Geek Girls Lambast Prejudice in Music Video

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Cecilo:

RJ 17:

Easton Dark:
Uh... I don't think the term 'fake geek girl' means that women can't be geeks. It's about how some would lie about being fans of geeky things to be more popular, right?

So... uh... yeah.

They're lying so they can be more popular......around "geeks and nerds"...?

Sorry, but that statement just really doesn't make much sense at all. "Geek" and gamer culture isn't as shunned and ridiculed as it used to be, I'll give you that, but I doubt it's gotten to the point where it's "cool" to spend your Saturday nights watching anime and playing videogames rather than going out to parties to get wasted. The closest thing women lying about being fans of geeky things would be booth-babes, but they're not trying to be popular with us. They're models hired on to do a job: wear this and stand next to our booth looking pretty. They get paid at the end of the day for doing their job (modeling) and that's as far as it goes for them. Are there some that are genuinely into the games/characters they're modeling for? I'm sure there are. But I'd imagine most of them see it as just another job.

Ahh. But which is easier, being popular around other people who are trying to be popular. Or being popular around people who are shunned from normal experiences such as parties.

I think you will find it many times easier to get a reaction and get people attached to you if you show a little bit of cleavage on a webcam to the average 14-18 year old gamer. It's why a lot of "Fake Girl Gamers" Are commonly reduced to attention whores. Normal Girl Gamers won't call attention to the fact that they are actually women, or if they do, it is to correct someone who believes they are male.

As far as I have seen, being a fake girl gamer is more about giving that girl an ego boost and ego stroking. Having tons of people drooling over them can be a big boost to someone.

What defines "normal" though? Can a cam-whore not be a real nerd? If someone likes the attention of other people, can they not have other hobbies as well? And even if they don't, why do you care?

People get hung up on classifying whether they're a "Real" or "normal" nerd or not, as if it's one or the other. People are a ginormous spectrum of hobbies, interests and personalities. Trying to codify them into one category or another is as futile as it is insulting.

Easton Dark:
Uh... I don't think the term 'fake geek girl' means that women can't be geeks. It's about how some would lie about being fans of geeky things to be more popular, right?

You know what's funny? How the "fake geek girl" moniker is thrown usually at very good-looking women.

Almost... As if a lot of guys (geek or not) are... resentful... because despite being part of geek culture, the hot girls will still not sleep with them.

I still remain to be convinced that this "fake geek girl" thing is not just another form of slut shaming.

Oskuro:

Easton Dark:
Uh... I don't think the term 'fake geek girl' means that women can't be geeks. It's about how some would lie about being fans of geeky things to be more popular, right?

You know what's funny? How the "fake geek girl" moniker is thrown usually at very good-looking women.

Almost... As if a lot of guys (geek or not) are... resentful... because despite being part of geek culture, the hot girls will still not sleep with them.

I still remain to be convinced that this "fake geek girl" thing is not just another form of slut shaming.

You've got a point. I'm a 30 year old woman and I still bristle a bit at really good looking women saying they are gamers. That has to do with me being a girl, though, and insecure. Not about 'geek-cred' or whatever. Though, honestly, I would believe the less attractive person more than the attractive one.

But I'm also a judgemental asshole, and now that I'm grown up, I resent the popular girls from high school just as much as I did when I was 17... just now I know exactly why. And I'm still in that mindset of anyone prettier than me must be a bitch and other things and not as true a fan as I am... but that's just me having issues and never having gotten closure from all the bullying I got growing up in the 80's and 90's as a really geeky girl.

Cecilo:

They're lying so they can be more popular......around "geeks and nerds"...?

Sorry, but that statement just really doesn't make much sense at all. "Geek" and gamer culture isn't as shunned and ridiculed as it used to be, I'll give you that, but I doubt it's gotten to the point where it's "cool" to spend your Saturday nights watching anime and playing videogames rather than going out to parties to get wasted. The closest thing women lying about being fans of geeky things would be booth-babes, but they're not trying to be popular with us. They're models hired on to do a job: wear this and stand next to our booth looking pretty. They get paid at the end of the day for doing their job (modeling) and that's as far as it goes for them. Are there some that are genuinely into the games/characters they're modeling for? I'm sure there are. But I'd imagine most of them see it as just another job.

Ahh. But which is easier, being popular around other people who are trying to be popular. Or being popular around people who are shunned from normal experiences such as parties.

