Assassin's Creed 2 Set During French Revolution?

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Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Yep, they spoke English in Jerusalem whenever the original was set, but in this game they will speak the native language..

TGLT:

Sennz0r:

rossatdi:

Sennz0r:

Are they single-shot rifles with the accuracy of that time? Sure I'll take you on.

Okay, okay. Lets adjust for training and cost of equipment. Where do you get off calling early modern European warfare unmanly? It's not like knights and samurai were particularly 'manly' in that they basically just rode around killing poorly armoured peasants. And if anyone starts any bullshit about "samurai don't ride horses" I'll kneecap them.

Cost of one samurai: a life time of training, discipline and very expensive weapons.
Cost of one musketeer: 3 bob and a few weekends practising at the range.

In fact, warfare isn't manly, its horrible, bloody and always ends in death. And I'm joining the army sometime soon!

Anyway, wasn't this thread about the setting? I think revolutionary France would be a pretty awesome one.

Yes, samurai once rode around on horses cutting off heads of peasants. It was cruel, it was horrible.

But, as you said, these people also made fighting their life. The Samurai developed codes of honour, became extremely traditional. They actually did fight for their honour, souls and homes.
I can't really say a musketeer who spent 6 days at bootcamp has the same values as Samurai. Apart from the occasional patriot most of these people were drafted forcibly, thus making them unmotivated soldiers. It's not the effectiveness of the numbers and equipment I respect here. It's the devotion and drive of the people who choose to live in this way.

These same Samurai who would regularly kill insolent peasants and even Asian historians say were pretty regularly no better than tyrants or bandits? Kind of like the Knights developed a code of chivalry and then only applied it to knights. People with power like that in that time period were dicks.

EDIT: Scratch that, people with that kind of unquestionable power period are dicks.

When they developed these codes they didn't kill innocent peasants anymore. So yeah at fist they were no better than savages but they developed.

D_987:

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Yep, they spoke English in Jerusalem whenever the original was set, but in this game they will speak the native language..

I don't like French....

Sennz0r:

TGLT:

Sennz0r:

rossatdi:

Sennz0r:

Are they single-shot rifles with the accuracy of that time? Sure I'll take you on.

Okay, okay. Lets adjust for training and cost of equipment. Where do you get off calling early modern European warfare unmanly? It's not like knights and samurai were particularly 'manly' in that they basically just rode around killing poorly armoured peasants. And if anyone starts any bullshit about "samurai don't ride horses" I'll kneecap them.

Cost of one samurai: a life time of training, discipline and very expensive weapons.
Cost of one musketeer: 3 bob and a few weekends practising at the range.

In fact, warfare isn't manly, its horrible, bloody and always ends in death. And I'm joining the army sometime soon!

Anyway, wasn't this thread about the setting? I think revolutionary France would be a pretty awesome one.

Yes, samurai once rode around on horses cutting off heads of peasants. It was cruel, it was horrible.

But, as you said, these people also made fighting their life. The Samurai developed codes of honour, became extremely traditional. They actually did fight for their honour, souls and homes.
I can't really say a musketeer who spent 6 days at bootcamp has the same values as Samurai. Apart from the occasional patriot most of these people were drafted forcibly, thus making them unmotivated soldiers. It's not the effectiveness of the numbers and equipment I respect here. It's the devotion and drive of the people who choose to live in this way.

These same Samurai who would regularly kill insolent peasants and even Asian historians say were pretty regularly no better than tyrants or bandits? Kind of like the Knights developed a code of chivalry and then only applied it to knights. People with power like that in that time period were dicks.

EDIT: Scratch that, people with that kind of unquestionable power period are dicks.

When they developed these codes they didn't kill innocent peasants anymore. So yeah at fist they were no better than savages but they developed.

The code of Bushido, much like the code of Chivalry, stopped nothing. Samurai are not super human saints. They were people with a lot of power and weapons. They were in fact usually the ONLY people with weapons that weren't mildly modified farming tools.

