PlayStation 4 Is Already Profitable, Sony Says

PlayStation 4 Is Already Profitable, Sony Says

PlayStation 4

It's only been on the shelf for six months but Sony President and CEO Kaz Hirai says the PlayStation 4 console is already pulling its own weight.

Historically, it hasn't been easy making money from a game console. Manufacturing costs are high and margins are tight, and there's always the worry about the Other Guy and how long he's willing to take it on the chin just to maintain a little bit of an edge in market share. Companies do it because a large user base allows them to make money on software, accessories, licensing and of course the long-term dream that the hardware itself will eventually start to make some money too, but you may recall that it took the PlayStation 3 more than three years before it stopped bleeding green.

Things are looking a lot better for the PS4, however. Speaking at a corporate strategy meeting earlier this week, Hirai described the launch of the console as "hugely successful" but said long-term success will depend on "how solidly we can continue to grow the installed base."

"In terms of game titles for PS4, as of April 13, 47 titles had been launched with a total of 20.5 million units being sold via retailers and over the network on the PlayStation Store," he said. "From a profitability perspective, PS4 is also already contributing profit on a hardware unit basis, establishing a very different business framework from that of previous platform businesses."

It was estimated last November that the PS4 costs $381 per unit to build, so the profit isn't much, but it's better than nothing and a massive improvement over the $805 per unit cost of the PlayStation 3, which sold for $599. Even better for Sony, that vastly-reduced cost allowed it to sell the PS4 at a substantially lower price than the Xbox One, which no doubt played a large part in Microsoft's recent decision to release a version of the console without the Kinect.

Source: Polygon

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As a PC gamer - looking at the state of the market right now...
1) The WiiU - I would just apologize and give up...
2) The XBox - I would refurbish the box as an upgraded TiVo ... and then given up.
3) The PS4 - seems ok, also the Vita somehow, magically, resurrected itself. :) "Time will tell", but it's looking good for them.

I just don't get it in the case of MS. Why would you hire such stupid people and let them design anything? TV integration?!? Kinnect, that they themselves just decided to dump?!? The crappy RAM that they were warned about by AMD reps. The insane marketing that tried to go all digital, all DRM?!? Double-u, tee, eff?!? :)

Well, it's profitable at a per unit basis, at least. I imagine it'll be some time before the entire project is profitable (in terms of making up for the initial R&D, marketing, etc costs and ongoing SG&A costs), but so far so good, I guess.

kanetsb:
As a PC gamer - looking at the state of the market right now...
1) The WiiU - I would just apologize and give up...
2) The XBox - I would refurbish the box as an upgraded TiVo ... and then given up.
3) The PS4 - seems ok, also the Vita somehow, magically, resurrected itself. :) "Time will tell", but it's looking good for them.

I just don't get it in the case of MS. Why would you hire such stupid people and let them design anything? TV integration?!? Kinnect, that they themselves just decided to dump?!? The crappy RAM that they were warned about by AMD reps. The insane marketing that tried to go all digital, all DRM?!? Double-u, tee, eff?!? :)

I imagine all these things sound great in the boardroom, among business professionals who've never played video games.

dyre:
I imagine it'll be some time before the entire project is profitable (in terms of making up for the initial R&D, marketing, etc costs and ongoing SG&A costs), but so far so good, I guess.

Given that the PS4 is built on a chipset that they bought directly from AMD and it uses existing PC architecture and components, I bet the development cost has been peanuts compared to the PS2 and 3.

It's still a lot of money no doubt, but I'd bet they planned on being 'in debt' to it for less than a year after the financial disaster of the PS3's first four years.

fix-the-spade:

dyre:
I imagine it'll be some time before the entire project is profitable (in terms of making up for the initial R&D, marketing, etc costs and ongoing SG&A costs), but so far so good, I guess.

Given that the PS4 is built on a chipset that they bought directly from AMD and it uses existing PC architecture and components, I bet the development cost has been peanuts compared to the PS2 and 3.

It's still a lot of money no doubt, but I'd bet they planned on being 'in debt' to it for less than a year after the financial disaster of the PS3's first four years.

