GSC: STALKER Too Hardcore for American Gamers

GSC Game World Public Relations Director Oleg Yavorsky says S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Shadow of Chernobyl failed to perform to expectations in North America because American gamers have trouble understanding eastern European games and gameplay.

In an interview with Eurogamer, Yavorsky said GSC Game World aims for audiences as broad as possible, but differences in "cultural mindsets" make their games less interesting and appealing to Americans and Asians than they are to Europeans.

"Most of our successful games were based on big historical elements, such as with Cossacks," he said. "Cossacks were pretty well known in Europe, so ultimately that game was more appealing to a European audience than to other audiences. I hear it discussed a lot that European games struggle to find an appeal in North America, for example, just because they're based on different settings and characters, with different stories being told."

Those cultural differences extend in attitudes toward core gameplay, Yavorsky added, suggesting the Russian and eastern European markets are far more receptive to unforgiving, "hardcore" games than those in North America. "Big companies always want you to make your game as easy as possible, so that any really non-intellectual person can play it," he said. "They want all sorts of tutorials to guide the player through, and this is something we've always been very resistant to."

"In our market we're used to having cheap games," Yavorsky continued. "That means all our audience play a lot of games and hence they're really hardcore about them - they want really challenging games, and they don't need to be guided through with basic explanations like, 'This is your gun; this is how you move.'"

"But then, everything, even up to the color spectrum and how bright your game is, can be an issue. It seems that to appeal to North America you need really flashy, bright games, and you can see that every eastern European game is very dark," he added. "In the end, I guess this just comes down to our culture and history - we're different people, and that's that."

GSC Game World is currently at work on S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Clear Sky, a prequel set one year prior to the events of S.T.A.L.K.E.R. that will offer improvements to the game's AI and interface, new weapons and monsters and large amounts of new territory to explore. The game is currently set for release at the end of August. Eurogamer's full interview with Oleg Yavorsky is available here.

Permalink

think thats being a bit unfair on our north american cousins across the pond. Wouldnt say his assessment is wrong though :-)

[quote=]

"Big companies always want you to make your game as easy as possible, so that any really non-intellectual person can play it," he said. "They want all sorts of tutorials to guide the player through, and this is something we've always been very resistant to."

"In our market we're used to having cheap games," Yavorsky continued. "That means all our audience play a lot of games and hence they're really hardcore about them - they want really challenging games, and they don't need to be guided through with basic explanations like, 'This is your gun; this is how you move.'"

"But then, everything, even up to the color spectrum and how bright your game is, can be an issue. It seems that to appeal to North America you need really flashy, bright games, and you can see that every eastern European game is very dark," he added. "In the end, I guess this just comes down to our culture and history - we're different people, and that's that."

[/quote]

So all he is really saying is that we US gamers(remember children, Canada is a little Europe and therefore vastly superior to the US in every way) are a bunch of retarded kiddies that need bright colors to counteract our ADD. That sure is a great way to win over the market your company is struggling in....

"But then, everything, even up to the color spectrum and how bright your game is, can be an issue. It seems that to appeal to North America you need really flashy, bright games, and you can see that every eastern European game is very dark," he added.

Not all American games are bright and flashy. In fact, most of the flashy ones seem to come from Japan. Most newish shooters (pretty much Doom 3 and later) are dark and dreary. There are of course exceptions to the rule, but it appears to me that American games are getting darker and grittier.

Russian and European game design is different. It just is, there's no getting around it. And thank god for that. There's no doubt that his statement about "flashy, bright games" is way too broad, but that's inevitable when you're speaking in generalities, which Yavorsky obviously was. Allowing for that, I think his points are perfectly valid; the American game industry has evolved over the past 20-some years to a point where "accessibility" is a priority. Long-time gamers will remember the days when it seemed like every developer's goal was to kick your ass with a game that was nigh-impossible to beat; in the current market, companies struggle to make sure games aren't too long or too hard for even the most hare-brained button-masher to finish.

STALKER isn't like that. It's not unforgivingly difficult but it's sure as hell not the easiest FPS you'll ever play either, and it's a goddamned monster in terms of sheer size. Even if you focus strictly on the main campaign, you're going to be playing a lot longer than you would with a "normal" FPS, and if you get wrapped up in side quests, factional progression, reading the reams of supporting information the game throws at you and so forth, you're in for a seriously long haul.