I think you will find it many times easier to get a reaction and get people attached to you if you show a little bit of cleavage on a webcam to the average 14-18 year old gamer. It's why a lot of "Fake Girl Gamers" Are commonly reduced to attention whores. Normal Girl Gamers won't call attention to the fact that they are actually women, or if they do, it is to correct someone who believes they are male.

As far as I have seen, being a fake girl gamer is more about giving that girl an ego boost and ego stroking. Having tons of people drooling over them can be a big boost to someone.

I'll give you that attention whores do indeed exist, but it should be pretty easy to tell the difference between an attention whore and a female gamer that happens to be attractive. Evidently, though, a large part of the community can't tell that difference and thus we have this absurd "Fake Gamer Girl" BS. I prefer to give people the benefit of the doubt, assuming that they're actually interested and knowledgeable in what they're talking about until they prove otherwise. I don't look at someone and say "Prove to me you really like Mass Effect."

"We're not just geeks, we're geek-GIRLS".

It's not an actual quote, but that's the message I get.
People with common sense already know how to treat other people well, assuming they're amicable or generally pleasant.
They're trying to convince people that have no interest in being nice towards other people, which is a bad idea.

Will Wheaton says; "Don't be a dick."
Good luck convincing dicks not to be dicks. Stop trying to get respect from people who are not willing to give it.
This goes for ALL people, despite gender, you have to prove yourself, your geekdom and your knowledge to some, because that's who they are. There are lots of competitive gamers or geeks, who don't assume you're just as interested in what they are, because most people aren't.

"That look of surprise when I talk about Star Trek? It gets old."
That is an actual quote from the video.
First off, it's been a while since the last series and most talk about TNG, which ended a very long time ago. So if I met her and was surprised, it'd be the fact that she's so young and is actually interested in an old concept, not because she's a girl.
One of my friends moved across Europe to live in my country and she's a Trekkie, had a crush on Worf and bought me a Red Shirt phone case for my birthday. When I found out she was a Trekkie, I was excited, because I finally had someone to talk about Star Trek with, not because she's a girl(Which is besides the point, because I'd known her for a while before then).
Really though, get used to it, because it's not going to change in your lifetime and it's not exclusively because you have a vagina.

This is a kind of "feminism light", where the usual trend of women wanting men to respect them for no reason, other than being women, carries on. They tend to forget that men have to earn the respect of other men as well and not all friendships just clicks, like when we were kids.
Want to blame someone? Blame the cheating, manipulative, condescending and the machiavellian kind of women who ruins it for everyone else and give some men the reason not to trust all women at face value. Or the tantrum throwing literal loot-whores who constantly reminds everyone else that they're girls and they're special.
Or the Candy Crush addicts who constantly bugs people on facebook and insists they're "such nerds, LOL".

In other words, if you stop giving a shit about it, others will as well. Just treat people as you want to be treated and ignore the stupid comments you get.
Men get them as well, as do fat people, skinny people, tall people, short people, black people and white people. We all get a dose of bullshit and asshat attitude.
You're not special, even if you're a minority :)

I'll quote my friend on a few things she said last night when we were hanging out eating pancakes and drinking beer(while she was stealing my cigs):
"People need to stop making an issue where there is none." (In regards to the Sarkeesian vids)
"You're responsible for yourself, no one else is." (Talking about raid-leading in WoW and gaining the respect of other players.)
"My world was so much easier once I stopped giving a shit about what everyone else thought of me, and got off my ass to improve my own situation." (Talking about moving between countries and being the only female programmer for the companies she's worked at.)
"Fuck, these are menthol! You cunt!" (That's what you get for stealing my fags!)

Do 'fake geek girls' exist? Yes, just as there are people in every subculture, fandom, or hobby that don't care about the source material itself but rather the attention they get by being around people who do like it. There are also fake geek people of every other gender as well.

So why is the fake gamer girl thing filled with so much vitriol on both sides? From the male perspective, you have a lot of lonely, socially awkward guys (this is a stereotype but hardly an untrue one) who have a hard time connecting with women. So, when one pays attention to them, is pretentious about her like of games and then leverages that to get the male to do things for her, he feels burned afterward and grows an intense mistrust of any female geek. He has no rational backing for this universal distrust, but emotions are not logical things.

As for the females, they get pestered one too many times about being female and a geek and they start to see and feel it everywhere, as if their gender means they have to pass some kind of test in order to join the club. This creates a justified feeling of persecution and resentment.

