Foxconn Reportedly Making PS4s With Forced Student Labor

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Well that explains how Sony is able to undersell the Xbone by such a large margin.

J Tyran:

hickwarrior:
So, how do I know what electronics are manufactured at foxconn then? And how prolific are those guys anyway? Cause I'd like to avoid them where ever possible. Though it probably cannot be done if it's in every gaming device out there...

Plus, millions are sold of them...

Its faster to ask which goods are not manufactured at Foxconn, they have dozens of massive factories across the world from the Indian Subcontinent to South America but are concentrated in East Asia. They make parts as well as complete items and some of the big brands they make complete items for include Apple, Dell, Sony, Nokia, Nintendo, Microsoft, Acer, Amazon (Kindles & whatnot), Google, Hewlett Packard. Big telecoms companies like Huawei and Cisco have most of their hardware like phones, switchboards and servers made by them too.

They make around one-third to half of all consumer electronics in the world, almost everything has parts that have passed through Foxconn at some point.

So basically swear off using tech altogether or buy apple products. Guess I should pick my poison then and be read yto close my eyes...

In less melodramatic news... Oh well, love my stuff too much to stop buying it.

so when the time comes how do I make sure the PS4 I buy wasn't one made in a place like that? I'd rather not give my money to them but I still want a PS4 do I have any options?.

Sgt. Sykes:
Foxconn is a cheap factory.

Most makers use Foxconn to assemble products to sell them as cheaply as possible.

Except who? Yep, Apple.

That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

What else is new? Who do you think makes your nike wear, iphones, clothing in general etc.

Petromir:

MrHide-Patten:
Reading the headline I pictured 10 year olds, not "kids" majoring in finance. Click bait much, I just assume that any piece of technology is glued together with childs tears.

I would however be lying if I said I cared for the plights of people slightly younger than I am being stiffed at an internship. It's not like they're shackled to the workstations.

So being forced to do unpaid work of no relevance to their degree merely to complete their degrees is fine because they aren't children.

I dunno that sounds like an 'Internship' to me >_>'

...

I am a highly jaded and damaged individual. Ignore me. But really apart from the 'working on a conveyer belt sticking pieces of shit together', my own experiences with internships were really no different, what I did was completely irrelevant in terms of adding to my knowledge, and really only gave me a sentence to add on my resume/CV that 'I DID A THING'.

And I suppose like me they'll just have to lie twist the truth and spin it the right way to have relevance to their actual degrees.

Life really is shit like that sadly.

Psychobabble:
Well that explains how Sony is able to undersell the Xbone by such a large margin.

While that MIGHT be a part of it, I think it was universally agreed by our professional internet detectives that it might be because Microsoft is insisting on bundling the kinect with the bone rather than Sony who isn't... Either way they're both guilty of overseas labor abuse as is nearly every fucking electronics manufacturer on the planet.

Isn't that like every internship ever? I get that it's probably way worse in china, but at face value, it's really just describing an average internship.

This might be slightly morbidly but this could be another sign of the labour shortages that China is slowly being overtaken by. The price of labour has risen sharply the last 10 years or so and its way more difficult to get anyone signing up for anything remotely looking like sweatshop operations. Apparently this is one of the long term effects of the 1 child policy they´ve had since the 70ies. Looks like they are trying to squeeze out a little more blood out of a system that is running more and more dry. So in a way this might be a positive sign for things to come although it could also mean of course that these sort of operations simply move to another low cost country. Electronics is a difficult and delicate thing to manufacture though, you sort of need a baseline of educated labour so it isnt like you could plonk down a factory in some african country ravaged by civil war.

Evil Smurf:

Sgt. Sykes:
Foxconn is a cheap factory.

Most makers use Foxconn to assemble products to sell them as cheaply as possible.

Except who? Yep, Apple.

That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

you did misread.
"except who? yep apple!" was reffering to the sell as cheaply as possible. . .

Credossuck:

Evil Smurf:

Sgt. Sykes:
Foxconn is a cheap factory.

Most makers use Foxconn to assemble products to sell them as cheaply as possible.

Except who? Yep, Apple.

