George R.R. Martin Pulling Back From Game of Thrones Season Five

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George R.R. Martin Pulling Back From Game of Thrones Season Five

The author of A Song of Ice and Fire plans to spend less time on the Game of Thrones set and more time writing his next book.

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Sometimes it seems like George is the only person on this planet who still thinks that he will have a say in how the series or the books will end.

Geez, it took this long of me saying "Get back to work" before he decides to actually try finishing the damn series, hearing this bull he shovels at the fans all the time. Well, we know damn sure if he dies, it won't with him, 'cause he's not just an ass, but a lazy ass.

FalloutJack:
Geez, it took this long of me saying "Get back to work" before he decides to actually try finishing the damn series, hearing this bull he shovels at the fans all the time. Well, we know damn sure if he dies, it won't with him, 'cause he's not just an ass, but a lazy ass.

Woah, how rude? This guy doesn't owe you anything, he's not obligated to finish his book series at all, what gives you the right to call him a lazy ass?

OT: Makes sense. It seems to me that the show is going completely off in its own direction anyway[1], so I'd imagine the author's input is becoming less and less relevant. At any rate, if it means the books will come out faster, this is good news to me. I've all but given up on the TV show at this point, sadly.

[1]

Wow, a lot of unexpected anger in this thread. I'm just glad that GRRM is buckling down and focusing on producing the story, rather than managing it's transition from book to screen.

Thunderous Cacophony:
Wow, a lot of unexpected anger in this thread.

More than a few fans are bent out of shape over how the t.v series has diverged from the source material. The idea that the show will be finished before the books no doubt terrifies them because they won't know which is based off which. Thus they won't be able to lord over the fans of the series just how superior the books might be. Their world has ended.

FalloutJack:
Geez, it took this long of me saying "Get back to work" before he decides to actually try finishing the damn series, hearing this bull he shovels at the fans all the time. Well, we know damn sure if he dies, it won't with him, 'cause he's not just an ass, but a lazy ass.

How dare he do anything other than spend 24 hours a day writing the book? We don't want the book to be good, we want it now!

Honestly, calm down a little. You've bought his previous books, and he's under no obligation to provide you with another. He's under no obligation to finish the series if he doesn't want to, especially not now that the TV show will end the story whatever happens. He doesn't want to, and indeed shouldn't, spend all his time writing Ice and Fire: he appears at conventions and goes on tours because he likes his fans - and, in theory, you are one of those fans. George R. R. Martin is not your bitch.

For the record, I'm not saying it's a bad idea for him to focus more on the book - I want to read it as much as anyone. I just get sick of people whining about how Martin personally owes them another book; if you believed how the internet talks about him, you'd think he only had weeks to live. I am a little saddened that he won't write an episode for next season though, because his episodes have generally been among the best ones.

Lunncal:
Woah, how rude? This guy doesn't owe you anything, he's not obligated to finish his book series at all, what gives you the right to call him a lazy ass?

He might be rockin' the jovial grandpa look, but he's far from an all around nice guy (like when he lost to Harry Potter ages ago). I don't care about the lazy part though.

Anachronism:

FalloutJack:
Geez, it took this long of me saying "Get back to work" before he decides to actually try finishing the damn series, hearing this bull he shovels at the fans all the time. Well, we know damn sure if he dies, it won't with him, 'cause he's not just an ass, but a lazy ass.

How dare he do anything other than spend 24 hours a day writing the book? We don't want the book to be good, we want it now!

Honestly, calm down a little. You've bought his previous books, and he's under no obligation to provide you with another. He's under no obligation to finish the series if he doesn't want to, especially not now that the TV show will end the story whatever happens. He doesn't want to, and indeed shouldn't, spend all his time writing Ice and Fire: he appears at conventions and goes on tours because he likes his fans - and, in theory, you are one of those fans. George R. R. Martin is not your bitch.

For the record, I'm not saying it's a bad idea for him to focus more on the book - I want to read it as much as anyone. I just get sick of people whining about how Martin personally owes them another book; if you believed how the internet talks about him, you'd think he only had weeks to live. I am a little saddened that he won't write an episode for next season though, because his episodes have generally been among the best ones.

