The Flash Pilot Review: Dumber Than A Speeding Bullet

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The Flash Pilot Review: Dumber Than A Speeding Bullet

But dumb isn't necessarily bad, so long as this thing doesn't take itself too seriously.

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I'm going to give this show a chance since I love Arrow so much. If it goes wrong, well, live and learn.

I've watched the trailer and I've watched the pilot, maybe they just did the trailer too well but the pilot feels like a longer version of the trailer.

"Guys, people have caught-on to how we only know how to characterize our heroes by killing their dad."

"What if we kill the mom instead?"

"Wilson... that has got to be... without a single doubt in my mind... the absolute BEST idea I've heard all day! Who's next in line? Flash? Let's get this ball rolling!"

I love the casting of John Wesley Shipp as the father. Someone had their eye on the ball that day...

ritchards:
I love the casting of John Wesley Shipp as the father. Someone had their eye on the ball that day...

I'm wondering if they are thinking about doing something interesting with it beyond a wink and nod to what has gone before? Maybe slide Shipp into the role of a Jay Garrick type?

The no Speed Force is actually a good thing, the whole implementation of it makes Flash too overpowered. Overpowered becomes boring, very quickly.

Looking forward to the forthcoming Arrow crossovers.

I quite enjoyed the pilot. It's certainly more 'fun' than arrow.

Flashpoint, (from what I read) was really bad. I'm disappointed they're using Barry Allan. He's the worst comic protagonist other than the alien scarecrow from Paying for It.

Yeah, definitely agree with it feeling like it was made of clichés. The two things that bugged me most were probably:

I'll give you the dialogue can be downright cringeworthy. Pretty much any scene with Iris in it, sadly (Her line about twerking? Ugh...), but the fun, colorful atmosphere more than makes up for that. It reminds me of the (incredibly awful) Arrow Pilot and how this is everything that wasn't. They're already starting on much more solid ground and Arrow has since become incredible. If something with as terrible a beginning as Arrow can become awesome I have no worries about the Flash working out its kinks.

Arrow has gotten really good over it's run. The introduction of Flash has helped move it away from being like Nolan's gritty Batman trilogy and much more of the fantasy style of a superhero comic. They are seriously missing a trick in not trying to tie these two to their film universe the way Marvel has with Agents of SHIELD. It would make the Justice League film way easier if Flash and one or two others have been established on TV and don't need to bog the film down in telling people who they are.

I honestly really enjoyed the pilot. It was interesting, it didn't waste it's time getting to the good stuff and it's looking good. I don't tend to get bogged down in "Cliches". I find this complaint mostly comes up when people have a hard time explaining what they don't like. But maybe my inherent love of comics helped me look past anything. It was really comfortable with itself. The episode had no inhibitions throwing the zonkiness of it all at you.

That's all very fine and good, Mr. Lincoln, but is the Queen song present? I know it's different Flash's but still, a flash is a flash is a flash.

008Zulu:
The no Speed Force is actually a good thing, the whole implementation of it makes Flash too overpowered. Overpowered becomes boring, very quickly.

Perhaps you can answer a question of mine: I'm not a DC reader, so my familiarity with Flash doesn't go beyond "he moves fast," and what I've seen in Justice League on cartoon network. But something that always bothered me about him and other "speed" characters is the physics of moving that quickly. For example, in the trailer I saw him dash to catch someone flying through the air that was hit by a car. Cool. Except in my mind I'm thinking "how does the person survive the impact of being hit by someone (something) moving as quickly as Flash was?"

It's physics. For example, there is that sequence in Days of Future Past where Quicksilver is moving faster than the shots fired by some prison guards, and "messing with them." Again, cool. But what makes bullets "bullets" is that they are projectiles moving as super fast speeds, and force is "mass x acceleration." So shouldn't the act of moving faster than speeding bullets mean that the impact of your mass on the environment is having the effect of bullets striking those surfaces? So Flash's feet hitting the ground should wear the hell out of his shoes immediately, and him "catching" someone as their flying thru the air should amount to him and all his mass hitting them with the force of an equally sized bullet, yes? How do they explain it away?

