PS4 Will Not Block Used Games or Require an Online Connection

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Grey Carter:

In which Sony wins E3.

Understatement of the year. Barring an unprecedented about-face from microsoft, i'd say Sony just preemptively won the entire console war.

They learned their lesson from last time. PS3 was never able to catch the 360 b/c Xbox pulled ahead so early. People buy consoles that they can play with their friends on. "All my friends are on Live" is one of the most common reasons people I know bought a 360 over a PS3 (second only to "i can play halo on it"). Its the reason i bought one.

Early adopters are the Hardcore gamers, the console with the most early adopters will have the best multiplayer experience, and therefore will win the War.

I wasn't planning on buying either one, but now I will 100% buy a PS4 just to support Sony as the new standard bearer against stupid DRM.

Spiridion:
So... there's basically no question as to which console I'll be buying... nor any sane person, I'd imagine. Really curious as to how Microsoft is going to climb out of this hole.

Like they climbed out of Windows 8 hole which failed and keeps failing and Surface fail that keeps failing and GFWL which...

Look, anyone can see a bloody pattern.

walrusaurus:

Grey Carter:

In which Sony wins E3.

Understatement of the year. Barring an unprecedented about-face from microsoft, i'd say Sony just preemptively won the entire console war.

They learned their lesson from last time. PS3 was never able to catch the 360 b/c Xbox pulled ahead so early. People buy consoles that they can play with their friends on. "All my friends are on Live" is one of the most common reasons people I know bought a 360 over a PS3 (second only to "i can play halo on it"). Its the reason i bought one.

Early adopters are the Hardcore gamers, the console with the most early adopters will have the best multiplayer experience, and therefore will win the War.

I wasn't planning on buying either one, but now I will 100% buy a PS4 just to support Sony as the new standard bearer against stupid DRM.

You could see a pattern a while ago. PS3 did pull ahead of 360 fairly recently worldwide. 360 is ahead in US only.

its going to be interesting to see what happens with these, since there both going for different markets.

RJ 17:

aelreth:
When the markets open in the morning, it's going to be a wild ride for MS shareholders.

I was thinking the exact same thing. "I wonder how far MS's stock is going to drop tomorrow..."

Seriously, their biggest competitor just came out and said "Hi everyone! You know all that stuff about the new Xbox that you hate? We're not going to do that! AND it'll be cheaper! AND you won't be forced to install a creepy spy-cam in your living room!"

In a market sense, Sony just ran up and kicked MS right in the balls.

My prediction: XBone launches as-is, but soon after they'll come out with a stripped-down model that's pretty much just the gaming console we wanted from them in the first place.

Your prediction is in line with the what is fast becoming Microsoft company tradition.

On the whole, your opinion as a consumer, with their product line, where do you think Microsoft will be by the end of the decade? It's you as a consumer that will decide it's fate.

Disclaimer: I'm a Network Admin & Technician on a Windows based system.

Xan Krieger:
By modern standards it's a sexual assault, not something to be happy about. Of course applying modern standards to past events is a futile thing but it doesn't mean we should use images like this to celebrate things, it's a sign of a problem with society back in the 40s.

Pretty selective reading of it, when she has said this:

It wasn't that much of a kiss. It was more of a jubilant act that he didn't have to go back. I found out later he was so happy that he didn't have to go back to the Pacific where they had already been through the war. The reason he grabbed somebody dressed like a nurse, that he felt so very grateful to the nurses who took care of the wounded.

And this:

=We send Christmas cards and he has a very lovely wife and I have talked to her. Were not friends to see each other, but through this happening we have something in common.

Besides, the photo is most probably being used here for comic hyperbole, so nit-picking it is missing the point.

Shamanic Rhythm:

Xan Krieger:
By modern standards it's a sexual assault, not something to be happy about. Of course applying modern standards to past events is a futile thing but it doesn't mean we should use images like this to celebrate things, it's a sign of a problem with society back in the 40s.

Pretty selective reading of it, when she has said this:

It wasn't that much of a kiss. It was more of a jubilant act that he didn't have to go back. I found out later he was so happy that he didn't have to go back to the Pacific where they had already been through the war. The reason he grabbed somebody dressed like a nurse, that he felt so very grateful to the nurses who took care of the wounded.

And this:

=We send Christmas cards and he has a very lovely wife and I have talked to her. Were not friends to see each other, but through this happening we have something in common.