Ah, I didn't know they outsourced so much of it. If they managed to get a good deal on the parts (and I guess they probably would, given their buying clout), then yeah, you're probably right.

Well the Wii U and the Xbone are selling like shit, SOMEBODY's making the profit.

Johnny Novgorod:
Well the Wii U and the Xbone are selling like shit, SOMEBODY's making the profit.

Didnt the Xbone sold more then the Xbox 360, a console that had a good launch?

From what I have seen so far everyone has been selling well enough with Sony taking a big advantage.

josemlopes:

Johnny Novgorod:
Well the Wii U and the Xbone are selling like shit, SOMEBODY's making the profit.

Didnt the Xbone sold more then the Xbox 360, a console that had a good launch?

From what I have seen so far everyone has been selling well enough with Sony taking a big advantage.

Nintendo is doing anything BUT well. Its shares have consistently dropped since 2007, having lost 82% of their value so far, it only managed to sell 5% of its target (Wii U) for the fiscal year and it has recently cut its Wii U sales forecast from 9 million to 2.8 million. That's only 30% of their original intentions. They don't think they'll even manage to make half as much money as they originally thought they would. They've recalculated their profit from 55 billion yen to a comparatively measly 25 billion. Hell, the president of the company himself has been quoted as saying "My duty, more than anything else, is to revive our business momentum".

And the Xbox One may have outsold the Xbox 360, but it's definitely not outselling the PS4, which is its actual competition. The PS4 is leading by a margin of 2 million sales. Not a particularly wide margin, but it's consistent and, well, if we're gauging profitability I would say he who profits more is the winner. And the Xbox One can't seem to do it, even though Titanfall was last month's best-selling game. PS4s just sell more at the moment. Why else do you think they decided to remove Kinect and slash $100 off their product? Do you think it was because they got bored of the extra money, or because people weren't giving them any?

dyre:

fix-the-spade:

dyre:
I imagine it'll be some time before the entire project is profitable (in terms of making up for the initial R&D, marketing, etc costs and ongoing SG&A costs), but so far so good, I guess.

Given that the PS4 is built on a chipset that they bought directly from AMD and it uses existing PC architecture and components, I bet the development cost has been peanuts compared to the PS2 and 3.

It's still a lot of money no doubt, but I'd bet they planned on being 'in debt' to it for less than a year after the financial disaster of the PS3's first four years.

Ah, I didn't know they outsourced so much of it. If they managed to get a good deal on the parts (and I guess they probably would, given their buying clout), then yeah, you're probably right.

Sony spent a fortune developing "Cell" (at least 2 billion US)...and Microsoft stole the tech within it (via IBM) and put it in the 360 in the shape of the "Xenon" processor...

Sony said years ago they would never do, or expose themselves to, the same again.

they were never going to make anything "bespoke" going forward.

you can be pretty certain the "development cost" of the PS4 was significantly less as a result...you can also be pretty certain that the PS3 was, in fact, the last "custom" games console hardware that we'll ever see...in no small part due to those lovely folks over at Redmond...

everything will effectively be "a consumer form factor PC" using "off the shelf" (and "behind the times") parts from now on.

Now all the games console needs is some games... I'd hate to see the "Playstaion has no games" meme pop up again, but thats the way it's looking. Granted Infamous Second Son was a lot better than Heavenly Sword, but I'm more cynical and jaded now.

Yeah, with the Wii U lagging behind from lack of interest, third party support, marketing, and first party games and XBone shitting itself onstage, I can't imagine it was all that hard to make a profit considering that it's the only console getting any real attention. Still, congrats. Good to hear someone's doing well.

Thats nice but I won't be touching one till it has BWC. The Wiiu looks better to me.

ZippyDSMlee:
Thats nice but I won't be touching one till it has BWC. The Wiiu looks better to me.

Then you will never touch one. It isn't happening. At least not for PS3 titles. You'll get PS2 and PS1 classics, but making the PS4 backwards compatible means putting in the old hardware with the new somehow, and bumping up the price significantly. The architecture is completely different from the PS3's cell processor. The only reason Wii U runs Wii titles, is because they both use PowerPC.

