axia777: Nintendo fans are crazy for the next iteration of any Nintendo product. PokemonZeldaMarioMetroid anyone? Same game over and over yet it sells like MAD.
UNFIX'D
I tried to fix it but I couldn't decide...
Also I doubt nintendo will ever die. It's essentially the nostalgia system, tons of gamers grew up with it and they will never get sick of their childhood series, even after their twenty eighth iterations. Plus now they've hooked nongamers in as well with their hannah montana games and etc. All they need to do now is bring out a Twilight game, and gaming may end as we know it. We'll have to download underground projects programmed by guys who miss what gaming used to be like, and every company will produce shovelware because as everyone always states, companies are only out to make money and if slapping "Twilight" on a game with very little effort put into it sells more than spending years developing the next best shooter then whats the point really? It's a waste of time and money in the eyes of a business you would think, and I'm surprised this hasn't taken place yet.
Hahahahahahahahaha. oh lol. oh wait, your serious? oh well your wrong i'm afraid, Nintendo sell too well to kids and housewives to go bust. And who says they can't bring out a new console during the PS3 and 360's lifetime? if the wii stops selling they'll bring out a new console and move on.
Nintendo is going to come out on top. They've targeted casuals, claimed it as their own. There's far more casuals than there are serious gamers. Nintendo's got the world in the palm of their hand.
Space Spoons: As much as hardcore gamers might disagree, the brains behind Nintendo aren't stupid. They know that the flow of money they've been getting from exploiting the casual market is starting to dry up. As soon as the casual crowd has moved on, you can fully expect Nintendo to enjoy a renaissance of sorts. See, they know that no matter how badly they're perceived in the eyes of gamers, if they put out another console Mario, Zelda, Metroid or Smash Bros. game, it will sell like hotcakes.
It's cyclical, my man. Exploit the wealthy and stupid while they're enamored with the Wii's gimmicky technology, and when they've lost interest, go back to exploiting gamers who'll buy any game that features a kid with a sword and a green hat.
The problem is is that sooner or later people will stop going back to Nintendo. You know the saying, Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me. There's a reason there isn't a fool me thrice. Also, even idiotic people who love games like Wii Sports stop falling for it sooner or later. Do you really think people will buy the same game 3 times? Sooner or later the housewives will stumble upon WoW and then Nintendo loses another buyer. Also, kids grow out of the kiddy game phase. Finally, I don't think Epic Mickey will do good. Most kids associate him with kiddy games, and won't buy it just because of that. Face it, people like to kill things. WHY do you think that the best selling games are games like GoW, Halo, GTA, and Borderlands. Violence.
I agree that eventually, Nintendo's going to lose the whole "bored housewife" demographic, but I seriously doubt that gamers will ever stop buying Mario, Zelda and Smash Bros. games. Heck, Brawl, Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy were the three reasons most gamers bought Wiis in the first place.
Georgeman: The hell? The thread hasn't been locked yet?
What a laughable thing to say. It's one thing not liking the console and its games, and another one completely to say that it's doomed. How many years have we been hearing this? Oh wait, 5 years, when the DS was lauded as "Virtual Boy 2" by the analysts. No, Nintendo is NOT doomed. Their consoles sell fantastically well (DS will soon reach PS2 in sales) and software-wise Nintendo sold a crapload with New Super Mario Bros, Mario Kart Ds and Wii and Wii Fit.
If Nintendo is doomed, then console gaming is doomed. End of story.
I think this thread is quite ridiculous too, but hear me out. Of course, Nintendo isn't doomed, it is just that it has alienated its original fanbase. They don't care so its probably the gans who are doomed. Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming. If Wii was the only console, boy, would I be a rabid pc gamer. They're not doomed, they're earning money but they don't represent console gaming in any way.
Nope. Sorry but you're wrong. Nintendo started alienating its fanbase maaaaany years ago when the Snes era began. Proof? NES sold 62 millions. Snes sold 46 millions. N64 sold 33 millions. Gamecube sold a paltry 22 millions. With the Wii, Nintendo has tried to bring back those NES gamers that didn't follow Nintendo through the generations.