There's a reason peasants had to learn to fight with farming implements.

Actually French Revolution sounds amazing. Sure China would be interesting, but I definitely give Ubisoft Montreal for picking a event and time that isn't very well explored by video games.

Sennz0r:

D_987:

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Yep, they spoke English in Jerusalem whenever the original was set, but in this game they will speak the native language..

I don't like French....

That was my way of letting you know hat I'm sure the game will be in English - if they spoke English in Jerusalem, why would they suddenly decide to make the characters talk in their native language? Even Ubisoft (who, incidentally are French) arn't that stupid.

D_987:

Sennz0r:

D_987:

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Yep, they spoke English in Jerusalem whenever the original was set, but in this game they will speak the native language..

I don't like French....

That was my way of letting you know hat I'm sure the game will be in English - if they spoke English in Jerusalem, why would they suddenly decide to make the characters talk in their native language? Even Ubisoft (who, incidentally are French) arn't that stupid.

They might be :)

gigastrike:
France, eh? This is surprising.

Why? Ubisoft is French...

And well, I'd personally prefer a Feudal Japan time, -BUT- I'm well aware the samurai/ninja thing has been done to death and back... So maybe this might be interesting. After all, the only rifles that existed at the time were exceptionally slow shooting, often more so than a trainer archer, so the addition of these types of guns shouldn't affect the melee-based-assassinations at all...

...I hope.

Sennz0r:
Ugh,, I can't say I share your enthusiasm on that one Pedro...
I was already moaning when I saw Fable 2 included rifles. Now imagine that plus the French (which I don't like too much anyways, nothing personal), the clothes they wore at that time and the pansy weapons they had to go with it.

I wish they'd go back in time for the sequel for a change. Set it in feudal Japan or ancient China. Somewhere where the civilisations at war at the time fought real battles with real warriors and real weapons. Not with tights and cannons and guns...

Sounds more like irrational prejudice to me. Seems like you would prefer "Marcus Fenix" as the main character or something.

ElArabDeMagnifico:

Sennz0r:
Ugh,, I can't say I share your enthusiasm on that one Pedro...
I was already moaning when I saw Fable 2 included rifles. Now imagine that plus the French (which I don't like too much anyways, nothing personal), the clothes they wore at that time and the pansy weapons they had to go with it.

I wish they'd go back in time for the sequel for a change. Set it in feudal Japan or ancient China. Somewhere where the civilisations at war at the time fought real battles with real warriors and real weapons. Not with tights and cannons and guns...

Sounds more like irrational prejudice to me. Seems like you would prefer "Marcus Fenix" as the main character or something.

Maybe it's irrational and it's most certainly stereotypical, but if I wanted Assassin's Creed 2 to be like Gears of War I'd say "why won't they make a game like Gears of WAR?" *yada yada yada fanboy blabbering ensues. No. I would've prefered it to be around a society that has a code, honour. And for me this happens to be a civilisation famed for its prowess in martial arts and ways of the sword. Not gunplay.
I actually have no love for the gun age, hence my disappointment when I found out Fable 2 kicked out my lovely bow and replaced them with guns, and at the same time was completely overjoyed when I heard Mirror's Edge could be finished without firing a single shot. However I am no hypocrite, I do play shooters, and enjoy a number of them. However I prefer melee combat and primitive ranged weapons far above firearms. I find them more a sign of valour and skill, as opposed to firearms, which are used by the ones who need more power than they are physically capable of creating.

Well this sounds a lot like survival of the fittest doesn't it :)
Let's just keep this within games, please, and most of all within the topic of warfare. Don't go and transfer this into everyday life.

I personally doubt that Revolutionary France is the best setting for an Assassin's Creed sequel... and that's not just because of the idiot "French-bashing troglodyte" demographic in the US making it a tough setting to market. You'd need to do some serious tap-dancing to make the Hashashin have any significance in 18th century Paris... so the title itself will be a bit awkward, or you run the risk of ending up with another stereotypical "conspiracy group" in your plot.