So, they make 'em for $381, and retailers sell 'em at $400. How are they splitting the $19 with the retailers?

fix-the-spade:

Given that the PS4 is built on a chipset that they bought directly from AMD and it uses existing PC architecture and components, I bet the development cost has been peanuts compared to the PS2 and 3.

It's still a lot of money no doubt, but I'd bet they planned on being 'in debt' to it for less than a year after the financial disaster of the PS3's first four years.

i dont remmeber where i read it so i cant give sources but i belive it was said that around 3 billions was spend on RnD for PS4. Thats in dollars.

Johnny Novgorod:
Well the Wii U and the Xbone are selling like shit, SOMEBODY's making the profit.

PC Manufacturers are. No, really, with new consoles spiking PC component sales as the DIY market is increasing rapidly PC part manufacturers are loving it.

josemlopes:

Didnt the Xbone sold more then the Xbox 360, a console that had a good launch?

From what I have seen so far everyone has been selling well enough with Sony taking a big advantage.

Xbox Done sold more at launch than Xbox 360. Xbox 360 launch wasnt good though, it was riddled by massive failures and other incompetence. The only reason they sold better than PS3 was because well, they were 1 year earlier and far cheaper. You know, like WiiU but actually had games.

Got to remmeber though that launch sales does not mean anything. The "Hardcore fans" will always buy at launch, first few millions will always be sold. Its the 10-50 million crowd that shows whether you product works or not. And what we see now is that PS4 is still in lack of supply in some places. Xbox Done never was. You know why they stopped touting sale numbers? yeah.....

Dead Century:

ZippyDSMlee:
Thats nice but I won't be touching one till it has BWC. The Wiiu looks better to me.

Then you will never touch one. It isn't happening. At least not for PS3 titles. You'll get PS2 and PS1 classics, but making the PS4 backwards compatible means putting in the old hardware with the new somehow, and bumping up the price significantly. The architecture is completely different from the PS3's cell processor. The only reason Wii U runs Wii titles, is because they both use PowerPC.

The PS3 might not be imposable but I have more PS2 games anyway. From now on if game companies want my money they will have to focus on BWC or I will just stick with the PC and emulation or 100-200 used consoles.

Well nice to see the obvious happening. A company that failed before should make sure its on the ball next time and Sony have done well in that regard. Microsoft, and Nintendo not so much, but there is always next time.

ZippyDSMlee:
The PS3 might not be imposable but I have more PS2 games anyway. From now on if game companies want my money they will have to focus on BWC or I will just stick with the PC and emulation or 100-200 used consoles.

So until they cater to you you'll just pirate their games? Well that isn't a good argument at all considering all those PC exclusives out there... what a dangerous viewpoint.

Rozalia1:
Well nice to see the obvious happening. A company that failed before should make sure its on the ball next time and Sony have done well in that regard. Microsoft, and Nintendo not so much, but there is always next time.

ZippyDSMlee:
The PS3 might not be imposable but I have more PS2 games anyway. From now on if game companies want my money they will have to focus on BWC or I will just stick with the PC and emulation or 100-200 used consoles.

So until they cater to you you'll just pirate their games? Well that isn't a good argument at all considering all those PC exclusives out there... what a dangerous viewpoint.

So buying used is somehow doing something illicit? Wow now that's a much more dangerous viewpoint.

ZippyDSMlee:

Rozalia1:
Well nice to see the obvious happening. A company that failed before should make sure its on the ball next time and Sony have done well in that regard. Microsoft, and Nintendo not so much, but there is always next time.

ZippyDSMlee:
The PS3 might not be imposable but I have more PS2 games anyway. From now on if game companies want my money they will have to focus on BWC or I will just stick with the PC and emulation or 100-200 used consoles.

So until they cater to you you'll just pirate their games? Well that isn't a good argument at all considering all those PC exclusives out there... what a dangerous viewpoint.

So buying used is somehow doing something illicit? Wow now that's a much more dangerous viewpoint.

Referring to emulation bud.