I've seen speed characters darting around, and causing car alarms to go off, and debris to fly into the air, and even the ground behind them to catch fire, but never heard and explanation as to why they don't obliterate the person that they "catch" in midair on impact.

Wow, reading Ross summary makes this show sound good, on paper.

I have seen the pilot and it completely sucks! I am not an eloquent person nor can I put what bothers me in a coherent way (I might have a job as a game or film critic otherwise), but believe me, the production value of this pilot is abysmal. Bad acting, bad plot, terrible non-sequiturs, and the dumbest actions/reactions from people.

I am concerned at the overall quality of the CW as this is the place where many fans turn to for their alternative-human stories. They messed up Flash, Arrow, Tomorrow People, etc. they have shows like Vampire Diaries and revisionist Reign... terrible lineup.

I shiver to think what they will do to I, Zombie!

tdylan:

008Zulu:
The no Speed Force is actually a good thing, the whole implementation of it makes Flash too overpowered. Overpowered becomes boring, very quickly.

Perhaps you can answer a question of mine: I'm not a DC reader, so my familiarity with Flash doesn't go beyond "he moves fast," and what I've seen in Justice League on cartoon network. But something that always bothered me about him and other "speed" characters is the physics of moving that quickly. For example, in the trailer I saw him dash to catch someone flying through the air that was hit by a car. Cool. Except in my mind I'm thinking "how does the person survive the impact of being hit by someone (something) moving as quickly as Flash was?"

It's physics. For example, there is that sequence in Days of Future Past where Quicksilver is moving faster than the shots fired by some prison guards, and "messing with them." Again, cool. But what makes bullets "bullets" is that they are projectiles moving as super fast speeds, and force is "mass x acceleration." So shouldn't the act of moving faster than speeding bullets mean that the impact of your mass on the environment is having the effect of bullets striking those surfaces? So Flash's feet hitting the ground should wear the hell out of his shoes immediately, and him "catching" someone as their flying thru the air should amount to him and all his mass hitting them with the force of an equally sized bullet, yes? How do they explain it away?

I've seen speed characters darting around, and causing car alarms to go off, and debris to fly into the air, and even the ground behind them to catch fire, but never heard and explanation as to why they don't obliterate the person that they "catch" in midair on impact.

COMICS.

ARE.

WEIRD!

Ahem.

Anyway, the "idea" is that they are wearing special suits designed to lower the friction and gravitational forces exerted on their bodies while running at these ludicrous ridiculous speeds. In the case of the Flash and other speedsters in the DCU, there exists this extra-dimensional force - called the Speed Force - that grants them additional abilities. Such as molecule manipulation (allowing them to phase though objects), extra strength, running even faster, time/dimensional travel (via speed), or anything else necessitated by the plot.

To answer your question about the force speedsters exert on others, it's kind of sort of accepted that they have control over that as well.

tdylan:
How do they explain it away?

It's called suspension of disbelief. "This guy runs faster than the sound barrier" is the premise. Nothing about that is even the slightest bit realistic. It makes no sense, either in terms of energy output for the human body, the forces of acceleration, or the effects he has on nearby things. It's pretty key to the premise that he is able to move insanely fast while frequently ignoring the inconvenient problems of said speed.

It's like Superman picking up a card and not ending up with holes through the bottom or Batman doing pretty much everything Batman survives or Wolverine regenerating despite that not working with the Conservation of Matter or any number of other things: You either suspend your disbelief because it's a fictional work that intentionally not based on the laws of physics or you go read/watch something else.

Fiction is fiction. It's not real. That's the entire point.

Falterfire:

tdylan:
How do they explain it away?

It's called suspension of disbelief...Fiction is fiction. It's not real. That's the entire point.