I think turn-of-the-19th century Europe in general is a good and unexplored setting for games, myself; just not really a good place to set a sequel to a game set in 12th century Jerusalem.

-- Steve

PedroSteckecilo:
I hope this rumor is true, I would LOVE to play a game set during the French Revolution, especially if it's during the "reign of terror" period. Also, Flintlocks and Rapiers.

Rapiers? Hell, I'm in despite my loathing for the original AC.

I thought it would be set somewhere in Japan, considering all the Asian clues they gave you at the end of the game.

Meh, this is a pleasant surprise in the full extent of the word. I wasn't going to play it if it was another damn ninja/samurai game.

Ace of Spades:
If I get to run up and assassinate Robespierre in High Profile, I will be very very happy.

You should be able to at least make the shot that shatters his jaw.

It would be neat if it were set in Sparta.

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

I find this statement a little confusing. If you're in their country, surely it's you who should make the effort to speak their language? Maybe I misunderstand what you're saying, but that just seems moronic to me.

This could be very entertaining. Not only could it easily outline some diverse charaters to kill, without some stpid conspiracy behind it, but it might also make some interesting missions - perhaps saving a man from the Guillotine as the blade is falling.

the rusk:

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

I find this statement a little confusing. If you're in their country, surely it's you who should make the effort to speak their language? Maybe I misunderstand what you're saying, but that just seems moronic to me.

I was only there for five days, and although I do speak a little French, it's a tourist town. I came across more foreigners than actual Parish people over there, sure they cater to these people who also have only a minimal grasp of the French language. When you're city is a tourist attraction, I think you should do a little effort to the person who is in need of your help to make yourself understandable. It's common decency. This guy just mouthed something in French, stood there, and walked away when I asked him what he just said.
I live close to the German border so quite a number of Germans come into the store where I work. When they ask me something in German, am I not supposed to help them instead of demanding they learn Dutch before they ask me something? Same thing with tourists.

This only happens to me in France and the French part of Belgium, mind you. The rest of the countries I visit try their best (sign language, couple words in English) to just communicate with me. It's just that a lot of French people are too 'proud of their country' to speak any other language besides French.

Pray to The Light they won't re-use the infinitely flow-breaking sin of having a dude sitting in a genetic memory machine causing "glitches" in the graphics perpetually.

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Maybe they, you know, don't know a language they have never been taught and will probably never have to speak.

Indigo_Dingo:

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Maybe they, you know, don't know a language they have never been taught and will probably never have to speak.

People in Paris never hear or speak English? YEs that might be true for a part of the population as this is the case in any country but that sounds highly unlikely, especially in such a city.
And even then they could have the decency to just make it known they don't understand what I'm saying instead of just saying something back to me in the fastest French I've ever heard. Didn't understand it but I'm pretty sure by is intonation he was calling me names.

Sennz0r:
Well I know about the setting, and I like the game, but I still can't get the picture of overly decorative castles, gardens, tights and silly piano music out of my head.
I'm sure you'll start out somewhere in the slums or something between the beggars and whores but to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Are you fucking joking?

The revolutionary events almost entirely took place in Paris, which was filthy, overcrowded, violent, and starving - that's WHY there was a revolution. The only 'decorative castles and gardens and silly tights' would be the minority of nobles sitting around in Versailles or the Tuileries, or Jacques Trop-d'Argent sitting in his chateau which was promptly torched by angry serfs intent on erasing the manorial records that kept them practically enslaved.

Stereotypical views on time period does not understanding of the setting make.