Rozalia1:

ZippyDSMlee:

Rozalia1:
Well nice to see the obvious happening. A company that failed before should make sure its on the ball next time and Sony have done well in that regard. Microsoft, and Nintendo not so much, but there is always next time.

So until they cater to you you'll just pirate their games? Well that isn't a good argument at all considering all those PC exclusives out there... what a dangerous viewpoint.

So buying used is somehow doing something illicit? Wow now that's a much more dangerous viewpoint.

Referring to emulation bud.

Not everything is available to be repurchased and I am sure as hell not re buying shit I already own. Besides by the time the PS3 is emulated as much as the PS2 is today we all will be dead. LOL

Rozalia1:
Well nice to see the obvious happening. A company that failed before should make sure its on the ball next time and Sony have done well in that regard. Microsoft, and Nintendo not so much, but there is always next time.

ZippyDSMlee:
The PS3 might not be imposable but I have more PS2 games anyway. From now on if game companies want my money they will have to focus on BWC or I will just stick with the PC and emulation or 100-200 used consoles.

So until they cater to you you'll just pirate their games? Well that isn't a good argument at all considering all those PC exclusives out there... what a dangerous viewpoint.

It's a perfectly valid and widespread viewpoint in this day and age. Pirating is meeting a demand, or it wouldn't exist to the extent it does currently, and if the company is ignoring that demand well bad luck. Why do you think Australia is the No1 pirating country of GoT?

I'd buy a Nintendo console if they remade Perfect Dark and Golden Eye, with no major gameplay changed(qte), even without a major graphical upgrade, which they both really really need, and I bet they would get alot of sales from the nostalgia of them. This money could then be used to make New games with new idea's instead of generic shooter 85 and mario does something 193.

Until they lift their game I wont be even buying a current gen console, and before you say anything note I use to download The Blacklist until 4 episodes in I realised it was being aired 1 episode behind on TV so i rewarded them by watching it and not downloading it. We need to reward behavior that is beneficial to the customer, and punish practices that aren't, and if companies hve to go bankrupt because of that, it's nothing but their own fault.

FumblesO'brian:
Not everything is available to be repurchased and I am sure as hell not re buying shit I already own. Besides by the time the PS3 is emulated as much as the PS2 is today we all will be dead. LOL

Justify it however you like, it doesn't change the simple fact of the matter.

FumblesO'brian:
It's a perfectly valid and widespread viewpoint in this day and age. Pirating is meeting a demand, or it wouldn't exist to the extent it does currently, and if the company is ignoring that demand well bad luck. Why do you think Australia is the No1 pirating country of GoT?

Valid and widespread among the self-entitled thereby meaning nothing. Its like stating that stealing cars being fine is perfectly valid and widespread opinion among car jackers, completely pointless.
Pirating is meeting a demand? Yeah a demand for free stuff but I'm sure you set yourself up for that one purposely.

No company has to seek you out and cater to you, if they don't want to open up the sale to you than that is within their rights. That is however no justification for breaking the law and stealing from them.
You want to pirate whatever do so no one can stop you, but don't stand here and try to put yourself on some moral high ground. They don't force you or anyone else to pirate by not having it available to you as you have no right to their games. It isn't food, you don't need to play video games to live.

FumblesO'brian:
I'd buy a Nintendo console if they remade Perfect Dark and Golden Eye, with no major gameplay changed(qte), even without a major graphical upgrade, which they both really really need, and I bet they would get alot of sales from the nostalgia of them. This money could then be used to make New games with new idea's instead of generic shooter 85 and mario does something 193.

Until they lift their game I wont be even buying a current gen console, and before you say anything note I use to download The Blacklist until 4 episodes in I realised it was being aired 1 episode behind on TV so i rewarded them by watching it and not downloading it. We need to reward behavior that is beneficial to the customer, and punish practices that aren't, and if companies hve to go bankrupt because of that, it's nothing but their own fault.

Generic shooter and Nintendo in the same sentence? Wanting a rehash of something, yet attacking Mario rehashes?
Nintendo makes plenty, and funds plenty of new stuff so I don't know where you're getting all this from.

While few would admit from among that crowd there are actually few who will "reward" to use your word a company for good business moves by ceasing to pirate, and start ponying up.