Then GRRM should have had "I may not bother finishing this series read at your own risk" on the cover of the fist book and then we wouldn't be here as far less people would have paid money for it.

If you start a book series those who buy it pay money on the promise of it's completion.

youji itami:

Anachronism:

FalloutJack:
Geez, it took this long of me saying "Get back to work" before he decides to actually try finishing the damn series, hearing this bull he shovels at the fans all the time. Well, we know damn sure if he dies, it won't with him, 'cause he's not just an ass, but a lazy ass.

How dare he do anything other than spend 24 hours a day writing the book? We don't want the book to be good, we want it now!

Honestly, calm down a little. You've bought his previous books, and he's under no obligation to provide you with another. He's under no obligation to finish the series if he doesn't want to, especially not now that the TV show will end the story whatever happens. He doesn't want to, and indeed shouldn't, spend all his time writing Ice and Fire: he appears at conventions and goes on tours because he likes his fans - and, in theory, you are one of those fans. George R. R. Martin is not your bitch.

For the record, I'm not saying it's a bad idea for him to focus more on the book - I want to read it as much as anyone. I just get sick of people whining about how Martin personally owes them another book; if you believed how the internet talks about him, you'd think he only had weeks to live. I am a little saddened that he won't write an episode for next season though, because his episodes have generally been among the best ones.

Then GRRM should have had "I may not bother finishing this series read at your own risk" on the cover of the fist book and then we wouldn't be here as far less people would have paid money for it.

If you start a book series those who buy it pay money on the promise of it's completion.

Did the first book end suddenly mid sentence with a "I couldn't bother to finish it. Sorry". No? Then the books you have bought are complete. The story may not complete but you have bought complete products, no one owes anyone, anything beyond the completion of the product you have bought. Which you already have.

youji itami:

Anachronism:

FalloutJack:
Geez, it took this long of me saying "Get back to work" before he decides to actually try finishing the damn series, hearing this bull he shovels at the fans all the time. Well, we know damn sure if he dies, it won't with him, 'cause he's not just an ass, but a lazy ass.

How dare he do anything other than spend 24 hours a day writing the book? We don't want the book to be good, we want it now!

Honestly, calm down a little. You've bought his previous books, and he's under no obligation to provide you with another. He's under no obligation to finish the series if he doesn't want to, especially not now that the TV show will end the story whatever happens. He doesn't want to, and indeed shouldn't, spend all his time writing Ice and Fire: he appears at conventions and goes on tours because he likes his fans - and, in theory, you are one of those fans. George R. R. Martin is not your bitch.

For the record, I'm not saying it's a bad idea for him to focus more on the book - I want to read it as much as anyone. I just get sick of people whining about how Martin personally owes them another book; if you believed how the internet talks about him, you'd think he only had weeks to live. I am a little saddened that he won't write an episode for next season though, because his episodes have generally been among the best ones.

Then GRRM should have had "I may not bother finishing this series read at your own risk" on the cover of the fist book and then we wouldn't be here as far less people would have paid money for it.

If you start a book series those who buy it pay money on the promise of it's completion.

Nope nope nope. Once you buy a book, the contract is complete. You have paid for a book, and you have received a book. No more. The possibility of the author not writing some more books, which you may or may not buy at a later date, is a risk you have to take.

Anachronism:

If you start a book series those who buy it pay money on the promise of it's completion.

Nope nope nope. Once you buy a book, the contract is complete. You have paid for a book, and you have received a book. No more. The possibility of the author not writing some more books, which you may or may not buy at a later date, is a risk you have to take.[/quote]

Of course there is no legal obligation for him to finish the series.

But frankly, considering the amount of money and fame he has made with the rise of the HBO-Series, I'd argue that there certainly is a moral obligation for him to finish as fast as possible and not write and sell this other stuff that nobody cares about.

If I was in his place, I'd feel just bad about leaving the fans waiting for so long and would buckle down to finish as fast as possible.

Exterminas:

Anachronism:

Nope nope nope. Once you buy a book, the contract is complete. You have paid for a book, and you have received a book. No more. The possibility of the author not writing some more books, which you may or may not buy at a later date, is a risk you have to take.

Of course there is no legal obligation for him to finish the series.