But it's a brilliant game. STALKER is far and away the finest FPS I've played in ages (and I've spazzed about it plenty of times previously, I know) and I attribute it primarily to the ambitious and unfettered attitudes toward design and development that non-American studios seem to possess. It stumbles in a number of places, but only because it sets its sights so high.

STALKER may be the biggest and best but GSC is far from the only Euro/Russian studio doing fantastic things right now. American gamers who don't pay attention are really missing out.

Well, I'm not gonna lie, STALKER was a huge buzz kill when I gave it a swing. That game was like getting dropped into Cormac McCarthy's 'The Road' minus the inspiring father-son relationship.

Hunh, interesting. Just hopped over to Gamespot to read the reviews, and difficulty or not I like the direction of incorporating some more open-ended aspects into the FPS experience. For just $20 there's not much to lose so I ordered up a copy. We'll see how it plays.

Dr. Evil:
I admit, I agree on everything Yavorsky said. Almost everything. Not everything that comes from the West is a flashy epilepsy-inducing digital Ritalin, though. There is a whole infinity of enjoyable games, but very few of them are FPS, to be honest.

I, as an (eastern) European gamer, expect a compelling story and a slightly unusual game setting before I cough up 10% of my monthly earnings for a single single game title. As heretic as it may sound, I would never play a game like Far Cry or Crysis, only to brag about how good it looks on my new Ati 3870. Beauty is skin deep, and I believe that video games are a form of art, or at least should be considered as such. And I like to consume my media as art. It doesn't matter will I play Half Life, read George R.R. Martin, listen to Type O Negative or watch No Country For Old Men, I expect to be entertained of course, but above that I expect to feel good about consuming my media on many different levels. I like my games to be well versed storytelling machines with immersive environments and nicely developed characters. With that said, I can only conclude that games like Stalker are made of pure, liquid, highly concentrated awesomeness.

And I completely agree with Yavorsky that the history, culture and a nation's mindset are crucial for a game market as a whole. When you combine a millennium long history of mutual hatreds, xenophobia and deeply rooted Byzantine mysticism with occasional wars to drench yourself in blood of thy neighbor, out of sheer spite and fun of it, you get a huge market that truly enjoys dark and gritty games.

The pretentiousness, its crushing me!

Dr. Evil:

TomNook:
The pretentiousness, its crushing me!

The stupidity! The retardedness! O tempora, o mores!

Retardedness?

I happen to be a red, white and blue American and I pretty agree with everything said here. Have you played Halo? How many American sites gave that sorry excuse for half a game perfect scores?

You know, I diagreed with everything he said (I live in the U.S.) but them I remembered that I have been playing european games (including S.T.A.L.K.E.R.) for over 5 years now and compleatly forgot what some of the U.S. games were like.

YES! I AM SO FUCKING STUPID! PLEASE SHINE BRIGHT LIGHTS IN MY FACE AND SPIN ME AROUND REALLY FAST!!

This is so untrue. I played through S.T.A.L.K.E.R. THREE TIMES. I love that game and it's open-ended gameplay. You can play it through in 8 hours or 80 hours. One of the best FPS I've ever played.

TomNook:

So all he is really saying is that we US gamers(remember children, Canada is a little Europe and therefore vastly superior to the US in every way) are a bunch of retarded kiddies that need bright colors to counteract our ADD. That sure is a great way to win over the market your company is struggling in....

No, he's just saying that American games like to appeal to a casual audience as well as hardcore gamers. Way to take him out of context...

It didn't do as well in the US because PC gaming just isn't as big as it used to be in the US. If they had released STALKER on the 360, they would have had much more success.

As much as I love STALKER, this guy is just making up ridiculous excuses to try and justify the poor sales. STALKER has much more in common with Western ideals and gameplay than some of the stuff that comes out of Japan and still sells well in America. Not to mention, most outlets gave STALKER a very good score over here. He just needs to learn that PC gaming just ain't what it used to be in America. PC gaming is still pretty popular in many European countries, so it's not very surprising that they saw greater success in Europe rather than in America.

I'm really finding it hard to see where the gameplay differences between the Eastern Europeans and Americans is at. STALKERs basic gameplay, shooting stuff, is extremely popular in America. FPS/RPGs have also done extremely well before in America (Deus Ex and System Shock 2). The whole "dark and frightening" FPS gameplay has been done plenty of times in America as well. Games with open-ended gameplay and broad open areas are also extremely popular in America (see Oblivion). The only real bit he has right is the difficultly differences.