Rozalia1:

FumblesO'brian:
Not everything is available to be repurchased and I am sure as hell not re buying shit I already own. Besides by the time the PS3 is emulated as much as the PS2 is today we all will be dead. LOL

Justify it however you like, it doesn't change the simple fact of the matter.

Hold up there don't quote me for things I've not said.

Rozalia1:

FumblesO'brian:
It's a perfectly valid and widespread viewpoint in this day and age. Pirating is meeting a demand, or it wouldn't exist to the extent it does currently, and if the company is ignoring that demand well bad luck. Why do you think Australia is the No1 pirating country of GoT?

Valid and widespread among the self-entitled thereby meaning nothing. Its like stating that stealing cars being fine is perfectly valid and widespread opinion among car jackers, completely pointless.
Pirating is meeting a demand? Yeah a demand for free stuff but I'm sure you set yourself up for that one purposely.

You do release that 90% of pirating of GoT is done by non tech savvy families who use EZTV etc? This isn't about free stuff this is about availability in a "Global Market" as we keep being told that's what we live in. I'm not sure about how much you know about release dates around the world but in Australia they released season 3 on February 19th, 2014. 1 year difference. Oh and we can only watch it on TV through Foxtel on their most expensive package, They have taken legal action to stop Itunes Australia from making it available to stream at a lower price. Yes Itunes was CHEAPER.
You will always have a percentage of people that want it for free, that is a very small percentage, but if a couple of people can make something more available to you than a multi million/billion dollar company then something has to change.

With car jacking ??? And I guess fishing for sport and killing people can be both reasoned out under the same argument that I enjoy it. It's the same logical link. And sorry each time a either hear or read "you wont steal a car" https://torrentfreak.com/copyright-corruption-scandal-surrounds-anti-piracy-campaign-111201/

Hypocrisy in action!

Rozalia1:
No company has to seek you out and cater to you, if they don't want to open up the sale to you than that is within their rights. That is however no justification for breaking the law and stealing from them.
You want to pirate whatever do so no one can stop you, but don't stand here and try to put yourself on some moral high ground. They don't force you or anyone else to pirate by not having it available to you as you have no right to their games. It isn't food, you don't need to play video games to live.

But this isn't a demand from 1 person, this a demand from millions of people and if companies can't see that then they should suffer. Companies are there to cater for us not us to them, that's a fact, otherwise they wouldn't be profitable. With the internet changed the "playing field" companies need to adapt and they just aren't so pirating has become a major "issue".

FumblesO'brian:
I'd buy a Nintendo console if they remade Perfect Dark and Golden Eye, with no major gameplay changed(qte), even without a major graphical upgrade, which they both really really need, and I bet they would get alot of sales from the nostalgia of them. This money could then be used to make New games with new idea's instead of generic shooter 85 and mario does something 193.

Rozalia1:
Until they lift their game I wont be even buying a current gen console, and before you say anything note I use to download The Blacklist until 4 episodes in I realised it was being aired 1 episode behind on TV so i rewarded them by watching it and not downloading it. We need to reward behavior that is beneficial to the customer, and punish practices that aren't, and if companies hve to go bankrupt because of that, it's nothing but their own fault.

Generic shooter and Nintendo in the same sentence? Wanting a rehash of something, yet attacking Mario rehashes?
Nintendo makes plenty, and funds plenty of new stuff so I don't know where you're getting all this from.

This I release wen the wrong way sorry, I should've moved it towards the backwards compatibility. I understand that new consoles usually use different base systems than old models so the time it would take to mod old games to get them to work wouldn't be worth it. But the Xbone and PS4 both are just off the shelf PC packages plain and simple, Why not make a Emulator for them have the emulator cost 10$ and say 5$ for 20 games and then all problems are solved its income on games already made and for a nice reasonable price.

I disagree with you saying I wanted a rehash and that was my fault for miss wording before. But in terms of Mario rehash vs PD and 007GE neither of them have 10 sequals so your argument doesn't really work there sorry.

Rozalia1:
While few would admit from among that crowd there are actually few who will "reward" to use your word a company for good business moves by ceasing to pirate, and start ponying up.