Besides, the photo is most probably being used here for comic hyperbole, so nit-picking it is missing the point.

So basically him being happy makes it OK? You don't just grab random people and kiss them, it's not legal and not right.

So the next generation console war has already been won without either of the major participants hitting the shelves (apologies to the Wii U). Wow, I did not see that coming (until a couple of weeks ago).

I'm pretty sure this is the first time I've ever thrown my hands into the air and said "HUZZAH!" enthusiastically instead of sarcastically.
I have a Wii U already, four games for it and a couple more I can think of that I'd want to buy, but now that I know the PS4 isn't going to screw players over with a metric ton of DRM...yeah, I think further down the line a PS4 will stand right beside my Nintendo, and it will be sweet.

http://au.gamespot.com/e3/ps-plus-required-to-play-ps4-games-online-6409709/ This is kind of disappointing, but I already have PS+ and enjoy all the free games, so no biggie. I mean 20$ for three months and 50 for a year plus a ton of games added in is a good deal.

So basically him being happy makes it OK? You don't just grab random people and kiss them, it's not legal and not right.

Nothing makes it 'OK', but if the woman in question seems to remember it fondly enough to keep in contact with the guy who kissed her, it seems a bit pointless to go on a crusade against people using the photograph for comedic purposes.

sb666:
http://au.gamespot.com/e3/ps-plus-required-to-play-ps4-games-online-6409709/ This is kind of disappointing, but I already have PS+ and enjoy all the free games, so no biggie. I mean 20$ for three months and 50 for a year plus a ton of games added in is a good deal.

Factor in that Plus is cheaper than XBL, and even factoring in a year's (or 15 months') worth of Plus the PS4 is STILL cheaper than the Xbone (without adding in XBL costs).

And thus, the battle is over. Sony has won without fighting and the logical fallacy "hey there is something worse out there" seems to be representative of reality.

The Pink Pansy:
Aaaaand, Microsoft got dumpstered.

Salt in the wound;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWSIFh8ICaA

image

That's a 5th-degree burn right there....

OT: Wooooo!! Goodbye XBOX 1!

... and yet the sheep will flock and buy Xbox One, and keep MS XBox division ridiculously profitable. They will buy it for Killer Instinct, Halo, Gears, Dead Arising, Ghosts... then they will complain when the DRM fails and stops them playing, but they will still buy MS stuff, and complain the company is killing the industry, and they will still buy.

Thats the problem, the vast majority of gamers dont care about anti consumer or how the big companies are shafting them, they will whine and complain, threaten to boycott but when the bloody box hits the shop shelves, they will be buying it while whining about it at the same time.

It happens all the time...

Prime example is CoD MW 2 PC ... a hell of a lot threatened to boycott the title because of its anti PC stance (no dedi servers, no consoles, no modding, no server browsing, etc etc) ... day the title launched the leaders of the boycott group were practically first in line to buy the bloody game...

... same with L4D2.

I dont expect MS to feel any pain from this 'loss' , when the box hits the shelves it will sell... unfortunately.

What'd be hilarious is if PS4 games cost twice as much as Xbone games as a result.

I don't know whether anyone here has said it ahead of me, I might have missed it skimming to the end of page 3...

But you guys might be interested to know that Sony developed the software that publishers may now use to charge you for attempting to register a used game. This was a story a bit more or less than a year ago.

Sony SOLD it to Microsoft, while keeping silent on whether or not they were going to use it themselves- but perhaps offering vague assurances to Microsoft behind closed doors that they would.

This is a clever sabotage; it's treachery on a par with EVE:O shenanigans. I think I'll endorse it by purchasing a PS4.

I still want to play The Last Guardian after all, and I don't think it's happening on the PS3 anymore.

Damn, Microsoft got utterly destroyed. Just saw the parts of the conference where Sony were making digs at the Xbone. Well, I suppose this is just what I wanted to see. XD

RicoADF:

GonzoGamer:

I'll admit, I was one of those people. The way things have been going lately can you blame me? Sony was the one that made online pass standard on all their 1st party games.

It was good to see Jack Trenton not only be explicit (repeatedly) this time but he was just smugly twisting the knife after a while. Still not buying a ps4 (not at launch at least) but that almost made me want to.
A little worried about Plus being required for online.

No I don't blame you and kudos for coming forward :-), so we can expect you looking at the PS4 once the price drops perhaps?