That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

you did misread.
"except who? yep apple!" was reffering to the sell as cheaply as possible. . .

http://www.apple.com/supplierresponsibility/our-suppliers.html

Okay, I feel bad again.

Honestly, this sounds less like human rights violation and more like a dick company and university are being dicks in a country that literally doesn't care at best. I've heard stories of people jumping off buildings in China and no one even reacting. Not sure if it's true, but it's damn shocking.

Psychobabble:
Well that explains how Sony is able to undersell the Xbone by such a large margin.

Did someone miss the part that says that 10% of Xbox One components are being made in the same factory?

Evil Smurf:
That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

Just to clarify (maybe you understood well): everyone else uses cheap manufacturing to sell cheaply. Apple uses cheap manufacturing to sell expensive products with a huge margin.

Ed130:

Khanht Cope:

Incidentally, is Foxconn by any chance the place that reportedly installed nets to prevent their workers from killing themselves?

Yes it was.

image

Nets, counsellors, and exorcists. Not even joking. Exorcists.

Sgt. Sykes:

Evil Smurf:
That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

Just to clarify (maybe you understood well): everyone else uses cheap manufacturing to sell cheaply. Apple uses cheap manufacturing to sell expensive products with a huge margin.

This, sadly is the price of capitalism.

Ed130:

Khanht Cope:

Incidentally, is Foxconn by any chance the place that reportedly installed nets to prevent their workers from killing themselves?

Yes it was.

image

Since theres no mandarin writing on the building, I would have thought it could have been any building with Foxconn shooped in. The guy with the T-shirt fabulously lifted makes me belive its real, or at least a well thought out shoop.

hickwarrior:
So, how do I know what electronics are manufactured at foxconn then? And how prolific are those guys anyway? Cause I'd like to avoid them where ever possible. Though it probably cannot be done if it's in every gaming device out there...

Plus, millions are sold of them...

It's every gaming device out there.

In fact, basically every major electronics device out there uses Foxconn facilities; there's really no real alternative, no one else has the kind of manufacturing capabilities to create millions upon millions of devices. Apple themselves (who are known most for Foxconn controversies and make up 40-50% of their profit) have previously said that they don't really like working with them but don't exactly have a choice. (Funnily enough, Apple are also the only ones who have actually tried to improve the situation.)

Charli:

Petromir:

MrHide-Patten:
Reading the headline I pictured 10 year olds, not "kids" majoring in finance. Click bait much, I just assume that any piece of technology is glued together with childs tears.

I would however be lying if I said I cared for the plights of people slightly younger than I am being stiffed at an internship. It's not like they're shackled to the workstations.

So being forced to do unpaid work of no relevance to their degree merely to complete their degrees is fine because they aren't children.

I dunno that sounds like an 'Internship' to me >_>'

...

I am a highly jaded and damaged individual. Ignore me. But really apart from the 'working on a conveyer belt sticking pieces of shit together', my own experiences with internships were really no different, what I did was completely irrelevant in terms of adding to my knowledge, and really only gave me a sentence to add on my resume/CV that 'I DID A THING'.

And I suppose like me they'll just have to lie twist the truth and spin it the right way to have relevance to their actual degrees.

Life really is shit like that sadly.
.

Well given that an internship outside certain specific fields is not usually completed as part of a degree in this country, and in all the ones it is I can think of its mandatory for it to be very relivent. No these do not count as internships.

Hell to qualify as an internship in the UK technically it has to provide relevant experience and not be displacing a paid worker. This example pases neither test.

There are plenty of internships that play fast and lose with the rules but this one is beyond most I've heard of in the UK.

Sgt. Sykes:

Evil Smurf:
That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

Just to clarify (maybe you understood well): everyone else uses cheap manufacturing to sell cheaply. Apple uses cheap manufacturing to sell expensive products with a huge margin.

However, no other company who uses Foxconn have actually tried to make the situation any better. While other companies sat back and did jack shit when the controversies started rolling in and let Apple take all the blame, Apple actually went out and hired inspectors and tightened up regulation. Since then situations in Foxconn factories have reportedly improved, though of course not yet at decent standards.