I get that, and I can suspend my disbelief. But it's when they got the lengths of saying (not that this particular example happened) "Here, Wally, put this on. It's a special experimental material that should resist the intense friction generated when you move, while remaining lightweight and not hampering your abilities." Cool. They go to the trouble of thinking "we'd better explain why his special suit doesn't get ripped apart by the friction of the air," but then when someone asks "what about him running into people?" The answer is "look! suspend your disbelief. You can't expect us to explain away everything."

At least Reed Richards says "Our clothes are made from unstable molecules, and that's why they don't burn when Johnny flames on." Wolverine is "cells divide rapidly so..." I even remember an episode of Lois and Clark where shots were fired in Clark's apartment, I think, and left holes in his costume. Lois said something like "I thought your costume was indestructible?" He answered "only when I'm wearing it. My body projects a field/aura/thingy a few millimeters that protects it from harm." I thought "bullshit, but at least they tried."

RossaLincoln:
The Flash Pilot Review: Dumber Than A Speeding Bullet

But dumb isn't necessarily bad, so long as this thing doesn't take itself too seriously.

Read Full Article

Dont listen to this guy people. Watched the pilot a few weeks ago when it leaked online. I thought it was pretty great. Im not even that much of a Flash fan and I enjoyed it.

WhiteTigerShiro:
"Guys, people have caught-on to how we only know how to characterize our heroes by killing their dad."

"What if we kill the mom instead?"

"Wilson... that has got to be... without a single doubt in my mind... the absolute BEST idea I've heard all day! Who's next in line? Flash? Let's get this ball rolling!"

Yeah, except Barry Allen's mother dying has been a staple point of the comics for a long time. Hell, go read or watch Flashpoint Paradox, Barry abusing his powers to prevent her death is what sets that story off.

Anyway, I think Flash isn't easy to do live-action without making it a tad cheesy or awkward.

Dead Century:

WhiteTigerShiro:
"Guys, people have caught-on to how we only know how to characterize our heroes by killing their dad."

"What if we kill the mom instead?"

"Wilson... that has got to be... without a single doubt in my mind... the absolute BEST idea I've heard all day! Who's next in line? Flash? Let's get this ball rolling!"

Yeah, except Barry Allen's mother dying has been a staple point of the comics for a long time. Hell, go read or watch Flashpoint Paradox, Barry abusing his powers to prevent her death is what sets that story off.

Fair enough. Admittedly I've always been a Marvel kid, so my knowledge of DC characters is minimal at best. That said though, it just goes to show how stupid of an idea it was to needlessly kill-off Superman's dad. Now they're introducing a story where the parent is actually supposed to die, and anyone who isn't already a huge DC fan is gonna look at it and wonder what DC's thing is with always killing-off the parents.

WhiteTigerShiro:

Dead Century:

WhiteTigerShiro:
"Guys, people have caught-on to how we only know how to characterize our heroes by killing their dad."

"What if we kill the mom instead?"

"Wilson... that has got to be... without a single doubt in my mind... the absolute BEST idea I've heard all day! Who's next in line? Flash? Let's get this ball rolling!"

Yeah, except Barry Allen's mother dying has been a staple point of the comics for a long time. Hell, go read or watch Flashpoint Paradox, Barry abusing his powers to prevent her death is what sets that story off.

Fair enough. Admittedly I've always been a Marvel kid, so my knowledge of DC characters is minimal at best. That said though, it just goes to show how stupid of an idea it was to needlessly kill-off Superman's dad. Now they're introducing a story where the parent is actually supposed to die, and anyone who isn't already a huge DC fan is gonna look at it and wonder what DC's thing is with always killing-off the parents.

Yeah, I agree with you there. It's weird. Same thing with how the New 52 turned Lobo into a emotionally fragile pretty boy instead of the heavy metal intergalactic bounty hunter that pokes fun at everybody in the DC universe.