Now, for my part, this phenomenon isn't even solely aimed at females. I myself have been quizzed on my own geekdom half a dozen times by suspicious nerds. I had a guy at work ask me to name every character he had sitting on his desk as he eyed me with suspicion. He knew I loved American football and was an athlete and so automatically assumed there was no way I was a geek.

So, are fake geek girls a problem? I think it is self evident that people lying to other people and playing on their weakness and desperation for money is most certainly a problem. I also think males allowing themselves to become suspicious and distrustful of all women because they were hurt by some is something they need to come to grips with and get over.

And for those who do not think fake gamer girls are a problem, I submit this idea to you. How many people would be appalled by a guy who went to knitting classes, with no interest in knitting whatsoever, to try and get lonely, emotionally vulnerable women to have sex with him or give him money? People would largely be up in arms about something like that and no one would blame a woman taken advantage of by such a man for being suspicious of any other men who claim to love knitting for knitting's sake. I've had a taste of this as well, being that I love knitting and took some hobby classes only to be eyed with suspicion and even accused of being a predator. What football loving, beer swilling athletes like to knit?

I can only marvel at how many people, even in an ostensibly above-grade community such as the escapists, who are impenetrable to common sense and basic understanding of what other people are, in the most simplistic forms imaginable, trying to say.

A catchy music video with a positive message that will of course be utterly lost on the bottom-feeders who it is targeted at, though they can't be faulted for trying.

Something to note: If at any point you have ever found yourself, here or otherwise, classifying the authenticity of someone other than yourself in whatever fandom or subculture you subscribe to, you're doing it wrong and are part of the problem.

Mcoffey:
If all you're doing is calling yourself a heart surgeon or a race car driver, then no, it still shouldn't matter. You're not in a position to hurt anybody, and nobody is being hurt by people saying they consider themselves nerds (Whether or not they're lying is irrelevant). It still shouldn't matter to you.

Of course you are hurting somebody. You are hurting the person you are lying to. You are also making the world a crappier place to live in, in general.

An lets be honest, if it were a guy making these claims you'd tell him the shut the heck up & stop talking bulltwaddle & rightly so... Just like we do when we are talking about different facets of geekdom. I just had just such a moment in which i had someone try to play the role of expert based on nothing more then reading something off of wikipedia.

Lacking a proper understanding of the topic the person in question had information, but due to a lack of legitimate knowledge, it was the wrong information. an thats why someone having read something off of wikipedia is not a geek in that given topic.

An so i will close by repeating what i've already said: the problem with information in this generation is that its to easy to find & people constantly mistake knowing a thing from wikipedia for actually knowing a thing because you actually understand it.

Smilomaniac:

It's not an actual quote, but that's the message I get.

Perhaps the issue is with you, then, and not them?

itsthesheppy:
I can only marvel at how many people, even in an ostensibly above-grade community such as the escapists, who are impenetrable to common sense and basic understanding of what other people are, in the most simplistic forms imaginable, trying to say.

A catchy music video with a positive message that will of course be utterly lost on the bottom-feeders who it is targeted at, though they can't be faulted for trying.

Something to note: If at any point you have ever found yourself, here or otherwise, classifying the authenticity of someone other than yourself in whatever fandom or subculture you subscribe to, you're doing it wrong and are part of the problem.

You have made my morning slightly happier with this post. Thank you.

Yeah because angry 12 year olds are really going to have their minds changed by a self-righteous music video.

Some of them may be even more pissed off by the delusion of self-importance, than individuals who pretend they are something they are not for profit, fun etc.

Smeatza:
Yeah because angry 12 year olds are really going to have their minds changed by a self-righteous music video.

Some of them may be even more pissed off by the delusion of self-importance, than individuals who pretend they are something they are not for profit, fun etc.

I can confirm this video will be nothing but fodder for the mill on 4chan.

Fake geek girls as concerns video games matters not to me. I am very interested, however, in the idea of 'fake Table Top RPG girls'.

Actually, scratch that, make it 'fake Table Top RPG people' in general. Do they exist?

I mean, the 'proving grounds' for something like that, to me, involves committing to a game that could be hours long, and require some degree of commitment mentally. And I guess I'd want proof, personally, because my group of players aggressively recruit, and we want to integrate new (but not novice) players to our games immediately, which requires playing. A faker would either have to ruin their own evening/night/early morning, or come clean very early on!