In the end, he is trying to look for the roots to a problem in all the wrong places. If he wants an FPS to be met with considerable success in America, he needs to look into putting his games on the 360 or PS3. I'm a huge PC enthusiast and think that STALKER is one of the best FPS I have played in years, but it's abundantly clear what the real root of the problem is. Gaming in America is more "advanced" (I don't mean like superior or anything) than the Eastern European market is. The gaming market in America ten or twenty years ago used to be EXACTLY what the market is like in Eastern Europe right now: full of hardcore titles that used to kick your ass and thus only the most hardcore of gamers would play. However, our market has matured and expanded beyond ass-kicking titles to include games that anyone can pick up. If the gaming market in Eastern Europe grows, I fully expect that easier games will start to replace very difficult games.

This article fails to point out the fact that the consoletards would rather play a lame online game than use their brains playing a great game like STALKER, or ones with innovative gameplay like Crysis. I am not saying that American developers cannot creat great games, take a long look at Valve, they are the worlds top developer, but the problem here are the consoles and they way they are harming the gaming industry.

Well, alright, you think that American gamers want [insertwhathesaid], so the next game you make should have all those things if you want to sell in the American market. If you want more sales in a market, you'd best cater for them, not just slam your product down their throats.

stompy:
Well, alright, you think that American gamers want [insertwhathesaid], so the next game you make should have all those things if you want to sell in the American market. If you want more sales in a market, you'd best cater for them, not just slam your product down their throats.

the difficulty is catering for 2 markets, that want different games, with 1 game. Though personally I agree, European games tend to have a much darker atmosphere, and more immersive storyline (I said tend, not every game does this of course). Whereas games from America tend to be straight out first person shooters, point and kill without as much storyline (again there are quite a few exceptions). I'm actually going to take Assassin's Creed to make my point here (Yes I know it was developed in Canada), this is a game that actually manages to appeal to both markets, it has a great storyline and a lot of immersion and gameplay that can be picked up in an instant, and whereas I as a European player feels a little annoyed that the developer didn't think I could handle using more then 7 buttons on a keyboard, in the American market the game would probably do exceptionally well because it's so easy to pick up, of course that's part of the reason it's done well her in Europe as well, but look at the games targeting either market and generally you'll find more European orientated games are more difficult to pick up and play quickly.

I don't find this very suprisng.

Japanese games are incredibly different to western games in both story telling and animation. I'm pretty sure most of you can tell the differences between Japanese games and Western games so I wont list the differences in great detail but I will say that they are incredibley different.

I have not been able to play STALKER yet dude to a poor Quality Graphics card but I know that it is the sort of game I would enjoy. I am a huge fan of Fallout and Half life and in seems to be an awesome combination of the two but I am also a fan of Halo and CoD4.

I think saying that gamers only like either flashy games or dark games is completely wrong.

Dr. Evil:
I'm sorry Joeshie, but you managed to miss the point. If you imply that the consoles sales are poor in Eastern Europe, you are wrong. We may be poor in new Lexus models, but when it comes to gaming we were ready to beat each other mercilessly in front of the store that was the first to receive GTA IV. A friend of mine was unable to buy PS3 version of the game the very same day it was available, so he had decided to avoid paying bills for a couple of months, and got himself an XBOX and the game. Besides, the first couple of days of it's release you couldn't buy GTA IV for less then 110 euros, or 170 U$D. The only thing that is stalling the console sales in EE right now would be the price. Market saturation depends on the price.

I wasn't suggesting that console sales are poor in Eastern Europe, but that they aren't nearly as big a force as they are in America. Likewise, Europe still has a very strong PC presence in comparison to the US, which is mostly likely why it preformed better in Europe than it did in America.

My point was to say that STALKER could have sold well in America if it had been released on either the PS3 or the 360, which sees considerably better sales in software than PC does.

Dr. Evil:
Furthermore, you can't really compare Oblivion to Stalker now, can you? Stalker is a FPS, with very little RPG in it, unless you count the armor statistics and anti-radiation vodka as RPG.