Tanis:
Wait...
You're telling me the goods I buy, from 3rd World nations and/or countries with little to no regulation and massive amounts of corruption...
Is abusing their workforce?

Jesus Christ, that's insane!
There is no way that underdeveloped nations with little regulation exploit the workforce. Don't be ridiculous.

On a serious note, pretty much all the technology anyone owns is made in 3rd world countries and are made by children and co. with as little to no payment. The precious Nike and Adidas are made by people in Africa who are paid approximately $5 per month. Yet why is it only that the world makes a huge fuse about this when it's gaming?
The whole fucking economy of the western world is based on exploiting underdeveloped countries because those don't have regulations to protect the worker. The only way to change this is to completely destroy our economy and build it up with a different consumer mindset. Buy less, consume less and use the money on stuff made in your own country, that is, on the TV that's maybe 4-5 times more expensive than a TV made in China. But that's not gonna happen anytime soon because I don't see the average Joe giving up on his comfort.

Saltyk:
Honestly, this sounds less like human rights violation and more like a dick company and university are being dicks in a country that literally doesn't care at best. I've heard stories of people jumping off buildings in China and no one even reacting. Not sure if it's true, but it's damn shocking.

Psychobabble:
Well that explains how Sony is able to undersell the Xbone by such a large margin.

Did someone miss the part that says that 10% of Xbox One components are being made in the same factory?

No but you obviously missed the part where it looks like most of the PS4 is assembled there while only 10% of the Xbone is.
Never my intention to turn this into some xbone vs ps4 statement, simply that it looks like Sony is getting a big advantage out of what equates to slave labor that seems to be reflected in their pricing.

Psychobabble:

Saltyk:
Honestly, this sounds less like human rights violation and more like a dick company and university are being dicks in a country that literally doesn't care at best. I've heard stories of people jumping off buildings in China and no one even reacting. Not sure if it's true, but it's damn shocking.

Psychobabble:
Well that explains how Sony is able to undersell the Xbone by such a large margin.

Did someone miss the part that says that 10% of Xbox One components are being made in the same factory?

No but you obviously missed the part where it looks like most of the PS4 is assembled there while only 10% of the Xbone is.
Never my intention to turn this into some xbone vs ps4 statement, simply that it looks like Sony is getting a big advantage out of what equates to slave labor that seems to be reflected in their pricing.

Not that i care about the ps4 or xbone, but it's pretty much the same. Foxconn is not the only factory abusing people

And no fucks were given.

Seriously, I don't care where my goods come from and under which circumstances they have been produced. If I'd start with that, I'd end up living like an amish.

Sony, MS and Apple utilize slaves in China, Nintendo processes conflict minerals, Volkswagen closes local production facilities and moves them to low-wage countries and so on. So much injustice in the world, so little we can do about it...

In the end it's the price-benefit ratio that matters to me. Are the offered goods of acceptable quality and come to a reasonable price? If yes, I buy them, if no, screw them. I would never buy fair-trade stuff either just because the label claims the peasants in buttfuck-nowhere got a few cents more than their free market colleagues.

I'm sure this isn't really the discussion most people are having specifically, but China is way up there in "human rights" violations because their population doesn't have any. It's almost impressive that after being at war with itself so many times for this exact reason, they still don't have any. And now, while country has tried to position itself on the world stage while everyone is talking about their economy overtaking other nations, it's built on all of this! A country so over-populated that the value of any single person is completely moot.

There's a person WAITING to get into that internship program, probably thousands. They were told, "we've already got enough people" and these students went home and had to tell their parents their shame. Are you mad at Foxconn or the countries that allow these practices? Last I checked, they weren't building in any first world countries. You can feel shame about your phone being made this way, but there are people IN CHINA buying the phones made in these factories. They can SEE the people jumping out of windows. They aren't reading about something horrible in a far off land, THEY SEE THEM JUMP and then turn around and buy a new iPhone fresh off the assembly line.

I guess once we get worker robots this might all go away, after all, even unpaid slave labor can complain, run away or kill itself. The robots will be perfectly subservient, and those students can get an internship fixing the robots. Baby steps folks.

rusad:

Ed130:

Khanht Cope:

Incidentally, is Foxconn by any chance the place that reportedly installed nets to prevent their workers from killing themselves?