Why would I aggressively pursue such proof? Because I love playing with new people! D&D is so much fun with a mixed crowd, whether the rules aren't an impediment to the enjoyment of the game because we've all been playing for years, or there are new players learning the ropes to the game, it's the dedication and the drive I appreciate.

As to the topic at hand, I still see it as not a gender issue. Geeks and nerds establish pecking orders the same as other clicks/social groups, and people who don't 'measure up' to the 'alpha' geek will be looked down upon by said nerd.

And how do they measure this? Who can hit the ball the farthest? Who can run the fastest? Who can fly the planes the best? No. It's who knows the most about their favourite topic.

...

Personally, that's why I don't get into long conversations with aggressive geek/nerds. Not that I think I know everything and am smug, but more that my ego doesn't need bruising from some obsessive person in an anonymous forum where the word 'polite' means nothing.

matthew_lane:
The argument isn't that real geek girls don't exist, its that there are girls out there who are faking being geeks: The basics of logic folks. An again i am disappointed in the obvious bias shown by Escapist writers. I get that biased joournalism sells more, but there is a point where ones bias becomes so silly, that you become the gaming version of faux news.

Oh yes, a newspaper demonstrating their desire for others to not be assholes to people you know nothing about. What horrible bias! This will destroy the geek culture as we know it! Because as you know, witch hunting for the eeeeeeeeeevil "fakes" is the only thing keeping us alive!

So, it seems that these girls do not even understand the concept of what a fake geel girl is and still tries to somehow "Disprove" a fact.
yeah, this is not going to start any controversy at all....

Lilani:

matthew_lane:
The argument isn't that real geek girls don't exist, its that there are girls out there who are faking being geeks: The basics of logic folks. An again i am disappointed in the obvious bias shown by Escapist writers. I get that biased joournalism sells more, but there is a point where ones bias becomes so silly, that you become the gaming version of faux news.

Oh yes, a newspaper demonstrating their desire for others to not be assholes to people you know nothing about. What horrible bias! This will destroy the geek culture as we know it! Because as you know, witch hunting for the eeeeeeeeeevil "fakes" is the only thing keeping us alive!

why did you quote him? what your saying has absolutely nothing to do with the quote.

Geek and Nerd aren't gender specific terms. Calling themselves "Geek Girls" instead of "geeks" separates them just as much, if not more due to their adherence, as the neck-beards asserting their all faking it for attention.

Fake geek-girls dont exist...just a bunch of elitist alpha-geeks, who think they can judge who is a true geek and who isnt.
Guess lots of Nerds are still very insecure about their hobby.

RJ 17:

Cecilo:

They're lying so they can be more popular......around "geeks and nerds"...?

Sorry, but that statement just really doesn't make much sense at all. "Geek" and gamer culture isn't as shunned and ridiculed as it used to be, I'll give you that, but I doubt it's gotten to the point where it's "cool" to spend your Saturday nights watching anime and playing videogames rather than going out to parties to get wasted. The closest thing women lying about being fans of geeky things would be booth-babes, but they're not trying to be popular with us. They're models hired on to do a job: wear this and stand next to our booth looking pretty. They get paid at the end of the day for doing their job (modeling) and that's as far as it goes for them. Are there some that are genuinely into the games/characters they're modeling for? I'm sure there are. But I'd imagine most of them see it as just another job.

Ahh. But which is easier, being popular around other people who are trying to be popular. Or being popular around people who are shunned from normal experiences such as parties.

I think you will find it many times easier to get a reaction and get people attached to you if you show a little bit of cleavage on a webcam to the average 14-18 year old gamer. It's why a lot of "Fake Girl Gamers" Are commonly reduced to attention whores. Normal Girl Gamers won't call attention to the fact that they are actually women, or if they do, it is to correct someone who believes they are male.

As far as I have seen, being a fake girl gamer is more about giving that girl an ego boost and ego stroking. Having tons of people drooling over them can be a big boost to someone.

I'll give you that attention whores do indeed exist, but it should be pretty easy to tell the difference between an attention whore and a female gamer that happens to be attractive. Evidently, though, a large part of the community can't tell that difference and thus we have this absurd "Fake Gamer Girl" BS. I prefer to give people the benefit of the doubt, assuming that they're actually interested and knowledgeable in what they're talking about until they prove otherwise. I don't look at someone and say "Prove to me you really like Mass Effect."