But alot of people do! Steam, GoG, Origin(somewhat) all are accessible and cheap old and new games that you can instantly buy. We have rewarded these by making very profitable, which is the reward they are after. The games industry is struggling at the moment and alot of people are saying we will have another crash, but companies that have catered for the powerhouse that is the internet are doing rather well and laugh all the way to the bank. This is capitalism at work.

kanetsb:
As a PC gamer - looking at the state of the market right now...
1) The WiiU - I would just apologize and give up...
2) The XBox - I would refurbish the box as an upgraded TiVo ... and then given up.
3) The PS4 - seems ok, also the Vita somehow, magically, resurrected itself. :) "Time will tell", but it's looking good for them.

I just don't get it in the case of MS. Why would you hire such stupid people and let them design anything? TV integration?!? Kinnect, that they themselves just decided to dump?!? The crappy RAM that they were warned about by AMD reps. The insane marketing that tried to go all digital, all DRM?!? Double-u, tee, eff?!? :)

Hope xbox goes under or stops being a console. I learned that the low quality next gen games we have been getting is due to the xbox's lack of graphics RAM. Games had to be built around it so it can be supported. Its the same reason we have 50GB games, because they need "mega textures" to reuse.

If we are lucky, xbox will be abandoned and we will have true next gen games. Because Microsoft is fucking up way too much. I hope it sells so poorly that publishers just drop it.

No one on the other platforms should be punished for Microsoft's mistake.

Rozalia1:

ZippyDSMlee:

Rozalia1:
Well nice to see the obvious happening. A company that failed before should make sure its on the ball next time and Sony have done well in that regard. Microsoft, and Nintendo not so much, but there is always next time.

So until they cater to you you'll just pirate their games? Well that isn't a good argument at all considering all those PC exclusives out there... what a dangerous viewpoint.

So buying used is somehow doing something illicit? Wow now that's a much more dangerous viewpoint.

Referring to emulation bud.

You do know you don't have to pirate anything to use emulation, right? Sure, plenty of people do, but a lot also don't.

Ultratwinkie:

Hope xbox goes under or stops being a console. I learned that the low quality next gen games we have been getting is due to the xbox's lack of graphics RAM. Games had to be built around it so it can be supported.

I'll write a bit, even though it's probably going to be very boring and nobody will read it. :)

The problem is actually very simple. Both the box and the PS4 use the same architecture with some minor tweeking here and there. It's an AMD low speed multicore CPU combined with a GPU (aka. an Accelerate Processor Unit -APU- from the AMD Fusion Project). Essentially, a medium range PC (some say a bit below). This setup however, has one issue - it uses common RAM for both the CPU and the GPU part of the APU. This way you get some very nice cooperation between the GFX generating part of the computer and the computational part (ie. you don't have to copy that much data between the system memory and the graphics memory on some card, like in a traditional PC - the PCI-e bus is no longer needed). However - both use the same RAM at the same time and thus need it to be VERY fast (you still have just a single memory controller). Any modern GFX card these days uses GDDR5 to ensure highest throughput (those massive textures used today, need a lot of mem bandwidth during rendering).

AMD said - put in GDDR5 and it should work fine (it still doesn't, as the PS4 can really drop the framerate in most of it's games so far).
Sony did it...
MS put in traditional DDR3 used in PCs as the CPUs memory - something that is just a bit below the throughput, required to texture polygons at high resolutions and be able to compute using the CPU part of the system at the same time. This is why rendering at a lower resolution actually increases the FPS on the Box - you can get away with slightly smaller textures. They tried adding something called ESRAM to buffer the memory operations but... well, it works as well as we can see so far. :)

TL;DR - XBox'es RAM is too slow, it's too late to fix it and everyone in the industry knows it. We're stuck with sub-par equipment and it's going to influence the quality of games for the next ~3 years.

If anyone remembers the design of the Amiga computers it used "Slow RAM" (or later on, Chip RAM) - we're dealing with this kind of problem again. Concurrency between chips to a single memory channel. But hey - it is a lot cheaper to make. :)

FumblesO'brian:
Hold up there don't quote me for things I've not said.