But frankly, considering the amount of money and fame he has made with the rise of the HBO-Series, I'd argue that there certainly is a moral obligation for him to finish as fast as possible and not write and sell this other stuff that nobody cares about.

If I was in his place, I'd feel just bad about leaving the fans waiting for so long and would buckle down to finish as fast as possible.

I don't like the term "moral obligation" at all in this context, but I would certainly prefer it if he finished the series. He has a lot of fans who want to know the end, and he loves the fans, so I'm sure he's as keen to get it finished as anyone. Apart from anything else, he'd finally be free of this albatross around his neck and would be allowed to do something else without people complaining about it all the time.

As far as "other stuff that nobody cares about," I think you're being extremely unfair. He's working on it because he cares about it, and that should be enough; but even apart from that, people demonstrably do care about his other work. Old Mars, an anthology he edited, just won a Locus Award, and Dangerous Women has been nominated for a World Fantasy Award. And of course, there is the small matter of being a producer and writer for Game of Thrones, that wildly popular TV series that everyone and their dog absolutely adores. By your own terminology, does he not have an "obligation" to that as well? Especially since I'm willing to bet that the vast majority of his fans came to the books after seeing the TV show?

And I'm sure he does feel bad about making the fans wait, but I think he'd feel worse if he rushed out a book he wasn't happy with just to satisfy the baying hounds at his door.

Yay, he's getting more work done on the book;

Boo, I'm less and less sure the show's own writers know what they're doing.

Okay, so in this piece of news he says that he's going to focus on his writing to get some shit done, and then people are outraged and certain that he won't finnish the books? I'm not sure i follow this particular train of thought :p. Just be glad that GOT isn't taking as long as some of the more ambitious comic series. It took like 6 years to finnish each chapter in Enki Bilals Nikopol Trilogy and those takes around an hour to read through^^.

Expected news is expected. The show is diverging in several ways already and he has to keep laying the track down as he would say.

Good on him. I want more to read. :D

OK, Martin is not lazy as much as unfocused. Hell it's been pretty clear that he is a lot happier with his "sideprojects" and books 4 and 5 are a clear testament that he doesn't know what he's doing with the story anyway, so I'd dare say it's probably for the best he doesn't keep writing another train wreck. Since he doesn't know what the hell he is doing he puts his efforts on sideprojects to avoid having to confront the issue of actually continuing the story.

After making that clear, he of course has no moral or contractual obligation to ever finish the saga and he can be content to sleep on his money pile like a dragon while giving HBO a few cliffnotes of desired events and let them finish the whole thing while he dedicates to other projects where he actually knows what the hell he is doing. Frankly, I'm thinking it's for the best if he never writes another saga book again and lets the series take care of it, I have no desire to plough to another 1000 page mess of Daenerys hormones, Jon Snow being a bloody twat and nothing actually happening in the grand scheme of things outside of asspulls.

To the "he has no obligation" crowd:
Yeah, and I have no obligation, legal, moral or hygenic, to refrain from spitting on the sidewalk in front of every person I pass on the street. That doesn't mean it's okay for me to do it or that other people would be out of line for calling me a dick.
GRRM has created a serialized work of art that many people care about deeply and he's made a great deal of money because of people's investment in the series. If he can't find time to write that's one thing and if he didn't realize how much of his time the series would take or how much it would burn him out on Westeros that's another thing; I truly sympathize. Nevertheless if he abandons ASoIaF in mid-stream for other projects his fans have every right to flame him for leaving them hanging. He's a grown-ass man, he knows what his fans want and he's smart enough to know that giving them something else will not be appreciated.

Wereduck:
To the "he has no obligation" crowd:
Yeah, and I have no obligation, legal, moral or hygenic, to refrain from spitting on the sidewalk in front of every person I pass on the street. That doesn't mean it's okay for me to do it or that other people would be out of line for calling me a dick.
GRRM has created a serialized work of art that many people care about deeply and he's made a great deal of money because of people's investment in the series. If he can't find time to write that's one thing and if he didn't realize how much of his time the series would take or how much it would burn him out on Westeros that's another thing; I truly sympathize. Nevertheless if he abandons ASoIaF in mid-stream for other projects his fans have every right to flame him for leaving them hanging. He's a grown-ass man, he knows what his fans want and he's smart enough to know that giving them something else will not be appreciated.