Don't get me wrong, I am just analyzing it. I don't personally care. I don't interact with these people, nor do I have any interest in interacting with them. Though I suppose some of the criticism that "Cam-Whores" Get is justified. For example, in a MMO. People that call out that they are girls sometimes do get their pick of loot "just for being female". And it is understandable that some people do get angry about that. Normal gamers don't want to be treated differently, they just want intelligent people to play with.

My only advice for women that are playing with a particular group of people who care that they are female, is to find a different group. There are more than enough groups of gamers to around, and if the group you are hanging out with are the kind of asses that make you take a test just to fit in, they aren't what the majority of gaming looks like. Leave them to their circlejerk, come join me in my gaming, or any other group. You'll fit right in as long as you know how to play.

Andy of Comix Inc:

Easton Dark:
Uh... I don't think the term 'fake geek girl' means that women can't be geeks. It's about how some would lie about being fans of geeky things to be more popular, right?

So... uh... yeah.

Yes, but that it doesn't exist for men, too, is why it's worrying. Or is there "fake geek men" we have to watch out for, too? And if there are - why don't people gun for them, too? It's probably cos most of the people shouting out against "fake geek girls" are insecure little straight fellas, eh.

Borderlands 2 DLC, Tiny Tina's Assault on Dragon Keep parodied the whole concept, and you know what? They did a better job than any internet commentator could ever do.

If this wasn't a real issue, then the moniker would've been 'Fake Gamer' without the 'Girl' added in the end.

It's kinda funny, because being a guy, I've dabbled into some nerd dubiousness myself. When MLP was hitting its peak and everyone seemed to be sick of how MLP memes were posted in every thread regardless of the topic, I started doing it myself to piss off those who are seemingly so easily rattled, even though I hadn't watched a single episode. And nobody thought of grilling me on my fandom (though mainly because maybe MLP fandom is rather inclusive or because everyone else was busy telling me to stop with the memes). Bwahahaahaha!

And guess what? I don't read mainstream comic books (except the few odd Alan Moore, Warren Ellis and Joss Wheadon ones). And thus if saying I'm excited about a new Marvel flick makes me a 'fake', then that makes you a poor, miserable, silly bastard.

HalloHerrNoob:
Fake geek-girls dont exist...just a bunch of elitist alpha-geeks, who think they can judge who is a true geek and who isnt.
Guess lots of Nerds are still very insecure about their hobby.

Totally, unequivocally false statement. The fake geek girl thing didn't arise out of nothing, it arose out of actual females who used their gender and sometimes their attractive looks to prey on emotionally vulnerable and lonely male geeks in order to extract attention, favors and/or money. The over reaction of blaming every female who is a geek for this fraud is wrong as hell, but to pretend that the fake geek girl thing was invented just so some people could be elitest is wrong. That's not to say the there aren't people who do use the fake gamer girl thing to create a witch hunt or to make themselves feel superior, but acting as if there weren't any people who were actually hurt by pretentious frauds is totally inaccurate.

I do not say any of that with disrespect intended toward you, I just want to make it clear that this issue is not nearly as cut and dried as people want to make it out to be.

Gorrath:
The fake geek girl thing didn't arise out of nothing, it arose out of actual females who used their gender and sometimes their attractive looks to prey on emotionally vulnerable and lonely male geeks in order to extract attention, favors and/or money.

Oh...now you got me all crying. Seriously, you are way to dramatic!
I have heard thousands of claims about fake gamer-girls, but never actually got to see one.
All I have seen (and sorry if I am wrong, but thats just my experience) are those elitist idiots I talked about.
I know at least one girl (she was a pokemon fan) who quit playing because she got hacked on for having no interest in EV-training (just a tad exaggerated), so sorry...my opinion is still that this whole "fake-gamer/nerd/geek-girl" issue is just an invention by geeks who want to keep their hobby something special.

Alright, Im getting sick of this whole goddamn issue that shouldn't even bloody exist.
What the hell are the requirements for being a geek anyway?

HalloHerrNoob:
Fake geek-girls dont exist...just a bunch of elitist alpha-geeks, who think they can judge who is a true geek and who isnt.

Of course they exist. There is nothing that becomes mainstream & popular that doesn't have a fake following hoping to gain perks by association, with out any of the personal sacrifice.