Dead Century:
Yeah, I agree with you there. It's weird. Same thing with how the New 52 turned Lobo into a emotionally fragile pretty boy instead of the heavy metal intergalactic bounty hunter that pokes fun at everybody in the DC universe.

Right? They practically had a license to print money with their own version of Deadpool (except that he's a lot more badass than Deadpool), and then they just turn him into a tired unmarketable stereotype who gets drowned under all the other characters trying to ape that stereotype and over-shadowed by the characters who do the stereotype well. Meanwhile there's only one Deadpool they would have had to compete with, and Lobo was (emphasis on was) a lot more bad-ass than Deadpool.

I watched the pilot and thought it was pretty rubbish. There was so much wrong with the show that I found it difficult to accept. First, the writing...the dialogue is awful, there's no other word for it. "The lightning bolt chose you" and other such drivel made listening to people talk painful. Second, the casting. Apart from the grizzled, black detective (who I think is probably the only good casting in the show) is terrible. The entire cast are like 17 years old and we're supposed to accept that they're physics Phds, forensics experts and what not? I can't, I simply can't buy it.

Then there's the little things. WhyTF does Allen sound like he has a jet turbine strapped to him when he moves fast? He looks like a man and the story is he runs fast, yet there's the sound of a frikkin jet when he runs. Then the 12 year old science kid who just so happens to have a perfectly fitting suit ready to go? Come on! Then, the whole story with his mother's murder seems terribly contrived and unnecessary. It doesn't really make him that much more interesting. Not every hero needs a contrived origin story.

I think it is a good idea badly done. The 90s show could have been a better template but by trying to make it something different whilst keeping particular elements of the source material and altering others resulted in a poor pilot. The casting and terrible script are the worst offenders but they aren't the only issues.

ritchards:
I love the casting of John Wesley Shipp as the father. Someone had their eye on the ball that day...

Absolutely agree. I loved him in the 90s series and think he's a great actor. It's great to see him back on the screen.

tdylan:
Perhaps you can answer a question of mine: I'm not a DC reader, so my familiarity with Flash doesn't go beyond "he moves fast," and what I've seen in Justice League on cartoon network. But something that always bothered me about him and other "speed" characters is the physics of moving that quickly. For example, in the trailer I saw him dash to catch someone flying through the air that was hit by a car. Cool. Except in my mind I'm thinking "how does the person survive the impact of being hit by someone (something) moving as quickly as Flash was?"

It's physics. For example, there is that sequence in Days of Future Past where Quicksilver is moving faster than the shots fired by some prison guards, and "messing with them." Again, cool. But what makes bullets "bullets" is that they are projectiles moving as super fast speeds, and force is "mass x acceleration." So shouldn't the act of moving faster than speeding bullets mean that the impact of your mass on the environment is having the effect of bullets striking those surfaces? So Flash's feet hitting the ground should wear the hell out of his shoes immediately, and him "catching" someone as their flying thru the air should amount to him and all his mass hitting them with the force of an equally sized bullet, yes? How do they explain it away?

I've seen speed characters darting around, and causing car alarms to go off, and debris to fly into the air, and even the ground behind them to catch fire, but never heard and explanation as to why they don't obliterate the person that they "catch" in midair on impact.

I agree here too. Superman catching Lois Lane in the first film is one of the most often cited implausible/impossible scenarios. At the rate she was falling, the speed she would be travelling at when two arms of steel intercepted her would have killed her. Batman in The Dark Knight "catches" Rachel after the Joker throws her from a rooftop. They land on a car (which gets totalled) but themselves aren't putty for some reason.

What I have to say follows another point below...

Falterfire:
It's called suspension of disbelief. "This guy runs faster than the sound barrier" is the premise. Nothing about that is even the slightest bit realistic. It makes no sense, either in terms of energy output for the human body, the forces of acceleration, or the effects he has on nearby things. It's pretty key to the premise that he is able to move insanely fast while frequently ignoring the inconvenient problems of said speed.