My comparison to Oblivion was more along the lines of having large open areas to explore. Americans love having freedom and having plenty of room to explore, which is one of the elements that makes STALKER stand out from most modern FPS. This guy continued to paint the VERY false picture that there are significant gameplay differences between STALKER and what America wants. The fact of the matter is that there are many games with gameplay styles just like what STALKER offers that do just fine in America.

Dr. Evil:
Besides, for every gem like Deus Ex and System Shock 2, there are hundreds of piece of shit titles like Turning point: fall of liberty or America's army. I think that's more like what Yavorsky wanted to say.

Then that point is completely irrelevant to the discussion at hand. We are discussing why STALKER sold so poorly in the States, not how much crap gets released over here.

FYI, Turning Point: Fall of Liberty sold like shit over here and America's Army is an old online game. Even IF these games sold well, it has no bearing as to why STALKER didn't sell well over here.

Dr. Evil:
I'd really like to see someone dig up the info about Stalker sales in Eastern Europe compared to... say... Gears of War (don't get me wrong, I didn't play the GoW, must be because never got interested in the first place after seeing the screenshots; I might like it). Some nice statistics might prove Yavorsky completely right. In the end, it is all about the culture and mindset, no matter how strange you think it is. Americans like more casual games and easy ones, straightforward and not too mind boggling. No wonder that all the best American studios end up sucking a fat one, the very same moment they decide to make a good game or try out something new, despite their publisher's wishes. That's how Black Isle Studios ended up, and Troika Games, eventually. Mark my words, folks: as soon as EA gets a huge hard on, Bioware will start developing Nascar simracing sequels.

I know this may be hard for you to understand, but an easier game doesn't automatically mean it's a bad game and a hard game doesn't automatically mean that it's a good game. It's also not fair of you to just completely blanket cover all of America and say that all of us want casual games. If people only wanted casual games in America, then Bioshock wouldn't have sold so well. Or Mass Effect. Or the Orange Box. Or Call of Duty 4.

Yes, there are differences between Eastern Europe and America game design, but the similiarites FAR outweight the differences. I think both you and Yavorsky both need to understand that it was releasing STALKER on a platform with a smaller audience that caused the poor STALKER sales in America, rather than the small cultural differences.

I can't really disagree with the article, but I don't think that you can really say that one whole culture is more hardcore than another, but I see that European gamers and North American gamers(even in Mexico) have very different definition of hardcore. It seems the hardcore in America is RPGs lately(FPS too), But it makes you wonder what with all the different servers and what not out there, how much do the two gamer cultures mesh? I would say a fair amount, but I will see what others here say.

Joeshi, I think you're on the right track in refuting the claim that Americans are less tolerant of more hardcore games. However, that article overall concentrated more on the cultural differences between eastern Europe and America, and how they tend to like darker games with a more serious theme, which is definitely true. American games have been attempting to portray themselves this way lately, but very few actually do. Take Gears of War, with its aggressively dark and grittily desaturated visuals - yet that is just the stylistic presentation. The game itself doesn't address any serious themes or ideas, and the over-the-top action and gore-filled gameplay place it squarely in the realm of traditional American sci-fi shooters.

I know talking about cultural differences between America and Europe can seem a little bit silly since most of us are descended from Europeans and we share a fair amount of the same media, but that kind of thing should not be underestimated, and I am definitely with Malygris in being thankful for that. For example.... American developers like action-adventure, but something like Beyond Good and Evil with its quirky visual style doesn't really fit with our culture. This is not true of all games or all Americans, but overall it's true enough to cause the observable differences between our games and the ones from across the pond.

I loved STALKER, but it is definitely true about some games and genres do better in some regions more than others. Not exactly groundbreaking what he is saying.

Joeshie:
Yes, there are differences between Eastern Europe and America game design, but the similiarites FAR outweight the differences. I think both you and Yavorsky both need to understand that it was releasing STALKER on a platform with a smaller audience that caused the poor STALKER sales in America, rather than the small cultural differences.

You don't think Yavorsky is smart enough to implicitly account for the PC-exclusive nature of STALKER in his comments?

Beyond the fact that they both involve guns and monsters, STALKER is significantly dissimilar to major American FPS releases over the past few years. It's also a weird-looking shooter made by a company nobody's ever heard of, and as a couple million Madden NFL 08 owners will tell you, the mainstream American game audience isn't big on experimenting with new and exotic things. It's impossible to attribute STALKER's failure to become a major hit to one particular reason, but those cited by Yavorsky are very valid.