You are also correct, but he also has the right to not give a fuck which is what I was at least trying to get to. But I also consider that the last 2 books were mostly crap, so I'm in the "clearly overrated" part of the moat where I really don't care if he never finishes.

To comment on the anger, I believe Neil Gaiman said it best: "George R.R. Martin is not your bitch."

I'll admit to some exasperation myself, tho, I shan't lie. Not because I think Martin owes me anything, but because it's becoming more and more clear that the series itself is not good enough to warrant so much time. Simply put, there are authors out there who create superior art at a faster pace, and it's frustrating to see so much adoration heaped on this one series of books in dire need of a ruthless editor.

MatsVS:
To comment on the anger, I believe Neil Gaiman said it best: "George R.R. Martin is not your bitch."

I'll admit to some exasperation myself, tho, I shan't lie. Not because I think Martin owes me anything, but because it's becoming more and more clear that the series itself is not good enough to warrant so much time. Simply put, there are authors out there who create superior art at a faster pace, and it's frustrating to see so much adoration heaped on this one series of books in dire need of a ruthless editor.

I've not watched the show but that's the general impression I get from the little I've read of ASoIaF. It's good but nowhere near as great (or devastatingly dark) as Berserk or as imaginative as say the Riftwar books. It just happens to be the series that filled the gaping hole in the market for "mature" high production value epic fantasy on the screen after LotR[1] turned an entire generation or three of non-readers onto the genre.

[1] And to some extent Harry Potter and Twilight as well. Since tons of young men and women today obsessed over Harry Potter as kids, fawned over Twilight as teens and now want another big fantasy series to obsess over with their friends.

Wereduck:
To the "he has no obligation" crowd:
Yeah, and I have no obligation, legal, moral or hygenic, to refrain from spitting on the sidewalk in front of every person I pass on the street. That doesn't mean it's okay for me to do it or that other people would be out of line for calling me a dick.
GRRM has created a serialized work of art that many people care about deeply and he's made a great deal of money because of people's investment in the series. If he can't find time to write that's one thing and if he didn't realize how much of his time the series would take or how much it would burn him out on Westeros that's another thing; I truly sympathize. Nevertheless if he abandons ASoIaF in mid-stream for other projects his fans have every right to flame him for leaving them hanging. He's a grown-ass man, he knows what his fans want and he's smart enough to know that giving them something else will not be appreciated.

Well, no. You don't have an obligation to do those things, not doing them will make people hate you, and think you are an ass. But you don't have to do them. At the same time however, doing that doesn't require a great amount of effort on your part, it just requires you act like a decent human being.

If you want a more appropriate comparison, it would be like you hmm.. Closest thing that a normal person could do is I suppose a web series, you get half way through it and decide you no longer have motivation or interest in it. A lot of people may like it, but if you have no interest in it, you don't HAVE to do it. And if you force yourself to, it is going to go down in quality.

That's the problem, people expect the same quality, but at rushed rates, and you can't have both. That is not how it works.

While I do admit I would be lying if i said i wasn't wanting him to finish the series before he died, I am not exactly as worried as I would be with some other projects. Why? Well, he's already gone and given HBO an ending to the series and an outline of basically the rest of the events so...worst case scenario is even if he dies, the series won't be left "Unfinished" unlike some other series in the past which have had this happen to them.
Plus, as Martin said in the past, he's not exactly in bad health so I doubt it's going to be a Wheel of Time Scenario here guys.

So relax, take a deep breath and just let Martin do his thing. Either way, the series is going to get an ending that Martin had a hand in.

Razhem:

Wereduck:
To the "he has no obligation" crowd:
Yeah, and I have no obligation, legal, moral or hygenic, to refrain from spitting on the sidewalk in front of every person I pass on the street. That doesn't mean it's okay for me to do it or that other people would be out of line for calling me a dick.
GRRM has created a serialized work of art that many people care about deeply and he's made a great deal of money because of people's investment in the series. If he can't find time to write that's one thing and if he didn't realize how much of his time the series would take or how much it would burn him out on Westeros that's another thing; I truly sympathize. Nevertheless if he abandons ASoIaF in mid-stream for other projects his fans have every right to flame him for leaving them hanging. He's a grown-ass man, he knows what his fans want and he's smart enough to know that giving them something else will not be appreciated.