Disbelief can only be suspended so far. In drama, stories happen in a mundane world and there's not so much need to stretch an audiences willingness to suspend their disbelief. Fantasy and Sci Fi make up the two genres where rules can be bent significantly (horror with often supernatural elements come under fantasy for the purpose of discussion).

With fantasy, practically anything can go as long as a world is internally consistent and logical. Be it magic, supernatural forces, a divinity or other mystical entity we accept that these things are not mundane and don't conform to our rules or laws. Sci Fi however *does* need to conform. The Flash, and any other comic books set in modern day Earth (or an analogous version thereof) are sci fi. The conform to our rules and laws in most things but for the superheroes which are fantastic. Fantastic heroes in the mundane world is their hook. But being set in the mundane world means that established facts should be observed.

One of the cardinal rules of *good* sci fi is that things must conform with science fact (unless there's an explanation for why it doesn't). Fantastic elements can be used where science doesn't yet know (for example, FTL, the ansible, laser pistols, transporters, etc). As long as it doesn't contradict science fact, science fiction can and should go nuts with the rest. I can accept Superman flying because Krypton/Yellow Sun/Different Physiology. But I cannot accept Captain America in this scene. I can accept his shield being indestructible, but cannot accept that he and it could withstand that blow from Thor because I understand how physics works. When something like that happens, which is completely impossible, it shatters willing disbelief. Even with an indestructible shield, in that scene Cap should have been sent hurtling backwards or squished downwards into the ground leaving a red, gloopy mess.

In the 90s Flash, the lightning bolt supercharged Barry Allen's metabolism such that he was superfast. He healed fast, moved fast, reacted and thought fast and realistically needed copious amounts of food to fuel himself. I can roll with this as it is within the realms of science fact (a person's metabolism and its effect on bodily processes is quite understood) but with a cool fantastic element.

Suspension of disbelief is all well and good but having implausible, illogical or downright impossible things occur will shatter it. Having a man sound like a jet turbine is one of those ways. A good writer will make escapes daring and dramatic within the realms of believability, given what the audience knows of the world in which the story takes place.

tdylan:
For example, there is that sequence in Days of Future Past where Quicksilver is moving faster than the shots fired by some prison guards, and "messing with them." Again, cool. But what makes bullets "bullets" is that they are projectiles moving as super fast speeds, and force is "mass x acceleration." So shouldn't the act of moving faster than speeding bullets mean that the impact of your mass on the environment is having the effect of bullets striking those surfaces? So Flash's feet hitting the ground should wear the hell out of his shoes immediately, and him "catching" someone as their flying thru the air should amount to him and all his mass hitting them with the force of an equally sized bullet, yes? How do they explain it away?

I've seen speed characters darting around, and causing car alarms to go off, and debris to fly into the air, and even the ground behind them to catch fire, but never heard and explanation as to why they don't obliterate the person that they "catch" in midair on impact.

About the Quicksilver scene, I had a gripe with it but not anything you've described. Although not realistic, obviously, I thought it was quite believable. I bought that he was moving so fast that the bullets only travelled a short distance before everything resolved. For the punches and pushes, as you say force does = Mass x Acceleration, thus he simply used significantly less "mass" in the formula to make up for the high acceleration at which said mass is turned into force (something light accelerating faster can have the same force as something heavier accelerating slower). I could believe that he was moving fast enough to defy gravity exerting a pull of 9.8m/s squared towards the ground.

The bit that challenged my ability to keep disbelief suspended was actually the music on his walkman. How was it we (through him) heard about 45 seconds of a song play at normal speed when everything that occurred did so in a fraction of a second in real-time. How did his cassette player not skip at that speed and also, where did he find over-the-ear headphones in the 1970s?

