Nintendo Says Used Games Aren't An Issue

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Nintendo Says Used Games Aren't An Issue

Shigeru Miyamoto

Legendary designer Shigeru Miyamoto says piracy is still a problem but used games really aren't on Nintendo's radar.

Used games are a vexing issue for game publishers simply because they see no money from their sale. You buy a brand-new game, the publisher gets its piece; you buy it used, and all the green goes to the retailer. It's an issue that's really flared up during this year's E3, which has been dominated by the introduction of new consoles from Microsoft and Sony, but Miyamoto, the man behind Mario, says it's not really an issue at all for Nintendo.

"For us it's less about used games and it's really more illegal copying of games that we're really worried about. By creating the games that we create and selling those games, it enables us to then create new versions of those games," he told CVG.

"We're more worried about piracy and we think used games are a whole other story. In fact, from our perspective you want to create a game that people will want to keep and keep playing for a long time," he continued. "That's the approach that we always take and that's the best way to avoid used games."

Regardless of where you come down in the debate over the relative evils of used videogames, I don't think anyone would argue that "make better games" is a better approach to cutting into the trade than a restrictive system of DRM. But will a permissive approach in a restrictive environment do anything to reverse the fortunes of the Wii U? That, as Miyamoto put it, is a whole other story.

Source: CVG

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Good to see that Nintendo isn't bothered with this whole used game thing as much like how Sony and Microsoft are. Now if only they'd make their consoles region free so then we could play the games that most of the time you never release outside of Japan or release to the rest of the world like 2 years later! >.<

Ubisoft, Sony, EA, now Nintendo, plus many other developers.... and Microsoft is being head strong about this.

It is kinda funny to see everyone jumping aboard the "No problem with Used Games" bandwagon now.

I still dont like Nintendo with the whole claiming everything on Youtube thing thought.

Proof that Nintendo is stuck in the past. They still treat their customers like people!
(Though Sony is getting a lot of love from me lately for not screwing everything up, good on them)

One more person with common sense. He not only dismissed the symptoms publishers are afraid of, but identified the real potential problem.

They really are two different beasts. While you don't gain money from used sales, that's still just one copy occasionally passed around. It still has to be originally bought. A game copier can flood the market with tons of cheaper copies. Instead of one official disc floating around between friends, etc.. you get an entire community who has no need to buy one from anybody ever.

Scribblesense:

(Though Sony is getting a lot of love from me lately for not screwing everything up, good on them)

Except, you know, making you pay extra to play games you already own.

I can imagine it's not an issue for the Wii U, they have to have games in the first place!

Oh Nintendo I need more Wii U games, I can't wait until next year for the best ones. I'm too impatient.

thethird0611:
Ubisoft, Sony, EA, now Nintendo, plus many other developers.... and Microsoft is being head strong about this.

Ubisoft and EA at least are just trying to get good PR. Whatever claims they may make about valuing used games are undermined by their concerted efforts over the years to stab the second-hand market in the heart.

OT: Not surprised by this. Nintendo is the only company whose consoles seemingly don't allow for DRM or online passes from publishers. Given how Nintendo games generally sell for much longer than other games, they seem to have the right approach: make games that people will keep buying and keep playing, even years after release.

Also, Miyamoto's latest video on Pikmin 3 is just adorable:

AAUAARGH! Don't attack my eye!

Neronium:
Good to see that Nintendo isn't bothered with this whole used game thing as much like how Sony and Microsoft are. Now if only they'd make their consoles region free so then we could play the games that most of the time you never release outside of Japan or release to the rest of the world like 2 years later! >.<

Mostly because Nintendo knows how to not let budgets run wild while most devs and pubs are blaming others for their own incompetence

thethird0611:
Ubisoft, Sony, EA, now Nintendo, plus many other developers.... and Microsoft is being head strong about this.

It is kinda funny to see everyone jumping aboard the "No problem with Used Games" bandwagon now.

I still dont like Nintendo with the whole claiming everything on Youtube thing thought.

Though funnily enough Let's Plays aren't allowed under the Youtube Partners EULA. So the ones actually in the wrong were the channels that tried to monetize their LP's in the first place

How to make used games a non-issue: Make games that are so awesome people don't want to sell them.

I am going to be so sad when this man finally retires.

Neronium:
Good to see that Nintendo isn't bothered with this whole used game thing as much like how Sony and Microsoft are. Now if only they'd make their consoles region free so then we could play the games that most of the time you never release outside of Japan or release to the rest of the world like 2 years later! >.<

If they were really concerned about pirates, those would be the issues they'd be addressing.

Microsoft's blood is in the water so everyone's marketing sharks go in for the kill...

See, this guy. This guy right here.

This guy gets it.

Thank you, Shigeru.

DVS BSTrD:

Neronium:
Good to see that Nintendo isn't bothered with this whole used game thing as much like how Sony and Microsoft are. Now if only they'd make their consoles region free so then we could play the games that most of the time you never release outside of Japan or release to the rest of the world like 2 years later! >.<

If they were really concerned about pirates, those would be the issues they'd be addressing.

Indeed, they just seem to have it "pirates are an issue...that is all."

