Lightning Returns Blends Final Fantasy With Dark Souls

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I don't mind the change to the combat and the lack of turn based combat. What I don't care for is the constant push towards only one character. I play Final Fantasy games for the character interaction and development, and the side questing for hours. I like having a party of multiple characters with a ton of side content to explore. Final Fantasy is not a single person adventure, it's an adventure of multiple characters.

So far they haven't been able to get their heads on straight with any of the Final Fantasy XIII titles. The first was linear as hell and tunneled you to the damn end and had an extreme lack of side quests that Final Fantasy is so good at and known for. The 2nd dropped you down to 2 characters and consolation prized in a monster for a 3rd party member, while having a story that was half-assed.

Now this one comes off as "You gotta rush through it!" and gives you only Lightning.

I'm not confident about the story in this game, but the stories in ALL the FF games were pretty bad. Even the good ones. The gameplay looks pretty interesting though, and I'm not too proud to admit that I loved FFXIII-2 for some reason, so I'll definitely be getting this.

The7Sins:
If it does not have turn based combat then it is a shit Final Fantasy game. Will not get. Thanks for making my decision easy Square.

Have you played final fantasy crisis core? It's got a (In my opinion, obviously) great story, staples of final fantasy like summons, magic and attack skills (Jump etc.) It isn't turn based and I actually really enjoy the change in pace from my normal FF games. Admittedly, I've massively overdone the side missions so I now 3-shot bosses in the storyline, but hey.

The story is probably going to suck (considering how much worse it got in FFXIII-2, something i never thought possible) but the gameplay sounds interesting. I love games that are built around a concept of time managment (like Pikmin and Dead Rising) and a Dark Souls inspired combat system could be very interesting.

Iīm probably going to buy it, atleast itīs more interesting than most other AAA games out there, atleast they try to do something with the gameplay instead of just focussing all their energy on story.

schtingah:
But I like Final Fanatasy -because- of its turn-based combat :(.

Oh well, here's hoping they can make it work but colour me pessimistic.

Me too, exactly this. Every game gets further away from the template that actually made the games good (in my opinion). I used rush to my PS3 owning mate's house on Final Fantasy release days and we'd hole up there for a weekend just hammering through them. I don't think he even bothered to buy the last one.

rosac:
Admittedly, I've massively overdone the side missions so I now 3-shot bosses in the storyline, but hey.

Being massively overpowered is the sign of someone really enjoying their FF! I think I could max the party in VII with my eyes closed now, maybe have to open them for the weapons. :)

Sorry if this is off the point but if we are going to bang out repeated sequels of a specific Final Fantasy's could it not have been 6,7,8 or 9, you know, the good ones?? I really hated all the characters in 13, particularly that Vanille one. It was like she had some sort of mental disorder and was disconnected from reality. Maybe that actually goes somewhere, I wouldnt know, I almost died of boredom by the third disc and stopped playing. Which brings me back to the point, sequels of the good FF's would be nice.

Last few FF's have been a bit flat so even though it may not be super original if its borrow is too obvious, i'd let it slide if breaths new life into the game.

Now I wish this was on the PC.

Hixy:
Sorry if this is off the point but if we are going to bang out repeated sequels of a specific Final Fantasy's could it not have been 6,7,8 or 9, you know, the good ones?? I really hated all the characters in 13, particularly that Vanille one. It was like she had some sort of mental disorder and was disconnected from reality. Maybe that actually goes somewhere, I wouldnt know, I almost died of boredom by the third disc and stopped playing. Which brings me back to the point, sequels of the good FF's would be nice.

To be fair, Vanille is gone in FFXIII-2, as far is i know (havenīt played that many hours yet), actually the entire cast seem to be different from FFXIII.

The new characters arenīt that great though, i think Sazh is the only character i liked in that game. And maybe Fang, but she was kinda forgetable.

Realtime combat AND a time limit? The two things I dislike most about RPGs. I think I'm going to die from not-excitement.

On the one hand, this sounds like something I could enjoy playing.

On the other hand, so did Dirge of Cerberus before it actually got released...

Zeriah:
Count me in as interested with the Action combat. I have not enjoyed the turn based combat in FF games since FFX and it is good they are changing it up a bit, but if we still have to go into a new 'battle zone' or whatever you call it whenever you fight something, then no thanks.

Same to the letter. This has actually got me curious despite not liking the series at all since FF10 (well, FF10-2 if you include the combat mechanics that I actually really liked). However, I love Dark Souls so I'm incredibly interested in this.

Dr.Awkward:
Dear Square Enix:

I'm pretty sure the reason people played Final Fantasy was for the story and interesting characters, and not for the gameplay. I mean, really, who cares about how combat if it can be easily broken and doesn't scale with your progression - People just want a fantastic story and deep, interesting characters to come first, dammit!

