Dead Rising 3 PC Version Will Run Into Issues Above 30 FPS, Says Capcom

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Dead Rising 3 PC Version Will Run Into Issues Above 30 FPS, Says Capcom

Capcom says players can unlock the game's 30 FPS cap on the PC version, but will probably run into problems if they do.

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Excuse me a second.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I am amused by the incompetence.

But is it really incompetence, or just lazyness? :)

Good move Capcom, also the minimal specs they posted are ridiculous

I would just like to point out the FPS-related difficulties with Dark Souls 2 on PC, which can be seen in comparison on this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVrlwnYkRMI&feature=youtu.be

In this game, they have tied much of game logic to frame rate. It should be noted that the PC version of the game is set to 60 frames by design, which requires modding or system-limiting to change back to 30 as there is no in-game option (30fps displays the console-standard behaviors).

Some other things were not covered by this video as they are hard to actually see. In particular, the invincibility time during a roll or backstep is cut in half when playing at 60 FPS, and certain enemy attacks that have the ability to track the player during their animation now have a ghosting effect described as "shockwaves" by the playerbase.

You can likely expect similar issues in Dead Rising 3. I wouldn't expect anything too crazy, unless something moving at twice the expected speed (not everything will) manages to clip through a solid object in some way, but there could be some game-breaking speed-related issues nontheless

At this stage I'm remembering a Totalbiscuit episode where he unlocked the fps cap on a racing game and suddenly the game went at lightning speed to an unplayable degree. So, takin' bets: We gonna get that kind of shenanigans or just odd glitches here and there?

Weresquirrel:
At this stage I'm remembering a Totalbiscuit episode where he unlocked the fps cap on a racing game and suddenly the game went at lightning speed to an unplayable degree. So, takin' bets: We gonna get that kind of shenanigans or just odd glitches here and there?

Odd glitches (mostly funnily acting physics from what I understand). The NFS game you mentioned actually tied the entire gameplay to the framerate with the exception of the other cars - hence why that game went insane.
DR3 seems to only have some physics and zombie-animations tied to 30 FPS (if I got that right) so it should be fully playable at 60 but you probably notice some rather obvious oddities.

At this point im just curious to what kind of issues uncapping the framerate can introduce.

Weresquirrel:
At this stage I'm remembering a Totalbiscuit episode where he unlocked the fps cap on a racing game and suddenly the game went at lightning speed to an unplayable degree. So, takin' bets: We gonna get that kind of shenanigans or just odd glitches here and there?

Well, sure, we developed and ported the game, but how does it work? We just don't know. We simply have no way of knowing how it works, or how it will work if you unlock the framerate. What is QA? We simply don't know.

Well, that just explains so much about today gamedev industry.

man thats some lousy programming, i think dark souls and need for speed also have some seriously problems once the framerate is unlocked

This is kind of sad to be fair, so basically buy dead rising 2 as it works? Dark Souls 1 had a few problems if you unlocked framerate as you sometimes would fall through the world when sliding down a ladder, shitty ? yes . should have done better? also yes but they get a small ammount of slack as they had never done a pc game before and told everyone beforehand that they did not know what they where doing but they would do there best, they have also learned form there mistake and dark souls 2 works very very well on pc. Capcom as made loads of PC games for years so they should know better.

Its just shitty programming and there is no excuse for it, its not like we are back on the IBM 5150 and the games are locked to the clock rate of the CPU , this is 2014 and its totally 100% unacceptable.

Do not buy

Defective by design.

Translation : We are incompetent as fuck at PC porting... and we don't give a fuck, suck our dick, we're motherfucking Capcom.

Jeez how incompetent can you get?
I mean, it seems like most AAA developers have gone to shit. They cant even code their games right...

erbi79:
But is it really incompetence, or just lazyness? :)

Good move Capcom, also the minimal specs they posted are ridiculous

It's neither. See, it's clear the consoles are where CAPCOM is aiming to get their revenue from, less competition in the market place and an audience that will more readily spend full price, as opposed to a PC consumer who has more choices and...is more apt to wait until that sucka drops to a reasonable price.