As for your opinion that Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming, I disagree though respect your opinion. My opinion as to what is console gaming? Easy to pick up and play. Exactly like the NES and the Wii. Yes, a return to those days. A bit primitive but effective.
I'm pretty sure if Nintendo ever made a Pokemon MMORPG, they would have enough money to buy out the other two companies...(ok, well maybe that is a gross exaggeration, but they would make a damn lot of money if they did that).
Also, no one holds a candle to Nintendo's share in the handheld market..this just proves it..
HG131: So, the Wii is the highest selling console, right? That sounds good to me, you? Well, they forgot one thing. This generation of gaming is going to be the longest gen ever, and it still has another 7 - 10 (or more!) years left. It's like in horse racing. Being at the front of the pack at the start normally means you burn out and lose before it's over. They have to make good games for it to last, as lasting on console sales is impossible. They are making the kinds of mistakes 2 other companies made. Sega and Atari. Sega did good at first with the Dreamcast. But then everyone else got better and it died. Atari had a popular console. So, what did they do? Sell stuff like ET and that port that turned Pac-Man Fever into Pac-Man Cancer. Nintendo thinks they can live off of console sales for 10 more years? There is only so many housewives, Nintendo. Either stay with the pack or die alone, it's your choice.
Alright first, they are already designing the Wii 2. I'm pretty sure it will be released before 2013. The average console lifespan is 6 years. The N64 and Gamecube lasted about this long. And, the Wii is still selling rather well. And so are the games.
And although the system is dated, the quality of games are pretty decent. Even if they are kiddy games, quality games sell. And they keep releasing new games in the same series over and over again. And they still sell like crack.
Nintendo can see the forest from the trees. They plan ahead. I would not be surprised if they stayed Number 1 for the next 10 years.
Atari died because they gambled too much on Pac-Man and ET. Dreamcast died because the PS1 and 2 overshadowed it. The Jaguar was the stake in the heart for Atari.
I will say that the Wii isn't doing much to persuade me into defending it. I didn't like Punch-Out!, nor The Conduit. The best games on the Wii are Deadly Creatures and the Metroid Prime Trilogy, in my opinion.
But, they are making money, so I can't really say anything against them.
RenegadeAngel: Also, Halo changes things each time? You shoot aliens. Then sometimes, you don't. Don't get me wrong, I like the Halo games, but Bungie really cracked the formula of "people like to shoot aliens", it's hardly dramatically varied gameplay.
Halo 1 had good story, decent Multi Halo 2 had passable story, great Multi, extra vehicles, extra weapons, dual weilding the ability to play as elites. Halo 3 has good story, 4 player co-op, better graphics, more guns, equiptment, vehicles, multi-player maps, custimizable armours, forge level editor, saved films, bungie space, online rankings and stat tracking... So, no real changes at all hey? And while I love zelda, you get the same abilities and items from the previous titles. The only things that change are story and grahpics.
Its not just about gameplay changing when it comes to sequals, its about advancing the story line. So games like Wii Sports (which have no story) need to change significantly to warrant the purchase of the sequal.
Well, it's not always about the story advancing. The story in Halo was never fantastic, and it wasn't a brilliant ending. The way you've described it is that every time they put in "extra" things or "more" things, which is really the same as what Wii Sports is doing; putting in more things. The minigames are creating entirely new gameplay mechanics, whereas Halo is creating new ways to play with the existing mechanics. Appreciated, both of these things are good in their own right, but there is quite a change between Wii Sports and Resort, probably more between Halo 1 and 2.
DrDeath3191: Let me say this: Just because YOU don't like Wii Sports or Wii Fit, doesn't mean that they're A) Crap or B) the sign of Nintendo's doom. Because if anything, it's quite the opposite. So kindly remove you head from your anus.