Sennz0r:
I was only there for five days, and although I do speak a little French, it's a tourist town. I came across more foreigners than actual Parish people over there, sure they cater to these people who also have only a minimal grasp of the French language. When you're city is a tourist attraction, I think you should do a little effort to the person who is in need of your help to make yourself understandable. It's common decency. This guy just mouthed something in French, stood there, and walked away when I asked him what he just said.
I live close to the German border so quite a number of Germans come into the store where I work. When they ask me something in German, am I not supposed to help them instead of demanding they learn Dutch before they ask me something? Same thing with tourists.

This only happens to me in France and the French part of Belgium, mind you. The rest of the countries I visit try their best (sign language, couple words in English) to just communicate with me. It's just that a lot of French people are too 'proud of their country' to speak any other language besides French.

The French are infamously picky about their language, and you think they're jerks for it; therefore, the French Revolution is a bad setting for the next Assassin's Creed.

Sorry, but it doesn't pass the giggle test.

And just for reference, armies at that time weren't 'unmanly' and reliant on 'wimpy' guns. They were successful because of drilling, rather like the Romans.

That would be an awesome idea, and extremely original. How many other games have used that setting? As far as I know, NONE.

Sennz0r:

Indigo_Dingo:

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Maybe they, you know, don't know a language they have never been taught and will probably never have to speak.

People in Paris never hear or speak English? YEs that might be true for a part of the population as this is the case in any country but that sounds highly unlikely, especially in such a city.
And even then they could have the decency to just make it known they don't understand what I'm saying instead of just saying something back to me in the fastest French I've ever heard. Didn't understand it but I'm pretty sure by is intonation he was calling me names.

Or he was saying "I'm sorry, I don't speak english". You know, one of the two.

Sennz0r:
And even then they could have the decency to just make it known they don't understand what I'm saying instead of just saying something back to me in the fastest French I've ever heard. Didn't understand it but I'm pretty sure by is intonation he was calling me names.

Heaven forfend, I can't imagine why... *eyeroll*

-- Steve

*sigh* I miss Paris, oddly the only mean person I ran into in France was a particularly grumpy transit official, and I'm pretty sure he was unpleasant because he was a transit official, not because he was French.

Sennz0r:
(again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

I lol'd. and I really hope you aren't serious.

Saevus:
Are you fucking joking?

Well no I'm not joking. It's excactly my point that in my MIND when I see something being depicted in that time I see posh castles and people in tights with funny piano music.

I mean seriously, what's the first thing that crosses your mind when you hear the word French? And don't tell my it's nothing stereotypical. Only a French citizen would have no stereotypes in his mind on hearing that word. Same for every other country. I'm sorry it's the first thing I thought of, and it didn't appeal to me.

I damn well know there wasn't a revolution because everyone was living happily and hygenically in their 20 room castles. I also acknowledged I knew about the poverty and the slums. It's just not the first thing I think of when I hear "France around 1700'.

Also, this:

The French are infamously picky about their language, and you think they're jerks for it; therefore, the French Revolution is a bad setting for the next Assassin's Creed.

Is NOT my argument. It was me elaborating on how a couple French people made my holiday that much more difficult because they refused to help me out, thus me having a general dislike for them.

Please quote me when I said it wasn't a good idea to have Assassin's Creed take place in France during the Revolution. I was merely voicing my opinion, why I would have prefered it would take place somewhere else. Why I'm not jumping through hoops out of glee at hearing this rumour. It might be the most brilliant setting ever, it just doesn't sound that great in my ears.

Indigo_Dingo:

Sennz0r:

Indigo_Dingo:

Sennz0r:
to my annoyance they will be French as well (again, nothing personal, most of them are just too damn arrogant to speak a couple words English when you need to find your way in EFFIN PARIS).

Maybe they, you know, don't know a language they have never been taught and will probably never have to speak.

People in Paris never hear or speak English? YEs that might be true for a part of the population as this is the case in any country but that sounds highly unlikely, especially in such a city.
And even then they could have the decency to just make it known they don't understand what I'm saying instead of just saying something back to me in the fastest French I've ever heard. Didn't understand it but I'm pretty sure by is intonation he was calling me names.