As for who can determine the difference between a true geek & who isn't, its pretty simple. If you were to say "i am such a huge comic book geek, i went and watched the Avengers movie." I would then ask you "Really? Do you collect the Avengers comics by chance?" If you were to answer yes, we could have a good old chin wag about how misunderstood Hank Pym is, or Black Widow is a really boring character, or even, What the hell is Marvel thinking letting Hickman screw up the Avengers... If you answer no, then you are not a Comic Book Geek... At best you are someone who enjoyed watching a movie.

Simply put; a passing awareness of the existance of something doesn't make you a geek. To be a geek you must have an obsessive love of something. For instance if you are obsessive about the Marvel movies (the actors, the lore & the behind the scenes stuff), but have never picked up a comic then yes you are a geek: A Marvel movie universe geek.

Geek =/= Passing awareness.
Geek = Obsessive love of something + vast knowledge of the subject matter.

matthew_lane:

HalloHerrNoob:
Fake geek-girls dont exist...just a bunch of elitist alpha-geeks, who think they can judge who is a true geek and who isnt.

Of course they exist. There is nothing that becomes mainstream & popular that doesn't have a fake following hoping to gain perks by association, with out any of the personal sacrifice.

In all seriousness, what kind of perks (other than joy) do you get from being a geek?
Also..those personal sacrifices are mentioned way to often as defining a geek. I am sorry, I grew up with Commander Keen and Snake rattle ┤n roll, but because I had a happy childhood, I guess I am no real geek.
Thats just a load of bullshit!

Zachary Amaranth:

Perhaps the issue is with you, then, and not them?

Do yourself a favor and read my full post. You'd likely learn something.

Gorrath:

Totally, unequivocally false statement. The fake geek girl thing didn't arise out of nothing, it arose out of actual females who used their gender and sometimes their attractive looks to prey on emotionally vulnerable and lonely male geeks in order to extract attention, favors and/or money. The over reaction of blaming every female who is a geek for this fraud is wrong as hell, but to pretend that the fake geek girl thing was invented just so some people could be elitest is wrong. That's not to say the there aren't people who do use the fake gamer girl thing to create a witch hunt or to make themselves feel superior, but acting as if there weren't any people who were actually hurt by pretentious frauds is totally inaccurate.

I do not say any of that with disrespect intended toward you, I just want to make it clear that this issue is not nearly as cut and dried as people want to make it out to be.

Just like the opposite; Men who go for insecure women to have their way with them for a one night stand. Something that everyone believes it, but not when it goes the other way around :)

Amazing how blind people are in general. Innocent na´vetÚ?

HalloHerrNoob:

Gorrath:
The fake geek girl thing didn't arise out of nothing, it arose out of actual females who used their gender and sometimes their attractive looks to prey on emotionally vulnerable and lonely male geeks in order to extract attention, favors and/or money.

Oh...now you got me all crying. Seriously, you are way to dramatic!
I have heard thousands of claims about fake gamer-girls, but never actually got to see one.
All I have seen (and sorry if I am wrong, but thats just my experience) are those elitist idiots I talked about.
I know at least one girl (she was a pokemon fan) who quit playing because she got hacked on for having no interest in EV-training (just a tad exaggerated), so sorry...my opinion is still that this whole "fake-gamer/nerd/geek-girl" issue is just an invention by geeks who want to keep their hobby something special.

I didn't think calling out a false statement was in any way dramatic. Your specific experiences color your belief, as with everyone and their beliefs, such is to be expected. As I explained in a previous post, I myself have been put to the geek test a bunch of times because I do not fit a stereotype. But to dismiss everyone who's been harmed by predatory frauds as just being elitist does nothing to help the problem. The elitist jerks don't care what you or I think and the guys who have been hurt by such scams aren't going to rethink their over zealousness by being told that being used and emotionally discarded is their own fault or that it just plain never happened.

I just want people to be calm and rational about this whole topic (all topics really) and not lambast women because they like geeky things or engage in victim blaming because a guy's loneliness and awkwardness was used to manipulate him.

Gorrath:

I just want people to be calm and rational about this whole topic (all topics really) and not lambast women because they like geeky things or engage in victim blaming because a guy's loneliness and awkwardness was used to manipulate him.

Fair enough, but honestly I have never heard of someone who has been harmed this way and still kinda doubt they exist.
Obviously what your describe is wrong and its definetly not my intention to blame a victim, but I have never heard (or read) about such a case.
All I have heard are cases in wich women (who did nothing exept trying to fit in) were blamed to be no real geeks.

HalloHerrNoob:
In all seriousness, what kind of perks (other than joy) do you get from being a geek?