I really hate when people bring this up. I agree with your overall idea but not with the point you're trying to make. If I say that "Wii Fit is as fun as getting repeatedly punched in the face", it is automatically my opinion. It doesn't mean that it's crap, it means that I THINK it's crap. It seems to me that you're the one who needs to follow your own advice.
Yes, you're right of course. Everyone has their own opinion. But they can't use that opinion to say that Nintendo is doomed, especially when any and all evidence proves otherwise. I can respect that you might not like Wii Fit, but don't demonize the game as the end of Nintendo because yhou aren't fond of minigame collections. That's what I'm getting at.
DrDeath3191: Let me say this: Just because YOU don't like Wii Sports or Wii Fit, doesn't mean that they're A) Crap or B) the sign of Nintendo's doom. Because if anything, it's quite the opposite. So kindly remove you head from your anus.
I really hate when people bring this up. I agree with your overall idea but not with the point you're trying to make. If I say that "Wii Fit is as fun as getting repeatedly punched in the face", it is automatically my opinion. It doesn't mean that it's crap, it means that I THINK it's crap. It seems to me that you're the one who needs to follow your own advice.
Yes, you're right of course. Everyone has their own opinion. But they can't use that opinion to say that Nintendo is doomed, especially when any and all evidence proves otherwise. I can respect that you might not like Wii Fit, but don't demonize the game as the end of Nintendo because yhou aren't fond of minigame collections. That's what I'm getting at.
I guess I overreacted, my apologies.
Not a problem. I guess I could've delved into more detail. And ending the post with 'remove your head from your anus' didn't help matters.
Georgeman: The hell? The thread hasn't been locked yet?
What a laughable thing to say. It's one thing not liking the console and its games, and another one completely to say that it's doomed. How many years have we been hearing this? Oh wait, 5 years, when the DS was lauded as "Virtual Boy 2" by the analysts. No, Nintendo is NOT doomed. Their consoles sell fantastically well (DS will soon reach PS2 in sales) and software-wise Nintendo sold a crapload with New Super Mario Bros, Mario Kart Ds and Wii and Wii Fit.
If Nintendo is doomed, then console gaming is doomed. End of story.
I think this thread is quite ridiculous too, but hear me out. Of course, Nintendo isn't doomed, it is just that it has alienated its original fanbase. They don't care so its probably the gans who are doomed. Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming. If Wii was the only console, boy, would I be a rabid pc gamer. They're not doomed, they're earning money but they don't represent console gaming in any way.
Nope. Sorry but you're wrong. Nintendo started alienating its fanbase maaaaany years ago when the Snes era began. Proof? NES sold 62 millions. Snes sold 46 millions. N64 sold 33 millions. Gamecube sold a paltry 22 millions. With the Wii, Nintendo has tried to bring back those NES gamers that didn't follow Nintendo through the generations.
As for your opinion that Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming, I disagree though respect your opinion. My opinion as to what is console gaming? Easy to pick up and play. Exactly like the NES and the Wii. Yes, a return to those days. A bit primitive but effective.
Console gaming should attact, well, gamers and that's no the case with the Wii. The games that are released there are more gimmicks than actual videogames and that's the one and only reason that makes me think that Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming. Easy pick up and play is nice, sure, but it's not what console gaming is about (in my opinion, of course).
I'm sorry, how is it all possible you are spinning "making money off of consoles" as bad? Sony and Microsoft lose money on the consoles, while Nintendo gains. One point to Nintendo. But of course that doesn't matter.
Last time I looked, Microsoft was making a profit off the Xbox 360 console.
randomrob: Hahahahahahahahaha. oh lol. oh wait, your serious? oh well your wrong i'm afraid, Nintendo sell too well to kids and housewives to go bust. And who says they can't bring out a new console during the PS3 and 360's lifetime? if the wii stops selling they'll bring out a new console and move on.