Provided it gets much better support than my ps3, Sure. And I don't just mean the software; the firmware too.
I'll sure as hell buy it before even thinking about buying an xbone.

aelreth:
On the whole, your opinion as a consumer, with their product line, where do you think Microsoft will be by the end of the decade? It's you as a consumer that will decide it's fate.

My guess is that unless they end up releasing a version of the Xbox One that doesn't have all the things that gamers have been angry about, the Xbox is going to go the way of the Dreamcast. Add to it the fact that Windows 8 was a bust and the outlook isn't very good. Someone else in this topic said that if the publishers side with MS due to the fact that the Xbox One seems to favor publisher rights as a gaming console over gamer rights. My belief is that the simple laws of Supply and Demand would suggest that that will not be the case. Currently there's a big wave of support for the PS4 as Sony has come out and confirmed that their system won't be weighed down by all the negatives that the new Xbox has. It'll be hard to justify not making games for the PS4 when the demand for your Xbox exclusives plummets.

As the saying goes, gamers vote with their wallets. If the "features" of the Xbox have chased off a large portion of their target market (as the sentiment around this website would have us believe) then clearly people will be more likely to go with the competition. I highly doubt that publishers will bind themselves to a sinking ship just on a matter of principle over "We want absolute control over used game sales!" Being stubborn rarely makes a profit.

The thing is, though, from my understanding, all the things that people don't like about the new Xbox (i.e. mandatory Kinect, mandatory broadband connection, all this confusion over used/rented games) are part of its core design, they'd pretty much have to redesign the thing if they wanted to make up for their mistakes.

Sure this news is a huge plus toward PS4 but they should have other features or pros that isn't all being oppersite to X Box One.

Already knew I was not going to get the Xbox One, and that I will get a Wii U near christmas. And this sealed it for me, will be getting a PS4 when The Witcher 3 comes out (I'm mostly a PC gamer, but that game looks like it's been designed specifically to melt computers that aren't powered by cold fusion).

iniudan:

J Tyran:
Good news? Maybe, it's in the hands of the publishers now... We know some of the big publishers are desperate to try and restrict or stop used games, so what happens if they decide to throw in support for the Xbone and leave the PS4 in the dust?

Trouble is that it only seem to be EA that really want that (who were actually absent from Sony conference), has you had other major publisher (Ubisoft, Activision, SquareEnix) actually do a better presentation at Sony conference then Microsoft.

EA was absent from both Microsoft and Sony's conferences this time around. They held their own in between the two. While they did do a big support for Xbone last month, most of their games are cross platform, and this separate conference was very much to avoid playing favorites.

TiberiusEsuriens:

iniudan:

J Tyran:
Good news? Maybe, it's in the hands of the publishers now... We know some of the big publishers are desperate to try and restrict or stop used games, so what happens if they decide to throw in support for the Xbone and leave the PS4 in the dust?

Trouble is that it only seem to be EA that really want that (who were actually absent from Sony conference), has you had other major publisher (Ubisoft, Activision, SquareEnix) actually do a better presentation at Sony conference then Microsoft.

EA was absent from both Microsoft and Sony's conferences this time around. They held their own in between the two. While they did do a big support for Xbone last month, most of their games are cross platform, and this separate conference was very much to avoid playing favorites.

EA was at Microsoft conference, I would like to point you to Titanfall and Battlefield 4 been presented during it.

I find it really depressing that "[console X] does less mistakes than [console Y]" are the most exciting news we get in mainstream gaming now.

It still sucks, it just sucks less than the XBone.

Turns out this isn't entirely true. Dunno if you want to update the article Grey, because the PS4 certainly will allow for DRM from third-parties, and by implication will still be able to block used games.

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Turns out this isn't entirely true. Dunno if you want to update the article Grey, because the PS4 certainly will allow for DRM from third-parties, and by implication will still be able to block used games.

Turns out that that in itself is also not quite entirely true because what the Sony dude actually said was they aren';t adding any restrictions. Sony themselves are having their first party stuff DRM free and the other stuff is up to the publisher, but they aren't adding special options or methods of control for them like Microsoft are.

So for Sony it's business as usual, and we'll know exactly which publishers to blame.

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Turns out this isn't entirely true. Dunno if you want to update the article Grey, because the PS4 certainly will allow for DRM from third-parties, and by implication will still be able to block used games.