So they naturally don't want the PC version to be better than the console version. Which of course is a classically shortsighted decision from CAPCOM.

Hence they're deliberately hamstringing it. In fact given that the only real diff between PC's and consoles is more the power behind them and PC's have that hands down, it's very likely that they have in fact booby-trapped the game to produce problems when run at a speed greater than 30fps.

Now mind you the Unlimited MHz disaster has been common in PC games for sometime, that is when games are running way faster than the programmer intended which can create issues in multithreading , example, it can mean the models loading in before the extures have loaded.. But this issue is a known and any skilled programmer can address this. Hence why the problem chiefly pops up in older games.

Charcharo:
Jeez how incompetent can you get?
I mean, it seems like most AAA developers have gone to shit. They cant even code their games right...

It's not the developers being incompetent. Console games have been FPS-capped for a long time, where the speed of the game is directly tied to how many frames are displayed. This has been done since pretty much the dawn of time, and many devs who design a game in such a way encounter these issues when porting to PC (especially given lack of experience in the matter). It's really not that surprising. (This is even funnier when running emulated games that have framerate tied with the rate of the gameplay, as there's LITERALLY nothing you can do about it)

Either way, they should do better, but it's not a "new" issue in any manner of speaking. I question the attempt at a port in the first place given these problems exist.

I really couldn't care less about Dead Rising 3, but if Rockstar decide for some reason decide not to give GTA V's port to the guys who ported Max Payne 3 and they fuck up like this then I will be pissed. Still really bad that a PC port in 2014 still has a big chance of being terrible is just unforgivable, especially for a company who's made ports before.

What this basically means is a shit-ton of the moment to moment gameplay is tied to fps. PC devs have known since the fucking 90s not to do bullshit like this. Its basically the modern equivalent of games from the 80s tying game speed to CPU clock speed: Fucking stupid and reeking of sheer braindead incompetence. We saw this shit with Dark Souls where if uncapped the framerate you were very likely to fall through the floor (among other problems). I don't like layoffs in any situation, but the people responsible for enforcing and enabling this fucktarded code policy need to be fired and barred from ever holding a job dealing with computer code again.

My god... developers need to re-learn that you should NEVER tie ingame physics into the framerate!

alj:
This is kind of sad to be fair, so basically buy dead rising 2 as it works? Dark Souls 1 had a few problems if you unlocked framerate as you sometimes would fall through the world when sliding down a ladder, shitty ? yes . should have done better? also yes but they get a small ammount of slack as they had never done a pc game before and told everyone beforehand that they did not know what they where doing but they would do there best, they have also learned form there mistake and dark souls 2 works very very well on pc. Capcom as made loads of PC games for years so they should know better.

Its just shitty programming and there is no excuse for it, its not like we are back on the IBM 5150 and the games are locked to the clock rate of the CPU , this is 2014 and its totally 100% unacceptable.

Do not buy

Defective by design.

Dark Souls 1 had no option to go to 60 FPS, you had to force it with a mod. Yet it still gave FAR less issues than Dark Souls 2 running at 60 FPS. I played the entirety of DS1 at 60FPS and had zero issues at all. Playing DS2 at 60 makes weapons degrade twice as fast and removes half of the invincibility frames from your dodges, completely screwing the game balance.

Sure. it's got a much better interface and better PC native controls but the frame rate caused far less issues in the first game.

Sotanaht:
I would just like to point out the FPS-related difficulties with Dark Souls 2 on PC, which can be seen in comparison on this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVrlwnYkRMI&feature=youtu.be

Just do you know, you shouldn't use YouTube videos for frame rate comparisons if they show gameplay. YouTube doesn't support 60 FPS, never has, and any videos rendered at 60 FPS are scaled down to 30 during the processing part of uploading a video.