Yes it was.

image

Since theres no mandarin writing on the building, I would have thought it could have been any building with Foxconn shooped in. The guy with the T-shirt fabulously lifted makes me belive its real, or at least a well thought out shoop.

Foxconn use a western logo, mainly because most of its costumers are western businesses.

But if you really want Chinese characters then here you go.

image

image

I did unpaid work as well, in the UK. The held job seekers allowance ransom forcing people to work 'voluntary' jobs before it was branded as slavery by some third party or the EU (can't remember which, it was a report last year). Now many would think "Good, people should work for their benefits." which I agree however they were selling these Voluntary jobs as a way to get a job past without needing an interview by working for them for a number of weeks.

I spent 11 weeks, 8am-5pm, five days a week trying to impress Matalan for a 4 hour contract (which isn't even worth it as it would just cover my traveling costs, but I was desperate). which when I started had 4 available but it turns out they hired 4 people while i was working through the normal process a week into my labour and told the new employees to not tell me they had just been hired so they could keep me working as long as possible. I got half the amount of breaks then an employee and I were beneath them when it came to hierarchy so if the supervisor gave them a job they didn't like they could just dump it on me.

"This whole thing is just giant BS...

" the students are often assigned tasks that have no bearing whatsoever on their field of study"

And? That's how it is everywhere... At least they don't have to make coffee for the managers."
-some guy from facecrap comments

Me: Hay what about crApple? They assemble their stuff solely throuh foxconn and it's "slave workers".
This whole article is really the same BS we got from Kony2012 or just about any big charity (red cross,and others, I'm pointing at you and your poinyant (sick) spam in my yahoo mail.)!

Doom972:
Unfortunately, this is how all mass produced electronics are made. People will continue to ignore it since otherwise it would cost too much.

Indeed. Anyone who doesn't realize that at least some part of every electronic device they own was made in a sweatshop under working conditions we would find appalling is being willfully naive.

Anyone who complains about this but has never lifted a finger to complain to the people who actually make these decisions would be a bit of a hypocrite. People can pretend to be as outraged as they'd like, but most of us are complicit by never so much as firing off an email demanding that companies do better, and continuing to buy the things they produce in this manner.

Casual Shinji:
Is there any electric device that isn't made by forced Chinese labor though?

They have entire polluted wastelands over there where people recycle cell phones and laptops and whatnot. To the detriment of their own health.

It's the uncomfortable truth behind practically all our entertainment. But what can we do about it?

I want to referr you all to Futurama's "Third World Planet"

Charli:

Petromir:

MrHide-Patten:
Reading the headline I pictured 10 year olds, not "kids" majoring in finance. Click bait much, I just assume that any piece of technology is glued together with childs tears.

I would however be lying if I said I cared for the plights of people slightly younger than I am being stiffed at an internship. It's not like they're shackled to the workstations.

So being forced to do unpaid work of no relevance to their degree merely to complete their degrees is fine because they aren't children.

I dunno that sounds like an 'Internship' to me >_>'

...

I am a highly jaded and damaged individual. Ignore me. But really apart from the 'working on a conveyer belt sticking pieces of shit together', my own experiences with internships were really no different, what I did was completely irrelevant in terms of adding to my knowledge, and really only gave me a sentence to add on my resume/CV that 'I DID A THING'.

And I suppose like me they'll just have to lie twist the truth and spin it the right way to have relevance to their actual degrees.

Life really is shit like that sadly.

Psychobabble:
Well that explains how Sony is able to undersell the Xbone by such a large margin.

While that MIGHT be a part of it, I think it was universally agreed by our professional internet detectives that it might be because Microsoft is insisting on bundling the kinect with the bone rather than Sony who isn't... Either way they're both guilty of overseas labor abuse as is nearly every fucking electronics manufacturer on the planet.

I could not agree more. This artcle is pretty much spam and should not be on Escapist.

Steven Bogos:

You may want to take some time to think about exactly where your next-gen console is coming from.