TomNook:
[quote=]

"Big companies always want you to make your game as easy as possible, so that any really non-intellectual person can play it," he said. "They want all sorts of tutorials to guide the player through, and this is something we've always been very resistant to."

"In our market we're used to having cheap games," Yavorsky continued. "That means all our audience play a lot of games and hence they're really hardcore about them - they want really challenging games, and they don't need to be guided through with basic explanations like, 'This is your gun; this is how you move.'"

"But then, everything, even up to the color spectrum and how bright your game is, can be an issue. It seems that to appeal to North America you need really flashy, bright games, and you can see that every eastern European game is very dark," he added. "In the end, I guess this just comes down to our culture and history - we're different people, and that's that."

[/quote]

So all he is really saying is that we US gamers(remember children, Canada is a little Europe and therefore vastly superior to the US in every way) are a bunch of retarded kiddies that need bright colors to counteract our ADD. That sure is a great way to win over the market your company is struggling in....

And the strange appeal of the Halo series which, baring the first as the technology didn't really exist at the time, are little more than programs to make your television puke bloom at you?

Malygris:
Beyond the fact that they both involve guns and monsters, STALKER is significantly dissimilar to major American FPS releases over the past few years. It's also a weird-looking shooter made by a company nobody's ever heard of, and as a couple million Madden NFL 08 owners will tell you, the mainstream American game audience isn't big on experimenting with new and exotic things. It's impossible to attribute STALKER's failure to become a major hit to one particular reason, but those cited by Yavorsky are very valid.

Is it really that different? You look at Bioshock which had a very unique setting with a very similar atmosphere, but still managed to be a big seller. I would hardly call it a "new and exotic" shooter either. It looks and plays like most other FPS games made nowadays: without any color and strong attempts at realism.

Sure, mainstream gamers didn't purchase STALKER. Was it because it was too "foreign" and different for their tastes? Nope. It was because most mainstream gamers A) didn't have a good enough PC to play the game (even my decent gaming rig at the time of it's release had a hard time chugging through it) and B) because none of them had ever even heard of the game.

Everyone keeps saying it's different than most modern FPS games, but I keep pointing to many successful FPS games that share much in common with STALKER. The fact of the matter is that STALKER was not successful in the US because people either didn't know about it or have access to it. It didn't matter how similar or different it was from American FPS games because it was bound to sell poorly right from the beginning. If they had wanted STALKER to preform well then they should have put some sort of marketing campaign behind it (I'm pretty in the know with gaming news and releases and I only found out about it from some screenshot on 4chan) and placed it on a console.

Could you guys just leave Halo alone for now? The goddamn game is 7 years old so why not start bashing the original Doom as well?

Maybe jump onto some new games like CoD4 or Gears?

As for S.T.A.L.K.E.R.,the game is buggy,the AI is retarded,the loading times are huge,randomly spawning bandits keep killin me and taking over areas I helped capturing,you can instantly complete a quest because your target was killed by somebody else and you can lose the game/quest because a vital character walked into an anomaly.

And although it's still one of the best games I've ever played, I reckon that average Madden-playing Console-tards(coincidentally, 95% of them are American) wouldn't have the balls to put up with this kind of shit.

I understand Yavorsky is commenting on cultural differences between two different gaming niches, but I hardly find generalization to be an adequate approach to a problem.

Most European games are grittier when compared to American games, but the most important factor is taking into account what kind gamer will be playing your game. I enjoy shooter and I also enjoy RPGs, nothing fascinates me more than a good narrative. I have played STALKER and I enjoyed it every much, but I sadly lack the time to explore all of the game and finish it (similar situation to Oblivion). Therefore it is important to take into account if there are American gamers that enjoy the genre as much European ones.

Another issue is blaming accessibility as a mere "difference". It is an important factor and although some players may value it more than others it might imply into game-design flaws.

Last but not least, he doesn't mention how bad sales were in the US (I'm Brazilian for the record), so it is pretty hard to evaluate whether this "thematic" difference corresponds as well as he says.

He may be right, but I can't shake the feeling that his comments sound as if they had made the right design decision and the American gamers are the wrong. I'm not taking sides, just hinting that he might be being to harsh on what is a fragile topic.