To be fair, the company promised they are not doing it with first party titles. Microsoft on the other hand has made no such promise. Nintendo likely will end up having to leave that kind of thing to the publishers as well eventually as the publishers are the ones who choose what system a game comes out on.

SkarKrow:

Turns out that that in itself is also not quite entirely true because what the Sony dude actually said was they aren';t adding any restrictions. Sony themselves are having their first party stuff DRM free and the other stuff is up to the publisher, but they aren't adding special options or methods of control for them like Microsoft are.

So for Sony it's business as usual, and we'll know exactly which publishers to blame.

True, but Sony themselves stated, or at least implied, that PS4 games will be able to be played used on a system-wide level. The implication being that Sony had set down some sort of mandate to ensure that any game could be bought or played second-hand, as per their power point slide, as per the video they put up taking jabs at Microsoft.

This is now simply not the case. And with the number of third-party games being trussed up as 'MMOs' or 'persistant multiplayer experiences' SimCity style in order to justify an always online connection (The Division, Destiny, The Crew, Titanfall), it means third-party games will likely be functionally identical on PS4 as on Xbone.

Well for the publishers that actually try to do it, don't buy their games. I won't. Mainly because im part of the glorious PC master race, and the witcher 3 and cyberpunk for the PC is gunna rock.

PS: Why the fuck do people like halo? It has a shit story, shit combat and shit MP. Far better shooters out there.

Ok, but remember Linux support on the PS3? Or backwards compatibility with PS2 games?

What guaranty do I have that they won't just release a patch a few months after release and implement everything Microsoft is doing? The patch could be in the works already.

Basically, I have little faith in any company at this point.

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:

SkarKrow:

Turns out that that in itself is also not quite entirely true because what the Sony dude actually said was they aren';t adding any restrictions. Sony themselves are having their first party stuff DRM free and the other stuff is up to the publisher, but they aren't adding special options or methods of control for them like Microsoft are.

So for Sony it's business as usual, and we'll know exactly which publishers to blame.

True, but Sony themselves stated, or at least implied, that PS4 games will be able to be played used on a system-wide level. The implication being that Sony had set down some sort of mandate to ensure that any game could be bought or played second-hand, as per their power point slide, as per the video they put up taking jabs at Microsoft.

This is now simply not the case. And with the number of third-party games being trussed up as 'MMOs' or 'persistant multiplayer experiences' SimCity style in order to justify an always online connection (The Division, Destiny, The Crew, Titanfall), it means third-party games will likely be functionally identical on PS4 as on Xbone.

I suppose that is a possibility but we'll have to see what that means, for now at least the PS4 seems the better system on the DRM front and we'll learn more as we go. If ti becomes a problem then I simply won't buy stuff from those particular publishers, and I won't be pre-ordering anything with stupid DRM.

Though Destiny does seem to have actual MMO stuff going, just in case you haven't been keeping up with it. The Division looks cool but I haven't read anything yet, tired and not long in from work you see.

To me it just seems like the Xbox One is a much more enabling device for publishers, and it's daily connection and such will factor into that tremendously. But as I said, we'll have to wait and see how it all pans out. As of right now, Sony has a much better stance, and if they can say that there won't be any used-blocking allowed then we'll all be happier for it, though I don't think a 8 online pass is the same as blocking a used sale.

well guess which console I am going to buy

iniudan:
Trouble is that it only seem to be EA that really want that (who were actually absent from Sony conference), has you had other major publisher (Ubisoft, Activision, SquareEnix) actually do a better presentation at Sony conference then Microsoft.

Oh, that would be even more delicious.

Sony PS4: another great feature is that we don't have any games from EA.
Microsoft Xbox One: Our brand is now unfortunately associated with EA.

dakkster:
Why preorder though? That's just you giving GameStop/whoever an interest free loan. Keep your money and use it when the PS4 actually comes out. Out of curiosity: Have you watched any of the Jimquisitions about why we shouldn't pre-order?

The retailer I pre-ordered from doesn't charge your credit card until it actually ships, so there is no loan. Pre-orders can be helpful, in that the retailers will have a good idea of the demand, and therefore try to get enough stock to meet said demand.

Pre-orders for games/software (which is what the Jimquisition episode was about) are very different to those of hardware. Games are essentially infinite in supply (particularly in the age of downloadable games) - but hardware is not. It takes a lot of effort and resources to run those factories, and big hardware launches frequently deplete the stock to the point where the hardware is unavailable for months, until the factories can supply more.

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