Agreed. SquareEnix should make anime instead of games.

likalaruku:
I'm sick of innovation with this franchise. I'd be happy if they were still doing 2D dropdown RPGmaker-style games & focusing more on telling a story with compelling characters & less of fighting mechanics.

It must be sad for SquareEnix when fans of your "games" want you to get rid of the "game" part.

I'll just point out that the limited inventory thing has been done well in the past, by Square no less, in Parasite Eve 1.

(now there's a game I wish would get a remake...)

This is the first time I've been genuinely interested in a Final Fantasy game. O_o Their pretty hallway simulators were never that interesting to me. I like JRPGs, but FF is a bad representative of the genre. Suikoden, SMT, and the Xeno- games are all superior. Also, I couldn't help but laugh at the "impressive lifespan by keeping things fresh." Wait, what? XD

Cognimancer:
The game's story must be completed in seven in-game days, so time management is critical - but, with successful completion of missions, that timer can be pushed to thirteen days.

I absolutely HATE time limits in games... I want to be able to explore, check every corner, pick up every gil off the ground... Atelier Rorona ruined that series for me with its restrictive deadlines... I would hate to see the same thing happen with FF.

Captcha: smashed potato. What's taters, precious? What's taters?!?

Gearhead mk2:
So Lightning is gonna die over and over and over and over again.

Sounds good to me!

Beat me to it. Actually, most FF games would be improved by the deaths of their main characters.

This looks like a decent game for once. I loathe the combination of turn-, menu-based combat and real time combat all of the newer FF games had until now. Let's also hope they don't decide to turn the grind up like they did in FFXII, or continue using instanced combat.

Kopikatsu:

Plot of XIII-2 can be summed up as 'Time machines'.

Slightly more seriously, the heroes lost.

Thanks for the plot summary. I was getting worried about the time limit, because it was probable that you couldn't go a slower and more methodical way, as opposed to a speedrun. But seeing as time has stopped existing... 7 days are a lot of time...

Then there's the biggest plot hole yet: How the hell can anything happen if the concept of time has stopped existing? My understanding is that if we lose the 4th dimension, we won't be able to know it until it returns and something has been changed, simply because human thoughts and actions always also move forward in time, in addition to what is happening on XYZ.

Also, for both FFXIII-3 and FFXV: I want to be able to choose which character I play as in combat (if possible, in general, too). I don't want to be stuck playing emo prick number n+1... or a female character with an incredibly stupid voice (wait, this is Square we're talking about... that's not going to happen, is it?).

This is terrible. They have managed to completely kill final fantasy for me. Ugh....

Fiz_The_Toaster:
Ya know, I'm totally okay with them doing that.

With a franchise that's been going on for this long I would think they would want to do new things with it so it's not too boring or easy. I have no idea how this is all gonna work, but I'm hoping the end results are awesome.

That's the thing that bothers me is they arn't doing "new things" but rather just copy-pasting ideas from other developers have been known to work.

All this does is prove that the developers for Final Fantasy have completely run out of original or new ideas (with the possible exception of FFXV) and are now just going to paste FF characters with other game's formulas.

It is sad to see a series I loved lose their identity.

This game just looks better and better the more I hear about it. I'm especially interested to see how the time limit plays out in practice.

I don't know why people are complaining about the loss of turn-based combat now, when Final Fantasy hasn't really had it since IV and the previous two FF XIII games didn't even pretend to be turn-based.

What is wrong with the proposed combat? It was fine with a somewhat similar style in Kingdom Hearts and the last few FFs have had horrible combat and levelling systems in place. Even if it is a bit "harder" I guarantee you that you can grind to make it easier like pretty much every RPG(bar some WRPGs). The ATB has never been a great turn based combat system anyway. Also can we stop throwing around buzz words like emo and brooding when only one FF protagonist I can think of even comes close to it and he is more just a self absorbed ass hole than anything else.

The series has needed some major overhauls for a long time at which points varies from person to person and if you ask 10 people at which point in the series you'll get 11 opinions.

BaronIveagh:
I'll just point out that the limited inventory thing has been done well in the past, by Square no less, in Parasite Eve 1.

(now there's a game I wish would get a remake...)

They did time travel well in the past too, in Chrono Trigger but managed to screw it up in XIII-2.

AwesomeDave:

Cognimancer:
The game's story must be completed in seven in-game days, so time management is critical - but, with successful completion of missions, that timer can be pushed to thirteen days.

I absolutely HATE time limits in games... I want to be able to explore, check every corner, pick up every gil off the ground... Atelier Rorona ruined that series for me with its restrictive deadlines... I would hate to see the same thing happen with FF.

Captcha: smashed potato. What's taters, precious? What's taters?!?

With inventory limits, exploration would still be punished even without the time limit.