Aiddon:
snip

Technically Let's Plays are allowed as long as they fall under the rules of the Fair Use Act of 1976. I've been LPing for quite a while and have only run into a few problems, but I won those disputes. Monetizing them without contracts from the companies themselves is actually not allowed.
As for how they practice, yeah Nintendo doesn't let their developers run wild with budgets and have them create new games that people will keep.

Neronium:
Good to see that Nintendo isn't bothered with this whole used game thing as much like how Sony and Microsoft are. Now if only they'd make their consoles region free so then we could play the games that most of the time you never release outside of Japan or release to the rest of the world like 2 years later! >.<

A million times this. I know that Nintendo have always been pretty cool about the whole used games thing but I really wish they'd stop region locking their devices. I'd love to be able to play both games that have an English release and the games they get that never make it out of Japan. I don't want to have to buy two consoles from two different regions to have access to the full library of games.

VanQ:

Neronium:
Good to see that Nintendo isn't bothered with this whole used game thing as much like how Sony and Microsoft are. Now if only they'd make their consoles region free so then we could play the games that most of the time you never release outside of Japan or release to the rest of the world like 2 years later! >.<

A million times this. I know that Nintendo have always been pretty cool about the whole used games thing but I really wish they'd stop region locking their devices. I'd love to be able to play both games that have an English release and the games they get that never make it out of Japan. I don't want to have to buy two consoles from two different regions to have access to the full library of games.

Aren't all of their handhelds region free? It's odd that they would ignore region locking in one half of their business but uphold it in another. They'd probably see a decent increase in sales if the west was able to buy Japanese-only games that are mysteriously not good enough for us.

OT: The vultures are circling the bloated corpse of Microsoft I see. Maybe the ghost of THQ will show up tomorrow, rattling chains and wailing about its stance on used games.

CriticalMiss:

Aren't all of their handhelds region free? It's odd that they would ignore region locking in one half of their business but uphold it in another. They'd probably see a decent increase in sales if the west was able to buy Japanese-only games that are mysteriously not good enough for us.

No, the 3DS is region locked and so was the Gameboy series. The only one that was not region locked was the brick Nintendo DS, which is the one I have. The original 3DS can still play some imported DS games however as I've played Jump Ultimate Stars on my 3DS. Nintendo's main reason for region locking is to "stop piracy", the other being if the game were banned in a country but I don't know of any Nintendo games that are banned, but that's obviously not working. Region locking is really archaic and doesn't do a good job at all. Sony dropped region locking on their consoles and handhelds and imports for those are really high. The other reason is so that it "protects Japanese profits" but that's not much in the long run if they never release the game. I can think of a slew of games on Nintendo consoles that I would import if I could.

In the past it was easier to break the region coding because the only difference were the edges on the cartridges so that when it would lock into place when play the NES/SNES/N64 it wouldn't come out. To bypass that you just needed to modify the cartridge slot so that Japanese cartridges would fit inside the system. For the Gamecube a soft mod disc called Freeloader would allow you to play Japanese Gamecube games on a NTSC or PAL Gamecube. They released the program for the Wii as well, but Nintendo patched it out with the 3.1 patch for the Wii. The Freeloader disc was discontinued as it was rendered useless and that's when the Homebrew mod started to come out more and more to break the region coding.

"In fact, from our perspective you want to create a game that people will want to keep and keep playing for a long time,"

Stop it, you're to good for this buisness.

Neronium:
The other reason is so that it "protects Japanese profits" but that's not much in the long run if they never release the game.

The R4 carts for the NDS are what stuffed up Nintendo's stance on region locking for everybody. Basically, they were designed abroad, and then brought over to the Japanese market, which was far less regulated out of... basically naivity. You could literally sell an R4 and wad of pirated games on the street down in Akiba. And people did. Before then, rampant piracy was basically unheard of in Japan. I remember at the time going months of commuting between seeing people playing legit games on the trains (playing a handheld on the train is very common outside of morning peak hour, and every last person would have the R4 slotted in). The government ended up stepping in and quickly passing some targetted laws forbidding the sales of the R4 device but it was too little too late, as the grace period on the law was long enough for most everyone to snap up an R4 cartridge and then download the titles from foreign sources.

Funny thing is, I can't see how region-locking could have ever prevented this, but either way, it appeared to directly lead to the paranoia over domestic sales you see today. If anyone else can chime in with an explanation, please do, but to me this still appears a knee-jerk reaction.

TK421:

Scribblesense:

(Though Sony is getting a lot of love from me lately for not screwing everything up, good on them)

Except, you know, making you pay extra to play games you already own.

Servers don't pay for themselves.

All the green doesn't go to the retailer when you buy a used game. Some of it covers what the retailer paid to the guy who sold it to them. All companies like gamestop do is facilitate our rights to sell the copyrighted products we own. That's all it is. Gamestop wouldn't exist if we didn't have the ability to sell our games.

By creating the games that we create and selling those games, it enables us to then create new versions of those games," he told CVG.

By creating games that we create... Did Google Translate fuckup somehow that it repeated itself?

And yes we know you keep making new versions of the same game.