That said, it was a great scene and thoroughly enjoyable :-)

One other gripe I had with the film was the serum that repaired Xavier's spine and allowed him to walk again, albeit at the cost of his telepathy (why does it have that effect??). After his spine is healed, how does it "unheal"? It makes no medical sense that someone's body would unheal in such a way and thus felt very contrived. They could've kept him from using his powers (an important plot point) by having him take a moral stand or suffer a mental breakdown (which he was on the verge of already) without a needless contrivance that is IMHO a scientific impossibility. (I could buy the serum working, I simply cannot buy its effect on his legs wearing off). (They did a similar thing in the very first XMen, at the end where Rogue unconsciously pinches Logan's ability and his wounds re-open. Why do they re-open after the were already healed, even if he lost his super-regeneration!?).

I did like the film very much, tho must admit but there were a lot of things wrong with it at worst, or that could've been done better at best. F.ex, massive plot points were entirely ignored (Charles' resurrection, Magneto being powered up again, Kitty's newfound ability, how Wolverine got his adamantium claws back, etc). It is lazy, a missed opportunity and a does a disservice to fans.

I can believe that speedy characters' bodies adapt to be able to withstand the physical exertions and forces that moving at speed implies, but like you find it harder to accept the effect of moving at those speeds has (or rather, does not have) on "ordinary" people and materials. A normal human being accelerated from zero to faster-than-a-speeding-bullet in a fraction of a second would in all likelihood be dead.

Maybe being less smart and/or ignorant helps the audience accept it all?

WhiteTigerShiro:

Dead Century:

WhiteTigerShiro:
"Guys, people have caught-on to how we only know how to characterize our heroes by killing their dad."

"What if we kill the mom instead?"

"Wilson... that has got to be... without a single doubt in my mind... the absolute BEST idea I've heard all day! Who's next in line? Flash? Let's get this ball rolling!"

Yeah, except Barry Allen's mother dying has been a staple point of the comics for a long time. Hell, go read or watch Flashpoint Paradox, Barry abusing his powers to prevent her death is what sets that story off.

Fair enough. Admittedly I've always been a Marvel kid, so my knowledge of DC characters is minimal at best. That said though, it just goes to show how stupid of an idea it was to needlessly kill-off Superman's dad. Now they're introducing a story where the parent is actually supposed to die, and anyone who isn't already a huge DC fan is gonna look at it and wonder what DC's thing is with always killing-off the parents.

To be even more fair about it you have to admit killing off the parents of any main character has been a staple of literary work for centuries, giving the child character freedom to go off in an adventure into the world or be the underlying catalyses for there life choices. It could also just be lazy writing, anyways my point was that the killing of a parent or parents is nothing new to origin stories really.

tdylan:

I even remember an episode of Lois and Clark where shots were fired in Clark's apartment, I think, and left holes in his costume. Lois said something like "I thought your costume was indestructible?" He answered "only when I'm wearing it. My body projects a field/aura/thingy a few millimeters that protects it from harm." I thought "bullshit, but at least they tried."

Actually, that makes total sense and is not necessary BS with in the superman canon. It could be seen as an extension of his tactile telekinesis. Basically part of his super strength, flight and other powers is that he has a invisible telekinetic field that allows him to move all that big stuff with force of will. This is also used to explain his flight. It is more of a modern addition to the superman mythos.

Also for all the people on this thread concerned with superhero physics you should look up James Kakalios, he wrote the book The Physics of Superheros. What you learn may surprise you. Here's the link to his site: http://www.physicsofsuperheroes.com/

Triaed:
Wow, reading Ross summary makes this show sound good, on paper.

I have seen the pilot and it completely sucks! I am not an eloquent person nor can I put what bothers me in a coherent way (I might have a job as a game or film critic otherwise), but believe me, the production value of this pilot is abysmal. Bad acting, bad plot, terrible non-sequiturs, and the dumbest actions/reactions from people.