OT: I will say the same thing as always: as long as the frame rate is consistent then I'm fine with 30 FPS. What's the point of having a high frame rate if it jumps around wildly. 60 is nice and is better, I'm not denying that. But I don't care if I'm playing a game at 30 or 60 at all, and I adapt just fine to it.

matrix3509:
What this basically means is a shit-ton of the moment to moment gameplay is tied to fps. PC devs have known since the fucking 90s not to do bullshit like this. Its basically the modern equivalent of games from the 80s tying game speed to CPU clock speed: Fucking stupid and reeking of sheer braindead incompetence. We saw this shit with Dark Souls where if uncapped the framerate you were very likely to fall through the floor (among other problems). I don't like layoffs in any situation, but the people responsible for enforcing and enabling this fucktarded code policy need to be fired and barred from ever holding a job dealing with computer code again.

I just completed Dark Souls at 60fps and never had any of those sorts of problems, but I agree that they're there. I think it's worse in DaS2 since if your computer can run it 60FPS isn't optional and it basically forces you into playing the hardcore mode of features that are already bullshit (why would you tie weapon degradation to the framerate?!).

Why am I not surprised. It's just amateur to do crap like that. That says to me that they had never planned a PC release. It was never intended to play on any console except for the Xbox One. If it were planned then they would have accounted for this platform when they were originally making the game. It didn't sell as well as MS lead them to believe it would and now they are probably scrambling to make some kind of profit on an otherwise decent game.

You know, I'm surprised there hasn't been more coding houses spring up to offer consulting/coding expertise for these companies that can't code worth a damn on the computer.

[Kathleen]Heeeeeeeeeeey everybody! Are you making a video game, and think that you're going to want to do a computer version as well? Well, come on down to Coders'R'Us, where you can pay us money and we can show you how you're going to mess it up.[/Kathleen]

They tied the physics and AI to the FRAMERATE?

WTF?

Only Dwarf Fortress gets away with that! D:

But then again, I quite enjoy "wild and crazy", so maybe it'll be worth it after all.

EDIT: lol at everyone bitching about "bad ports".

This isn't a porting issue, it's a design decision chosen at the start of the project that was made with only fixed framerates in mind. No amount of porting wizardry can fix this, they have to rewrite the physics and AI components from the ground up.

EDIT EDIT: Guys... there's actually nothing wrong with the tying other systems to the framerate, assuming that you can force a consistent framerate. Stop acting like it's a terrible decision and they should be burned for it. My Dwarf Fortress comment was meant to be humorously hypocritical.

Sure, it would be nice if they could adjust their systems to a forced 60 or even 45 FPS (and before anyone asks, NO, linear scaling is not an option), but let's not act like the game is somehow unplayable because of its 30 FPS cap.

Neronium:
OT: I will say the same thing as always: as long as the frame rate is consistent then I'm fine with 30 FPS. What's the point of having a high frame rate if it jumps around wildly. 60 is nice and is better, I'm not denying that. But I don't care if I'm playing a game at 30 or 60 at all, and I adapt just fine to it.

I agree. Hell I recently beat Deadly Premonition on ps3 even it's frame rate wasn't as bad some pc games I've played that run at 45fps for one minute than shit through the floor when some AI's walk on screen and I have to tweak settings. Is it really that bad to play a game at 30fps? It would probably be more noticable on a monitor than a tv. I get that some people get motion sickness but that's not a majority of people

Whatever, if it runs well then I don't care. But since it's Capcom I'm not really holding my hopes up.

Vareoth:
Whatever, if it runs well then I don't care. But since it's Capcom I'm not really holding my hopes up.

Well, it's running at 30, so, there's never really "Well".

The Lunatic:

Vareoth:
Whatever, if it runs well then I don't care. But since it's Capcom I'm not really holding my hopes up.

Well, it's running at 30, so, there's never really "Well".

My apologies. Perhaps I should have used the words tolerable, passable and mediocre instead.

Why the hell would you tie stuff like physics into the FPS rate? We stopped doing that during the DOS era because its a shitty idea. Plus its quite frankly insulting that this guy thinks that we can't see the difference on PC in 2014 between 30 and 60fps.

Vareoth:

The Lunatic:

Vareoth:
Whatever, if it runs well then I don't care. But since it's Capcom I'm not really holding my hopes up.

Well, it's running at 30, so, there's never really "Well".

My apologies. Perhaps I should have used the words tolerable, passable and mediocre instead.