Piracy and used games create pretty much the same problem, which is if your game isnt good enough to buy new, people get it other ways. If you are a publisher and you dislike one but not the other because of how it eats into profits, then that publisher is kinda stupid.

tdylan:

TK421:

Scribblesense:

(Though Sony is getting a lot of love from me lately for not screwing everything up, good on them)

Except, you know, making you pay extra to play games you already own.

Servers don't pay for themselves.

Pretty sure multiplayer on PC is free.

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:

thethird0611:
Ubisoft, Sony, EA, now Nintendo, plus many other developers.... and Microsoft is being head strong about this.

Ubisoft and EA at least are just trying to get good PR. Whatever claims they may make about valuing used games are undermined by their concerted efforts over the years to stab the second-hand market in the heart.

Except that this could be a major turn around point from Ubisoft and EA. The only thing that we see from them about used games is the things like Operation $10, which we see is gone from ALL systems, not just the Xbox. Since the Xbox is the only one with this new Used Game DRM, we can easily see its not just trying to get good PR.

So you know what bud? Lighten up, give the big guys a chance when they do something good.

thethird0611:

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:

thethird0611:
Ubisoft, Sony, EA, now Nintendo, plus many other developers.... and Microsoft is being head strong about this.

Ubisoft and EA at least are just trying to get good PR. Whatever claims they may make about valuing used games are undermined by their concerted efforts over the years to stab the second-hand market in the heart.

So you know what bud? Lighten up, give the big guys a chance when they do something good.

I would love to look at those companies straight in the eye and give them a second chance, except I can't see them through the enormous pile of shit they have created that has made me very cynical. It would take years of not being dicks in order to gain any sort of good will back.

Ubisoft has given PC gamers way too many middle fingers as well as EA. Ubisoft admittedly hasn't given console's many middle fingers but EA sure has.

It's just that simple: Create a game they don't want to sell. Make the game so much fun they have no reason to cash it in just to buy another one. Of course I'm the collector type (almost a hoarder at this point) I don't toss things unless it's broken. I finish a game it goes on the shelf. That in itself is a trophy for me. I don't need the medals or achievements to tell me what I've accomplished. I just look over at the shelf and know what I've done. Most sell their games once they've conquered it or just because they lack the funds for the newer shinier games coming out a minute later. Doesn't help that most games boast involved game play but only take 4-6hrs to plow through. Everyone wonders why I play RPGs, just more staying power than the usual FPS or Fighting game. Multiplayer isn't enough. Build something with staying power.

PunkRex:
"In fact, from our perspective you want to create a game that people will want to keep and keep playing for a long time,"

Stop it, you're to good for this buisness.

Yes, it's like Nintendo realizes what the point of games are. Though Nintendo also thinks long term and big picture rather than other companies who have memories and attention spans equivalent to that of a may fly's

Someone get Jim on this! Now! He's going to go to town on this one....

image

So Miyamoto is advocating the win-win scenario that engaging, fun games that people will want to keep forever will decrease used games sales?

Why has it taken this long for them to figure that out!?

kael013:
So Miyamoto is advocating the win-win scenario that engaging, fun games that people will want to keep forever will decrease used games sales?

Why has it taken this long for them to figure that out!?

I don't think Nintendo figured this out now so much as they live in their little bubble and all this shit with MS just made them go "Huh? That is a problem for others making games? Well here is how we always solved that problem." To me me Nintendo style games have always been about Huge amounts of replay value and trying to make games you just want to go back to.

kael013:
So Miyamoto is advocating the win-win scenario that engaging, fun games that people will want to keep forever will decrease used games sales?

Why has it taken this long for them to figure that out!?

Yeah, I'm pretty sure this was always nintendo's response when asked about used games.
"It's not a problem because people actually KEEP our games! lol"

kael013:
So Miyamoto is advocating the win-win scenario that engaging, fun games that people will want to keep forever will decrease used games sales?

Why has it taken this long for them to figure that out!?

This really isn't a new concept for Nintendo, they've always been like that if you really look at their games, though I think this is the first time they've actually said it publicly.

ether way, its words more devs need to live by

Here's my question: Why is piracy an issue for Nintendo? They more or less only make console games!

Eppy (Bored):
Here's my question: Why is piracy an issue for Nintendo? They more or less only make console games!

Piracy was a huge issue for the DS with R4 carts, and the homebrew scene on the Wii also allowed for a lot of gamers to pirate Wii games.

Eppy (Bored):
Here's my question: Why is piracy an issue for Nintendo? They more or less only make console games!

The wii was homebrewed and some unsavory individuals used the homebrew program to allow them to play burned discs. While it could be legitimately used for playing back up copies most people who used the program didn't use it for that reason.

Then there is the massive amount of rom sites online. While people will buy their retro game lineup on the virtual console many people will just use PC emulators. Though Nintendo hasn't taken any major action against roms for a long while.

Piracy plagues Nintendo quite a bit simply because they didn't make it too difficult to hack and manipulate their consoles. With the Wii all you needed to do was insert an SD card and run a program in order to homebrew it. Homebrew in itself is a positive thing that allows users to mod their wii games and add new programs, but some abused the freedom it gave them.

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