I am concerned at the overall quality of the CW as this is the place where many fans turn to for their alternative-human stories. They messed up Flash, Arrow, Tomorrow People, etc. they have shows like Vampire Diaries and revisionist Reign... terrible lineup.

I shiver to think what they will do to I, Zombie!

I did say it's dumb and that every single line of dialogue, not to mention pacing and character, is dumb dumb stupid. I also noted how it feels like a 2 hour movie edited down to 45 minutes. I'm with you!

But, I actually like the SFX in a low budget TV kind of way, and I think the supporting cast, especially Jesse L Martin, are good. I also am cutting it some slack because it's a pilots and pilot are often awful.

jecht35:
To be even more fair about it you have to admit killing off the parents of any main character has been a staple of literary work for centuries, giving the child character freedom to go off in an adventure into the world or be the underlying catalyses for there life choices. It could also just be lazy writing, anyways my point was that the killing of a parent or parents is nothing new to origin stories really.

Granted, cliché or not it is a valid storytelling device. Everyone will lose a parent at some point in their lives, some tragically at younger ages than others. Some may never have known one or both parents. The relationships we have with parents and siblings is a very real and relatable thing with which the audience can identify.

The problem with this pilot is that it was a needless contrivance. His mum just happened to be killed a super-powered villain (why?). He then by sheer chance gets his own superpowers. He then meets the same supervillain years later. It is so contrived and implausible that it smacks of the laziest, worst kind of storytelling.

I can understand with Bruce Wayne as his parents' deaths was the driving force behind his crusade. I can understand with Spiderman (at least Sam Raimi's version thereof) where they're irrelevant (except as a device to explain how he came to live with Ben and May Parker). Barry Allen in the pilot did not become a hero because of that event, it was a freak accident that made him fast. The supervillain/mother's murder is an artificial and needless cliché for the sake of adding depth or drama, that is the dictionary definition of a contrivance. Such a coincidence makes disbelief significantly harder to suspend. IMO the story would've been better and more believable without it.

Primus1985:

Dont listen to this guy people. Watched the pilot a few weeks ago when it leaked online. I thought it was pretty great. Im not even that much of a Flash fan and I enjoyed it.

No listen to me. I need validation. PLEAASE.

But more seriously, let me stress that I spent a good half of this thing talking about what I liked. But I can't get past how rushed and superfluous everything feels, and how cringeworthy the dialogue, pacing and so on are. BUT in case I overtalked during the my review, I am going to give it an episode 2 chance.

Eiv:
I quite enjoyed the pilot. It's certainly more 'fun' than arrow.

That's good to hear, since that was my biggest worry.

tdylan:

Falterfire:

At least Reed Richards says "Our clothes are made from unstable molecules, and that's why they don't burn when Johnny flames on." Wolverine is "cells divide rapidly so..." I even remember an episode of Lois and Clark where shots were fired in Clark's apartment, I think, and left holes in his costume. Lois said something like "I thought your costume was indestructible?" He answered "only when I'm wearing it. My body projects a field/aura/thingy a few millimeters that protects it from harm." I thought "bullshit, but at least they tried."

I don't get why it matters, really. It's a show about someone who can violate physics as we know it. Any pretense will just be that.

[quote="SecondPrize" post="7.856692.21223422"]That's all very fine and good, Mr. Lincoln, but is the Queen song present? I know it's different Flash's but still, a flash is a flash is a flash.

And Queen improves virtually everything.

tdylan:

008Zulu:
The no Speed Force is actually a good thing, the whole implementation of it makes Flash too overpowered. Overpowered becomes boring, very quickly.

Perhaps you can answer a question of mine: I'm not a DC reader, so my familiarity with Flash doesn't go beyond "he moves fast," and what I've seen in Justice League on cartoon network. But something that always bothered me about him and other "speed" characters is the physics of moving that quickly. For example, in the trailer I saw him dash to catch someone flying through the air that was hit by a car. Cool. Except in my mind I'm thinking "how does the person survive the impact of being hit by someone (something) moving as quickly as Flash was?"