You are also correct, but he also has the right to not give a fuck which is what I was at least trying to get to. But I also consider that the last 2 books were mostly crap, so I'm in the "clearly overrated" part of the moat where I really don't care if he never finishes.

Actually you do, most places i know of casually spitting all over the place is against the law. If you have a unbridled desire to spit, carry a handkerchief around. You not being a douche bag is not the same as you not writing a book.

So there's authors who can publish multiple, quality books in one year and then there's others like GRRM who take several years to write one novel.

There should be a happy medium. One novel every two years (no more). Who is his publisher? Paying GRRM all this money. If it weren't for the show then they probably would have stopped paying him. Obviously they won't now that the show has not only boosted book sales (by a huge amount I'm guessing) but has also made GoT a household name and up there with The Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter when it comes to fantasy.

Exterminas:
Sometimes it seems like George is the only person on this planet who still thinks that he will have a say in how the series or the books will end.

...I don't see how he won't have a say on how the books end. The show is a different story of course, as HBO is going to make whatever changes it feels are necessary to keep the viewers.

But the books are completely separate, and GRRM is going to write them however he wants.

Lunncal:
snip

In response to your spoiler tag footnote, the character you mentioned has not yet been officially cut. When Benioff and Weiss were asked about that at Comic-Con they refused to comment, meaning it could go either way.

And even if this and other certain characters don't show up this season (Euron, Victarion), that doesn't mean they have been officially cut either. Ramsay Snow, the Reeds, and Mace Tyrell all showed up a season later than expected, I don't see why the same couldn't be true for these guys.

(Although it seems pretty certain now that Arianne has been cut.)

Imre Csete:

Lunncal:
Woah, how rude? This guy doesn't owe you anything, he's not obligated to finish his book series at all, what gives you the right to call him a lazy ass?

He might be rockin' the jovial grandpa look, but he's far from an all around nice guy (like when he lost to Harry Potter ages ago). I don't care about the lazy part though.

Didn't he call Rowling a hack or something? Or was that a different author?

The show is about to surpass his books anyway, there's no need for the guy there.
He can watch the show from his home and grab and idea or two :)

Wereduck:
To the "he has no obligation" crowd:
Yeah, and I have no obligation, legal, moral or hygenic, to refrain from spitting on the sidewalk in front of every person I pass on the street. That doesn't mean it's okay for me to do it or that other people would be out of line for calling me a dick.
GRRM has created a serialized work of art that many people care about deeply and he's made a great deal of money because of people's investment in the series. If he can't find time to write that's one thing and if he didn't realize how much of his time the series would take or how much it would burn him out on Westeros that's another thing; I truly sympathize. Nevertheless if he abandons ASoIaF in mid-stream for other projects his fans have every right to flame him for leaving them hanging. He's a grown-ass man, he knows what his fans want and he's smart enough to know that giving them something else will not be appreciated.

Lots of places blatantly spitting in public walkways and such is illegal.

And furthermore, lots of places, you spit directly in someone's path, near them or in their general direction, that could be considered instigating minor assault.

So I guess that analogy fell apart immediately.

Good idea, please finish the damn story lines before you die George. We don't need the last half a book written by Michael Bay.

Kontarek:

Exterminas:
Sometimes it seems like George is the only person on this planet who still thinks that he will have a say in how the series or the books will end.

...I don't see how he won't have a say on how the books end. The show is a different story of course, as HBO is going to make whatever changes it feels are necessary to keep the viewers.

But the books are completely separate, and GRRM is going to write them however he wants.

Lunncal:
snip

In response to your spoiler tag footnote, the character you mentioned has not yet been officially cut. When Benioff and Weiss were asked about that at Comic-Con they refused to comment, meaning it could go either way.

And even if this and other certain characters don't show up this season (Euron, Victarion), that doesn't mean they have been officially cut either. Ramsay Snow, the Reeds, and Mace Tyrell all showed up a season later than expected, I don't see why the same couldn't be true for these guys.