The thing is Microsoft + Sony have beaten Nintendo to the punch, or at least almost, with Natal and PS-Motion controls bring a powerful platform with casual friendly controls, for Nintendo to arrive late to the party with the power but effectively the same interface then Nintendo will lose all it's lead.
All Microsoft/Sony require is a peripheral for a system which is already in peoples homes, a Wii HD would mean a whole new platform = harder trick to pull. PS3/360 are now down to almost the golden price that Wii sold at, a new Wii-HD would have to cost more.
If you ask me, Nintendo will slash, slash and again slash down the price of Wii, they can keep cutting the price down to $99 and still with a few hardware revisions turn a profit, especially with all the peripherals.
Remember, once Natal/PS-Motion are here the big hitters won't just appeal to the Casual + hardcore but they have a serious head up in Multimedia with Netflix, Blu-ray, Media-centre integration, Sky TV/iPlayer (in UK), movie rentals and so on. That is an aspect that Nintendo now has no chance getting into this late in the game, mainly because the Wii at the moment does not have the capacity to exploit it but if they release a Wii-HD they will have to start effectively from scratch and no company would want to get on that boat.
Wii was the boost that Nintendo needed but it is coming to a dead end. In the next year or two Nintendo will have no choice but to start cutting costs and broaden their market even further, the cannot deepen their product, the Wii was never designed for that.
Soccer mom's will soon be flailing around in front of Natal or fondling Sony's luminous balls (lol) and Wii will go the way of all other popular fads, dropped in favour of the latest new thing and I think Microsoft/Sony are much better positioned to hold their audiences' attention even into the next generation.
Maybe this is wishful thinking, I know there is a new Zelda Game coming out, I'd buy a Wii just for that... but only if it had it's price cut down to about £99... otherwise I'll just wait.
Well, maybe Nintendo will be forced to make a wii (style console) that's actualy next-gen. Capable of near 360, or PS3 graphics, physics, and using engines to match. Unless that happens i can't see the wii lasting 7 years. However i think it's got a good while left in it because, despite what I and many people may say, it does (i must Admit) have some really good/engaging/interesting titles. TLoZ, was i feel really good, Mariokart was a lot of fun, and smash hits like GH don't require brilliant graphics and so will be more at home and popular (perhaps) on the Wii than either of the other two consoles.
randomrob: Hahahahahahahahaha. oh lol. oh wait, your serious? oh well your wrong i'm afraid, Nintendo sell too well to kids and housewives to go bust. And who says they can't bring out a new console during the PS3 and 360's lifetime? if the wii stops selling they'll bring out a new console and move on.
The thing is Microsoft + Sony have beaten Nintendo to the punch, or at least almost, with Natal and PS-Motion controls bring a powerful platform with casual friendly controls, for Nintendo to arrive late to the party with the power but effectively the same interface then Nintendo will lose all it's lead.
All Microsoft/Sony require is a peripheral for a system which is already in peoples homes, a Wii HD would mean a whole new platform = harder trick to pull. PS3/360 are now down to almost the golden price that Wii sold at, a new Wii-HD would have to cost more.
If you ask me, Nintendo will slash, slash and again slash down the price of Wii, they can keep cutting the price down to $99 and still with a few hardware revisions turn a profit, especially with all the peripherals.
Remember, once Natal/PS-Motion are here the big hitters won't just appeal to the Casual + hardcore but they have a serious head up in Multimedia with Netflix, Blu-ray, Media-centre integration, Sky TV/iPlayer (in UK), movie rentals and so on. That is an aspect that Nintendo now has no chance getting into this late in the game, mainly because the Wii at the moment does not have the capacity to exploit it but if they release a Wii-HD they will have to start effectively from scratch and no company would want to get on that boat.
Wii was the boost that Nintendo needed but it is coming to a dead end. In the next year or two Nintendo will have no choice but to start cutting costs and broaden their market even further, the cannot deepen their product, the Wii was never designed for that.