It's physics. For example, there is that sequence in Days of Future Past where Quicksilver is moving faster than the shots fired by some prison guards, and "messing with them." Again, cool. But what makes bullets "bullets" is that they are projectiles moving as super fast speeds, and force is "mass x acceleration." So shouldn't the act of moving faster than speeding bullets mean that the impact of your mass on the environment is having the effect of bullets striking those surfaces? So Flash's feet hitting the ground should wear the hell out of his shoes immediately, and him "catching" someone as their flying thru the air should amount to him and all his mass hitting them with the force of an equally sized bullet, yes? How do they explain it away?

I've seen speed characters darting around, and causing car alarms to go off, and debris to fly into the air, and even the ground behind them to catch fire, but never heard and explanation as to why they don't obliterate the person that they "catch" in midair on impact.

It gets a little weird with classic non new 52 DC. In traditional Silver Age forward DC the DC Speedsters are empowered by a universal power known as the Speed Force. Basically an almost semi sentient or purposeful vast extra dimensional energy force that sits on the razors edge intersections of Mass, Energy, Velocity and Time. It does not simply allow the Flashes to run fast, rather it fully imbues and empowers them and gives them a range of subtle abilities. Often mainly limited by the wielders mental limits. The most typical is the speed force imbues and surrounds the runner, acting as a forcefield protecting them when running. The field naturally sits close to their skin hence the spandex. They can extend the field out so as when they catch someone that person is matched to them. By manipulating the field some of the speedsters have demonstrated other abilities such as being able to shift out of phase with the physical world and hence run through walls, or gift the velocity to another or steal velocity from others and the environment around them to further power themselves.

Yeah it is pure comic book magic BS. But it is generally a much higher caliber of it than we typically see. With some parts of it being fairly well defined, almost to Star Trek Warp Drive levels. Much of this comes from the early 00's and Mark Waid who really took some time to think things through.

Oddly considering that under Stan Lee Marvel tried to give their heroes a bit more of a structured reasoning beyond simply "comics is magic" (Stan apparently always hated Superman's unexplainable abilities.) they skipped the Speedsters. I don't think there has ever been a proper Marvel explanation for how Quicksilver or Northstar don't get chewed to pieces when they run.

RossaLincoln:

Triaed:
Wow, reading Ross summary makes this show sound good, on paper.

I have seen the pilot and it completely sucks! I am not an eloquent person nor can I put what bothers me in a coherent way (I might have a job as a game or film critic otherwise), but believe me, the production value of this pilot is abysmal. Bad acting, bad plot, terrible non-sequiturs, and the dumbest actions/reactions from people.

I am concerned at the overall quality of the CW as this is the place where many fans turn to for their alternative-human stories. They messed up Flash, Arrow, Tomorrow People, etc. they have shows like Vampire Diaries and revisionist Reign... terrible lineup.

I shiver to think what they will do to I, Zombie!

I did say it's dumb and that every single line of dialogue, not to mention pacing and character, is dumb dumb stupid. I also noted how it feels like a 2 hour movie edited down to 45 minutes. I'm with you!

But, I actually like the SFX in a low budget TV kind of way, and I think the supporting cast, especially Jesse L Martin, are good. I also am cutting it some slack because it's a pilots and pilot are often awful.

Sorry, I should have been clearer: the part that sounds good is the summary you made of the show (the first 2-3 paragraphs). The blurb about what the episode is about looks pretty cool. It makes you want to watch it... that is, until you actually watch it :)

Your critique of it was dead on. The SFX were ok, they are believable in the context, but the rest of it scares me about CW's ability to pull off a competent show!

Wait what is wrong with new 52? Admittedly I just started reading again with it (after a 20+ year break from comics) and almost everything in the new 52 is pretty golden (ok there are a few stinkers, hawk and dove, green team, hunted).

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