(Although it seems pretty certain now that Arianne has been cut.)

Martin is going to die before he finishes the books. At least it is very likely that he will. I mean, look at his work pace and then look at this guy: His he the sort of man that lives to be produtive in his 80s or 90s? No, quite frankly. And he isn't going to become a faster writer with increasing age, he is going to become slower.

He is going to pull a Robert Jordan on the book series and it seems like he is the only one who is still adamant that this will not happen. Someone else will finish the books and the series will run out of books to adapt soon, so they will likely start making up their own stuff.

Granted, I have exaggerated that, sure Martin will "have a say" in that, like his wishes and ideas (so far as they exist) might fall into consideration. But seeing as how things went with Jordan, there is also going to be a lot of foreign influence in the finished work

Hey, while he's at it... Could he also finish a few new Wild Cards books?

Kontarek:

Lunncal:
snip

In response to your spoiler tag footnote, the character you mentioned has not yet been officially cut. When Benioff and Weiss were asked about that at Comic-Con they refused to comment, meaning it could go either way.

And even if this and other certain characters don't show up this season (Euron, Victarion), that doesn't mean they have been officially cut either. Ramsay Snow, the Reeds, and Mace Tyrell all showed up a season later than expected, I don't see why the same couldn't be true for these guys.

(Although it seems pretty certain now that Arianne has been cut.)

The interview the character's actor seems to make it pretty final and official to me:

... And now you tell me Arianne has been cut too. Great.

I wouldn't even mind so much if I thought the alternate content would be good in its own way, but all of the worst scenes in each season are the ones the writers decided to add for themselves. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I can't help but feel the series is just going to become crappier and more generic as it deviates from the books more and more, because that's how the changes have all been in the past.

Exterminas:

Martin is going to die before he finishes the books. At least it is very likely that he will. I mean, look at his work pace and then look at this guy: His he the sort of man that lives to be produtive in his 80s or 90s? No, quite frankly. And he isn't going to become a faster writer with increasing age, he is going to become slower.

He is going to pull a Robert Jordan on the book series and it seems like he is the only one who is still adamant that this will not happen. Someone else will finish the books and the series will run out of books to adapt soon, so they will likely start making up their own stuff.

Granted, I have exaggerated that, sure Martin will "have a say" in that, like his wishes and ideas (so far as they exist) might fall into consideration. But seeing as how things went with Jordan, there is also going to be a lot of foreign influence in the finished work

He's only 65; he could easily have another 15-20 years in him to finish the series (though I don't think it'll take him more than 10). While his dying before that is a possibility, it is hardly a certainty. We know nothing about what sort of health he is in, and frankly it's not really our business. Not to mention this article says he's at least trying to buckle down and write faster, and you can't really ask anything more from him than that.

Lunncal:

The interview the character's actor seems to make it pretty final and official to me:

... And now you tell me Arianne has been cut too. Great.

I wouldn't even mind so much if I thought the alternate content would be good in its own way, but all of the worst scenes in each season are the ones the writers decided to add for themselves. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I can't help but feel the series is just going to become crappier and more generic as it deviates from the books more and more, because that's how the changes have all been in the past.

Lucky for us the actors/actresses have zero say in whether or not their characters are cut. The person in the interview could be lying or could legitimately not realize that the character still has a part to play. Gotta wait for word from Weiss and Benioff for it to be official.

And I was initially upset about Arianne being cut as well, but the more I thought about it the more it made sense. I suspect they are going to divide up her (admittedly small at this point) role among the 3 Sand Snakes (and possibly Trystane). We as an audience already have a bit of connection with the Sand Snakes because we met their father, Oberyn, last season and were enraged by his death, which they likely will be as well. If it's going to be that death and the anger resulting from it driving the action in Dorne next season, why not express it through the man's daughters instead of his niece? It seems to me the Sand Snakes are far more interesting than Arianne anyways, and could fill her book four role without too much trouble at all.

Is it really that much of a loss loosing Lady Stoneheart and Arianne, at least for now? The whole of the Martell family outside of the Oberyn have been a joke since they are all talk and no do currently and the Lady Stoneheart plotline doesn't really seem to know where it's going after the fifth book.

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