Soccer mom's will soon be flailing around in front of Natal or fondling Sony's luminous balls (lol) and Wii will go the way of all other popular fads, dropped in favour of the latest new thing and I think Microsoft/Sony are much better positioned to hold their audiences' attention even into the next generation.
Maybe this is wishful thinking, I know there is a new Zelda Game coming out, I'd buy a Wii just for that... but only if it had it's price cut down to about £99... otherwise I'll just wait.
This generation has proven that just because the tech is superior, that's no guarantee of success. The Wii's market penetration makes Natal and the PS3mote pretty much futile. People own and recognize Wii. The other consoles are alien to them, besides perhaps acting as a DVD or Blu-Ray player.
You've made some very good points, but I don't think Nintendo is in trouble for the foreseeable future.
You make the argument that Natal and the Sony Balls will take out Nintendo's target audience and thus the Wii will die. I Will present my counter arguments to that.
Consumers, especially in the target audience that Nintendo has dominated (the soccer momsn little kids, and grandparents), often don't do their research on the consoles. They buy because they recognize things, and Mario is much nicer mascot than Master Chief or the PS logo. A lot of them don't know that the Wii sucks compared to the X360/PS3, a lot of them don't care if the Wii sucks compared to the X360/PS3. They just want Mario.
However, I do agree that the Wii is still (despite the argument I just presented) in pretty deep shit. Sony and MS are moving in on their turf, and the Wii is simply not capable of matching the quality or quantity of the features on the other consoles. The Wii looks to me like it's trying to ride the wave of popularity and consumer ignorance to the finish line. With the popularity waning and the pool of ignorant consumers shrinking (not to mention that they're being decimated in the hardcore arena), I'm not sure if that strategy will work.
LOUD NOISES PEOPLE ANGRY AND MY CAT HAS JUST BEEN SET ON FIRE! Okay, now that that is out of the way I will not say anything because I know nothing of what is happening around me because I play WoW. I think I am in a cave now...
Yeah, i bought a Wii - and i sung its praises when it came out. I loved the Mii system, the Menu interface, the controller's pointing and shaking features. The console was beautifully designed for you to interact with it.
I don't remember the last time i turned the Wii on now, and its not just because i got an xbox, its because i had no reason to. There have been no Wii games worth buying, nothing is taking advantage of the Wii's capabilities and Nintendo's nieche in the 'Family' market - a market consisting of small children and frail old age pensioners, has kept it from utilising the potential at all.
Its unfortunate, but after years of interesting innovation and excellent games (Mario Sunshine, Zelda: Ocerina of Time ect) Nintendo seem to have just given up on actual 'Gamers'.
The price they pay: we gamers have given up on them.
Truth of the matter is, this whole idea of there being "generations" of consoles that need to be released in sync with each other is misguided. If Nintendo decides the Wii needs to be upgraded, they'll just put out another console, whether it be 7 years from now or next month, and screw what Sony or Microsoft might be up to. (Well, okay, it'd probably take longer than a month to develop a console.)
Also, if console generations lasted 7-10 years, we'd be on about third generation right now. You might have read somewhere that today's consoles are referred to as such. However, I could actually trace back a procession of consoles much greater than three: Nintendo Entertainment System, Super Nintendo, Nintendo 64, Nintendo GameCube, Nintendo Wii (5 generations).
The people who really decide what a console generation is are really the same who decide what 'age' we are in (e.g. the information age). It's just an arbitrary label historians slap on things to try to keep it straight. Wikipedia says we're on our seventh console generation now, and I doubt theirs is the only definitive count.
I think the consoles really last somewhere around 2-4 years before technology causes games to seem old and dated compared to their competition, bringing about the necessity of another one to continue to complete. Then you get unusual situations like the strong market on the PS2 still resulting in quite a few games being released for it.
Their big hitters coming out for the Wii (Mario, Zelda) are all just boring re-hashes of the same damn thing.