The dumb thing is both FF13 games should be 1 full game of 20 or less hours when you cut the crap out (IE cutscenes) so we get to stories with no ending and 3rd game that's even more different than the other 2.
I geez, i can't even say I hope this one is better. Enjoy everyone else, I'll be saving my money.

OtherSideofSky:
This game just looks better and better the more I hear about it. I'm especially interested to see how the time limit plays out in practice.

I don't know why people are complaining about the loss of turn-based combat now, when Final Fantasy hasn't really had it since IV and the previous two FF XIII games didn't even pretend to be turn-based.

ATB was a turn based battle system. Both 12 and 13 had turn based systems behind the scenes. If it's strictly turn based that you are talking about, you forgot about 10 and 10-2.

Hm ... the games know almost entirely for their cutscenes and turn based combat want to turn into the next big adventure game with semi-hack/slash combat. Something seems really wrong here and it's not looking like another Dragon's Dogma take. They should stick with making movies. The games are linear enough as is.

GAunderrated:

Fiz_The_Toaster:
Ya know, I'm totally okay with them doing that.

With a franchise that's been going on for this long I would think they would want to do new things with it so it's not too boring or easy. I have no idea how this is all gonna work, but I'm hoping the end results are awesome.

That's the thing that bothers me is they arn't doing "new things" but rather just copy-pasting ideas from other developers have been known to work.

All this does is prove that the developers for Final Fantasy have completely run out of original or new ideas (with the possible exception of FFXV) and are now just going to paste FF characters with other game's formulas.

It is sad to see a series I loved lose their identity.

Personally, I think it's a little early to be saying that since the game isn't out in the wild yet, but I totally get the concern since it's traditionally a turn-based game.

That said, I would rather them try out things from other games with their own twist rather than keep doing the same thing over and over again, and have it feel stale. Maybe they want to do something different with this one game that fits the game's story, but I'm just guessing.

Well if your gonna take ideas from something good take it from Dark Souls, I guess.

But just the fact that FF13-3 is even a thing, I am not holding my breath for this game. Also wasn't the story, characters, and writing horrible? I doubt it'll be any better with Lightning as the silent Chosen Undead Fem-Warrior discovering Lordran's past by reading item descriptions.

I'm probably one of the few people who's actually interested in this game, but when comments like this come from Square Enix, I take it with a massive load of salt. They tend to say a lot of lofty bullshit to try to impress people, even more so than other developers/publishers. Sure it may sound all well and good, but it's just not going to reflect the reality of the game. I still think Lightning Returns' gameplay is intriguing, as well as the general premise of the game despite the fact that I had the instinct to loathe it as soon as it was announced, though between this and Final Fantasy XV (which I'm super excited for, don't get me wrong), I'm afraid that Square Enix is going to abandon turn-based combat altogether. That's sad for me, because I LOVE turn-based combat, especially in Final Fantasy, but so many other people hate it. But as long as they finally pull their shit together and start making quality games again, it's a sacrifice I'm more than willing to live with.

Not that I'm expecting Lightning Returns to be anything special. Fun and worth a buy once the price comes down, perhaps, but nothing major. I am expecting Final Fantasy XV to redeem the series, though.

Fiz_The_Toaster:

GAunderrated:

Fiz_The_Toaster:
Ya know, I'm totally okay with them doing that.

With a franchise that's been going on for this long I would think they would want to do new things with it so it's not too boring or easy. I have no idea how this is all gonna work, but I'm hoping the end results are awesome.

That's the thing that bothers me is they arn't doing "new things" but rather just copy-pasting ideas from other developers have been known to work.

All this does is prove that the developers for Final Fantasy have completely run out of original or new ideas (with the possible exception of FFXV) and are now just going to paste FF characters with other game's formulas.

It is sad to see a series I loved lose their identity.

Personally, I think it's a little early to be saying that since the game isn't out in the wild yet, but I totally get the concern since it's traditionally a turn-based game.

That said, I would rather them try out things from other games with their own twist rather than keep doing the same thing over and over again, and have it feel stale. Maybe they want to do something different with this one game that fits the game's story, but I'm just guessing.

It may be a bit too early to call but when all the news and trailers I see make me want the game less as a FF fan, It is hard not to assume it will be crap.

See that's the thing, FF I-X for me each had something new and interesting in them. They were able to create interesting new battle mechanics and characters every single game. None of the gameplay feels stale when I play them. They all have something unique about them but still retain that "final fantasy feel" if you can understand what I am talking about.

Yet in FFXII, XIII, and XIII-2 it all feels like we are playing a game that is just trying to take other game ideas that have worked out and then try and jam FF into it and expect it to work. Neither of those 3 games I listed have any sort of FF feel to it. Many of the characters just come out flat and boring.