Current-gen consoles were assembled/manufactured by Foxconn as well. There's a good chance parts of your PC or laptop were assembled/manufactured there. Many mobiles are assembled/manufactured there.

This has absolutely nothing to do with next-gen consoles and everything to to do with labour practices in general. In fact:

Casual Shinji:
Is there any electric device that isn't made by forced Chinese labor though?

And that's the thing. We get indignant at the iPhone or the PS4, but the fact is that they produce so many things it's damn weeeeeird to see people get indignant over a single instance. To be fair, though, I don't think most people are aware.

For example:

Adam Jensen:
I really try to stay clear from all things assembled at Foxconn, which is why I'll probably never own a smartphone. But is there any piece of technology that isn't assembled there? I remember reading that Apple moved it's production line from Foxconn to another company. Apple of all people. And I dislike them the most.

What did you type this up on? My last MoBo was Foxconn-assembled and I didn't even know.

It's not just mobiles.

Tanis:
Wait...
You're telling me the goods I buy, from 3rd World nations and/or countries with little to no regulation and massive amounts of corruption...
Is abusing their workforce?

And with labour laws in America under attack, we could be next!

VoidWanderer:
You would think, that with a population of 1 billion people that the 'grapevine' would actually be very effective in spreading worthwhile pieces of information... like 'Foxconn are exploiting people (again)

You're assuming a lot of options. Options the Chinese don't have. They may be well aware, but not really have much choice in the end. Hell, other universities may be doing this.

Keep in mind that Stephen Fry pulled up statistics on Chinese labour and while his defense of Foxconn sort of falls flat, it turns out they're slightly better in terms of things like salary and suicide rate. And remember, that's not a defense of Foxconn I'm making, but an indictment of the Chinese labour laws and business practices overall.

Again, the problem comes down to this: how does one avoid such products? It's not even JUST China, but Foxconn specifically is so megalithic. Hell, they're so pervasive, we probably all have Foxconn products in our homes.

Cybylt:

I think all of the corporate inquiries end with, "Well, we could stop it... but that would mean paying for labor. Eeehhhhh..."

Yup. Our electronics would cost slightly more. Slightly. And isn't a small cut in MSRP worth the blood of factory workers?

Psychobabble:
Well that explains how Sony is able to undersell the Xbone by such a large margin.

It really doesn't. The article already mentions the Xbone, and Microsoft used Foxconn for their last console as well.

In fact, the big news story a year or two back was about the iPhone, and we all know how cheap that is....

Evil Smurf:

Credossuck:

Evil Smurf:
That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

you did misread.
"except who? yep apple!" was reffering to the sell as cheaply as possible. . .

http://www.apple.com/supplierresponsibility/our-suppliers.html

Okay, I feel bad again.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/even-worse-than-foxconn-apple-rocked-by-child-labour-claims-8736504.html

Pegatron has been accused of forced child labor. So... yeah.

Evil Smurf:

Sgt. Sykes:
Foxconn is a cheap factory.

Most makers use Foxconn to assemble products to sell them as cheaply as possible.

Except who? Yep, Apple.

That makes me feel better about owning an apple computer and phone.

Nah, you are still funding virtual slave labor.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/07/29/apples-pegatron-china-labor-watch/

Pretty much every single company that can get away with this does this. Even Amazon is hard on its employees in the US. These people do not have a choice, else they would not be working there.

Also sony and microsoft may not want cheap but they want fast, demand is so high for sony especially this sort of thing was bound to happen.

I find it interesting that this news is being met with a basic sentiment of "meh" and a couple shrugs, now that it's a game console from Sony being made by Foxconn using questionable labor practices. I remember not so long ago that when it was Apple that was reported as using Foxconn, there was a major nerd-rage meltdown all over the place. A number of people opined without haste that such practices were precisely the reason they would never buy Apple products, as they typed such opinions on a computer built of parts (and possibly the whole computer, depending) that were made in a Foxconn factory. Many of these same people were then quick to lob the good ol' "iSheep" retort with reckless abandon, using the Foxconn manufacture of Apple products as justification for such insults. I find the double standard very interesting indeed.

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