Epic Mickey looks interesting.....but it won't save the whole console. I personally considered the Wii dead in the water around the time I noticed I hadn't touched the thing in a year and my most recent Christmas list has fuck all Wii games on it.
IcemanFreeze: I'm pretty sure if Nintendo ever made a Pokemon MMORPG, they would have enough money to buy out the other two companies...(ok, well maybe that is a gross exaggeration, but they would make a damn lot of money if they did that).
Also, no one holds a candle to Nintendo's share in the handheld market..this just proves it..
Georgeman: The hell? The thread hasn't been locked yet?
What a laughable thing to say. It's one thing not liking the console and its games, and another one completely to say that it's doomed. How many years have we been hearing this? Oh wait, 5 years, when the DS was lauded as "Virtual Boy 2" by the analysts. No, Nintendo is NOT doomed. Their consoles sell fantastically well (DS will soon reach PS2 in sales) and software-wise Nintendo sold a crapload with New Super Mario Bros, Mario Kart Ds and Wii and Wii Fit.
If Nintendo is doomed, then console gaming is doomed. End of story.
I think this thread is quite ridiculous too, but hear me out. Of course, Nintendo isn't doomed, it is just that it has alienated its original fanbase. They don't care so its probably the gans who are doomed. Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming. If Wii was the only console, boy, would I be a rabid pc gamer. They're not doomed, they're earning money but they don't represent console gaming in any way.
Nope. Sorry but you're wrong. Nintendo started alienating its fanbase maaaaany years ago when the Snes era began. Proof? NES sold 62 millions. Snes sold 46 millions. N64 sold 33 millions. Gamecube sold a paltry 22 millions. With the Wii, Nintendo has tried to bring back those NES gamers that didn't follow Nintendo through the generations.
As for your opinion that Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming, I disagree though respect your opinion. My opinion as to what is console gaming? Easy to pick up and play. Exactly like the NES and the Wii. Yes, a return to those days. A bit primitive but effective.
Console gaming should attact, well, gamers and that's no the case with the Wii. The games that are released there are more gimmicks than actual videogames and that's the one and only reason that makes me think that Nintendo doesn't represent console gaming. Easy pick up and play is nice, sure, but it's not what console gaming is about (in my opinion, of course).
The thing with the Wii is that it doesn't try to impress with its motion controls. It tries to help non-gamers get into gaming easier. I have always tried handing my family (who are not into gaming) the Wii remote to play. They were able to play and have fun with Wii Sports. I then tried giving them the classic controller to play Super Mario 64. Madness, I say!
And pick up and play, in my opinion, has always been a domain of console gaming. The first games in consoles were arcade ports or had arcade-like gameplay. Few buttons, no tutorials, challenging, etc.
Nintendo still has a good number of upcoming titles, such as the new Zelda title, New Super Mario Bros
yeah but people are starting to, well not hate but get board of those overused games, Zelda is still going to be the same old Zelda only with minor graphical up grades, you'll either get the boomerang first or the grappling hook. same with mario same old supermario but in 3-d graphics.
HG131: So, the Wii is the highest selling console, right? That sounds good to me, you? Well, they forgot one thing. This generation of gaming is going to be the longest gen ever, and it still has another 7 - 10 (or more!) years left. It's like in horse racing. Being at the front of the pack at the start normally means you burn out and lose before it's over. They have to make good games for it to last, as lasting on console sales is impossible. They are making the kinds of mistakes 2 other companies made. Sega and Atari. Sega did good at first with the Dreamcast. But then everyone else got better and it died. Atari had a popular console. So, what did they do? Sell stuff like ET and that port that turned Pac-Man Fever into Pac-Man Cancer. Nintendo thinks they can live off of console sales for 10 more years? There is only so many housewives, Nintendo. Either stay with the pack or die alone, it's your choice.
I don't know where you got that 7-10 year BS; there is no way 5 year old hardware is going to last another decade. Even MS said at the last E3 that they only expected this generation to continue into 2012.
Very clever. I see what you did there. Here's my contribution...