Or he was saying "I'm sorry, I don't speak english". You know, one of the two.

Could be, but I'm pretty sure I would've understood the word "Anglais" when it was said by that person.

Anton P. Nym:

Heaven forfend, I can't imagine why... *eyeroll*

-- Steve

Your sarcasm is evident, sir, and lightly out of place since you were not there.

Anyway I'm not here to discuss my - to you rediculous - prejudice towards certain people.
Can we please get back on topic?

PedroSteckecilo:
I hope this rumor is true, I would LOVE to play a game set during the French Revolution, especially if it's during the "reign of terror" period. Also, Flintlocks and Rapiers.

I second that. Fuck yeah.

TheCheesy4:
It would be neat if it were set in Sparta.

Don't even start....

And as for the game, I think it'd be very....interesting....to see a game set in that particular time period. I don't know whether we'd be controlling Altair or one of his descendants, but I do know that I will be very upset if AC2 doesn't clear up some of the many mysteries introduced by the first game.

*cough*PieceOfEden*cough*

Sennz0r:
I revise that statement, they did make firearms. I apologise.

However one thing I will stand firm on: The Cinese - just like the Japanese - didn't fight like wimps. Even with the introdustion of firearms large groups (e.g. Samurai) still didn't use them, and stayed true to their traditions. And kicked ass at it too.

No they did not kick ass, they all died for bringing a shitty sword to a gunfight.

Sennz0r:
It might be the most brilliant setting ever, it just doesn't sound that great in my ears.

For entirely personal reasons that amount to little more than some bad personal experience and stereotypes entrenched in your mind - that's the evidence that you've given.

When I hear French the first thing I think of is a language, the second thing I think of is classes in that language, and the third thing I think of is Paris (mental images of Notre Dame de Paris and bakeries, primarily). Some people think of cuisine and alcohol. Some people think of mustached dudes in berets riding around on bikes and playing accordions. Some people think of frogs. I fail to see how there are more stereotypes surrounding 'French' than 'Arabic', and your suggestions of 'ancient China' and 'feudal Japan' carry even more stereotypes and connotative baggage.

Have you said "This is bad and will be detrimental to the game"? Nope. Have you implied it? Everywhere.

TomNook:

Sennz0r:
I revise that statement, they did make firearms. I apologise.

However one thing I will stand firm on: The Cinese - just like the Japanese - didn't fight like wimps. Even with the introdustion of firearms large groups (e.g. Samurai) still didn't use them, and stayed true to their traditions. And kicked ass at it too.

No they did not kick ass, they all died for bringing a shitty sword to a gunfight.

I lol'd. "It is dishonourable!" is always the excuse of a noble-military class when they're confronted with a weapon that lets anyone fight and thus threatens their power.

TomNook:

Sennz0r:
I revise that statement, they did make firearms. I apologise.

However one thing I will stand firm on: The Cinese - just like the Japanese - didn't fight like wimps. Even with the introdustion of firearms large groups (e.g. Samurai) still didn't use them, and stayed true to their traditions. And kicked ass at it too.

No they did not kick ass, they all died for bringing a shitty sword to a gunfight.

I wouldn't call the Katana a shitty sword, it was perfect for its purpose...

Which was you know, duels and killing unarmed/unarmoured peasants.

PedroSteckecilo:

TomNook:

Sennz0r:
I revise that statement, they did make firearms. I apologise.

However one thing I will stand firm on: The Cinese - just like the Japanese - didn't fight like wimps. Even with the introdustion of firearms large groups (e.g. Samurai) still didn't use them, and stayed true to their traditions. And kicked ass at it too.

No they did not kick ass, they all died for bringing a shitty sword to a gunfight.

I wouldn't call the Katana a shitty sword, it was perfect for its purpose...

Which was you know, duels and killing unarmed/unarmoured peasants.

Against a guy with a rifle it wasn't a very good weapon is all I'm saying.

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