I've become dis-enfranchised with Sony and am looking for a good reason to upgrade to the new xboxone. If I could suddenly have access to all of those 360 games I had missed over the years I would see that as a huge selling point. Having access to next gen content, and having access to a huge library of excellent 360 titles apparently is not considered a selling point. But let's not forget, the xbox one design is not aimed at delivering great content for consumers but rather on allowing MS to control the used game market. Won't buy it.

I guess im one o fthose five percent since I made a point to get a PSN account and 20 dollars just so I could get P3Fes on PSN, and cause the only reason I even use a wii on my own is to play my GC games.

you know what though, go ahead and dont release any old games remade/mastered for the XBox1 and see how many supporters you lose. Tell me if its only 5%

EDIT: though after how "bad" the reveal went if i was in the company the last thing I would be doing is insulting my audience.

That was the single stupidest thing I've ever heard an industry head say.

Just... wow.

emeraldrafael:
I guess im one o fthose five percent since I made a point to get a PSN account and 20 dollars just so I could get P3Fes on PSN, and cause the only reason I even use a wii on my own is to play my GC games.

you know what though, go ahead and dont release any old games remade/mastered for the XBox1 and see how many supporters you lose. Tell me if its only 5%

EDIT: though after how "bad" the reveal went if i was in the company the last thing I would be doing is insulting my audience.

Exactly, imagine if other industries were run this way.

Hotel guest: Excuse me sir, could I please have a wake up call for 7am

Hotel employee: What don't you know how to work an alarm clock? There is one in your room. Don't you have a smartphone? Just ask Siri to wake you up. You are such an old-fashioned douche bag, why would you want me to call you on the TELAFONE to wake you up when you have the future of wake-up calls in the palm of your hand?

Hotel Manager: YOU'RE FIRED!!! Please pardon the rudeness of my former employee, can I offer you a free dinner in our restaurant for the anti-customer conduct of my FORMER employee. Did I mention that people deserve to be FIRED for treating customers with disdain. Please don't tell others that you hate my hotel, this is, afterall, a competitive industry and my business can be made or broken on word-of-mouth, grassroots commentary by dis-enfranchised customers such as yourself.

Just sayin'

*sighs* At least PS4 had a kinda reason to not do BC with the CELL architect.

Ya late in the console life no one is really playing the older games, but when you come out with that new console and only a handful of games, Your just telling your customers to go elsewhere when they finish the few games that come out for the system in the launch timeframe.

This comment will probably fall on deaf ears, but...

PC IS THE WAY TO BE!

I can still play PC games from the 1990's on my "current gen" PC that runs things like GW2, BF3, and so on.

Oh, and why backwards compatibility is important? Look at something like TF2, a game well over 5 years old still being played (and updated) today. If not compatible with the new game systems, the game dies...same for Minecraft. They kill 3rd party games by these restrictions.

However, in an attempt to be fair, I'm pretty sure the statement is meant to read more like this...

"If my company were to offer a product that is backwards compatible than, by definition, my COMPANY would be truly backwards in our thinking instead of thinking forward into the shiny future."

Now it is perfectly acceptable to feel an attitude of disdain from MS over even the charitable interpretation of the statement due to the fact that you can still infer the logical next step "if companies that offer BC are truly backwards, then the consumers who want their products must also be backwards". Although to be fair he didn't really implicitly call anyone backwards.

Deathfish15:
This comment will probably fall on deaf ears, but...

PC IS THE WAY TO BE!

I can still play PC games from the 1990's on my "current gen" PC that runs things like GW2, BF3, and so on.

Oh, and why backwards compatibility is important? Look at something like TF2, a game well over 5 years old still being played (and updated) today. If not compatible with the new game systems, the game dies...same for Minecraft. They kill 3rd party games by these restrictions.

I was exclusively a PC gamer back in the late 90s. I fell away from it during the PS2 era because I felt that console games were finally starting to catch up with PCs in offering games that were more epic and complex. Plus I liked the simplicity of simply opening a box, inserting a disc, and playing immediately.

Consoles are becoming overly-complex, bloated with erroneous features, and full of restrictions and bullshit hassles for the consumers. Add to that the fact that every single major console release right now is either a FPS or a sequel / remake, the games on console are becoming samey and boring.

Hell ya I was looking into the price of a decent gaming PC today, I'm ready to switch back.

be nice if they'd add a backwards compatible version of the console for a higher price. i'd pay it, no question about it

Well of course it doesn't have backwards compatibility, nobody is playing original XBox games anymore. Now I assume the XBox 1 is the spiritual predecessor of the 360, correct? Otherwise why would the 360 be XBox 2pi, while this is XBox 1pi. It just wouldn't make any sense. I'm just waiting for the 360 to get backwards compatibility support for XBox 180 games.

Please. For the love of god. No one buy an Xbox 1 on day 1.

Microsoft needs to learn a lesson, and the only way they'll ever figure it out is if they make big fat zero dollars on launch day.

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 NEXT

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Register for a free account here