Yeah, I'm kinda of the same opinion.

I'd greatly prefer a 60+FPs experience. And I won't buy a full-price 30FPS game, but, if it goes on sale for super-cheap like the last game did. I'll consider it.

Reminds me of Mass Effect 3's multiplayer, where like Sotanaht (post 4) noted above with Dark Souls 2, much of the game's logic was tied to the framerate. In ME3, the most Massive Effect of this was the enemy targeting and firing. The console version's 30 fps delivered enemies that were a lot slower to do everything, whereas the 60 fps PC version's foes were a lot deadlier. People noticed this and took it steps further, playing with the fps limiter in the game files in order to achieve very bizarre experiences.

On 10 fps, you could run all around the map and take no damage from anything, as enemies were "thinking" too slow to complete checks for line of sight, aim, and fire before you were long gone.

On 90 or 120 fps (don't remember how high they got it), players would be cut down mercilessly and almost instantly by enemies that could "think" a lot faster, resulting in hilariously fast team wipes.

Ok... between this and the unGODLY system requirements (seriously. The Xbone does NOT have the power of a 7870 so why is that the minimum requirement?), I think Capcom is trying to sabotage the PC port to make it do poorly to make some sort of point about how it's not worth it to make PC ports.

Tin foil hats, anyone? Though I think it's more plausible than most conspiracy theories.

EDIT: Also, game programming 101, NEVER TIE YOUR GAME LOGIC TO FRAMERATE! Framerate is unstable and variable no matter where the game is, tying any game logic or physics to the framerate is one of the stupidest things you can do as a game developer. Anyone who does it needs to be fired and go back to school on this.

And I am reminded of this:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/8545-Shaming-PC-Ports-Because-Why-Not

Would it really be so hard to delay the release just a little bit, work with the code, and do some bug fixing?

Gylukios:
Reminds me of Mass Effect 3's multiplayer, where like Sotanaht (post 4) noted above with Dark Souls 2, much of the game's logic was tied to the framerate. In ME3, the most Massive Effect of this was the enemy targeting and firing. The console version's 30 fps delivered enemies that were a lot slower to do everything, whereas the 60 fps PC version's foes were a lot deadlier. People noticed this and took it steps further, playing with the fps limiter in the game files in order to achieve very bizarre experiences.

On 10 fps, you could run all around the map and take no damage from anything, as enemies were "thinking" too slow to complete checks for line of sight, aim, and fire before you were long gone.

On 90 or 120 fps (don't remember how high they got it), players would be cut down mercilessly and almost instantly by enemies that could "think" a lot faster, resulting in hilariously fast team wipes.

This explains SO MUCH of my problems with ME3's MP. How did I never find this out...

But yea... you'd think tying ANYTHING to Framerate or system clock speed... just a terrible awful idea. I don't claim to be an expert programmer, but hell, I learned this before I finished high school.

Revolutionary:
Translation : We are incompetent as fuck at PC porting... and we don't give a fuck, suck our dick, we're motherfucking Capcom.

And you'll buy it anyway, so we have absolutely no reason to change or care.

BigTuk:
So they naturally don't want the PC version to be better than the console version. Which of course is a classically shortsighted decision from CAPCOM.

Hence they're deliberately hamstringing it. In fact given that the only real diff between PC's and consoles is more the power behind them and PC's have that hands down, it's very likely that they have in fact booby-trapped the game to produce problems when run at a speed greater than 30fps.

Hanlon's Razor comes to mind. Never attribute to malice what can be attributed to incompetence.

More likely they're just stupid enough to tie stuff to framerate like the idiots that they are. Just like several other console developers do, as noted this has caused problems with games like Dark Souls 2, Mass Effect 3, and Need For Speed: Pursuit. It's not new, but if I had a guess, it's probably one of the least hardware demanding solutions, used because of anemic console specs, for games that are intended to be console exclusive.

My guess is they had an exclusivity deal with microsoft that had some sales stipulation "if it doesn't make X sales by Y date, exclusivity is off and we can port it elsewhere to make our money back", they just never thought it would come to that, but it did because the xbone didn't sell enough.

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