Apologies it was in response to ZippyDSMlee.

FumblesO'brian:
You do release that 90% of pirating of GoT is done by non tech savvy families who use EZTV etc? This isn't about free stuff this is about availability in a "Global Market" as we keep being told that's what we live in. I'm not sure about how much you know about release dates around the world but in Australia they released season 3 on February 19th, 2014. 1 year difference. Oh and we can only watch it on TV through Foxtel on their most expensive package, They have taken legal action to stop Itunes Australia from making it available to stream at a lower price. Yes Itunes was CHEAPER.
You will always have a percentage of people that want it for free, that is a very small percentage, but if a couple of people can make something more available to you than a multi million/billion dollar company then something has to change.

With car jacking ??? And I guess fishing for sport and killing people can be both reasoned out under the same argument that I enjoy it. It's the same over exajuated link. And sorry each time a either hear or read "you wont steal a car" https://torrentfreak.com/copyright-corruption-scandal-surrounds-anti-piracy-campaign-111201/

Hypocrisy in action!

How you feel on the matter does not give you reason to break the law.

Hypocrisy? And? Them breaking a law doesn't give you carte blanche to do whatever you like.

FumblesO'brian:
But this isn't a demand from 1 person, this a demand from millions of people and if companies can't see that then they should suffer. Companies are there to cater for us not us to them, that's a fact, otherwise they wouldn't be profitable. With the internet changed the "playing field" companies need to adapt and they just aren't so pirating has become a major "issue".

So if a company cannot fill a demand be it due to lack of resources, unprofitably, or even simply because foreign government forbids it...they deserve to suffer. I think you need to get over yourself if you think every company in the world is your slave, and that they deserve some sort of punishment if they don't get on their knees for you.

FumblesO'brian:
This I release wen the wrong way sorry, I should've moved it towards the backwards compatibility. I understand that new consoles usually use different base systems than old models so the time it would take to mod old games to get them to work wouldn't be worth it. But the Xbone and PS4 both are just off the shelf PC packages plain and simple, Why not make a Emulator for them have the emulator cost 10$ and say 5$ for 20 games and then all problems are solved its income on games already made and for a nice reasonable price.

I disagree with you saying I wanted a rehash and that was my fault for miss wording before. But in terms of Mario rehash vs PD and 007GE neither of them have 10 sequals so your argument doesn't really work there sorry.

Sony has Playstation Now, and Microsoft will likely push their own attempt soon. Secondly if top of the range PCs can't emulate PS3 how in bloody hell do you expect the PS4 to do it? You are literally asking the impossible, and ignoring the only alternative to BC Sony have presented.

Doesn't change the fact you attacked rehashes, and asked for one in the same sentence.

FumblesO'brian:
But alot of people do! Steam, GoG, Origin(somewhat) all are accessible and cheap old and new games that you can instantly buy. We have rewarded these by making very profitable, which is the reward they are after. The games industry is struggling at the moment and alot of people are saying we will have another crash, but companies that have catered for the powerhouse that is the internet are doing rather well and laugh all the way to the bank. This is capitalism at work.

Laughing to the bank? Those companies are themselves not far from the edge, perhaps slightly further away but still near it. If crash happens they go to, their practices won't save them they'll die all the same.

KarmaTheAlligator:

You do know you don't have to pirate anything to use emulation, right? Sure, plenty of people do, but a lot also don't.

How many do you wager just pirate? And how many do you wager have a console to extract the BIOS from, a legal disc to either run or get the ISO from, or in the case of cartridges they own something to slot them into (or the means to digitize the cartridge's data).

Rozalia1:

KarmaTheAlligator:

You do know you don't have to pirate anything to use emulation, right? Sure, plenty of people do, but a lot also don't.

How many do you wager just pirate? And how many do you wager have a console to extract the BIOS from, a legal disc to either run or get the ISO from, or in the case of cartridges they own something to slot them into (or the means to digitize the cartridge's data).

I already acknowledged that plenty do, but it's not a reason to equate emulation to piracy.