Recognition of intellect for starters. We've moved into an age where knowledge is more important then physical strength, where ingenuity & esoteric skills are lauded like no time before in human history. Everyone wants to be thought of as smart, as intelligent & as right.

Geekdom has always been associated with intelligence, rightly or wrongly.

So putting on a pair of thick rimmed glassess & pretending that enjoying watching big bang theory makes you such a geek (because you keep on telling people "i watch BBT, i'm such a geek"), is essentially pretending to be intelligent by geek proxy.

I'm smart because i'm smart, knowledgable in particualr fields because i've studied & am still studying (will have my advance diploma by years end). I like geeky things because those are the things i like. Liking them didn't make me smart of knowledgable, but alas thats the association people try to foster by pretense of geekdom... That an the pretense of being alternative.

matthew_lane:

HalloHerrNoob:
In all seriousness, what kind of perks (other than joy) do you get from being a geek?

Recognition of intellect for starters. We've moved into an age where knowledge is more important then physical strength, where ingenuity & esoteric skills are lauded like no time before in human history. Everyone wants to be thought of as smart, as intelligent & as right.

Geekdom has always been associated with intelligence, rightly or wrongly.

So putting on a pair of thick rimmed glassess & pretending that enjoying watching big bang theory makes you such a geek (because you keep on telling people "i watch BBT, i'm such a geek"), is essentially pretending to be intelligent by geek proxy.

I'm smart because i'm smart, knowledgable in particualr fields because i've studied & am still studying (will have my advance diploma by years end). I like geeky things because those are the things i like. Liking them didn't make me smart of knowledgable, but alas thats the association people try to foster by pretense of geekdom... That an the pretense of being alternative.

What the hell are esoteric-skills supposed to be?
Also, I kinda doubt that this gives you any real perk...I mean its not like geeks have a better chance of getting a job (rather the opposite) or getting through college or whatever.
Also, socially I still think it would be better formular to pretend to be an athletic party girl than a geeky-loner.
So, no...I still dont really see the perks in this...

HalloHerrNoob:

Gorrath:

I just want people to be calm and rational about this whole topic (all topics really) and not lambast women because they like geeky things or engage in victim blaming because a guy's loneliness and awkwardness was used to manipulate him.

Fair enough, but honestly I have never heard of someone who has been harmed this way and still kinda doubt they exist.
Obviously what your describe is wrong and its definetly not my intention to blame a victim, but I have never heard (or read) about such a case.
All I have heard are cases in wich women (who did nothing exept trying to fit in) were blamed to be no real geeks.

As I have personal experience related to a friend being taken advantage of in this exact way, I can say it most certainly does. It's not even an unknown happenstance really, as several others in this very thread have pointed out seeing girls who do this kind of thing. Obviously I am unlikely to convince you just by telling you, but at least maybe we can view the topic with less automatic assumption. I will decry the use of the fake geek girl moniker and geek litmus test stuff where its used by elitist or misogynist jerks to be assholes, but we are best served by trying to understand the full causes of the issue instead of making broad generalizations about it. And again, no disrespect toward you, our experiences are simply quite different on this matter.

HalloHerrNoob:

Gorrath:

I just want people to be calm and rational about this whole topic (all topics really) and not lambast women because they like geeky things or engage in victim blaming because a guy's loneliness and awkwardness was used to manipulate him.

Fair enough, but honestly I have never heard of someone who has been harmed this way and still kinda doubt they exist.
Obviously what your describe is wrong and its definetly not my intention to blame a victim, but I have never heard (or read) about such a case.
All I have heard are cases in wich women (who did nothing exept trying to fit in) were blamed to be no real geeks.

I would recommend going to twich.tv around 8-12pm EST. You will find several channels on there with women who have facecams, So conveniently placed so as to show their breasts. As well as a donation box directly under their stream, who do not actually play the game, they sit around in whatever game they are playing (Mostly WoW) and take donations just for existing.

This is preying on men who were ostracized from normal relations for being "Geeky". I am not blaming all women for this, quite the opposite, I am quite happy with my own girlfriend, I am glad I can talk to her about Warhammer, Sword of the Stars, Marvel and DC comics and actually get a conversation out of bringing these topics up. I just see that there are some, very opportunistic women who see insecure men, who have probably either been rejected by or just never worked up the courage to ask out attractive women, and see them as a way to make money, or get attention. There are men that do this too. There are some live streaming men that play their games with a cam shirtless. And I am sure there are some women (Even men) who donate to him just because he is shirtless.