For all its flaws FFXII actually had some things I liked about it just not enough to redeem it. While FFXIII's universe is just one big pile of poo that SE refuses to flush.

To all the people complaining about the switch from turn-based combat: If Final Fantasy XIII and XIII-2 are any indication, it's not exactly as though SquareEnix wants to keep doing the 'classic' turn-based combat anyway. Personally, what I hope is that if they're going to continue with this Action-RPG stance past Final Fantasy XV, they at least take the cues from Kingdom Hearts and have full parties. There are enough solo-ARPGs around as it is.

As for this game in particular... I don't know. I hate Final Fantasy XIII and I haven't played enough of XIII-2 to formulate an opinion of it, but if that's any example I'll probably buy this one anyway and then never even put it in my PS3.

GAunderrated:

Fiz_The_Toaster:

GAunderrated:

That's the thing that bothers me is they arn't doing "new things" but rather just copy-pasting ideas from other developers have been known to work.

All this does is prove that the developers for Final Fantasy have completely run out of original or new ideas (with the possible exception of FFXV) and are now just going to paste FF characters with other game's formulas.

It is sad to see a series I loved lose their identity.

Personally, I think it's a little early to be saying that since the game isn't out in the wild yet, but I totally get the concern since it's traditionally a turn-based game.

That said, I would rather them try out things from other games with their own twist rather than keep doing the same thing over and over again, and have it feel stale. Maybe they want to do something different with this one game that fits the game's story, but I'm just guessing.

It may be a bit too early to call but when all the news and trailers I see make me want the game less as a FF fan, It is hard not to assume it will be crap.

See that's the thing, FF I-X for me each had something new and interesting in them. They were able to create interesting new battle mechanics and characters every single game. None of the gameplay feels stale when I play them. They all have something unique about them but still retain that "final fantasy feel" if you can understand what I am talking about.

Yet in FFXII, XIII, and XIII-2 it all feels like we are playing a game that is just trying to take other game ideas that have worked out and then try and jam FF into it and expect it to work. Neither of those 3 games I listed have any sort of FF feel to it. Many of the characters just come out flat and boring.

For all its flaws FFXII actually had some things I liked about it just not enough to redeem it. While FFXIII's universe is just one big pile of poo that SE refuses to flush.

No I see where you're coming from. I'm a Silent Hill 'fan', so I'm used to this kind of thing.

I think where we differ is that I never grew up playing Final Fantasy and the first one I ever played was FFXIII and I enjoyed it. I don't have a personal point of reference other than people screaming at me for how wrong I am for liking it and that I should try such and such in the series. Looking at the whole series I can see FFXIII being completely polarizing, and that might be because, from what I understand, that they were changing things on the fly while trying to get the game out.

There are things wrong with FFXIII that I will readily admit to not liking, but I did think XIII-2 fixed a lot of what was wrong with the one before it. Do I think the third one is gonna convince people to try it out for doing things different? Probably not. Personally, I'm cautiously optimistic about this one because I want to know if the changes they do justify anything in the game.

Not possible. FF is at it's core cheap as hell. The point is to out-cheap the enemy. Dark Souls and Demon's Souls are very fair.

As a fan of FF13 but not FF13-2, I have to say this sounds more and more interesting as time goes on. Reading up on what the creators are doing this time around makes me more and more positive on this spinoff game than I have on the majority other FF spinoffs. The only FF spinoffs I have ever liked were Crisis Core: FF7, Dissidia, Dissidia 012 and Theaterythem.

My name is Fiction:

Dark souls isn't difficult.

Its just cheap. Ive been able to take the traps, they can be spotted if youre paying attention. I can deal with the ambushes that only work because the camera is shit. Ive got over thinking the shield mechanics are broken because Id entered an area I wasnt ready for early with no way of telling I shouldnt be there. That early on I was mulling over whether the shield is not an option in the game or that I was getting the mechanics fundamentally wrong.

Once youve took time to block and look at the attack patterns its not that hard, I just exploit the shit AI. From enemies that will sit still while I take 15 minutes to shoot them to death over and over again, to skeletons that will happily dive off cliffs like lemmings to Fatties that will stand shouting while I back stab them over and over, knights that will come just within my range to be hit then wander off over and over again until dead. The game seems to have been thrown together.

But last night I was 1 shotted by a living chest with no "tells" this would be any different that the tens of other chests Ive opened. No chance to dodge/block just an animated eating sequence and about 4 hours worth of souls and humanity gone. Dont think Ill be loading Dark Souls up again. I like tough and challenging, Ive beaten contra, thunder force, R Type, bionic commando, ninja gaiden, gouls and ghosts... but that was just the developer being a tool.

OT, its about time they tried something different with FF, Ive not played a "traditional" JRPG in ages. I kind of feel been there done that with all of it. If it shapes up they may get me on board.

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