KarmaTheAlligator:

I already acknowledged that plenty do, but it's not a reason to equate emulation to piracy.

You're arguing very minor details, its obvious I was referring to illegal emulation which is widespread (you can argue this I suppose but...), and sickeningly considered completely correct/justified by a large group of people. From pirates to all those youtube "superstars".

Its pirating simple as, and likely a gateway to pirating of modern games too. In fact I'd wager a good portion of those emulation criminals are also pirating all the latest games too.
I suppose you can argue that in regards to the first world, but there are two other worlds out there and in those I can safely sit correct without question.

Rozalia1:

KarmaTheAlligator:

I already acknowledged that plenty do, but it's not a reason to equate emulation to piracy.

You're arguing very minor details, its obvious I was referring to illegal emulation which is widespread (you can argue this I suppose but...), and sickeningly considered completely correct/justified by a large group of people. From pirates to all those youtube "superstars".

Its pirating simple as, and likely a gateway to pirating of modern games too. In fact I'd wager a good portion of those emulation criminals are also pirating all the latest games too.
I suppose you can argue that in regards to the first world, but there are two other worlds out there and in those I can safely sit correct without question.

Meh pirating is the direct sale of illicitly copied media everything else is fans being fans. Tho in a perfect world I'd like revenue sharing IE 60% of profits go to an organization that devies up the money amongst the IP owners. Sadly what we have these days is closer to intellectual tyranny than anything else.IMO you can not block the flow of information/inspiration just because no one is making money off it. By all means shut down those making an illicit revenue everything else is fandom and or information and or inspiration which creates more IP than sticking to a tyrannical intellectual rights system which tends to steal things from the bottom up as most top heavy systems do.

Is it bad that the first thing that came to me was that Sony should have invested in better hardware from the start? It seems way too early to be turning a profit.

Rozalia1:

KarmaTheAlligator:

I already acknowledged that plenty do, but it's not a reason to equate emulation to piracy.

You're arguing very minor details, its obvious I was referring to illegal emulation which is widespread (you can argue this I suppose but...), and sickeningly considered completely correct/justified by a large group of people. From pirates to all those youtube "superstars".

Its pirating simple as, and likely a gateway to pirating of modern games too. In fact I'd wager a good portion of those emulation criminals are also pirating all the latest games too.
I suppose you can argue that in regards to the first world, but there are two other worlds out there and in those I can safely sit correct without question.

With all due respect mate, didnt you in another thread defend shills and lying :P?
There is more research (and general opinion) supporting that mods affect sales then there is to emulation and piracy ...

OT:
To be fair, Sony kinda deserve this. Whilst I dont support their choice of RAM ( 8 GB DDR 3 and 2-3 GDDR 5 would have been better) they have built the best console this gen.
That and MS and Nintendo basically failing the basic things... which is sad. I mean, several of my friends are gamers, and of the kind that does not keep up to date on hardware or such details of the industry, but do know games.
They did not even know the Wii U exists. And they did know the PS4 exists.

I'm glad Sony is seeing some profit. They definitely won this gen's crown for best console.

With this being said, the prices on PS4's are going down too. Hell, I just found an online store selling brand spanking new PS4's for $295 thanks to their 15% off everything sale:

http://iconicbargains.zhuncity.com/node/477753

Charcharo:
With all due respect mate, didnt you in another thread defend shills and lying :P?
There is more research (and general opinion) supporting that mods affect sales then there is to emulation and piracy ...

And? So me defending shills means I can't attack pirates? Nice logic.

Pray tell than why you won't provide me with this evidence than? Secondly general opinion goes beyond your particular circle.

Rozalia1:

Charcharo:
With all due respect mate, didnt you in another thread defend shills and lying :P?
There is more research (and general opinion) supporting that mods affect sales then there is to emulation and piracy ...

And? So me defending shills means I can't attack pirates? Nice logic.

Pray tell than why you won't provide me with this evidence than? Secondly general opinion goes beyond your particular circle.

Good. So we both agree that emulation is not a problem then :) .

No, it is not a problem. I just cant decide whether I like your amoral nature or really do not. I guess its complex.

 

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