Though that isn't even the worst part of Twich.. Just look up ZileanOP. Scam artist and his girlfriend.

Moral of the Story is. DON'T DONATE TO PEOPLE ON TWITCH.

matthew_lane:

HalloHerrNoob:
Fake geek-girls dont exist...just a bunch of elitist alpha-geeks, who think they can judge who is a true geek and who isnt.

Of course they exist. There is nothing that becomes mainstream & popular that doesn't have a fake following hoping to gain perks by association, with out any of the personal sacrifice.

As for who can determine the difference between a true geek & who isn't, its pretty simple. If you were to say "i am such a huge comic book geek, i went and watched the Avengers movie." I would then ask you "Really? Do you collect the Avengers comics by chance?" If you were to answer yes, we could have a good old chin wag about how misunderstood Hank Pym is, or Black Widow is a really boring character, or even, What the hell is Marvel thinking letting Hickman screw up the Avengers... If you answer no, then you are not a Comic Book Geek... At best you are someone who enjoyed watching a movie.

Simply put; a passing awareness of the existance of something doesn't make you a geek. To be a geek you must have an obsessive love of something. For instance if you are obsessive about the Marvel movies (the actors, the lore & the behind the scenes stuff), but have never picked up a comic then yes you are a geek: A Marvel movie universe geek.

Geek =/= Passing awareness.
Geek = Obsessive love of something + vast knowledge of the subject matter.

Why does the distinction matter? Is an Avengers comic book fan so strapped for time that he needs a filter so he knows who not to talk to, lest his social calender be stretched too thin by his legions of compatriots? I don't read the comics. I loved the movies. I've read up on Wikipedia because I find the backstories interesting, but I don't have the time or money to get invested in comics (since it usually requires going back 20 years) and don't find the comic format a particularly enjoyable way to read a story. But hey, I love talking about Avengers to people, and if I get something wrong about it because I've only read Wikipedia, they can correct me, increasing my knowledge and appreciation for the subject matter. And hey, I may have just made a new friend. But if I call myself an Avengers fan instead of an Avengers Movie Universe As Defined By The Current Generation Of Marvel Movies fan, and and the comic fan decides I'm a poser and not worth talking to, than it's his loss. And mine, but mostly his.

Why is correctly categorizing people so important?

P.S. Regarding the "predatory women" idea, there's a much easier way to protect yourself. Find out about someone's personality before you have sex with them, not just whether or not they share your interest.

Cecilo:
(...)
Moral of the Story is. DON'T DONATE TO PEOPLE ON TWITCH.(...)

Yeah, I am definetly with you on this.
Though I wouldnt exactly call those girls fake-geeks, I can see your point there.
Having said this: Whoever spends money on those girls, just for the feeling of attention (I guess), is having some real fucked-up social life.

The main problem nowadays is not that most people think like that. The main problem is that there are a ton of people who pretend to be geeks, when they actually aren't, just for the attention. This causes the really stupid geeks to lump all women together and just hate them all.

Anyone who doesn't believe this is a real thing is a kind of stupid on par with those who don't believe girl geeks are a thing.

It's depressing to see how many people are still on the 'Fake Geek Girls are a HUGE problem' bandwagon. What do you care if those nefarious "cam-whores" get lots of hits? As long as you don't watch those videos, what does it matter to you?

Why would it hurt me if someone less invested in "geekyness" than myself attends a con? I wouldn't care if someone attended who just saw the funny costumes and wanted to check it out. People here compare it with attention grabbers in other popular niches. But to my knowledge, those other popular niches don't make such a fuss about a few hanger-ons. Most sport fans would welcome women who celebrate their home team's championship, even if those women didn't follow their team as obsessively as they did during the rest of the season. I can't see why I should give a damn when it happens to my hobby.

I don't see how it's such a terrible burden if I were to find myself confronted with somone who isn't as "geeky" as I am. If I feel my conversation partner doesn't have anything interesting to say, well, too bad. I'll find a way to get out and talk to someone else.

And if it is true (and I doubt it is) that there is a widespread problem of attractive women targeting geeky boys to "seduce" them and get at their money, well, that sucks. But people lying to take advantage of you is a problem in the real world, one way or the other. Why do you think all the booths at cons are for? Those people also want to make money of you. Grow up, keep your eyes open, and think before you act. It's not like I would spend tons of money just like that to please a REAL Geek, male or female.

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